Has projection evolved or devolved?

[Xanth]

There are two realms.  Physical and non-physical.

What I've come to realize is that there is only "one" realm.

What we call the physical is nothing but a mere point of view in relation to what we call the non-physical.

I'm starting to see how interconnected "here" and "there" really are.  They're two sides of the same coin?  Sort to speak.

They're so interconnected that sometimes it's hard to tell where one ends and the other begins.

[Lionheart]

.Society and its expectations have changed.  In the recent past (Early 1900's), it was occult groups doing the projecting.  These people took it as a serious spiritual practice that was the other side of their physical lives.  

This is so true PR and can be witnessed here everyday. I have found that we have a number of new people that come here and expect "miracles" right away. This new generation seems to me to be a "now" generation. If it doesn't happen right away, move on to the next thing that you are curious of. We get questions everyday here that have been answered again and again. We have Stickies that are here to aid people, that have been written by people that are serious about Astral Travel, so serious they have are making it an "artform", but still it takes too much time for someone to read a post or reply. I don't understand that at all. When I first got into sales years ago, I found the top person in the company and hung on their coat tails. I went out to eat with them, drink with them, I wanted to learn everything I could possibly could. I would basically ask them if they could be my "mentor" of sorts. When I first came to this website, I found the people that were good at Astral Projection and started sending them PM's asking for tips. I went back in their History and read every post they had written here. I went to every link that they supplied.  I don't see this anymore, I don't see the deep will and commitment and this is definitely what is needed to learn and understand what it is we are being taught. I have personally done more research on this topic in the last year and half then I have ever done on anything in my life and still I am just at the beginning. This is an artform and I don't think in one's entire lifetime that they could ever master it to a "t'. Just when you think you are getting the hang of it, a new level approaches and shows you that you basically know nothing. This is a school that you never really graduate from, you just keep getting upgraded.

[Volgerle]

This thread reminded me of what 'vintage' projector Sylvan Muldoon wrote about it. He was an experienced RTZ-only projector, so he might fit the hypothesis. However, here is what he says and I think that it clearly contradicts the proposition that it wasn't widely done by people within the 'occult' or 'medium' scene back then:

Read downwards from "As far as higher astral conditions are concerned"

http://books.google.de/books?id=Z3hRU7_mCVEC&pg=PA179&hl=de&source=gbs_toc_r&cad=4#v=snippet&q=%22So%20far%20as%20higher%20astral%20conditions%20are%20concerned%22&f=false

So, in a nutshell, Muldoon mentions occultists or mediums who project to the "higher planes" all the time and he was even told that he might not be 'evolved' enough because he couldn't do it (as he admits). So this view would back up the argument of 'evolution' when we start to reach higher planes too. (I myself can confirm what others write here: I started to have RTZ projections and after a few of them never anymore).

Regarding older literature, please remember all the Theosophical or other occult books by Leadbetter, Blavatsky, Besant and others. They drew maps of astral / mental planes and bodies. How would / why should they have done it if they had't been "there" experiencing it for themselves. It is true that they derived a lot of their 'cosmology' from Buddhist or Hindu teachings already, but they were avid experiencers and themselves, like many secret societies then.

[Xanth]

This thread reminded me of what 'vintage' projector Sylvan Muldoon wrote about it. He was an experienced RTZ-only projector, so he might fit the hypothesis. However, here is what he says and I think that it clearly contradicts the proposition that it wasn't widely done by people within the 'occult' or 'medium' scene back then:

Read downwards from "As far as higher astral conditions are concerned"

http://books.google.de/books?id=Z3hRU7_mCVEC&pg=PA179&hl=de&source=gbs_toc_r&cad=4#v=snippet&q=%22So%20far%20as%20higher%20astral%20conditions%20are%20concerned%22&f=false

So, in a nutshell, Muldoon mentions occultists or mediums who project to the "higher planes" all the time and he was even told that he might not be 'evolved' enough because he couldn't do it (as he admits). So this view would back up the argument of 'evolution' when we start to reach higher planes too. (I myself can confirm what others write here: I started to have RTZ projections and after a few of them never anymore).

Regarding older literature, please remember all the Theosophical or other occult books by Leadbetter, Blavatsky, Besant and others. They drew maps of astral / mental planes and bodies. How would / why should they have done it if they had't been "there" experiencing it for themselves. It is true that they derived a lot of their 'cosmology' from Buddhist or Hindu teachings already, but they were avid experiencers and themselves, like many secret societies then.

I don't believe that for a second.

Granted, I haven't read any of his books yet... but it seems to me that *EVERYONE* has projections not in the RTZ.  The difference with Muldoon (and let's be honest, with most people who claim to have nothing but RTZ projections) is that he didn't recognize them as such, so he probably greatly ignored those projections.  I see this happening on a massive scale from new people who come here to the Astral Pulse.  People completely ignoring valid experiences because they don't line up to someone else's expectations or what someone else has told them it "should" be like.

In this case, Muldoon was Muldoon's worst enemy... and it shows that we need to drop two things in order to fully free ourselves to experience:  BELIEF and LABELS.
Drop those two things and just EXPERIENCE, and you'll open yourself up to everything reality has to offer.

[todd421757]

Thank for the replies Personalreality, Lightbeam, Volgerle.

[personalreality]

What I've come to realize is that there is only "one" realm.

What we call the physical is nothing but a mere point of view in relation to what we call the non-physical.

I'm starting to see how interconnected "here" and "there" really are.  They're two sides of the same coin?  Sort to speak.

They're so interconnected that sometimes it's hard to tell where one ends and the other begins.

Oh I don't disagree at all.  It's just easier to explain it this way.  It's just like Yin and Yang are a whole, which is why in their most common symbol there is a little yin in the yang and a little yang in the yin.  They are inseparable.

In the aboriginal dreamtime paradigm.  the dreamtime provides the form for the physical and the physical provides the dreamtime with purpose. 

The same for Jung's archetypes.  They aren't inert concepts, they are the basis of our reality and we in turn function through them.

Even better, Earth is one planet with a night and a day.  It isn't a different planet at night or during the day, it's just a different perspective.

[Stookie_]

Once you see (not theorize) that "all is one", the separations make so much more sense. I've said it before, I'll say it again, there's a microcosm and a macrocosm and both are true.

Regarding whether projection has evolved or devolved, I don't think either... or a bit of both. I suppose it reflects society - in certain ways we've advanced a lot, in other ways we've become much more materialistic and egotistical. But if you're living right, you shouldn't have to worry about that.

[todd421757]

Thank you Stookie for the reply.