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Author Topic: First Astral Projection or mimic Lucid dream?  (Read 2118 times)
Dreamkey
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« on: September 02, 2015, 04:38:42 »

Hi all, I had a strange experience the other night and I was wondering if someone could tell me if it was infact an astral projection experience or instead only a lucid dream. ( I admit I am skeptical about separating both these terms)

I awoke during the night and decided to meditate for approximately an hour on my back, I  then rolled on my side and let myself fall asleep slowly. ( I can't fall asleep on my back) My mind was silent and I had a somewhat enchanced focus and awareness due to meditating which made it hard to fall asleep.

because of my prior meditation I kept becoming aware of the sensation of falling deeper into sleep, a sort of deep wave crashing over your body and your vision becoming further engulfed in a deeper blackness also accompanied by a feeling of somewhat sinking or dissociation. This sensation would further awaken me because it's onset was instant sometimes even startling me because of its sudden and abrupt shift , it would send a sort of pins and needles throughout my body ( not to be confused with vibrations.) Anyway this occurred maybe 5 times.

eventually I just became accustomed to the suddenn onset of the sensation, and went further into the rabbit hole. I started to feel the "vibrations" I would personsally describe them as a sort of very fast pulsating energy not intense or uncomfortable more gentle and subtle accompanied by a very quiet fluttering of sorts in the ear the pulsating became faster and faster I was Patiently and enthusiastically awaiting for the intensity to grow..

This is it this is the moment I decide in an instant, I roll out of my body I experience what feels like pushing myself through a barrier or force field I feel a sort of detachment as I succeed ( kind of like when you bury your foot in wet sand and as you pull you feel a release of pressure and it makes that slurping sound) I roll out onto the ground and then I kind of just find myself back in my body where the oddest thing is happening my vision is coming out of my F***king stomach, like what the hell? It's coloured and clear I'm looking out my stomach at half my bed and half my room. I feel as if I'm on my hand and knees crouched over where my real body would be only my head and vision are stuck in my stomach.. I'm forcing myself out pulling my neck upwards as if it where like my head was buried in sand.

I finally come out  I'm stumbling around feeling unusually lethargic a feeling of no energy my vision is grey and awfully blurry ( kind of like looking through a telescope) my vision is out of my control, I feel like a new born calf stumbling all confused and dazed like "what the F*** is going on man, who's this big cow" Wink I stumble for maybe ten seconds around my bed then collapse back in my body really unintentionally all weird experiences cease and I'm in a calm mild sleep paralysis which then subsides quickly and I awaken confused, excited and quite frankly a little disappointed.

I'll add that I'm a frequent lucid dreamer, probably have had well over 100 lucid dreams that often vary in control and length and even quite a few that have tried mimicking AP. this however I would consider to be a most unusual experience with a lot of unexpected things such as vision out of my stomach, and a feeling of lethargy and lack of energy which I have never heard about let alone expected or experienced before and 97% of my lucid dreams are spontaneous where I lose consciousness then regain once in a dream which was not the case in this particular situation. Although I still add the possibility that it may have just been an unusual lucid dream mimicking AP with unintentional results, I am yet to conclude and hopefully will in the near future where I take further endeavours into the rabbit hole Wink

Thoughts?
« Last Edit: September 02, 2015, 05:13:01 by Dreamkey » Logged
Xanth
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« Reply #1 on: September 02, 2015, 07:54:39 »

I'll add that I'm a frequent lucid dreamer, probably have had well over 100 lucid dreams that often vary in control and length and even quite a few that have tried mimicking AP.
This is all I really need to know.  Projection.  All "over 100 lucid dreams" = projections. 

Forget about what you THINK an astral projection or a lucid dream is.
A Projection = you consciously experiencing a reality which you identify as not being this physical reality.  That reality can be perceived as your bedroom, your house, your neighbourhood, some strange place you've never been to or anything else really.  You just have to be experiencing it directly and consciously AND identify it as NOT being this physical reality.

That's it.  Easy, eh?

It's so easy, people don't believe it.  They think "astral projection" is something that's so hard to do.  They usually build it up in their head as some kind of mystic trip.  Well, it's not. 
Even just what you would call a "dream" is a projection... it's just a projection in which you don't realize you're projecting.  Even this physical reality experience you're having right this very second is a projection.  Smiley
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« Reply #1 on: September 02, 2015, 07:54:39 »

logoVisit the website of Astral Pulse creator Adrian Cooper.

Home of the best selling book Our Ultimate Reality.

Astral Projection, Metaphysics and many other subjects.

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ThaomasOfGrey
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« Reply #2 on: September 03, 2015, 00:42:12 »

In childhood I would commonly recall my astral projections during the night. This skill has returned just due to my intent, but I can confirm that what I typically thought of as a lucid dream is remarkably similar to the impression you are left with after a conscious projection from a waking state.

These experiences could all be labelled astral projections. For an experienced voyager like Xanth I imagine it is easy to see the similarities of experiences on the entire spectrum.

I believe the spectrum of experience is key here. When I think of the astral projections I have during the night, while extremely vivid at times, it is not what I imagined astral projection to be like because I usually end up stuck in the context of the situation. Occasionally I have been able to realize I was dreaming and apply conscious will to the scenario, but usually this interference results in waking or even reality "melting".

When I think of astral projection I imagine flying in amazing landscapes that I can change at will, building things, living fantasies, meeting other consciousnesses. I haven't had this experience yet but I suspect that it is just an extension of what I already know.

Maybe the real question here isn't whether it was an astral projection or not, but whether the content of the experience was sufficiently satisfying for your goals to achieve the label in your mind.

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Dreamkey
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« Reply #3 on: September 03, 2015, 04:27:15 »

So my initial presumptions that their is no difference between an AP and a LD were correct, and a projection is simply experiencing consciousness.. And an "astral" projection would be experiencing consciousness in a seperate reality one other than physical reality, the confusion is just the induction technique.. WILD (Wake Induced Lucid Dream = "AP" .. Spontaneous lucidity = "LD"? Well someone could have explained that to me last week, before I spent $75 on Robert Monroes F***ing books  evil  wink  grin

I suppose I wanted to believe in more than just a conscious dream, where astral projection was going to the "Spirit Realm" where entities beyond ones imagination actually exist.. The lower realm and higher realm etc etc.. If you want to get all Don Juan crazy I wanted to meet "inorganic beings" .. Everyone talks about spirit guides and angels and all that jazz.. But it's just ones intention and imagination that creates those "realities"? Damn I thought Robert Waggoner was onto something with the whole "hidden observer".. Someone behind the curtain so to speak.. Bet it's a disappointment when that curtain drops and it's a reflection  undecided ...

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Xanth
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« Reply #4 on: September 03, 2015, 05:26:57 »

That's just it... you're ALWAYS in a "spirit realm".
There's no difference between this reality which we call the "physical reality" and any reality you experience while projecting or sleeping. 

None.  Let that sink in for a bit.  Smiley
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« Reply #4 on: September 03, 2015, 05:26:57 »



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ThaomasOfGrey
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« Reply #5 on: September 03, 2015, 11:26:46 »

So my initial presumptions that their is no difference between an AP and a LD were correct, and a projection is simply experiencing consciousness.. And an "astral" projection would be experiencing consciousness in a seperate reality one other than physical reality, the confusion is just the induction technique.. WILD (Wake Induced Lucid Dream = "AP" .. Spontaneous lucidity = "LD"? Well someone could have explained that to me last week, before I spent $75 on Robert Monroes F***ing books  evil  wink  grin

I suppose I wanted to believe in more than just a conscious dream, where astral projection was going to the "Spirit Realm" where entities beyond ones imagination actually exist.. The lower realm and higher realm etc etc.. If you want to get all Don Juan crazy I wanted to meet "inorganic beings" .. Everyone talks about spirit guides and angels and all that jazz.. But it's just ones intention and imagination that creates those "realities"? Damn I thought Robert Waggoner was onto something with the whole "hidden observer".. Someone behind the curtain so to speak.. Bet it's a disappointment when that curtain drops and it's a reflection  undecided ...



I wouldn't be so fast to dismiss AP as merely a dream. The mistake is thinking of dreams as being limited to only subconscious data. I can't testify with personal experience  but respected people explain that shared experiences can occur which both subjects recall and persist through multiple experiences. The difference in these experiences are like living on earth as the only person who has ever lived and the insane creative variety that can be witnessed in this reality today.
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Dreamkey
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« Reply #6 on: September 03, 2015, 13:51:40 »

I can recall many lucid dreams that would suggest that perhaps we aren't always alone in dreams and that not every "dream character" is simply a figment of our imagination.. As we all know expectations, will and intent is the building blocks of lucid dreaming and when you find "independent agents" ( DC's that seem to act independently, that are out of the lucid dreamers control and that act contridictory to expectation and reason.) as well as scenarios, and situations where things completely go against initial expectation, reasons and beliefs... You start to have doubts... But then again I don't think that ones subconscious should be so easily dismissed .. People believe what they want.. I have no doubt that the subconscious is quite capable of conjuring up an independent agent that swears until they are black'n blue they are a seperate entity or even a reoccurring "spirit guide" that is seemingly more intelligent than the conscious dreamer.

My intuition tells me Their has to be more then boring Ol mundane life, but what if intuition is just desire wearing a mask? Well I'll just haft to wait until my subconscious conjours up something that leaves me without any residue of doubt..

Why is it if we live in a world with "spirits" that we don't see them in waking hours .. Except the "intuitive" ones the ones that desire to be someone special so bad that they start hallucinating and cause themselves mild schizophrenia .. If the paranormal is real then why is that million dollar challenge still waiting to be claimed..

Magik... "Everything is energy and you can manipulate energy through the power of will" then why the can not one person on this earth levitate objects create something out of nothing.. WHERE IS THE PROOF man... Wicca's, witch's, psychics, mediums ... Where is the studies, the research the videos in a controlled environment, I need PROOF man  undecided

Woah got carried away  grin maybe I'm just frustrated because I want it all to be real but can't logically accept it.. My apologies if I disrespected someone, wasn't my intention I think my point is that the subconscious's ability to trick you shouldn't be disregarded so lightly.

Any wizards care to share their opinion?  wink

Edited for language... let's please keep this PG13, this is a family forum.  Thanks.  ~Xanth
« Last Edit: September 03, 2015, 17:06:08 by Xanth » Logged
Xanth
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« Reply #7 on: September 03, 2015, 17:09:17 »

Magik... "Everything is energy and you can manipulate energy through the power of will" then why the can not one person on this earth levitate objects create something out of nothing.. WHERE IS THE PROOF man... Wicca's, witch's, psychics, mediums ... Where is the studies, the research the videos in a controlled environment, I need PROOF man  undecided
Because this reality has "rules" that govern it's existence.  They're not really HARD rules though... and they *can* be broken if done correctly.  There are examples of this "rule-breaking" though.
Do some research and find them.  Mother's lifting cars off their children... Monks bending spears against their necks... etc... Psychic ability has already been proven as long as you're not the kind of skeptic that refuses to read about it.
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ThaomasOfGrey
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« Reply #8 on: September 04, 2015, 00:44:15 »

I have no doubt that the subconscious is quite capable of conjuring up an independent agent that swears until they are black'n blue they are a seperate entity or even a reoccurring "spirit guide" that is seemingly more intelligent than the conscious dreamer.

This is true; there have been a few times where I have tried to challenge the entities I see in a lucid dream by stating out loud to them that it was a dream. I was unable to tell if I was dreaming or not so I thought it would be a good test. Not surprisingly the entities reacted in the exact same way I would have expected them to if it was this reality.

There are still contrary opinions on spirit guides, whether they are a part of the subconscious or a separate entity. I am talking about incontrovertible experiences though. You and another person jump into isolation tanks in the same room. You have a shared dream where you construct a Colosseum and fight to the death for fun. Afterwards you both get out of the tanks and talk about the experience you clearly remember. This cannot be explained by subconscious alone.
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Dreamkey
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« Reply #9 on: September 04, 2015, 04:46:56 »

And who creates these supposed "rules" and how does one break them... And have you done this personally? .. Perhaps you could point me in the right direction. Indeed I've watched a few documentaries on Shaolin monks. The "Ring of fire" documentary that features "John Chang" is probably the most credible documentary there is on "psychic" powers .. I just need to experience it myself, I'm sure you can understand.

And as for shared dreaming experiences, something I have not really researched, could you link me to any credible research?
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ThaomasOfGrey
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« Reply #10 on: September 04, 2015, 08:11:04 »

And who creates these supposed "rules" and how does one break them... And have you done this personally? .. Perhaps you could point me in the right direction. Indeed I've watched a few documentaries on Shaolin monks. The "Ring of fire" documentary that features "John Chang" is probably the most credible documentary there is on "psychic" powers .. I just need to experience it myself, I'm sure you can understand.

And as for shared dreaming experiences, something I have not really researched, could you link me to any credible research?

Xanth may be able to explain the concept better but my understanding of the "rules" is that they are governed by collective consciousness which is kind of like a 5th dimensional concept where all consciousness exists as a cohesive unit. Breaking the rules is somewhat of a negative feedback loop in the sense that your mind will not allow fluctuations in reality that defy what you are mentally prepared to accept.

I don't think you will be able to find much solid evidence on shared dreaming or even the objective existence of consciousness outside of this reality. It isn't completely satisfying but the best scientific evidence on this topic that I have seen is a study on near death experiences where individuals that were arguably brain dead were able to obtain knowledge that should not have been possible via astral projection.

http://profezie3m.altervista.org/archivio/TheLancet_NDE.htm

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Dreamkey
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« Reply #11 on: September 04, 2015, 10:00:00 »

I'm familiar with the feeling of "oneness" although perhaps it's more a feeling of being connected with everything rather than actually being everything .. Kind of like a rope connecting two people we aren't both the same being We are seperate beings but connected via the rope.. The theory that everyone and everything is God doesn't really make sense if there are set "rules" because that would mean there would be a godhead one who creates the rules one who is seperate? .. or you create your own reality through belief .. And most of the time one just adopts beliefs due to social conditioning .. And you haft to break those beliefs in order to experience the wider reality, so in a sense this could be "breaking the rules".. Who knows .. Damn this philosophical thinking is making me all tired  tongue
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khukai
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« Reply #12 on: September 13, 2015, 13:04:03 »

When you become lucid within a dream, wouldn't it be considered projecting? Because at that stage we are fully conscious right?
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Xanth
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« Reply #13 on: September 13, 2015, 21:53:07 »

When you become lucid within a dream, wouldn't it be considered projecting? Because at that stage we are fully conscious right?
Quite correct.   Smiley
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