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Author Topic: Question about time spent phasing  (Read 8637 times)
travilanche
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« on: September 29, 2011, 10:41:57 »

I have a question about the time a person can spend phasing.  It says in Michael Raduga's guide that a person can only phase for around 10 minutes.  How is this enough time to do some of the incredible things that people talk about doing, like exploring the RTZ, and deep space and things of that nature.  How does that allow time to search through the Akashic records and other such phenomena?  How does it give you the time to go back and reexperience memories from the past?  It is just a confusingly short amount of time.

While reading Mastering Astral Projection in 90 days by Robert Bruce, he makes it sound like you can astral project for hours on end, and do it anytime you want.  What is it that I'm missing here?
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astraladdict
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« Reply #1 on: September 29, 2011, 13:41:30 »

-___- Yet another reason why i prefer to NOT read books and just find the answer by experience. When he says you can only phase for 10 min, chances are only HE can phase for 10 min. You can phase as long as you want to. I've phased for hours so many times.

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« Reply #1 on: September 29, 2011, 13:41:30 »

logoVisit the website of Astral Pulse creator Adrian Cooper.

Home of the best selling book Our Ultimate Reality.

Astral Projection, Metaphysics and many other subjects.

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Xanth
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« Reply #2 on: September 29, 2011, 13:43:29 »

Yeah, it's important if you're going to read books to try and not take everything said as gospel.
I can personally guarantee you that you can project for longer than 10 minutes.  Smiley
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CFTraveler
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« Reply #3 on: September 29, 2011, 16:54:12 »

Ditto.
Plus, I think that it depends every day- some days you can be 'out' for a while, other times, not.
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Stookie_
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« Reply #4 on: September 29, 2011, 16:57:13 »

Yes, it's possible... but I don't find it very easy. The longer you go, the harder it is to maintain awareness and if you click out, there's a good chance you won't remember any of it. That's why it's mostly recommended in the beginning to keep them short and try to wake up and write it down immediately. With practice and experience you can maintain awareness for longer periods of time. Start small.
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« Reply #4 on: September 29, 2011, 16:57:13 »



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CFTraveler
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« Reply #5 on: September 29, 2011, 17:07:31 »

Quote
While reading Mastering Astral Projection in 90 days by Robert Bruce, he makes it sound like you can astral project for hours on end, and do it anytime you want.  What is it that I'm missing here?
Er... please tell me where it says that.
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BlueHalcyon
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« Reply #6 on: September 29, 2011, 21:04:58 »

Well... You can be out for 10 minutes, and it might feel like 15, 20, half an hour, maybe longer... From what ive heard, atleast. Cheesy
« Last Edit: September 29, 2011, 21:08:20 by BlueHalcyon » Logged

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travilanche
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« Reply #7 on: September 29, 2011, 22:53:30 »

Er... please tell me where it says that.

I don't remember where it is exactly.  But I remember a spot where he says he regularly meditates in deep space for hours at a time. 

And it's good to hear alot of people here can phase for lengthy periods of time.  Ten minutes isn't really enough time to watch a pack of velociraptors hunt a hadrosaur.  But I can see the need to keep it short and simple in the beginning. 
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Rudolph
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« Reply #8 on: September 29, 2011, 23:12:54 »

I have a question about the time a person can spend phasing.  It says in Michael Raduga's guide that a person can only phase for around 10 minutes.  How is this enough time to do some of the incredible things that people talk about doing, like exploring the RTZ, and deep space and things of that nature.  How does that allow time to search through the Akashic records and other such phenomena?  How does it give you the time to go back and reexperience memories from the past?  It is just a confusingly short amount of time.

While reading Mastering Astral Projection in 90 days by Robert Bruce, he makes it sound like you can astral project for hours on end, and do it anytime you want.  What is it that I'm missing here?

I did not finish all of MAP in 90 days but I did read a lot of it and I do not recall him saying that about OBE specifically (but it does make me wonder what his longest OBE might really be). Meditating in deep space for hours at a time is something many can do with a little practice, but that is not the same as OBE imo.

I mentioned here a few days ago on the astral 'time' thread about how Monroe would retell the story of some awesome projection that would seem to require at least an hour and he would return to his body to find that he had been out for about 7 minutes.

Just recently though, I made note of the time as I began an OBE attempt and then experienced three lonnngggg projections in a row with only maybe a minute between the first and second projection and maybe a few minutes between the 2nd and third. Each "seemed" very long and eventful, and I do not recall losing consciousness at any point, and it was over a period of nearly two and a half hours before I got up and started writing it all down...

But, time does both stretch and/or compress in the OBE state for me. And I still consider myself new to intermediate at all this so I won't try to say for certain that my OBEs must have been that long. It sure seems like it though.

I learned a lot from the RB MAP in 90 Days methods and I like the Lucidology youtube lessons. The Raduga obe4u.com free SOBT ebook kicked my success rate up to a whole new level. I highly recommend all of them.




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light487
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« Reply #9 on: September 30, 2011, 00:39:48 »

One of the other things he says in that book is to never remain "calm and relaxed" within a phase.. that one took me completely by surprise. His reasoning is that if you ever stop to catch your breath, so to speak, that you will lose focus and return to your body. The fact that you should NOT allow yourself to become "calmed" and "relaxed" is completely contrary not only to everything else I have read but also to my own beliefs about phasing. I can kind of understand from a beginner's point of view that you need to have a goal or set of goals to provide intent for your experience and that if you should find yourself "wandering" without a purpose, then the beginner might find themselves back in their body.. that kinda makes sense.. but moving on past that beginner stage.. I think remaining calm, relaxed and unemotional would be key to maintaining the phase for long periods of time. Perhaps it is this misconception of his, that is the cause for his short trips.
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MikeMk
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« Reply #10 on: September 30, 2011, 16:50:30 »

)))

there is a lot of tests that have proven that you can't lucid/project more than 2 minutes in 99% of all cases

ok, if you can do more, it depends on REM that lasts no more than 15-20 minutes...

Of course, one minute may seem like 30 minutes. It's another topic to discuss.
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Rudolph
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« Reply #11 on: October 01, 2011, 01:08:54 »

)))

there is a lot of tests that have proven that you can't lucid/project more than 2 minutes in 99% of all cases

ok, if you can do more, it depends on REM that lasts no more than 15-20 minutes...

Of course, one minute may seem like 30 minutes. It's another topic to discuss.


No statistical test has ever proven what "can't" be done. (not possible -- google 'you can't prove a negative' and read up on the statistical type items).

You *can* take a poll and announce that "the survey shows" such n such. But those sort of stories are ridiculously unreliable.

The inseparable link between OBE and REM is something I have my doubts about. I have read references to papers about non-REM OBEs but I have not seen the data.

Brain dead patients regaining consciousness and reporting NDEs were certainly not in REM.

I think the jury is still out on this one.





« Last Edit: October 01, 2011, 01:33:06 by Rudolph » Logged

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Orion-
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« Reply #12 on: October 01, 2011, 20:45:53 »

)))

there is a lot of tests that have proven that you can't lucid/project more than 2 minutes in 99% of all cases

ok, if you can do more, it depends on REM that lasts no more than 15-20 minutes...

Of course, one minute may seem like 30 minutes. It's another topic to discuss.

These "tests" assume that if the brain says something, this thing is also happening. However, just because the brain isn't in the rem state, that doesn't mean we can't dream/lucid/project.

Another question for you. If my dream lasts 2 minutes in your time, and 30 in my time, how long did it last? There is no time, there is only duration which is highly subjective.
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« Reply #13 on: October 01, 2011, 23:26:29 »

I think he said the longest phase he'd heard of was 20 minutes long. Since you don't spend any time in the phase doing things like traveling from one place to another, and action follows thought immediately, the rapid sequence of events makes it seem like you are spending much more time than you really are. A 20 minute phase would probably feel like hours.
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Rudolph
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« Reply #14 on: October 02, 2011, 00:25:45 »

These "tests" assume that if the brain says something, this thing is also happening. However, just because the brain isn't in the rem state, that doesn't mean we can't dream/lucid/project.

Another question for you. If my dream lasts 2 minutes in your time, and 30 in my time, how long did it last? There is no time, there is only duration which is highly subjective.

Actually, without REM, dreaming is not going to be a happening thing. "Dreams" and REM are basically synonymous. If you checked the clock and went immediately into a dream and then checked the clock immediately following the end of the dream and the clock showed 2 minutes had passed, the dream lasted two minutes... regardless of how long the dreamer thought the dream might have lasted.

Being Lucid may not require a physical body and/or brain. But the thing we call a "dream" does. Dreams are artifacts of what can be impressed upon the physical brain and physical awareness. The "physical awareness" can be a very poor representation of what is actually occurring in an extra-physical dimension.

Of course there is "TIME"... without time there would be no duration.



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Lionheart
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« Reply #15 on: October 03, 2011, 04:51:35 »

 I have a question for the people here that are visiting the Astral Plane regularly. When I phase I am in the Astral for about 10-20 mins physical time. After that I end up in the 3D dark zone for the rest of the time. Can you go back immediately or do you have to reboot the process entirely from the start? It now takes me anywhere from 10-15 mins to get there, then another 10-20 mins there, but then I just sit in the 3D dark zone and watch, but nothing else ever happens, other than just kind of floating and feeling good. Am I wasting my time or is that all you can see at a time? I have changed my intent/visual to a new scene but with no avail. Could it possibly be my own fear of not being able to remember my experience, since I write down all that I have seen in that session?
 
« Last Edit: October 03, 2011, 05:25:39 by Lionheart » Logged
Xanth
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« Reply #16 on: October 03, 2011, 05:05:03 »

Instead of thinking about changing your intent... try visualizing where it is you want to go.  Smiley
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Lionheart
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« Reply #17 on: October 03, 2011, 10:08:47 »

 Ryan I mean I have problems getting back there again. My question should have been how long do you stay in the Astral before you can't maintain it anymore? I have my visuals, then I decide to end the session. Before that I will just float in the 3D zone. On a couple of occasions I have after floating I have changed my visual intent, but I can't maintain it for longer than a couple of seconds. Could this be because of fatigue? My sessions normally last about an hour. 10-15 working on towards the Phase, 15-20 in the zone than about 20-25 mins just relaxing in 3D darkness. I came to the conclusions on the timing of this due to how far I am in my Isochronic Tones MP3.
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Xanth
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« Reply #18 on: October 03, 2011, 15:25:04 »

Ryan I mean I have problems getting back there again. My question should have been how long do you stay in the Astral before you can't maintain it anymore? I have my visuals, then I decide to end the session. Before that I will just float in the 3D zone. On a couple of occasions I have after floating I have changed my visual intent, but I can't maintain it for longer than a couple of seconds. Could this be because of fatigue? My sessions normally last about an hour. 10-15 working on towards the Phase, 15-20 in the zone than about 20-25 mins just relaxing in 3D darkness. I came to the conclusions on the timing of this due to how far I am in my Isochronic Tones MP3.
For me, once I'm coming out of an experience and I go through that Black Void... it's an almost immediate shift back to the physical.  Now, if I can notice this shift occurring, I can usually keep my eyes closed and my body still upon waking, then shift back almost immediately.

I don't really know what controls the duration of the experience really.  I think it has something to do with your focus, but I really don't know.
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Rudolph
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« Reply #19 on: October 04, 2011, 17:59:00 »

I have a question for the people here that are visiting the Astral Plane regularly. When I phase I am in the Astral for about 10-20 mins physical time. After that I end up in the 3D dark zone for the rest of the time. Can you go back immediately or do you have to reboot the process entirely from the start? It now takes me anywhere from 10-15 mins to get there, then another 10-20 mins there, but then I just sit in the 3D dark zone and watch, but nothing else ever happens, other than just kind of floating and feeling good. Am I wasting my time or is that all you can see at a time? I have changed my intent/visual to a new scene but with no avail. Could it possibly be my own fear of not being able to remember my experience, since I write down all that I have seen in that session?


I go back immediately, within seconds or something less than a minute... usually... of course there are the exceptions. Three and often 5 or 6 times.

The first projection is usually the longest.

If I project several days in a row even the first will be shorter in duration. It seems to take about a week or two to fully recharge.
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light487
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« Reply #20 on: October 04, 2011, 22:33:32 »


I go back immediately, within seconds or something less than a minute... usually... of course there are the exceptions. Three and often 5 or 6 times.

The first projection is usually the longest.

If I project several days in a row even the first will be shorter in duration. It seems to take about a week or two to fully recharge.

I find a similar thing in my practises. If I don't do anything "actively" for a few days and then I find some spare time to practise, when I get this Binaural beats running it's so strong and focused though no success as yet.. but if I do that every day.. the effects of the Binaural beats or even practise without audio wanes dramatically..
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travilanche
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« Reply #21 on: October 05, 2011, 10:31:42 »

I'm curious as to how long some of you attempt a phase before you decide it is time to give up?  I haven't achieved getting into the phase yet, but I still am feeling something.  I usually do attempts from around 15-30 minutes.  Is this too long, or not long enough, or just right? 
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light487
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« Reply #22 on: October 05, 2011, 10:52:35 »

From all the accounts I have read by the "masters" (hehe.. don't know how else to refer to them), if you don't get anything within 20mins, then anything longer is pointless.. however... there are also a lot of people who say it takes them longer.. so I think that 15 mins is a little too short and 30mins is probably a good average.. but there's nothing really wrong with an hour either.. whatever works and feels comfortable to you.

I think that it would also depend on how much "response" you are getting from your endeavours.. so.. if after 20mins you are still making no progress, maybe a good indication that your mind isn't in the right space and to get up, do something else for a while and then return later to try again. However if you are getting some "signs" of progress then there's no reason to stop just because of some time limit..
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