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Author Topic: Are we Gods??  (Read 11605 times)
Lost soul
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« on: November 17, 2014, 06:55:54 »

Recently after some searching and thinking i made up some conclusions:

every spirit chose to reincarnate to learn new stuff we all know that.

In the none physical world there is an infinite numbers of realities and dimensions.

every spirit can make - create what ever it want's

what i thought for some times that the physical universe is some sort of school for education new young god's which it's us as spirits

after learning so many things in so many life times we might reach some sort of level or rank that the Buddhists call it "Enlightenment"

which a point i believe the spirit is ready to start it's own universe and even create other new spirits of his own to raise them and teach them the way our god thought us

there are many common theories these days tells us about spirits before living a life in the physical world they make a lot planning and discussions with the who so called elders

the existence of the elders prove that the spirits are different in their ages just like us in the physical
some of us are old spirits and some others are new and young.
 
it could also prove that God isn't stopping giving birth to new baby spirits all the time 

i begone to imagine that reaching the Enlightenment for a spirit is a level of growing where the spirit can become an adult God and even becoming able to create life and new spirits in it's own new universe

because at that point a spirit learned so far enough to take the responsibilities of taking care it's new children and it's own universe. Just like a man becoming ready to take care his own family and house     


 infinite numbers of universes creates even more  infinite numbers of universes and it's been going on like that since ever!.

which it's crazy i know. but if someone has other opinion about the cosmos let me know Smiley

None of us really understand how everything started from the beginning. or even if it had a beginning.

it's just my conclusions
« Last Edit: November 17, 2014, 07:05:35 by Lost soul » Logged

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« Reply #1 on: November 17, 2014, 08:31:05 »

That would be the goal.
Enlightenment doesn't mean that you're god tho, it just means you understood what life is really about.
If you are a polytheist then yeah, I mean you can eventually be a god or call yourself some kind of god.
I mean I prefer the word Celestial Deity, you are a god in the universe serving the probably Ultimate god that created everything.
Who knows... I don't for sure I mean I wish but I don't think anyone can understand that as a human being.
This is a very delicate subject, I would say that to me this would reflect more the teachings from the Tao.
I particularly like The Zhong Lü Chuan Dao Ji, which describe what would be the stages through immortality here let me quote:

Quote
The Zhong Lü Chuan Dao Ji lists five classes of immortals:

Guǐxiān (鬼仙—"Ghost Immortal"): A person who cultivates too much yin energy. These immortals are likened to Vampires because they drain the life essence of the living, much like the fox spirit. Ghost immortals do not leave the realm of ghosts.

Rénxiān (人仙—Human Immortal”): Humans have an equal balance of yin and yang energies, so they have the potential of becoming either a ghost or immortal. Although they continue to hunger and thirst and require clothing and shelter like a normal human, these immortals do not suffer from aging or sickness. Human immortals do not leave the realm of humans. There are many sub-classes of human immortals, as discussed above under Shījiě xiān.

Dìxiān (地仙—“Earth Immortal”): When the yin is transformed into the pure yang, a true immortal body will emerge that does not need food, drink, clothing or shelter and is not affected by hot or cold temperatures. Earth immortals do not leave the realm of earth. These immortals are forced to stay on earth until they shed their human form.

Shénxiān (神仙—"Spirit Immortal"): The immortal body of the earthbound class will eventually change into vapor through further practice. They have supernatural powers and can take on the shape of any object. These immortals must remain on earth acquiring merit by teaching mankind about the Tao. Spirit immortals do not leave the realm of spirits. Once enough merit is accumulated, they are called to heaven by a celestial decree.

Tiānxiān (天仙—“Celestial Immortal”): Spirit immortals who are summoned to heaven are given the minor office of water realm judge. Over time, they are promoted to oversee the earth realm and finally become administrators of the celestial realm. These immortals have the power to travel back and forth between the earthly and celestial realms.
-wiki Xian (Taoism)

To me this would be a plausible answer but again, it all depends on your spirit, I mean, there's no answer to what really is after you achieved all of that.

I think you definitely need to be enlightened to get to that stage but then it may happen to new spirits who evolve faster.
To me tho, you would really need to teach people about enlightenment and spread awareness to become a higher being.
Becoming a Celestial Immortal requires an entire devotion, and a full understanding and awareness of what the universe is.
Would probably take millenniums earth years to achieve such a thing.
Unless you already have accumulated all this teaching on earth and you are enlightened, and reincarnate enlightened just to keep teaching people then I guess you need to do it from the beginning or from where you left off in your past life.

Theses are just speculations tho... even an enlightened beings can't fully understand the concept behind the universe. Maybe I'm wrong tho.
But that enlightened being need to have been through the highest planes...
And I don't know if at that point that person can go on earth. I think there's probably restrictions as to what you can do at that stage. Maybe send some signs or something.

I don't know... We'll see...
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« Reply #1 on: November 17, 2014, 08:31:05 »

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Szaxx
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« Reply #2 on: November 17, 2014, 10:47:00 »

To add to the immensity, all the physical universes are contained in one shadow of a four dimensional one.
That takes some getting your head around.
Youtube flatland for a simplified introduction to the multidimensional aspect on this. We all understand three dimensions naturally. Any 3D shape is a shadow in 4D.

Mind blowing...
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« Reply #3 on: November 17, 2014, 14:00:58 »

To add to the immensity, all the physical universes are contained in one shadow of a four dimensional one.
That takes some getting your head around.
Youtube flatland for a simplified introduction to the multidimensional aspect on this. We all understand three dimensions naturally. Any 3D shape is a shadow in 4D.

Mind blowing...

mind...not...computing...
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Lost soul
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« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2014, 21:55:31 »

That would be the goal.
Enlightenment doesn't mean that you're god tho, it just means you understood what life is really about.
If you are a polytheist then yeah, I mean you can eventually be a god or call yourself some kind of god.
I mean I prefer the word Celestial Deity, you are a god in the universe serving the probably Ultimate god that created everything.
Who knows... I don't for sure I mean I wish but I don't think anyone can understand that as a human being.
This is a very delicate subject, I would say that to me this would reflect more the teachings from the Tao.
I particularly like The Zhong Lü Chuan Dao Ji, which describe what would be the stages through immortality here let me quote:
 -wiki Xian (Taoism)

To me this would be a plausible answer but again, it all depends on your spirit, I mean, there's no answer to what really is after you achieved all of that.

I think you definitely need to be enlightened to get to that stage but then it may happen to new spirits who evolve faster.
To me tho, you would really need to teach people about enlightenment and spread awareness to become a higher being.
Becoming a Celestial Immortal requires an entire devotion, and a full understanding and awareness of what the universe is.
Would probably take millenniums earth years to achieve such a thing.
Unless you already have accumulated all this teaching on earth and you are enlightened, and reincarnate enlightened just to keep teaching people then I guess you need to do it from the beginning or from where you left off in your past life.

Theses are just speculations tho... even an enlightened beings can't fully understand the concept behind the universe. Maybe I'm wrong tho.
But that enlightened being need to have been through the highest planes...
And I don't know if at that point that person can go on earth. I think there's probably restrictions as to what you can do at that stage. Maybe send some signs or something.

I don't know... We'll see...

I appreciate for telling me all of this.
although each person been throw NDE or alot of Astral projections have many different opinions about this

it is very mind blowing indeed
but for what i see for example we can create our own realities. In lucid dreaming for example.

we can even create our own characters in that dream. visiting them over and over again.
but still they well always remain subjects that doesn't have any souls in it

it's only me the god of that small universe i made the real living thing

but also i can imagine it that way: maybe at sort of point or rank you might be able of produce life ( new spirits) in you're own universe 



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« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2014, 21:55:31 »



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Lost soul
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« Reply #5 on: November 17, 2014, 21:56:20 »

To add to the immensity, all the physical universes are contained in one shadow of a four dimensional one.
That takes some getting your head around.
Youtube flatland for a simplified introduction to the multidimensional aspect on this. We all understand three dimensions naturally. Any 3D shape is a shadow in 4D.

Mind blowing...


who know's maybe the entire cosmos is nothing but a lucid dream of a creature that is living in a larger 4 dimensions universe.

or someone who has reached the enlightenment in an older universe and created us. 

maybe god is trying to educate us to become gods like him someday. just like a Parents teaching their kids how to be Parents someday

 that really gives me the headache when i think about it :/


« Last Edit: November 17, 2014, 22:05:35 by Lost soul » Logged

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« Reply #6 on: November 18, 2014, 06:47:16 »

The more you think about it the more your mind shatters.
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« Reply #7 on: November 18, 2014, 06:55:14 »

Are we Gods?
Let's take the familiarity with linear time out of the question.
How many more advanced practitioners of the art have been in that position where all time is available simultaneously?
Add to this the total clarity of mind where everything you've ever learned is instantly available in a flash of thought. You'll have noticed the clarity is way above the natural one in the physical. The physical aspect of size is also known where you can put the galaxy in your hand to seeing the spaces between atoms.
Then add that examination of objects with the hyper clear mind operating, you see the insides, the outsides, the internal workings and all this info is presented in a single thought packet you clearly understand. This sense of 'examination', of knowing, doesn't come close to anything available in the physical world.
It is an imprint in a telepathic sense that all the object has to offer is available instantly.

If all the above is clearly understood and taken for granted then the question starts to have perspective above the 3D world we think we understand.
Although we can create a realm of existance easily, these realms are also controlled by a higher authority. To test this for yourself all you need is hyper clarity and the desire to make a nasty place for (experimental purposes) and see what occurs.
We are no more than children and the most proficient practitioners will most likely agree.
No human mind can understand the communication principles with the source. We at best can see a hazy screenshot of a HD movie by comparison.
We are not Gods,  we are led to believe we can be, to see if our reactions are justifiable in becoming one.
Life is a lesson, that needs some serious thought.

It's also over before it has really begun.


A list of thought provoking comments that should open the mind to more than the eye can see.



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« Reply #8 on: November 18, 2014, 08:38:52 »

Are we Gods?
Let's take the familiarity with linear time out of the question.
How many more advanced practitioners of the art have been in that position where all time is available simultaneously?
Add to this the total clarity of mind where everything you've ever learned is instantly available in a flash of thought. You'll have noticed the clarity is way above the natural one in the physical. The physical aspect of size is also known where you can put the galaxy in your hand to seeing the spaces between atoms.
Then add that examination of objects with the hyper clear mind operating, you see the insides, the outsides, the internal workings and all this info is presented in a single thought packet you clearly understand. This sense of 'examination', of knowing, doesn't come close to anything available in the physical world.
It is an imprint in a telepathic sense that all the object has to offer is available instantly.

If all the above is clearly understood and taken for granted then the question starts to have perspective above the 3D world we think we understand.
Although we can create a realm of existance easily, these realms are also controlled by a higher authority. To test this for yourself all you need is hyper clarity and the desire to make a nasty place for (experimental purposes) and see what occurs.
We are no more than children and the most proficient practitioners will most likely agree.
No human mind can understand the communication principles with the source. We at best can see a hazy screenshot of a HD movie by comparison.
We are not Gods,  we are led to believe we can be, to see if our reactions are justifiable in becoming one.
Life is a lesson, that needs some serious thought.

It's also over before it has really begun.


A list of thought provoking comments that should open the mind to more than the eye can see.





Szaxx is right about this, basically even tho we are really advanced in the physic world and we have a basic to a good understanding of the astral world. We're still like an empty box in the eyes of the source or god. A box with maybe a sheet of paper with our achievements on it... but that's all.
We can do basic stuff, we can imagine great things... We can invent technologies etc. But even tho we are getting good at this stuff, technology doesn't allow us to create a universe.
How I see it is that experienced spiritualists/enlightened persons will be given the privilege to stay there when they die. Basic teachings so that you can learn to create and manipulate energy out there from nothing.
More teaching about spirituality itself, deeper valors meanings, cleansing of the spirit, higher enlightenment. Language, Mathematics, basically everything that you need to learn and much much more. Until you are either called/allowed to go higher.
Then maybe you'll have attempts at creating small universes etc. Maybe there's even something better than universe who knows?
Inventing new spirits maybe? I have no idea.
Maybe there's different kinds of universes... parallel universes or dimensions? maybe learning how to create your own dimension...
There's always a possibility for something more.
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« Reply #9 on: November 18, 2014, 11:02:46 »

Until then, all we can do is save them from their 'locked and cycling world' or get them the hell out of their predicament they seem to be in (retrievals). If we choose to make a river appear or make the forest far more dense  wink , do it without them seeing it.
They escape and you don't fail.

Wonderful experiences to be had once you're in such a position.
 cheesy
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« Reply #10 on: November 18, 2014, 13:21:47 »

Are we gods?

You create your entire reality as you're experiencing it.
Yes, you're a god.
I'm a god.
Each consciousness here is a god.

We're all the authors of our own realities... and each others, this physical reality is nothing more than just one of an infinite number of non-physical realities.
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« Reply #11 on: November 18, 2014, 22:08:13 »

Thanks guys for you're interesting theories.

I do believe how ever every spirit can create what ever it want's

But what makes us deference from the ultimate God of our common reality is that we are not ready yet to start forming other souls like us
we can create Mountains - Sailor - trees -entire planets - even fake living characters. But not real souls yet.   

not until maybe millions of life times we have to live in and learn from every lesson comes from it.

Until then we might be ready to take their responsibilities and raise them
we all now getting raised by god by learning from these life times

we all still none adult children gods either we like or not.

and it's interesting in our physical reality that god is giving us an examples of his ultimate purpose. By allowing us having children and teach them to take responsibilities. just like what he is teaching us.

trust me raising a baby spirit won't be easy Cheesy
even spirit's get throw challenges and pain and sadness and loneliness. some of them even prefer staying in their own hell they create.
 
a child spirit has to get throw many life times to learn. Experiencing of being good or evil. sad and happy.
and they also need guides just like the human children needs them

am sure some of you don't even want to start thinking about it
 
let's also remember something: It's our eternal freedom.

no one well force anything on us

« Last Edit: November 18, 2014, 22:13:42 by Lost soul » Logged

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« Reply #12 on: November 18, 2014, 22:27:16 »

Quote
You create your entire reality as you're experiencing it.
Yes, you're a god.
I'm a god.
Each consciousness here is a god.

I agree with the fundamentals of this. And with this, I personally dont beleive this
Quote
not until maybe millions of life times we have to live in and learn from every lesson comes from it.

since anything is possible IMO, including becoming the type of God most people think of. I could become that without learning as much lessons as you would think, maybe even in this life.

I think everyone has the capability to alter their reality whether they realize it or not.

Good topic to discuss   grin
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« Reply #13 on: November 18, 2014, 22:36:59 »

We are the "gods" or "editors" of our own realities. Think of that as a client-sided thing, though. Yes, we experience our own worlds, but we are only "gods", objectively speaking, in our own realities. We cannot be gods to anyone else unless they let us. We cannot make up another person's world experience. So really, we are only our own gods in our own worlds. In the world outside of our own minds, we are simply just people.
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« Reply #14 on: November 19, 2014, 00:30:44 »

Yes i agree with all of you
but all of us also agree we're still not able to create a separate life (spirit) or consciousness of our own.

let me give you an example: in my lucid dreams i find my self being able to create what ever i want.
even people of my own creation.

i was their god for sure.
but they will still remain Soulless objects.

not unless someone else agreed to share my dream and become something with consciousness  (that also might be good idea to understand how the earth world works) because it's a common huge dream.
 
but anyway no matter how far i can create i still won't have the to ability to create a spirit of my own and become it's god.

not with that childish experience i have compare to the wise elder ones.

because creating a life is a huge responsibility
that's something impotent i learned from star trek Cheesy 

but however maybe at a certain point they well allow me to do that kind of thing.
after having full understanding of what life really is.

this whole cosmos could be nothing but another spirit reality who got his education from an older universe. And now he became our creator and our god and also our universe. 

and that older universe that created ours probably had the same story with even an older OLDER universe Cheesy
this number probably goes on for ever.

At least this is how i imagine it

All evidence shows that life keep growing and expanding even in the none physical without any limitation and keep moving forward


« Last Edit: November 19, 2014, 01:21:47 by Lost soul » Logged

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« Reply #15 on: November 19, 2014, 01:21:07 »

After a lot of thinking I start making some connection between evaluation and reincarnation.

I imagine when a spirit is a new born it knows nothing at all.

It begins to reincarnate in a single cells creatures in earth and many different planet’s. to learn about life and everything in a very slow way.

Reincarnating so fast. And when it became ready to learn more it started to evolve the cells into something more and more sophisticated.

Each “after life” the spirit comes back with more knowledge it get’s from more sophisticated bodies and longer life times.

Until we became human

Now when we come back we come with more knowloge then ever.
I still fail to know who exactly are the elder ones.

They could be god’s from other universes. Or the spirits of wise people like Buddhist monks.

Nobody really knows
I leave that to you to decide

I still believe though that god well never stop forming new spirits.
That’s why reincarnation in animals and cells and Insects well still goes on.

I believe all of us been reincarnating for millions of years. And we reached so far and advanced right now.

And they are still those who are way far behind of us.

It’s a very long and a slow process indeed
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« Reply #16 on: November 19, 2014, 06:57:33 »

After a lot of thinking I start making some connection between evaluation and reincarnation.

I imagine when a spirit is a new born it knows nothing at all.

It begins to reincarnate in a single cells creatures in earth and many different planet’s. to learn about life and everything in a very slow way.

Reincarnating so fast. And when it became ready to learn more it started to evolve the cells into something more and more sophisticated.

Each “after life” the spirit comes back with more knowledge it get’s from more sophisticated bodies and longer life times.

Until we became human

Now when we come back we come with more knowloge then ever.
I still fail to know who exactly are the elder ones.

They could be god’s from other universes. Or the spirits of wise people like Buddhist monks.

Nobody really knows
I leave that to you to decide

I still believe though that god well never stop forming new spirits.
That’s why reincarnation in animals and cells and Insects well still goes on.

I believe all of us been reincarnating for millions of years. And we reached so far and advanced right now.

And they are still those who are way far behind of us.

It’s a very long and a slow process indeed


This is all what life is about, and love, giving the energy you don't need in order to help people around you evolve to the same spiritual level as you.
Most people don't realize they don't need that much energy to go through a day.
When the excess of energy is not properly managed it is wasted.
Energy vampires, or if you prefer, people that use you.

If you have just enough energy to go through your day and you give the excess to god or people who can put it to good use then that's good.
I think god use this excess energy to create more consciousness or distribute it back to the ones in need.

You explained it very well Lost Soul
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« Reply #17 on: November 19, 2014, 21:52:42 »

This is all what life is about, and love, giving the energy you don't need in order to help people around you evolve to the same spiritual level as you.
Most people don't realize they don't need that much energy to go through a day.
When the excess of energy is not properly managed it is wasted.
Energy vampires, or if you prefer, people that use you.

If you have just enough energy to go through your day and you give the excess to god or people who can put it to good use then that's good.
I think god use this excess energy to create more consciousness or distribute it back to the ones in need.

You explained it very well Lost Soul

Thank you my friend 
I really appreciate that Smiley
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« Reply #18 on: November 20, 2014, 02:32:50 »

Yes and no. If everyone is a god... then isn't no one a god?

For a simpler, easier to follow example...

Say you take a feudal, European monarchy, and now declare that everyone is a king. Everyone gets to wear a crown (but not everyone can afford a golden crown, so some people can make theirs out of wood or such). Everyone is in charge, but they can't really make others do what they want, because all the subjects are kings now too. Everyone gets to live in the castle. Are these kings like the king that they had previously? Not really... some things are defined by exclusion.

So if everyone is a god, then being a god means something different than it meant before. The very fact of it being a universal trait means it lost its original definition.

Most meanings of the word that stem from the Greek idea center around the god being the apex of a certain ideal. There are none better than this being at what they excel at. They are the measuring stick against which all others must be compared.

It is another language issue again I think.
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« Reply #19 on: November 21, 2014, 21:53:59 »

Yes and no. If everyone is a god... then isn't no one a god?

For a simpler, easier to follow example...

Say you take a feudal, European monarchy, and now declare that everyone is a king. Everyone gets to wear a crown (but not everyone can afford a golden crown, so some people can make theirs out of wood or such). Everyone is in charge, but they can't really make others do what they want, because all the subjects are kings now too. Everyone gets to live in the castle. Are these kings like the king that they had previously? Not really... some things are defined by exclusion.

So if everyone is a god, then being a god means something different than it meant before. The very fact of it being a universal trait means it lost its original definition.

Most meanings of the word that stem from the Greek idea center around the god being the apex of a certain ideal. There are none better than this being at what they excel at. They are the measuring stick against which all others must be compared.

It is another language issue again I think.


We all humans but not all humans are adults.
the same with gods
we are just young gods who's seeking the Infinite wisdom and knowledge.
and maybe at a certain level they might give us the power to create life   
this how i imagine it
 
« Last Edit: November 21, 2014, 21:58:38 by Lost soul » Logged

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« Reply #20 on: November 21, 2014, 22:21:55 »

If we see god as a continuous spirit creationist then there will never be a time where everyone becomes god, there will always have more spirit to teach.
And if we eventually end up creating spirits too then it's exponential...
To say we're god like the source... No I don't think that's possible unless like I said you merge with it.
But to be a Celestial Overseer creating more universe... yeah that's a possibility.
And beside, it's not like from one day to another everybody will change and decide to go the spiritual path until they become that overseer.
Most people are not even interested in spirituality. Maybe 2 or 3 out of 10 will eventually find their way but the other souls are thrown back in the cycle of reincarnation until they start getting interested I think...

This is a real mystery.
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« Reply #21 on: November 22, 2014, 21:09:57 »

If we see god as a continuous spirit creationist then there will never be a time where everyone becomes god, there will always have more spirit to teach.
And if we eventually end up creating spirits too then it's exponential...
To say we're god like the source... No I don't think that's possible unless like I said you merge with it.
But to be a Celestial Overseer creating more universe... yeah that's a possibility.
And beside, it's not like from one day to another everybody will change and decide to go the spiritual path until they become that overseer.
Most people are not even interested in spirituality. Maybe 2 or 3 out of 10 will eventually find their way but the other souls are thrown back in the cycle of reincarnation until they start getting interested I think...

This is a real mystery.

Yeah it's kind of hard to understand how all of this works with our small minds.

I wonder if you agree with me or not but i see the spirits who need to reincarnate do it by their own will.
like they spend something like 100 years in haven by their own time scale until they realize there is something is missing so they go back to learn more.

and they only do it with their guides and their help after planning for it very carefully.

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« Reply #22 on: November 22, 2014, 21:39:28 »

Yeah it's kind of hard to understand how all of this works with our small minds.

I wonder if you agree with me or not but i see the spirits who need to reincarnate do it by their own will.
like they spend something like 100 years in haven by their own time scale until they realize there is something is missing so they go back to learn more.

and they only do it with their guides and their help after planning for it very carefully.



To me I see reincarnation as an obligation.
How I see it is that you need to reincarnate until you are enlightened.
After that you are free to stay up there or go back to teach people even more about reincarnation and wisdom.
I believe it's obligatory but I also believe that god or the source (whatever you call it) tells us the reason why we need to reincarnate.
If I was a bad spirit (say like hitler for example) then the source probably tells him what he did wrong, but calm his spirit until he understand that there's no other issues than to reincarnate to learn how to control himself. Eventually achieving enlightenment... However long that may take in Hitler's case (lol).
Or if you say that you don't care and you do not want to know anything about it, that he would put you in some kind of purgatory until you are calmed down and then he'd bring you back to tell you again that you need to reincarnate.
Maybe that each of our lives is god's parallel universe and that there's one for each single lives and we have to try em all, or a portion (like a room for each lives that, they're not test but rather destiny and that nothing you do will change the course of your actions, because of that, each room would be programmed to teach you the things you need to understand) See it like this: It would be so precise that anyone going through that life would do the same errors, and the same actions as anyone else going there.
But I believe once you are enlighten that you are free from reincarnation.

I strongly believe that no one can escape reincarnation until they are enlightened.
The reason for that is that it's the ultimate goal of a spirit.
An enlightened spirit stop thinking about his own and start helping others instead.
You may remember some stuff from past lives, or have some celestial flashbacks, I think those are signs that you are getting closer to your enlightenment too.
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« Reply #23 on: November 23, 2014, 14:03:35 »

Even if someone is finished doing everything they want to do, some reincarnate just to go through life again. Some like the experience, some don't.
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« Reply #24 on: November 23, 2014, 17:19:57 »

Maybe we are just those ones that like the experience then  wink
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