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1151  Astral Chat / Welcome to Astral Chat! / Re: Bilderberg Group_Controlling the world?? on: February 28, 2010, 20:46:48
Long time no see, Kazbadan!

And I would agree with part of what was said previously- I don't doubt that there are  few small secret conclaves that wield a tremendous amount of social and economic power, and are responsible for many big decisions, but I think the real model is also much more complicated than that; there are other forces, interests, and uncontrolled variables deciding the path political states take as well, beyond what any one group or person can control.
1152  Astral Projection & Out of Body Experiences / Welcome to Out of Body Experiences! / Re: My First OBE on: February 28, 2010, 17:57:13
Why do both of these accounts post the same thing, lol?

And how did Fresco Edit RisingSon?

Mysteries.......
1153  Astral Projection & Out of Body Experiences / Welcome to Out of Body Experiences! / Re: How I Got Out For The First Time on: February 13, 2010, 20:28:17
Well Congratulations on your success, and I'm glad you were able to work out your background issues! It's not easy to step away from something like that, and heroin is about as addicting as they come.
1154  Astral Chat / Welcome to Astral Chat! / Re: Debt on: February 13, 2010, 09:08:31
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Whats wrong with binary

Lightwaves sound waves emotions thought

all a wave made of positive and negative male and female
the simple answer is often the right one

:NodesOfYesod:

I never made the connection that you were Nodes of Yesod.  wink What happened to your old account?

And I guess my response to that line of reasoning is that yes, binary relationships are pretty common in nature, but they are clearly not the only sorts of relationships that appear (some things are uniary and seem to have no opposite, such as sand, the number zero, a square circle- there is no opposite of a square circle- and others are arranged in groups of three or more), and so it is not logically valid to assume that a given phenomenon will adhere to a binary pattern without evidence to support that line of thought.
1155  Astral Chat / Welcome to Astral Chat! / Re: Debt on: February 12, 2010, 11:19:58
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I can confirm the 'light and dark star' thing, sorta. A star appears bright on one frequency, dark on another, and invisible on another. It's just not a duality so much as a change in perception

True, but that goes for pretty much any physical object... some are completely invisible at certain points in the electromagnetic spectrum, if that is what you mean.
1156  Astral Chat / Welcome to Astral Chat! / Re: Debt on: February 12, 2010, 01:10:02
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there are 2 universes one male and one female if there is a light star in one there is a dark star in the other. they sit in the same place and occupy the same systems .our nearest star is male and female like the rest of life a female star(spirit)
sourounded by the male star (fire element)

I have a feeling it is a bad idea to get involved in this, lol, but I can't resist....

How is it that you know this, again?  huh
1157  Dreams / Welcome to Dreams! / An emotional and musical dream I had with sublimely consumming narrative on: February 08, 2010, 08:31:31
Last night I slept in a bit too long (  cool ), and I had the sort of dream I normally have when I stay in late-cycle REM for extended periods. It was very clear, but not lucid, so I believed the story it was telling- in my opinion, the way I prefer it, because this acceptance allows certain experiences and emotions I would not otherwise experience.


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The backstory was fairly trite: some sort of hollywood-style outbreak had occured, and the normal zombie infection, with transmission via bite. I had apparently held up with one of the other well-armed survivors, an old workingclass-hero type, and we were living our lives in this old ruined farmhouse. The episode at which I joined my remembered narrative, we were desperately fighting off a horde of the infected who were besieging the farmhouse through all openings, and at a moment of terrible tension, we were forced into an interior room with no windows, our would-be assailants thundering on the only door.

The odd thing about this room was that it had a railing down the middle, and door opened by rotating on an axis in the middle, so that when it opened, you could enter on either side of the door, but the raling in the room ensured that you could only enter the side of the room which corresponded to the side of the door you entered.

I looked at my companion, and there was a sort of consciously shared understanding that we would not get out of the situation without facining what was behind the door, so I allowed it to open, and what occurred afterward was quite counterintuitive- on his side, 3 zombies entered, and on mine, a frightened and attractive young lady; he passed me another look which clearly signified, "thanks...".

The three of us now in the room expressed great relief upon realizing that we were now alone after the prior onslaught, and of all things, the young lady, overcome with emotion, and the realization that our life prospects were clearly limited, suggested that we make love, which dream-me consented to, lol... which is also surprising, as erotic episodes are very infrequent in my dreams, for whatever reason.

Afterward, there was some mental lapse, and the next episode involved the three of us dealing with some new threat, in the form of these shining white, ethereal spectre type beings, which for some reason or other now wandered the deserted world, screaming terribly, like banshees. It was unclear what would happen to a person they were able reach, but I unconsciously knew it had to be something unmentionably dreadful. We had apparently rigged this system at the doors that emitted some sort of electrical pulse, accompanied by a grating siren sound, that for whatever reason repelled them, and needed to be activated whenever they were approaching.

This precise contingency is what we fell to, as a small but very threatening number of these beings were very nearly upon us before we activated the aforementioned defense system. Being exhausted from the effort this constant defense took, and there not being any intact electrical ligthing in this house, I fell asleep that night. I was awakened by a sound, and as I stepped into the main room of the house, brightly shining, silver moonlight had bathed the space, of supernatural intensity. As I stood there, I heard someone playing a harp, a mournfully minor-keyed song, filled with powerful longing, accompanied by an angelic voice, singing a gentle, yet sublime song, speaking of the rapturous joy a young girl had walking alone through her desserted country town at night, imagining she was dancing with the stars.

( I am certain that the song in the dream was inspired by this one from Joanna Newsom, which I had heard weeks ago, and is very much like it; in fact, I am very glad that I made the connection, as now it allows me a connection to the dream.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sJ-mEpcxeoo  )

It was truly a transcendant moment.

I was overwhelmed with the juxtaposition of all that was happening at once- I knew that we were in dire trouble, and that terrible things were lurking outside in the night wishing us all kinds of harm, and that it was only a matter of time before we were overcome completely; yet this unspeakably beautiful thing could be, this girl singing her song of past and serene joys, and I felt such ecstasy in being given that gift in such a dark time, that I was filled with the calmest accpetance of the fate that awaited all of us, and felt that I could never be afraid again after hearing such as that.

I walked through the supernatural moonlight, and found her in her chamber, as she was ending her song, and she knelt at an old harp, a silver ray falling on her from a high window. A wrapped figure lay next to her, and she explained calmly to me that it was her attendant, who had been bitten.  The attendant stared calmly at me, with a startlingly ambiguous look, half lucid, half mad. It was understood by all there that she would not last long, but that she should be cared for as long as any trace of humanity remained, as my new friend felt a sort of reverent duty toward her.

We sat talking for a while in the moonlight, when we heard the shrieking of the white banshee beings again, and I ran to all of the doors activating the electronic deterrent system, at the last just before they stormed inside, and trailed off in rage.

As I returned to my friend, she was holding her old attendant, who now had a look of pure insanity in her eyes, and her teeth had yellowed and were falling out. She lept up at me, and I ran out of the room, frantically searching for a weapon. I found a large, but dull kitchen knife, and as I scrambled back, she was leaping through the doorframe at me, and in great alaram and haste, I slashed at the side of her neck, although she continued to flail at me, and I just continued hacking at her neck, cleaving off her head, the gaping hole filled with spongy white material sort of like old tofu, that did not at all resemble human flesh. Satisfied that she was dispatched, I walked back to my friend, who gazed at me with a look of understanding, but mixed with great loss.

The next moment, we heard the shrieking of the banshee creatures again, who had returned in haste, and I ran again to all the doors, but this time I didn't make it to all of them intime, and I was forced to jump out of one of the windows, as three of the creatures flooded into the remaing doors. I ran out into the night, frighted of what might happen to my friends, but knowing that I was powerless to stand against them, as they were apparently impervious to any weapons we had, and facing one meant some sort of instant death.  I also felt quite naked outside the house, with all the terrible things that were lurking out in the night, and me armed only with a feeble kitchen knife for protection. A few minutes later, I saw them glide back out of the house, unaware of my presenence outside.  I ran back inside, activating all the systems, and rushed then to see what had become of my friends. I found her in the same room, hunched against a wall, srubbing her arms franitcally with a sponge at a wash basin. She had the same look of near madness, and yellowed teeth, and I suddenly felt overpowering loss, thinking back to the gifts she had given only in the same night. I carried her to a wash basin, scrubbing her frantically, but to my great consternation, she transfiggured into a cooking wok, with a coat of rust. I then was possessed of the idea that if I could only scrub off all the rust, that she might change back and be saved... but I awoke amid this desperate attempt.

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Aside from being an incredible experience filled with overpowering emotions, I think this dream has demonstrated something to be very clearly: many of us here are familiar with the Hindu idea of the world as a sort of divine play, in which we all voluntarily take on various parts in the drama, with the need for a veil of forgetfullness, to allow us to better become our parts, for the fullest possible experience.

I think dreams like the one I had are a similar vehicle... they allow us to suspend past notions, and fully become a player in an all immersive experience, and have emotions and feelings that we could never otherwise have access to.

I wonder how much truth this idea might have, and if that is really part of what we are on earth to experience....
1158  2012 and The Transition of the Ages / Welcome to 2012 and The Transition of the Ages / Re: Awakening! on: February 07, 2010, 05:15:52
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BTW, google Phineas Gage, its a case of a guy that lost alot of his brain, yet he still lived a complete life.

Well, Gage is a good example of mental plasticity, as he regained most of his faculties, but one should also note that people considered him to be much different after his accident.... he was supposedly quite mild mannered before, and after, he was given to bouts of angry rage.
1159  Astral Chat / Welcome to News and Media! / Re: Scientists remove Monkey's head, attach it another's decapitated body on: February 05, 2010, 08:52:40
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1. Is that picture from the real procedure or taken from an horror movie?
2. The connection to the other body consists only on veins and arteries?
If its true, then it proves nothing. Is virtually the same than connecting someone to a machine that keeps it alive... after all the body is a biochemical machine. All they did is keep the blood flowing, that could be done with any device.


I believe it is from the actual procedure, although it does look very grotesque, and the lighting is dramatic, lol.

And yes, the decapitated body was essentially a life support system for the 2nd head- only contributing blood. Nerves are near impossible to reconnect.

It probably died of immuno-rejection. The same thing will often kill newly transplanted individuals.
1160  Astral Chat / Welcome to Astral Chat! / Re: could someone explain to em what this is on: February 03, 2010, 10:01:34
Well, normally the experience seems to work itself out on its own...

The main thing seems to be to not disrupt the state through any kind of excitement, as that will send brain-waves back toward the alpha, and less deep trance. It can be frightening at first not to have any bodily awareness, but you mustn't let that bother you.

Sometimes vibrations will greatly intensify, and other times you will drift into hypnogogic images- pictures that sort of flash before your eyes briefly, like micro dreams. You need to to try your best to remain perfectly aware of your situation, without becoming excited at all. If you can maintain this awareness, you sort of drift into the state where projection is imminent- you don't really need to actively do anything here... it is more just about waiting for that moment, and recognizing it for what it is.
1161  Astral Chat / Welcome to Astral Chat! / Re: could someone explain to em what this is on: February 01, 2010, 05:40:37
Hard to say without experiencing what you felt, but it sounds vaguely similar to the state of sleep paralysis which often precedes projection experiences.

You may have probably read by now that most projections are also preceded by a decrease in bodily awareness accompanied by buzzing and tingling sensations, known ubiquitously as "the vibrations". In other words, if projection is your intention, then that state is the springboard from which to make attempts  wink
1162  Metaphysics / Welcome to Metaphysics! / Re: Earth Sized Spherical Objects Orbitting Our Sun on: January 31, 2010, 07:26:42
It really is, and bits and pieces like this really tell the story of what the Vatican is at its core, where it's interests lie, and why it holds a near monopoly on the telliscopes and intruments studying the sun.
1163  Metaphysics / Welcome to Metaphysics! / Re: Earth Sized Spherical Objects Orbitting Our Sun on: January 31, 2010, 06:41:07
Well, the "physicist" they interview doesn't sound exactly credible, although if what he is saying is indeed correct, it is utterly amazing- the idea that the way to travel vast intragalactic distances is by using the singularities buried in all stars is fascinating.... it would mean that long distance space travel might not be that inconceivably far in the future for the likes of us (centuries, maybe). But that is provided that what he explicitly admits to be mere theories are true.

On another note, the idea that the vatican owns a near monopoly of equipment and telliscopes observing the sun is not new or even surprising, but it takes a little history lesson of the type you normally never get in school:

When Christianity first came to Rome, it wasn't the only new religion in town, and nor was it even the only salvationist group. The Romans at this time had been largely fascinated with the mysticism of the Egyptians, which was nearing its end at around 100 ad. The Cult of Isis was one major import from this influence, which was concerned with communing with the Goddess, who in turn promised immortality to her subjects, and also, unsurprisingly, with the sun as one of her symbols she shared with other deities, such as Ra. The earliest church which Constantine helped to institute out of the half-clandestine worship of the early Christians had many things in common with this Cult of Isis, and many of the symbols and motifs had actually been integrated into the Vatican.

The vatican has always been fond of Egyptian obelisks as well, probably partially due to this early shared history, and many obelisks were shipped straight from Egypt to Rome. Infact, the entire road to Saint Peter's Basilica, the great cathedral of the pope, is lined with obelisks, and in the piazza directly in front of Saint Peter's, there is a massive Obelisk which was imported in 37 AD, and re-erected there in 1586.




I was priveliged to live in Rome for about a year, and I took a class with a famous American historian who lives there, where we would spend 4 hours a week tramping around the city, discussing the supressed histories of all the major fountains in the city, and the symbols of the powerful families of the Vatican and the later free masons which plastered just about every church and cathedral, but normally go overlooked.

There is a well known fountain, the Fountain of the Four Rivers in the very center of another of the colossal piazze of Rome, Piazza Navona, directly in Front of the great chuch of San Agnese.



Now it is well documented in most guidebooks and architectural histories, but none of them really tell the story of what it really represents. The imagery relates to the ideas imparted to the sculptor, Francesco Borromini, by one of the Vatican's historians, Athanasius Kircher. Kircher felt that all the great rivers of the earth are connected via a great feeding chamber, and this theory is embodied in the three European rivers, and the Nile, depicted, which also are meant to correspond to the rivers of Eden.

More importantly, however, is the Obelisk, which Kircher, from his studies of the Egyptian texts, had determined was meant to be a sort of "lightning rod" for the divine essence of the gods from the sun, which would then flow into the place the Obelisk was erected and concentrate. The real reason the Vatican wanted this fountain to be mounted with an Obelisk, was because they wanted to absorb the essence of God flowing from the sun, and concentrate it around their major churches.

With this in mind, it is easy to understand how the Vatican is really a group which derives its heritage from Egyptian and Greek sources, as much as early Christianity, and with this understanding, one can clearly see their interest in observing celestial objects, and principally the sun.

1164  2012 and The Transition of the Ages / Welcome to 2012 and The Transition of the Ages / Re: Alien messages on: January 30, 2010, 03:34:46
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About this galactic internet thing - I'm still trying to figure out how it works, but it's possible for anyone to get into it. I'm only a minor telepath and I've seen some neat things.

Haha, Zareste... I actually said something remarkably similar a couple days ago, half joking / half serious; I am pretty sure I never read a reference to the idea before it occurred to me, although I admit, it is a farily simple and direct concept multiple people would come up with:


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We are basically in the dark, since there is no real way that this story can develop, no new way for information to come. I would say it is like the Greek who discovered Jupiter- amazing find, but impossible to know what it was or meant at the time, and no way to find out anything more. If there is an intergalactic "internet" through which other entities are connected, we haven't even learned to read yet.
1165  Metaphysics / Welcome to Metaphysics! / Re: Earth Sized Spherical Objects Orbitting Our Sun on: January 30, 2010, 03:25:40
I would agree.... the compression thing is a poorly considered response, and vaguely implies they were inelegantly trying to hide whatever it was. Very clumsy, if that is the case.
1166  Astral Chat / Welcome to News and Media! / Re: Scientists remove Monkey's head, attach it another's decapitated body on: January 29, 2010, 07:59:32
I don't know... I think it is probably not a numbers game like that. The way I tend to view the whole body-consciousness interface relationship, is that a biological body can be an appropriate seat of consciousness provided it can remain homeostatic and metabolize. I would hypothesize that the consciousness ceases to be associated with it as soon it ceases to biologically maintain itself, and therefore ceases to be a responsive interface peripheral. But again, this is all speculation- who really knows? rolleyes
1167  Astral Chat / Welcome to News and Media! / Re: Scientists remove Monkey's head, attach it another's decapitated body on: January 28, 2010, 10:11:39
Well, I am not sure of that last argument Kurt, since by most definitions, a person having been decapitated is dead after a few minutes, if not instantly by most standards, so I would say that "life" is probably not tied to the number of intact energy centers, but rather the ability of the biological body to continue proper metabolism, ie.: growth, energy use, integration of new matter and excretion of waste matter, building and breaking down of compounds. When there is no oxygen supply to feed this metabolism, or no direction of the processes through proper nerve impulses in the autonomous system, then metabolism ceases, and biological life.


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I just wanted to throw in my thoughts on this: couldn't this experiment be proof that the soul does not exist? if you think about it, if there is a soul and the physical body (of an animal or a person) is mutilated enough so the organisms body should die under normal circumstances, then shouldn't the animals (or persons) soul had left the body after the decapitation? and the head be lifeless regardless of it being fixed correctly onto another alive body?

I think the operative word here is "should". Should implies a concept like "ought to", and it is pretty hard for anyone to say what such a thing as a soul ought to do, since despite what some may think one way or the other, no one really knows anything particularlly definitive about souls, and so no one is really qualified to say how a soul should behave in a given situation. That said, I don't think it is possible to disprove the existence of souls by stating that they did not behave as expected, and this is also quite counter-intuitive, since you would be assuming knowledge of the behavior of something you simaltaneously were asserting did not exist. In other words, this does not seem to be the kind of experiment formulated in such a way as to yield data useful for backing up assertions like the one you made.


Sometimes I feel like my function here is shooting down arguments, lol... I really don't mean it, honest rolleyes
1168  Metaphysics / Welcome to Metaphysics! / Re: Earth Sized Spherical Objects Orbitting Our Sun on: January 28, 2010, 01:29:34
Oh, I don't make these statements expecting more information to be forthcoming, but rather just to caution against jumping to a loose conclusion.

I agree- I don't expect major news outlets to cover such a story- and it wouldn't surprise me either if they were gone tomorrow. As I said before, I think we are totally in the dark about what they might be, and we were just lucky enough to catch a glimpse of them because someone spotted them in the images at the right time.

It is like a flight of mallards are on migration, and they get passed by an F22 going the speed of sound... it is a prodigious occurence, but one which they have no way of understanding, only a fleetingly limited image of, no way of gaining any insight into, and one which they shouldn't expect to ever occur again.

I could be wrong, and this could be the beginnings of a massive phenomenon, but I am basically expecting this to be one of those profound, brief occurences which we cannot place.
1169  Metaphysics / Welcome to Metaphysics! / Re: Earth Sized Spherical Objects Orbitting Our Sun on: January 27, 2010, 23:33:33
Perhaps, they are, but you also need to rule out possiblities like optical artifacts, and super-concentrated gas masses. That said, I would also lean toward them being objects, since they seem to block light, and seem to appear in farily regular shapes. I still think it is premature to make judgements without further information, but I also favor the idea that they seem to be objects placed there, if what we are seeing is accurate.
1170  Metaphysics / Welcome to Metaphysics! / Re: Earth Sized Spherical Objects Orbitting Our Sun on: January 27, 2010, 03:08:24
I feel like those objects, if they are such, are probably quite significant. But I also feel like this is one of those things that may never come up again, and everyone will forget about it, as amazing as it is if those things actually are what people suppose them to be.

We are basically in the dark, since there is no real way that this story can develop, no new way for information to come. I would say it is like the Greek who discovered Jupiter- amazing find, but impossible to know what it was or meant at the time, and no way to find out anything more. If there is an intergalactic "internet" through which other entities are connected, we haven't even learned to read yet.
1171  Metaphysics / Welcome to Metaphysics! / Re: Earth Sized Spherical Objects Orbitting Our Sun on: January 26, 2010, 08:51:16
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In a galaxy like ours, it's usually safer to say an object is there to destroy something than protect something

Hard to say...

Since most of us cannot claim to have much contact with non-human, physical, rational intelligences, I don't really think it is possible to make any assertions about what the majority of them might be like, or what sort of intentions they might hold.

But I can agree that it is certainly human nature to suspect foul-play before benificence, if only for the survival value it tend to bring.
1172  Metaphysics / Welcome to Metaphysics! / Re: Earth Sized Spherical Objects Orbitting Our Sun on: January 26, 2010, 08:46:41
Interesting. These images actually look authentic... anyone's guess what they might be, but they certainly do look artificial, if you take the ones in the SOHO images to be anything but optic artifacts.

I wonder if they have been there for a while, and people have just not noticed them....
1173  Astral Chat / Welcome to Astral Chat! / Re: Members' Artwork on: January 23, 2010, 22:03:32
Pretty legit hatching job- if these are without reference, all the better
1174  Astral Chat / Welcome to Astral Chat! / Re: Fluoride on: January 22, 2010, 06:40:59
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This is fine as long as you don't intend to persuade anyone into your line of reasoning.
But once you start trying to convince people what is right or wrong (true or false) regarding a particular situation... that's when your "instincts" fall to the side and REAL proof is required.

This is along the lines of what I was trying to say. You can prove something to yourself somewhat easily, and it is quite okay to share this with others. There is a distinction between sharing your findings, however, and trying to persuade others, since the latter clearly requires much stronger levels of proof and clarity to be done effectively. It is clearly not your intention to persuade, from what I have seen, and that is perfectly fine. The only danger comes when personal findings are reported as facts, since here the lines gray out. A person might have no intention of offering as their ideas as formal proofs, but when this is the case, it should be implied in the language used, since if the ideas discussed are presented as affirmed statements, rather than as personal experiences, this establishes the idea in the mind of a reader that a more rigorous proof is being intended than is the case.


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Don't be so sure... like I've said before, REAL proof is not always easy to find. What's real to one person may be fake to another.

Also quite true. Despite appearances to the contrary, there is actually very little agreement in accademic philosophy as to what constitutes a proof. Granted, we have tools like the laws of logical consequence, but these generally require logical axioms to function, like the law of non-contradiction, and these can never really be proven themselves, though they inductively seem to always hold. It is possible that even the law of non-contradiction itself may be not be fully true, although it is beyond disturbing to think of a situation where the same thing could both be and not be true, and the sort of terrifying world which might accompany such logical disorder.
1175  Astral Projection & Out of Body Experiences / Welcome to Out of Body Experiences! / Re: omnipotency on: January 18, 2010, 05:07:32
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That's why alternate realities exist.   


Maybe, but I am not sure that this solves the problem; omnipotence means being able to do anything at all provided it is possible- not possible merely in your own frame-reality. In order to be truly omnipotent, the abilities of such a being would need to transcend all contraints of separation stemming from their own place in reality. After all, we are taking omnipotence, not just being penultimately powerful in one's own sphere.
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