"transplanted organs affected the personality of the person who received the organ. Personal characteristics of the donor were caried over to the other person. For example a guy got one organ (i dont remember exactly which) from a person who died in early twenties in motorcycle incident and who liked eating chicken and led unhealthy lifestyle. Then that guy started eating chicken although he never ate it before and started to act differently. Some people also gor memories from other person."

  malganis, wasnt that the movie "body parts"? Heh. Im just being sarcastic, my apologies. I get tired of reading replies by opponents of the obe experience, especially when they claim to have had an obe but knew it was just a dream. Each is in the right to have their own opinion, but a lot of what some of these opponents claim seems like only a semi lucid dream, where they have very little control over the dream itself. I dont think a lot of what some of these people described was a full blown obe in the first place. When I first had semi lucid dreams it was interesting to say the least, but I would never mix a lucid or semi lucid dream up with obe's I would only do that if I never had an obe. Thats okay though, whoever wishes to worship the physical and materialism are in a way trapped but in the physical mindset they are right to. If I were to look at this argument from the physical side and mindset I would say that the ones who are were completely in the right. However looking from this from my perspective and from my point of view its an illogical outlook. No matter what evidence or proof I put up will do anything to sway someone looking from purely the physical aspect, and vice versa. However in the debate aspect I think that a lot of people are losing direction, with comments such as "you are getting upset because you can't win fair and square". Come on most of you are beyond these comments, however not all of you.

     Sure, I appreciate that. There are other studies that were done, even another study that almost mirrors the one I posted the exception is that they used pain instead of images of emotional or neutral aspects. The results were the same as well, there are reflexes/reactions they see occurring right before the actual event takes place. So there is a host of studies I could use to back up what I have to say. The thing is that I dont only see science as the only way to prove or experience these things.
     Though a good amount of scientific studies does back up some of the ideas I put forth though, such as physical actions/reactions are a result of the mind/consciousness rather than the other way around which a lot of people believe. That we (our consciousness) continue to thrive after physical elimination of the physical body. Even science says that energy cannot be created nor destroyed, the only that changes is its form. So in a way someone who is scientifically minded might find theirselves in a paradox in that yes our thoughts, and the consciousness we use to derive our decisions/thoughts is a form of energy, yet they believe our consciousness ceases to exist once we physically die.
    I hope I dont need to point it out, if I do then - If energy can not be created nor destroyed, how can it be that your consciousness and thoughts cease to exist once the physical body dies as they too are a form of energy? I dont need others here to elaborate on an answer to the question as its meant to be rhetorical. I already know the answer, and Ive found from my experiences I am right. I dont want others to be swayed one way or another just by what I say though. Believe what you want to believe, but you owe it to yourselves to search, research, experiment, and experience before you arrive at what you feel is a solid answer. Regards,
                                                                  T.L.

    The stages I go through before projection, hypnogogia,mind awake/body asleep(accompanied by sleep paralysis)/seeing through closed eye lids/vibrations/projection.  While in sleep paralysis I can always each and everytime see through my closed eye lids. There are still a lot of misgivings and misunderstandings about the events leading up to projection, I have no idea why as all of this has been covered so many times up and down the forums here.  Anyway to disprove or prove to myself a long time ago that I was indeed seeing through my closed eye lids I would take my digital alarm clock and put it next to me as I lay down, it displayed he time in huge red numbers which is perfect because the vision is not always crystal clear.  When I got to the mind awake/body asleep and I could see I would look at the clock down to the very second try to snap myself out of it (note I said try because at this point Im paralyzed so its hard to do) after a few tries I succeeded and looked at the clock it was exactly the time I noted when my eyes were closed (minus a few seconds of course).
   Being as skeptic as I was I did this ten times, succeeded each time I was able to snap myself out of paralysis. Later I realized well perhaps my mind was just good at taking educated guesses at the time. So I faced a television on a stand turned it to a channel I never watch, and muted the television so I could not here it. Then I went into mind awake/body asleep (which can take a long while depending) waited for the vision to kick in noted what show and what was going on in it visually then snapped myself out when I could and it was the same show I was watching with closed eyelids. I did this numerous times and everytime I was able to sit up from paralysis I was right on the money as to the show and what was going on in it. I realized I was in fact seeing through my closed eyelids.
   At the time I was married and my ex wife had the same experiences too regarding sleep paralysis and seeing through her closed eyelids when she was in paralysis, the only exception is that paralysis scared the living crap out of her and it was not an enjoyable experience for her. So from my experience and a few others' your experience seems to gel with my experiences leading up to projection. So you were probably very very close to the vibration stage. Usually it happens as I can see through my closed eyelids or what feels to be a few seconds later after the vision first kicks in. Keep it up good luck, dont let it scare you too much as it will hinder your progress.

Earlier I said that perhaps our physical actions are just reactions to our mind rather than our mind and thoughts are the reaction of the physical. I wanted to back this up with the study I mentioned...

http://www.newsmonster.co.uk/have-scientists-really-proved-that-man-can-see-into-the-future.html     and

http://www.quantumconsciousness.org/pdfs/presentiment.pdf (the actual study report)

this study shows that volunteers in this experiment have physical reactions to images before they actually physically see them. which means the volunteers can see the future albeit subconsciously and a small amount of time before. This shows that physical actions/reactions are the result of the conscious/subconscious mind.

The only thing I was doing before I was able to acheive obe's is meditation. I was not into meditation for projection though, I was interested in meditation first and then meditation made me interested in projection because of all the weird things that were happening to me while meditating. So I believe no its not needed. The whole idea when it comes to projection is intent. You have to be strong willed and you have to intend on it so much that your subconscious sees that strong intent and then acts accordingly. So if reading/using the new energy ways section will make the difference to your subconscious who am I to tell you not to, I would say do it, it can only help show your subconscious your intent is strong.

I do not get vibrations until my physical body is completely asleep. Sometimes this happens without the person noticing, and rightfully so. The body will fall asleep once the conscious mind is no longer focused on it, the main thing is youll notice you cant feel anything... physically speaking. If you are still able to feel anything from the physical body then it is not asleep yet. Once people cross that barrier and are in a state of conscious mind, body asleep the vibrations start to pick up. So if you think you are having the vibrations yet you can sit up physically with no problem, I would suggest to you that you are not at the state we call the vibrations. When I get this if I wanted to sit up physically I would not be able to because my body is paralyzed as it went to sleep. This is just a suggestion to point you in the right direction. Good luck, I hope you succeed.

     Yes and yes. I wasnt aware that people originally came up with it for lucid dreaming though. It helps induce the body asleep/mind awake state that is essential to conscious exit projection.  It helps for people that are just starting out induce the state easier. After years of practice/success I can do it by an act of will if the conditions are right, its like a mental process and very hard to explain. Im sure though that the interrupted sleep technique works in that it will make your body be physically tired still, and have the conscious mind awake and somewhat refreshed. There are a lot of misunderstandings about the states that need to be reached before conscious exit is possible. If you forget hypnogogia (something which too many get too caught up in discussing) the most important state to reach is mind awake/body asleep. Now Im not saying okay if you use this technique and you get to mind awake/body asleep you will 100 percent sure have a projection.
     There are a lot of things to take into consideration. When you enter this state all sorts of weird things happen and it might either freak you out, and scare the living crap out of you, or you could lose consciousness if consciousness is dwindling. Usually its most likely the first situation that will happen. Some start getting vibrations and swear they are being electrocuted and end the attempt. Others hear a loud boom which sounds like a bomb going off next to their head and it snaps them out of the attempt as well. Others start to get out and get way to scared to go on. As long as you are long passed the fear stage you should be fine and should succeed. Either way good luck and let me know what happens. People who often use this technique suggest you start it around 11pm. I used it during the day the few times I did use it, so it depends on what kind of schedule you keep. Im a third shifter so I do most of my attempts early morning - late afternoon. Once again good luck and let me know how you come along.

The subconscious seems to be a huge part of ourselves in the obe state. Even though you are completely conscious and able to freely form thoughts consciously the subconscious still acts on any conscious or subconscious thoughts. Obviously your subconscious thoughts wont be known to you consciously, that is why they are called subconscious thoughts. If they were conscious to you then you would be able to rectify them. Also a thought is a real thing, obviously we do not see this in the physical existence we live day to day. But lets look at this even if its just in a dream perspective. You think of an apple and intend on one being there, your subconscious creates that apple for you. In this lucid dream you can pick it up, smell it, feel it, see it, and taste it. Even though this apple was only a thought derived from you it is as real as anything else in this dream state. What some call thoughtforms are still perceived to be entities even though it was derived from someones mind it is still seperate too from them and seem to have their own thoughts.
 Some even view their own subconscious as a seperate person from theirselves. Its a crazy illogical kind of way to look at it but either way you look at it you could be right. In a lucid dream I had I wanted to hold an experiment, this was to create an "empty" person.
    Basically just a shell, I did this the person was there but had no seeming thoughts, reaction etc.. then I told myself I want my subconscious to use this vehical in which to speak and interact with me. Sure enough the person starts to move, looks at me weird. Then tells me that even though I seem sure of myself I am not as aware as I would like to think of myself as being. I told him I can see everything very clearly. I am away that my physical body is laying down in bed and that I am consciously active in my own mind, I know the name by which I live in the physical and all my past memories of that physical life, I am pretty damn sure I am aware of everything. He reaches in his pocket and pulls out a cell phone, and opens it up and hands it to me. I am confused and say hello? I hear at first what seems to be static, then I listen closer and its a drooling kind of moaning and snoaring sound. Then after a few second I repeat hello, who is this, then I hear everything Im saying through the phone as if it were some weird echo, then I realize that it is me in the physical talking in my sleep. Everything Im saying was being repeated by my physical body, it was as if my subconscious created a link to the physical in which I can observe my body making all sorts of noises, vocalizations, and sounds. Even though my subconscious acted like a seperate person it was part of me speaking to myself, even though it had its own thoughts and did unpredictable things. Regards,
                  T.L.

"A neurotransmitter like adrenaline is released, what can you say about this?
Would it change your thoughts on stuff?
Yes it would, there are only 2 options for a neurotransmitter, it either releases or it doesn't"

   I completely understand what you are trying to say and where you are coming from. You can drop it down to the smallest possible scale on the physical level and mentality but who is to say that the physical action/reaction is the cause of a thought, and not vice versa. Its like trying to argue what came first the chicken or the egg? The brain is the physical tool in which our consciousness can interact with the physical, so all you are saying now still can be explained by what Im saying. There was a study done a while back about thoughts and physical reactions etc.. Theres a certain physical response we get to certain imagery, feelings etc.. People would be shown an image an the correlating physical reaction would be gauged. They noticed in the study that the physical reactions were being seen before the images were shown by  fractions of a second. This shows that the brain is reacting to the images before we even really see the images physically, so this points to what Im saying that the physical reactions/actions are caused by the consciousness not the other way around. I know we are going back and forth here, and truth be told no matter how many times we keep at this we are still going to be in disagreement. Sure it would be nice to have physical proof to show you and prove to you that there is a little more to existence than you think. But its not necessary.
   The whole reason I am involved with this website and forum is to help those who are willing to try and experiment succeed in doing so. I want to help others who are cursious as I used to be about matters of projection, to have success in projection. To give direction and tips to those trying but not succeeding. I used to be whole heartedly against projection because I thought that the world we live in physically was all there is and ever will be, but I was wrong. Im not saying Im always right, but I know that this is not all there is to existence. When I had my own personal experiences at first I was still not convinced of course I dove deeper and deeper and come out with answers. The more scientific research I read up on the nature of consciousness, thoughts..etc.. the more those studies seemed to point to the obviousness of everything I was realizing. I wish I was wrong sometimes existing is boring, Ill give anyone that much, it would be nice once I get very old and tired of life. I would be happy if once Im done here Im done for good anywhere, it would be great to know I would be wiped out of existence. What better vacation? I want you to be right, but me wanting you to be right does not however make you right. There are some things we agree on but throwing the whole physical existence down to the simplest terms right or wrong when it comes to it on a physical level, does not make it the only existence and does not give validity to the claim that the non physical does not exist. I need rest as well. It was nice conversing with all of you today. Regards,
                                                                                     T.L.

     Are you of the belief that our thoughts actually exist in this plane? For instance lets just use the lucid dream state as the example here, while you are in this lucid dream walking around remarking at how real this is (even though you know it to be just a conscious dream) you purposely touch things to see if you can feel them, you conclude you can. You smell, taste, hear and after all that you conclude yes you can do all those things. Yet you are not using the physical body to do any of this. You are really there in the lucid dream, you are experiencing everything, so it is a reality. Also this whole dream itself, who can say it is in the physical dimension. it certainly isnt or else dream objects would be physical objects. No one can also say it wasnt reality, because for the short duration you were there you it was real or else you wouldnt be experiencing it. How can one experience something and say it didnt exist? What is the nature existance? That is what we are talking about.
   Dont get me wrong Im not saying obe's are dreams I am saying that dreams themselves are still a reality no matter how you look at it. To say you have no free will at all is just a sketchy comment.  I want to type this to you so therefore I am, I am coming up with all my remarks of my own accord. I dont have something forcing me to do this. I can remain here or lay down to sleep, I am of the belief that I can do either one I choose. I do not have anything forcing me one way or the other. Everything down to the very last detail is not pre-arranged for me. If it was and I was of the belief I would of shot myself a long time ago because that would mean nothing really matters, no choice you could ever make would be your own so what why would living help at all? However my experiences tell me otherwise and I have been free up to now to do and experience anything I choose to. As for consciousness existing, I am thinking at this very moment, I can interpret anything how I like. So as far as being able to formulate my own thoughts, and make decisions tells me yes I am conscious and have a consciousness, if I leave out all my experiences to date and just go by being able to freely think and communicate. Regards,
                             T.L.

"We view things with our eyes, we hear with our ears, but it gets more complicated when it goes to the brain.
After you've sensed feelings, hear sounds, seen things, these are put in your hippocampus in your brain correct?
So how come when you go to the astral plane, you still have all your memory?
Never mind that, how come you take your whole brain over to the other side?
Isn't your brain matter?
So you take only your brain to the astral plain, nothing else?
How about eyes? Ears?
You can't exactly see without your eyes and hear without your ears."

   You are too stuck on the physical aspect of everything, that is what Im trying to tell you. You are making too many assumptions. Sure information we gather is categorized in the brain, we are in agreement on that. Whose to say that is the only place memories are stored and accessed. Why is it that in altered states of consciousness memories long forgotten are spontaneously remembered etc.. You are assuming that the brain is absolutely the only place memories are stored. You are assuming that consciousness itself only exists within the human brain, even many leading scientists dont even subscribe to that way of thought. Some admit that they dont know if consciousness itself is literally "in the brain". Without our consciousness we would not even be able to see, hear, taste,feel,smell. Our hands, eyes, nose, mouth, are just interfaces in which physically we experience the senses as we know it, but in order to experience those senses of the physical body we need our consciousness.
    So if we need our consciousness to do all these things in the physical, it is very safe to say that if obe's are a possibility if you can bring yourself to admit the possibility, and you seperate the consciousness from the constraints of the physical. Consciousness alone can recreate these sensations. As long as you arent suspended in the physical and are only existing within the mental.
   There is sort of an example I can relate here, is it your opinion that your ears are the only way to hear period? Can you give me an example in which one could hear without the ears? The reason I ask is because the way you talk you are only viewing from one perspective only. There are tons of possibilities and to only believe in one ultimate existence would be a fools choice, especially when no one can claim to know all about existence. The nonphysical does not follow physical principles as we know them to be. The brain is a tool in which our consciousness can interact with the physical, so yes without the brain we would not exist and wouldnt be capable of a physical existence. That does not mean however the brain created the consciousness. Im not attacking you personally either like you said I was. I was just stating my opinions on the way you look at things. Never the less sorry if you thought I was. Regards,
                T.L.

Thirdeyeopen, I think you have smoked entirely too much ganja. 
To smoke it and forget why exactly you smoke it lmao need I say more? That was a great post man love it.

   There has been a lot of debate on the subject as to what it is...etc. What most who have gone there allegedly anyway, say that it is a place or what have you where all the excess energy goes from past, present, future events, thoughts, etc.. and that people just interpret it as a library, or a scroll, computer, and things that embody knowledge or information. As we all know here perception is the difference. Some may perceive in an obe that wasted energy is trash, or garbage. Its all about how the brain reprocesses this information upon reentry, when the brain is trying to relate its experience in physical terms. I cant tell you from my experiences as I havent even noticed or tried to find out if it even exists. All energy goes somewhere, so Im sure places such as this exists. I think it would probably be impossible for it not to exist the way I look at it. Also those who have related their experiences said that if they tried to read their own information regarding their future as they read it it changes as they read it, but if they read someone elses or what have you it would stay the same. So perhaps reading their own changed their personal future. Its hard to say, I will though for sure have to intend on going there next time I get a chance. I have so many things I want to do and some things I have to finish doing while out, so when the opportunity arises my list of things comes to mind and Im off doing something instantly. So I will intend on going there in the near future and relate any of my experiences with it here. Regards,
                                         T.L.

Actually I didnt say everything you said is nonsense. I said your logic to me is nonsense. That and just coming up with theories about how the world works or doesnt overnight is comical to me as well. Arguing back and forth about what you think and what my experiences tell me isnt going to help anyone. Really what we are doing here isnt what this forum was meant for. Im not going to sit here though and perpetuate this argument further. Im sorry if anything I said offended you. Regards,
                                                         T.L.

      Careful who you put your faith into. I know there are some who are the real thing when it comes to mediums, but its hard to find them trust me. They are very few and far between, too much greed out there if you know what I mean. Having said that anyone who can project can get there, anyone without a strong religious belief. I say that because the vibration rate at which the reception area Im speaking of is a little higher than a lot of the religious sort of places out there. From my experience and Im sure others, people with a certain religious belief will sort of just get stuck at the vibrational level at which others in his/her belief end up. So if you get caught up in a religion and the place those go with that religion is at a lower vibration rate than that of the reception you will get stuck there. Now its not a permanent kind of situation its just a problem that one can overcome if they can come to the realization that their belief is not the one true religion or what have you. I dont think its something that the majority of projectors will have to worry about as a lot of us have no formal religious belief, which is the only seeming reason I can altogether bypass those religious type places in the obe state.  As to the how you can get there that is tricky to explain.
   I have happened upon it by chance (the reception area) once I got there though Im able to know just end up there at will by holding a part of the place in my mind. I guess its kind of like locking on to the vibration rate so I can just kind of "skip" to it or what have you. How I originally got there I was thinking to myself about where the non religious end up when they leave the physical for good. This was a long time ago so I can not promise to the exact wording of what I was thinking of, but this is as close to it as I can remember.