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151  Astral Projection & Out of Body Experiences / Welcome to Astral Consciousness! / Re: do you acculy leave the body? on: February 11, 2014, 12:00:00
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From a God-Source-PoV it is right to say that you do not leave for Jamaica or leave your body in an OBE. It's because Jamaica does "not exist" as you think it does, neither does your body in the first place.
From a physical reality ruleset PoV (leaving for) Jamaica exists in your reality experience frame, like an apple, like a table, like your body, like your brain. Therefore leaving your body during OBEs exists, too.

Yes, this is a very important distinction and point. I thought of bringing it up too, but I thought it might confuse the already ambiguous language even further. The theory that I am advancing in this topic would say that projections appear to be a fully "God-source-POV" happening, and thus bypass the physical needs or rules about travel; this is in one sense because travel is a purely physical concept, and I am supposing projections to be fully non-physical in sourcing, but transduced by brains and hence also tainted with physical concepts (because that is how our brain is wired to understand the world- in terms of time and space).

Admittedly it is a very particular point, and requires some advanced word-bending to explain precisely on my part. I am not the best communicator at times, haha.

I guess if I had to explain it a different way, as to why I don't picture ghosts out there soul-traveling around the physical world, I might do it this way:

Picture a computer game. There are hundreds or thousands of copies. The Programmers (Source) authored this code, and this code is copied and placed in versions individual players possess. When I am in a certain place in the game world (baker street), and you are in the same place at the same time, do you expect to see me there too at the same time? Probably not, and that is because the visions of the game world we are seeing in our individual living rooms aren't the source itself, they are individual representations. They are pretty close, but they are distinct. Maybe your version has bright colors on your tv at home, and more importantly, your version doesn't have my character in it. That is what I think RTZ experiences are. I don't think we are communing with source (game code) directly, I think we are experiencing our own representations of it.

But then I think this is a bit labored lol. I think we get each other by now  wink
152  Astral Chat / Welcome to News and Media! / Re: More 'proof' ? on: February 11, 2014, 08:12:11
Decent article, but the "Miss Z" study was done in the 70's or 80's... it is a real classic that seems to get tons of references lol. I wonder if Charles Tart has been doing much research in that direction lately...
153  Astral Projection & Out of Body Experiences / Welcome to Astral Consciousness! / Re: do you acculy leave the body? on: February 11, 2014, 00:49:39
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I am yet to experience AP but I hope that it isn't a "dream" and you do actually leave the body. If you don't then that means there is no afterlife.

There are many assumptions built in here.

Any one metaphysical phenomenon being proven to be false or an illusion doesn't prove a thing about afterlives. Projections, remote viewings, psychic readings, clairvoyance, past-life regressions, channelings, and 20 other things could all for the sake of argument here be false while an afterlife would still be possible. You are forcing projection to be the measuring stick of the universe, which it hardly needs to be. For me it holds up somewhat well to that test, but then it isn't the only strange thing out there, and even if there were no strange things at all, any number of bizarre facts about the universe could never-the-less have been true. Mind has a strange primacy in the universe, which is evident in countless places. Take the P.E.A.R. study done at Princeton for decades, where they concluded that human desires effected the outcomes of otherwise random events. That to me illustrates that the materialism doctrine of the universe is not fully explanitory, and that in order to explain such results, the scientific mainstream needs to reassess the what properties it assigns to minds.
154  Astral Projection & Out of Body Experiences / Welcome to Astral Consciousness! / Re: do you acculy leave the body? on: February 11, 2014, 00:37:54
... but isn't your "physical" brain part of this 'physical virtual reality dataset' too, like the table, the apple, Jamaica?

So how can it then be independent? I'd rather think only mind is independent. Mind interprets the data, mind experiences the data. Your brain filters, collects, transduces the data streams perhaps, but is it the being / the 'persona' that is aware of it? The experiencing and aware mind is independent of the brain for me.

Consider the TV set analogy, or the filter analogy. The TVset is part of this reality, the program is not in that sense (metaphorically speaking). It still exists when the TV goes boom.  wink

Just my two cents.

The line you quoted from me was ambiguously written, and it admitted of several meanings now that I read it. The intended meaning among those possibilities was that the data is independent of its representations, not the brain. That phrase applied specifically to the brain would be the "metaphysical data of our brains is independent of the representation of the brain to us". Like all things in the world, I think the brain is both its data and its representation, meaning there is the platonic form of the brain which is pure computed data, then there is what is represented to us in MRI's and such.

I agree the mind itself (not a mind we would understand from this life, but still a mind) is not dependent on the brain for existence. But from what I have seen, everything I have ever experienced seems to be transduced and packaged for the mind by the brain. I guess it is sort of like the rules of the game... perhaps we agree to use the physical brains as our filter for the totality of our time on earth.

I don't think our positions are significantly different, and that the disagreement may largely be in defining terms or in how sentences are interpreted.
155  Astral Projection & Out of Body Experiences / Welcome to Astral Consciousness! / Re: do you acculy leave the body? on: February 10, 2014, 19:15:52
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JUst one thing - you said "You can go to places you have never been, and see them somewhat accurately sometimes". How can that happen without us leaving our bodies ?

Ok... so I have never been to Jamaica. But I have seen Jamaica in film footage. I have experienced Jamaica in a limited sense without having to leave the country (in this analogy, replace "country" with "body" to get the full meaning). The experience of Jamaica for me was fully in my head. What do I mean by this? Well, I have not communed with Jamaica in the fullest sense in actually being present there, but my film footage was data that my brain was able to interpret as images of a place called Jamaica. So too I have come to understand projection. Time and space are not constraints, and more importantly they are definitely not constraints of non-physical reality. You are suggesting that I need to leave my body to actually see Jamaica, because you are thinking of it in terms of physical travel. There is no travel, there is only being there, or not being there. Leaving your body to me is a phrase that doesn't compute, because there is nowhere to go, when there is no such thing as space or distance.

There are what we call "real time zone" experiences, where it seems like we are viewing a facsimile of the objective physical world. I think this is why such experiences are partly accurate, and partly not- because we are trying to have an experience that is similar to our waking lives in the physical world, but that is not what things are at their core. Such experiences are heavily constructed around what our expectations are, so while we may be reading some "objective" outside data to represent the spaces to ourselves, we can't separate that data from what we expect the place to be like.

For example, say I visited a fishing village in Jamaica in my projection. I don't expect there would be a ghostly spirit body traveling around that village that others could pick up... I see it more like remote viewing... I read the data from great distance. Which is not to say you couldn't meet others in non-physical situations, but I don't think such meetings are taking place because two ghosts met, I think it happens because you both had the same resonant intention.

This all makes sense to me because I conceive the world as a sort of platonic simulation. There are no apples or chairs or oak trees- what I think there is, is a sort of metaphysical computer simulation of a reality with apples and chairs in it. But that reality is only interfaced with through sense data. The apple doesn't really exist, your perceptions of the apple are what exist. This is why I am speaking of data. It is like I am interacting with the program of reality, but because I am not doing it through the normal channels (my earthly senses), my brain is the one given the task of constructing representations of that data, which is in itself independent of those representations.
156  Astral Projection & Out of Body Experiences / Welcome to Astral Consciousness! / Re: do you acculy leave the body? on: February 10, 2014, 09:06:02
For what it's worth, my two cents:

I think it is all in our head, and we don't leave our bodies. I think everything in the projection environment is a product of our brain interpreting a metaphysical reality with the equipment it has to work with. If we see a postman, or Sean Connery, or the devil, I think it is our brain taking raw data and converting it into a form that is symbolically meaningful to us. You can go to places you have never been, and see them somewhat accurately sometimes, but you will find that your mind fills in a lot of the blanks, and it is hard to sort out what you yourself authored from what has "objective" existence outside yourself- at least it has been for me.
157  Astral Chat / Welcome to News and Media! / Re: Did NASA oops? on: February 09, 2014, 21:20:25
It does sort of look like a non-inflated parachute free from its pod, so that is actually plausible to me, but who really knows I guess.

Another interesting image I saw recently is a stone the mars rover passed that resemble's a statue's face.

It is the one in the middle right that the arrow is not pointing at lol. Could be something, could be a case of looking for resemblances in a large pool of random data. These stories are sort of hard to make heads or tails of, because there is rarely any follow-up or later developments. You sort of believe what you believe about it, and that is it lol.

Mars is and space and general definitely does provide a lot of these visual anomalies though.

158  Astral Projection & Out of Body Experiences / Welcome to Out of Body Experiences! / Re: Marijuana, medication and OBEs on: February 08, 2014, 04:13:00
If you are like most moderate-heavy users, you will probably face a mild level of general memory-formation impairment- that is probably the most serious symptom I am aware of which there is data to support. Like you say though, it may well be your best option if pharmaceuticals are the competitors. In a way, I am imagining you will find certain kinds of projections easier, and others more difficult. You will find fully-conscious cross-over type experiences near impossible, because you won't be able to maintain gentle focus for long enough. You may also find projections of the sort long-period meditators sometimes experience much easier to achieve- these sorts of experiences begin as a sort of reality-dissociation where you become progressively more separated from what is going on around you, and end up in a sort of "Alice in Wonderland" trip.

If you have no better options, and force of will, or lifestyle changes can't create a positive change, it is a viable option.
 
Many Doctors believe Fibromyalgia may be caused by spinal misalignments, principally in the neck, and chiropractors may offer a lot of help in that regard. Also, strangely vigorous exercise will help many sufferers. I have close relatives for whom this is the case; they have a clinical diagnosis of Fibromyalgia, and they find as long as they go to workout once every day or two, their pain ends up being much more managable.

We can't really give medically sound advice here, for obvious reasons, but those are my thoughts!
159  Astral Chat / Welcome to Astral Chat! / Re: ECT to facilitate OBE experiences? on: January 28, 2014, 14:54:31
I guess it is also a matter of priorities and perspective. Why risk injuring yourself terribly for something that is of no benefit to you in that situation? For instance, if you had to work a job because your really needed to pay off your car, would you choose drag racing?
160  Bug Reports and Questions / Forums Bugs Reports and Questions / Re: Information Overload!!!! on: January 22, 2014, 23:37:26
^^^

This dude who answered the question before me created something like that, lol.

Xanth has collected all of Frank Kepple's extant posts into a pdf; quite a jumpstart is to be had from sifting through those alone.
161  Astral Chat / Welcome to News and Media! / Re: More Wasted Research on: January 19, 2014, 07:33:01
Lol I think mainly it is the article writers framing things in the way designed to most stir interest. I am sure the study had nothing at all to do with "sixth sense" and everything to do with exploring the science of sensory perception. Sort of the same way the media insists on calling the higgs boson the "god particle" even though that name explains less than nothing and the phrase was only uttered in an offhand way by one public spokesman. The media loves to view science and metaphysics as mortal combatants in a never-ending slug-fest.
162  Astral Chat / Welcome to News and Media! / Re: Hoax, Message or other? on: January 06, 2014, 06:27:50
Lmao Nvidia... I bet a lot of people aren't happy with them. That explains why private security showed up.
163  Astral Chat / Welcome to News and Media! / Re: Hoax, Message or other? on: January 05, 2014, 21:10:51
Linda is always a joy to listen to, if nothing else for her enthusiasm and her kind-hearted perspectives. I can't help but read the text on her site in her voice.

This one is really interesting, but I wonder if the "relaxed node" effect is found here; recent crop circle scholarship tends to say that the relaxed node formations are the legitimate ones.

It is perplexing to me why extra-terrestrials or whatever theoretical source we are dealing with would go through the trouble to make a blatantly clear message which is most obviously in braille script, reading the number "192" several times, and yet not provide any other clear information as to why they would provide us with that number. Sometimes I feel like these things are an IQ test... like we don't deserve the message unless we are smart enough to deduce it, lol.
164  Magic / Welcome to Magic! / Re: URGENT!! Psipog.net is Going Down Soon - Dl Before It's Too Late on: December 30, 2013, 01:51:41
I heard Unlimited Boundaries is going down, and if the wealth held within its posts shouldn't be lost, then everyone who reads this should go download the entire post bank (oh, and please click on every ad you see a few times  wink )
165  Astral Chat / Welcome to Members Introductions! / Re: I am the Spiritual Communist on: December 22, 2013, 02:50:20
Wasn't Communism as practiced by the Soviets strictly and militantly atheist, lol?

Oh well, welcome to the pulse  cheesy
166  Healing / Welcome to the Healing place! / Re: Healing request (Uterine fibroid) on: December 21, 2013, 18:37:35
I am wishing for her recovery, and hoping for her to find the proper means of treatment for this condition, whatever it ends up being.
167  Astral Projection & Out of Body Experiences / Welcome to Out of Body Experiences! / Re: Has anyone ever seen God? on: December 20, 2013, 16:39:52
How could you see God without being God?

If you seen the edge of a flipper, would you say you had seen a blue whale?

The way God is generally defined  in most circles has to do with totality, unity, and infinity; we are equipped to conceptualize ideas like those, but we are not equipped to experience them.

What thing, had you seen it, would have made you say you had seen God? A lot of light? How would something like that, or in fact any finite experience you would have had explain a concept like God fully? I don't doubt you could see something very impressive, but I am near certain whatever it was would fall far short of the definitions ascribed to God.

Did you maybe consider that you are at this very moment experiencing God, and to experience God any more than this, you would perhaps have to be better equipped to experience than you are now?
168  Astral Projection & Out of Body Experiences / Welcome to Astral Projection Experiences! / Re: Blast From the Past! on: December 19, 2013, 12:48:39
That is pretty funny Lion. If you recall a few months back... I met Astral Bruce Springsteen, and he held a concert... in a classroom no less, lol.
169  Astral Chat / Welcome to Astral Chat! / Re: stress cause of almost all illnesses? cool experience. on: December 17, 2013, 20:25:58
No, I don't think the relationship is 90-10, but it is quite significant and understated. I would guess maybe 40-65% of illness is attitude and mind states. There may be some people for whom mental states are a more important indicator, but those people are probably statistical outliers such as monks who focus on mental development for long times.

A huge part of illness is genetic components and predispositions, and another big factor is environmental exposures such as radiation or carcinogens or force fields such as the magnetic fields around electrical equipment. And also far on top is diet, which is probably only slightly less important than attitude, but more important than genetics or pharmacology for disease incidence and effects.

There is a kind of divide right now between Allopathic and Osteopathic medicine in the west; the Allopathic consists of things like surgeries, pharmaceuticals, and physical examinations. The Osteopathic encompasses all those things, but then also includes psychology and diet as important factors. The funny thing is, our society highly favors Allopathic practice, and denegrates Osteopathy, even though Osteopathy is more inclusive (for instance, the worst Allopathic medicine schools are about as selective as the best Osteopathic ones, so the assumption is that Osteopaths are flunky Allopaths, lol, whereas they actually have the superior educations.)
170  Astral Chat / Welcome to Members Introductions! / Re: Hello! on: December 17, 2013, 00:16:56

We're all friends here lol

Well, mostly everyone...

.....

except Tricky-cross-eyed Pete the sandwich thief. Tricky Pete doesn't have so many friends these days.
171  Astral Chat / Welcome to Members Introductions! / Re: CAUTION: Musician member here:-) on: December 16, 2013, 08:41:34
Hi Marius, I visited a few places in Romania a while back; Sighisoara, Crit, Malancrav, and about a dozen others; we were on a historic survey to document the 12th century Saxon sites. They are around Tarnava Mare in the Transylvania area- what part of the country are you from?

I also love playing the violin  wink

I am not spectacular at it, better at the piano, but it is a great instrument!

You can try to project in all sorts of positions. Lying upon the back seems to work best for most, but many others have done it from a chair or on their side. Also important is what time of day you try; most of us found that early morning, after you wake up in the middle of the night but before it is actually time to wake up is the best time. You will be well-rested so you will be less likely to fall asleep, and your body is best wired to enter that state at that time as it is preparing to put you back to sleep.

172  Astral Chat / Welcome to Astral Chat! / Re: Something to ponder not actually do on: December 14, 2013, 23:28:33
It really depends on the substance. They are not all the same. You wouldn't compare Tylenol to Prozac, or coffee to methamphetamines, so there really isn't a responsible way to make a blanket statement about all "drugs". A few have their uses, and some should never be touched by anyone.

I am assuming you are talking about heroin or something similar (you don't have to say which), to which I would reply with most of the drugs of that class, there is simply no safe way to experiment with them. Just as you would be hard-pressed to find a doctor to tell you the safe level of cyanide you can drink, I don't think any responsible person would recommend any dose of those drugs for any reason. You wouldn't use a flame thrower to light a birthday candle, and I am afraid that is what you are doing when you are trying to derive benefits from something of that addictive and toxicological severity.
173  Astral Chat / Welcome to News and Media! / Re: Nelson Mandela Transitioned on: December 12, 2013, 21:55:44
A lot of people seem to remember Mandela dying in prison, and so many in fact that some among those have theorized it is a symptom of a timeline shift. Somehow I don't think that is the reason... I feel like there must have been some event that a mass number of people confused or mis-remembered as Mandela dying in prison. Not sure what that might have been though...
174  Bug Reports and Questions / Forums Bugs Reports and Questions / Re: Avatar Image Problems on: December 11, 2013, 08:51:57
That is funny, because it said you have been here for precisely a week, lol, so that must mean from day one.

Maybe the image is incorrect scale? I know that the avatar function likes images on the smallish size more toward thumbnail scale.
175  Astral Chat / Welcome to News and Media! / Re: Nelson Mandela Transitioned on: December 06, 2013, 09:58:46
At first I thought you were talking about the Mandela "timeline split" idea that so many people brought up, lol:

http://mandelaeffect.com/nelson-mandela-died-in-prison

Then I noticed he was dead for real, not in some internet fantasy lol.
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