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Author Topic: How to relax the body while maintaining mental alertness  (Read 2204 times)
Yitai
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« on: May 30, 2015, 13:20:22 »

Hey there. I'm new. I've been interested in astral projection for years, tried to do it on and off over the years with no success. I'm generally neutral to the notion of it, neither believe it nor doubt it. It's just something I would like to commit myself to so that I might get personal confirmation.

Some background. When I was very young, I had a few lucid dreams. Just a handful. There was also this weird dream experience I used to get when I was still in pre-school, in which I saw a white background with, shall we say, multiple memories overlayed over it. Like a video slideshow of my memories playing over this white background. I was always aware I was dreaming in this state. Sometimes the memories would stop, and I would be stuck seeing pure white. I would try to wake up to no avail.
When I reached young teens, though, I more or less stopped dreaming altogether. Now I never dream. Haven't dreamed in years.

To the point, the main questions I want to ask to get me started are: Why don't I dream (or remember dreaming) and is this necessarily a hindrance to astral projection?
The other one, the main reason I registered because I haven't seen an answer that satisfies me, is how exactly can one have the body go to sleep while maintaining mental alertness? The problem I have is that mind and body seem to be inseparable in my experience. If I put my mind on the alert, my body gets excited. If I relax my body, my mind drifts off. I don't see how one can be mentally wired without exciting the body, or how one can relax the body without the mind going into sleep mode. How can one seperate mind and body?
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Szaxx
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« Reply #1 on: May 30, 2015, 15:11:10 »

Its trying to understand and rationalize the fact of we are more than what we THINK we are.

1, Now if we assume there's nothing more than a single existence and when your time is up, there's nothing more.
2, There's an afterlife and our individuality is only a requirement while we exist in this physical world.

Taking these assumptions further, we can look for anything to verify it one way or the other.
If 1 was true, would the many reports of ghost sightings exist?
Would the word reincarnation and the past life regression studies have any value?
Would the many versions of spirituality in religions exist?

Just based upon this miniscule amount of questioning it is looking more likely that assumption 2 is correct.
 
Many of us on this site have has experiences where we were in an environment not physical at all and am though percieved as so, things observed unknown to us have been verified later by going to the perceived location.
There's many reports from perfectly sane people of watching an operation on their body and seeing things out of sight that verified there's was something more than what we think we know.
Every anomaly is proof of something more, it shows our understanding in the physical world is flawed with inconsistency as what we are think IS correct, actually isn't.

Your natural tie with your body is normal and getting some conformation of separating the conscious you from the body itself needs you to keep an open and inquiring mind.
When you dream, you're conscious self is separated from the physical world and being able to project this conscious you to other environments only needs your self awareness to be increased to a higher level as when you're awake. Its being able to make decisions and having the method to put them into action. While awake, it's a thought then an action you'll make. When in the non physical, its also a thought then the environment reacts to your desires.
Reading the many posts on site you'll have found that fears have to controlled. The fear is a thought and the reaction while awake is not going to change much but create another thought. In the non physical these fear thoughts can manifest creating a loop of interaction like in a nightmare of sorts.
No harm comes from this, only a lesson in controlling fear.

To find yourself aware while falling asleep is great. Making it occur is difficult at first but not impossible. You need to get comfy and stay aware of the thinking you while ignoring the body completely. You sort of stay conscious in your mind and watch the darkness show whatever comes up whilst being passive by not reacting to anything. No calculating what it looked like or getting emotional, even frustration will halt the process.
Try to ignore the body and focus on what the darkness brings forth to start with. Only look forwards without moving your physical eyes. Sounds also appear when things are moving in the right direction. Ignore these too, they are similar to a hallucination and part of the process, an indication of sirts.
See if you can stay aware enough to not fall asleep. Its a fine line as you'll find.
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« Reply #1 on: May 30, 2015, 15:11:10 »

logoVisit the website of Astral Pulse creator Adrian Cooper.

Home of the best selling book Our Ultimate Reality.

Astral Projection, Metaphysics and many other subjects.

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Yitai
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« Reply #2 on: May 30, 2015, 17:20:20 »

Thank you for the quick response.

I've also most always been highly inclined to number 2. Rest-assured I don't need convincing, and even if I never project I'm not going to hold that up as evidence against it. If I don't, I'll just carry on wondering.

Perhaps it is lack of acuity on my part, but I don't feel fear is a factor for me. I'm not a very emotional person.
As for thinking, I make it general practice to maintain a quiet state of mind and don't feel that is much of an obstacle for me, either - at least, I feel I can go without intellectualizing it. Though, I do feel I could focus better. It's the 'stay aware of the thinking you while ignoring the body completely' part that is the core issue; I find myself unable to ignore the body, to seperate 'me' from the body.
Generally what happens is I either focus on being relaxed and end up drifting off, or I focus on mental proactiveness and the body becomes restless as a result.

Another one is 'Only look forwards without moving your physical eyes' I do find my eyes tend to move with each thought and sensation. Perhaps it's too much outside noise causing me to lose focus.
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Subtle Traveler
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« Reply #3 on: May 30, 2015, 18:55:02 »

I have found that this meditation recording from Jurgen Ziewe (before I go to sleep) results in an LD experience for me nearly every time (it's a freebie). You may or may not want to try it. It is a binaural beat. You can google that term, if you do not know what that is. Make sure that you use decent headphones.

http://www.multidimensionalman.com/Multidimensional-Man/Free_Deep_Meditation_Sounds_-_Binaural_Beats_files/30_min_deep_meditation-1.mp3

Click the link above, then right click the image and save to your PC.

I will let others respond to your other questions. There is a lot of material here (at AP) to learn how to have an OBE (see FAQ's). Be persistent with your practice.

Good luck.
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Lucidityman
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« Reply #4 on: May 30, 2015, 19:05:36 »

Hi

Goto sleep first and when you wake up your body and mind will be naturally quiet,calm. Then get comfy and then forget about your body. Just ignore it,don't focus on the body, just lie their. I move my eyes a little up so its almost like I am looking straight ahead from my forehead. The key is not to try, not to wait for anything to happen. Don't expect anything to happen.What will happen is that your mind will focus on the direction of were your eyes are looking. At first you will see blackness, then you will see flashed of light as your eyes sensors discharge random light particals. Their is no set amount of time that it takes to achieve this. It just when ever you almost drift of into sleep again, but this time before you drift of into sleep, you will suddenly become really alert, your mind will be very quiet and clear..and then its separation time.

Like he said its a very fine line. That's why the reward is so great when you actually do it. You can also slow your breathing down while you look ahead with closed eyes. Your goal should be to almost become dead in bed..LOL just so mellow. Were ear plugs if noise is a problem. It is easier to do if you just don't try and lie their. Once you start to think about it, then it won't work.

The human body will not fall asleep if its cold..exspecially your feet. So you can try and cheat a little by covering up 1/2 your body and letting the feet stay cold.What you want to do is create a mismatch between the brain and the body. If you do this correctly you will get s/p from the body being warm, yet the feet are cold. The brain gets mixed signals of if it can fall asleep or not. That should keep your awareness up enuff to get s/p.

The only focus you want to loose is on your body. You want the head to remain awake.

You not dreaming..well I think you dream just that you don't remember it. It won't hinder your attempts at obe.
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« Reply #4 on: May 30, 2015, 19:05:36 »



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Trepkos
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« Reply #5 on: May 31, 2015, 15:49:20 »

Don't let any thought enter your mind. A good way to accomplish this is by focussing your awareness on a point in the blackness of your vision. You will find it hard in the beginning because there will always be a tendency to get "sucked" into your visual thoughts. If this happens, just get out of "there" and re-focus on the point. It also helps to "stay aware of your self without thoughts" if you find the point-focus too hard. In time, the "getting sucked in the thoughts" will be less frequent. If you do this correctly, then your body will automatically relax. There is a correlation between your will to stay alert and the relaxation process.
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Yitai
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« Reply #6 on: June 01, 2015, 13:19:00 »

Perhaps it's that I'm making a mental effort to be aware. On the other hand I feel if there's no mental effort, or some kind of mental direction involved, then I cannot be on the alert as is said to be required for projection.
On the other hand, putting no mental effort in at all just seems to put me to sleep like usual.

I don't know whether I should be consciously directing my focus, or just go mentally limp.
There's many materials on the subject that seem to provide conflicting/ambiguous advice. Some say don't think. Others say think about a vision or a sensation. Some say just passively let it happen. Others say focus on making it happen.
Part of what makes it confusing is the meaning of 'thinking' is defined differently by different people. To me 'thinking' is any mental activity. Thus it is confusing when I see the advice 'don't think', as to me it equates to 'do not be mentally active' Yet to focus requires mental activity.

Trepkos, you said to "get out there" if I get a vision, and Szaxxx said "watch the darkness show whatever comes up whilst being passive" This is giving me mixed messages. Perhaps you guys have different opinions on this.
To think or not to think. To be passive or active. It's all very confusing =-d

Thank you all for your guidance.
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Szaxx
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« Reply #7 on: June 01, 2015, 18:37:28 »

Getting out there is applicable when the perceived scene has developed sufficiently. This is where it becomes your environment wherever it may be. You are in the scene and  its like being awake. Everything is moving around you so nows the time to interact.
The passive state is required before this stage. When you've relaxed and your body is fading from your perception of it. The early stages are the same as going to sleep, the difference is staying aware of who you are and not fading into an unconscious state. Too little awareness and you sleep, too much and you're waiting forever without much else occurring.
The process will give better results if its left to do its thing. The transition can take less than a min if everything is balanced. This can take years to achieve. I've had some successful results with this way back. Today its second nature to remain aware of myself and let whatever occurs happen on its own. The many methods available are conflicting if you're unsure of the differences. You can create a scene and this takes longer, it also requires better control of your mind with the many distractions that appear along the way. You're better leaving this until you've had some successful experiences. Once you get the feel of how it transpires, the task is easier.
Try to stay aware without thinking of your body. Images and sounds normally appear at random when the process is working. Just watch what comes along and try to not react to it. It will get louder and more crazy as things progress.
Statistically the best time is the instant you wake in the morning. Try it if you're not already.
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Trepkos
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« Reply #8 on: June 01, 2015, 22:42:30 »

Perhaps it's that I'm making a mental effort to be aware. On the other hand I feel if there's no mental effort, or some kind of mental direction involved, then I cannot be on the alert as is said to be required for projection.

You're right about this; mental effort is necessary.

I don't know whether I should be consciously directing my focus, or just go mentally limp.
There's many materials on the subject that seem to provide conflicting/ambiguous advice. Some say don't think. Others say think about a vision or a sensation. Some say just passively let it happen. Others say focus on making it happen.

It's true about the conflicting advice. The ones that say "let it passively happen" are usually in an advanced stage and so you don't need that. The ones that say "focus on making it happen" are missing the point because it can't happen if the thought-desire resides in the conscious mind so you might want to follow this advice only if you wish to communicate with the subconscious mind. The ones that say "think about a vision or a sensation" are using visualisation techniques and this is not a bad technique but the result is that if you succeed with this method, then you will probably have an experience relating to the subject of visualisation, thus this limits you in a way. If you try this technique, then visualize something trivial. The ones that say "don't think" are more on the right track because it just makes sense; your mind has to be empty for the required signals to reach your mind.
 
Thus it is confusing when I see the advice 'don't think', as to me it equates to 'do not be mentally active' Yet to focus requires mental activity.

"Don't think" is an action and requires effort or focus. "Being without thought" is a state and it is this state which relates to your conviction. You're confusing a state with an action.


Trepkos, you said to "get out there" if I get a vision, and Szaxxx said "watch the darkness show whatever comes up whilst being passive" This is giving me mixed messages. Perhaps you guys have different opinions on this.
To think or not to think. To be passive or active. It's all very confusing =-d

The trick in the beginning is to be active by not thinking. You will find that you cannot make the effort last forever so you'll become passive. It is the process of becoming passive that's important. How more active you are/were, how more vivid the vision will be when you automatically become passive and thus the more chance that you will slip into that scenery having a lucid dream or direct projection.

Anyway, see what you do with the advice. As for me, i followed Ingo Swann. He was a scientist and remote viewer. He said that the trick is "not thinking" and it worked for me.

Usually one encounters conflicting advice when browsing "the esoteric planet". Stay away from there if you require techniques, or look for a pattern in the chaos.

You can also try binaural beats; with this it requires less mental effort.


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Lumaza
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« Reply #9 on: June 02, 2015, 01:37:14 »

I don't know whether I should be consciously directing my focus, or just go mentally limp.
There's many materials on the subject that seem to provide conflicting/ambiguous advice. Some say don't think. Others say think about a vision or a sensation. Some say just passively let it happen. Others say focus on making it happen.
Part of what makes it confusing is the meaning of 'thinking' is defined differently by different people. To me 'thinking' is any mental activity. Thus it is confusing when I see the advice 'don't think', as to me it equates to 'do not be mentally active' Yet to focus requires mental activity.
I personally find that "going with flow" seems to be the easiest way. Sometimes you feel like just emptying your mind and noticing. Other times you feel like creating a "focus target". It won't take you long to find a method that you are comfortable with. Experiment with it. Have fun with it.

 I like to start with a simple target, like an apple. I visualize it, I spin it and look at it from all sides. But soon the apple morphs into something else. This is when I passively observe it and let it create anew. The same can be done with any kind of simple focus target. But keep it simple. Once again the adage "KISS", comes into play (Keep It Simple Stupid).

 You will find at first that it is very difficult to hold any image for longer than 10 seconds or so. But, the time will get longer and longer the more you practice.

 Here is a link to a great beginner's focus target.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3M-LuTRfcI
 It worked great for me. It's a great target because when done properly a imprint is already left in your visual when you close your eyes.  Thus, you don't have to begin to visualize to begin with. Perhaps it will for you as well.

 One warning I have though is he seems to make this way harder than it is. He tells you that you need to align Chakras, use energy body activation and things like that. He could have just simplified everything by just staying with the simple "candle flame" target. In other words, don't take everything he says as "law". This video is a extended version of his previous simplified one. His earlier one was only about 10 minutes long.

 Just remember to blow the candle out before you close your eyes to attempt your projection.
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Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you everywhere."
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To be successful with Astral Projection/Non Physical Exploration, your will to succeed must be much stronger than your acceptance of failure!
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