The Astral Pulse

World Cultures, Traditions and Religions => Welcome to World Cultures, Traditions and Religions! => Topic started by: Summerlander on September 01, 2011, 16:24:31



Title: Richard Dawkins cruelly answers audience question
Post by: Summerlander on September 01, 2011, 16:24:31
I'm just curious about what people think about this here.  Post your opinions.  Fire away...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JKGtcVoBhBQ&NR=1



Title: Re: Richard Dawkins cruelly answers audience question
Post by: Xanth on September 01, 2011, 16:47:20
It's only "cruel" within the context of the mans direct reason for asking the question... and I'm certain that fellow left the stage thinking "wow, what an butt".
In actuality, the response was very accurate and I don't believe that he said what he said in any attempt to be cruel.  He said what he said because he was asked a question and he provided an answer as per his experience.

It's an interesting exchange really.
Both men are speaking entirely from "their experiences"... which is as Richard mentions, is all he can do.


Title: Re: Richard Dawkins cruelly answers audience question
Post by: Stookie_ on September 01, 2011, 17:04:50
That guy was obviously there to confront him. Why else would a Christian go to something like that? Maybe the guy's question was really a cry for help... he's stuck and wants out, but his 50+ years of conditioning won't let him go.


Title: Re: Richard Dawkins cruelly answers audience question
Post by: Summerlander on September 01, 2011, 20:26:30
I agree with both of your responses.  The Christian guy was desperate indeed.  He seemed to want to convert Richard Dawkins.  I thought the answer wasn't cruel either.  As he put it, he believed the guy was being sincere, but, he interpreted it a different way: hallucinations.


Title: Re: Richard Dawkins cruelly answers audience question
Post by: Volgerle on September 01, 2011, 23:03:29
I think that in his very own way, Dawkins is a very religious man, too. No irony, I really mean it.


Title: Re: Richard Dawkins cruelly answers audience question
Post by: Summerlander on September 01, 2011, 23:51:29
 :-D

Sure!  He does seem to know a lot about different religions and the different gods!  Shiva, Allah, Apollo...

LOL!

 :lol:


Title: Re: Richard Dawkins cruelly answers audience question
Post by: light487 on September 02, 2011, 04:06:24
There's a difference between Faith and Belief (and of course Knowledge too).


Title: Re: Richard Dawkins cruelly answers audience question
Post by: Volgerle on September 02, 2011, 11:44:18
:-D

Sure!  He does seem to know a lot about different religions and the different gods!  Shiva, Allah, Apollo...

LOL!

 :lol:
Yeah, but I meant his own little-picture-religion.  :wink:

Blandly spoken: By this quasi-religious dogma based on the current dismal state of scientific epistemology, he declares you and me and many others here as ... INSANE.


Title: Re: Richard Dawkins cruelly answers audience question
Post by: Summerlander on September 02, 2011, 13:07:37
Not necessarily.  Not if he considers dreams to be sleep hallucinations.  And likewise, OOBEs and lucid dreams.  Visions of the night in general.  In which case, he wouldn't label us insane...just misguided perhaps.


Title: Re: Richard Dawkins cruelly answers audience question
Post by: Xanth on September 02, 2011, 14:29:11
I think that in his very own way, Dawkins is a very religious man, too. No irony, I really mean it.
His seems to be of the religion of science.  :)

Sure!  He does seem to know a lot about different religions and the different gods!  Shiva, Allah, Apollo...
One can study it, free from the ramblings of believing it.

There's a difference between Faith and Belief (and of course Knowledge too).
Only a slight difference... they're kind of from the same tree.  You need to believe in something to have faith in it, and you need to have faith in that belief.  So they're intricately linked.

Yeah, but I meant his own little-picture-religion.  :wink:
Little-Picture "Religion"... definitely.  :)
He doesn't see things in the greater scale.
Basically, his own beliefs seem to be tied directly to science in that if he hasn't seen it or directly experienced it... it doesn't exist.  That's a poor position to be looking at consciousness from.  LoL


Title: Re: Richard Dawkins cruelly answers audience question
Post by: Summerlander on September 02, 2011, 18:24:28
Yes, Xanth, but, even if he had seen it, he would interpret it his own way.  Just hallucinations.  I wouldn't call his view a "little picture".  It is simply what he believes to be the most viable explanation and he may also believe that one day science will prove that it is all in people's heads.

He could also turn around and say that Mr. Campbell's TOE is not to be taken seriously because it is pure conjecture.  Hence a "little picture" too.  Let's not call his view "little" because, for all we know, it might turn out to be true one day.  Also, you should look at this in regards to the Christian fellow:

http://obe4u.com/?page_id=307

Quote
One can study it, free from the ramblings of believing it.

Sure, one can study it.  And he clearly did.  In which case he'd have to have an interest in it.  And what he stated about the different gods and different cultures is justified.  Anyway, what was posted was a joke in reference to Dawkins being a "religious man". 


Title: Re: Richard Dawkins cruelly answers audience question
Post by: Xanth on September 02, 2011, 18:35:38
Yes, Xanth, but, even if he had seen it, he would interpret it his own way.  Just hallucinations.  I wouldn't call his view a "little picture".  It is simply what he believes to be the most viable explanation and he may also believe that one day science will prove that it is all in people's heads.
"Little picture" means he only views it from the perspective of the physical.


Title: Re: Richard Dawkins cruelly answers audience question
Post by: Summerlander on September 02, 2011, 22:12:56
oh, ok.


Title: Re: Richard Dawkins cruelly answers audience question
Post by: CFTraveler on September 02, 2011, 23:37:04
Not necessarily.  Not if he considers dreams to be sleep hallucinations.  And likewise, OOBEs and lucid dreams.  Visions of the night in general.  In which case, he wouldn't label us insane...just misguided perhaps.
 Yes he would and he has.   If you have read other things he has written, his opinion on anyone who has any belief or faith in anything (be it religion or anything that even smells paranormal) is very low- we're all either crazy or lying, or dangerous.  And this is putting it mildly.  I used to read a lot of his material (since I studied Anthropology and am personally of the Evolution/Catastrophism Ilk, lol) and read a lot of his material for the data content.  The problem that the data content is so arrogantly and just plain nastily put that I couldn't find myself able to quote him.



Title: Re: Richard Dawkins cruelly answers audience question
Post by: Xanth on September 03, 2011, 00:50:26
 Yes he would and he has.   If you have read other things he has written, his opinion on anyone who has any belief or faith in anything (be it religion or anything that even smells paranormal) is very low- we're all either crazy or lying, or dangerous.  And this is putting it mildly.  I used to read a lot of his material (since I studied Anthropology and am personally of the Evolution/Catastrophism Ilk, lol) and read a lot of his material for the data content.  The problem that the data content is so arrogantly and just plain nastily put that I couldn't find myself able to quote him.


What a fine upstanding individual... >_<
Yeah, I think I'm gonna ignore him then.  Thanks.  :)


Title: Re: Richard Dawkins cruelly answers audience question
Post by: Summerlander on September 03, 2011, 18:37:06
In that case, he's not doing himself any favours.  From what I got in the video though, he wasn't rude in any way shape or form.  Still, he is entitled to his own opinion.  It's like some believing Michael Jackson to have been a paedophile while others think he was innocent.


Title: Re: Richard Dawkins cruelly answers audience question
Post by: Ident on September 07, 2011, 13:16:41
I see the Christian guy as someone attempting to offer Dawkins the spiritual glory he feels within himself from his own experiences. This could be construed as attempting to convert Dawkins, who was having none of it and dismissed the Christian's experiences as self-delusion. The response could be considered rude.

On the other hand, Dawkins didn't answer the Christian's question at all, he simply closed his mind to the possibility of the truth of what the man was proffering. Maybe he had had his mind closed to this topic many years prior.

The real problem is that the topic is one which could occupy many evenings of comparative discussion and they had to fit their words into several seconds.


Title: Re: Richard Dawkins cruelly answers audience question
Post by: light487 on September 07, 2011, 21:17:28
Yer I agree that he didn't really answer the questions posed to him.. not that he has to answer them directly mind you.. but I agree he didn't. He used the same "if you grew up 'there', you'd believe in 'this'" answer that he's used a bunch of times.. almost word for word the same response that I've heard him use elsewhere.. so if anything, he was flippant..


Title: Re: Richard Dawkins cruelly answers audience question
Post by: Aims on September 12, 2011, 12:26:13
To the point: "Excuse Me, Mr Dawkins Series" by Clifford Goldstein.

http://freelygivensite.wordpress.com/category/speakers/clifford-goldstein/