vegetarianism

[Qui-Gon Jinn]

Hi A-M..  Wow, that has got to be some really screwed up people saying that... lol.. animal protein needed to be able to project, I don´t usually laugh at other peoples opinion, but this time I cracked up a little..  at the ones saying that, not you of course.
 All protein sources aren´t "fully equipped", but you can find lots and lots of the "fully equipped" (as good as the animal ones if not better, and without the bad stuff that comes with it) in the vegetarian kingdom!!  Take the soy bean for example, you can´t find better protein than that...  
 I would think the people stating this has a few thingies loose up in their offices, or/and they feel they have to find some way to justify why they kill and eat animals - why not say you need animal protein to develop your energy body?  YAY!!   *sigh*
I don´t mean eating meat is wrong, so don´t everyone go attacking me.
 
    Anyway, this is my 2 cents on the whole thing (learned that expression here on the forums yesterday, these forums really are informative... lol..)

  Be well //Qui-Gon


- Your focus determines your reality -

[cainam_nazier]

ooooo 2 cents..  That's a lot...  But seriously I would have to agree.  
An easy test.  Work on the new system.  If you can raise energy then you can project.  Simple, eh.




"I'm so poor I can't even pay attention."


David Rogalski
cainam_nazier@hotmail.com

[jo]

I have been vegetarian all my life....have never eaten meat....my parents were vegetarian. They led active spiritual/psychic lives . Mum died 2 weeks ago aged 98. I'm very active and energetic and psychically/spiritually alert and I'm 61 years of age. I'm not saying that's any big deal..there must plenty others the same...just mentioning it for the record, since you asked for contributions to this subject. I don't know what would happen to my system if I ate some meat.

jo

[Qui-Gon Jinn]

Jo, don´t try it please (relating to your last sentence), we wan´t you around!!  

  Be well //Qui-Gon

- Your focus determines your reality -

[Tom]

The way I heard it was the other way around. If you eat meat, you lower your "vibrations" or "frequency" and become less able to do astral projection and meditation. Your physical body is made up of physical matter, which you obtain from food and drink. The astral body is not composed of physical matter, but rather of astral substance. While I believe that having a healthy body will make having a healthier mind and healthier astral body easier, I do not think that what we digest becomes part of the astral body.


 

[goku22]

Jo, I've been a vegetarian my entire life also, I've met plenty of vegetarians, but very few who haven't ever eaten meat. One time, I thought what my friend had were french fries, so I asked for one, they were some nasty chicken thing instead. I didn't swallow it, and to this day, it makes me want to barf. I've never tasted something that felt as "wrong" as that. I think there might be something to the whole eating meat, means eating bad energies kind of thing. Obviously some groups have done it right, the native americans used everything, and gave the proper respect to the animal's spirit. I just think in today's society, it's so easy to just go to the grocery that people don't actually think about what they're eating. People always say to me, "Well vegetables have to die for you to eat them, what about that?" They have a point of course, unless you eat only fruit, you can't eat without killing something. I don't think killing for food is wrong, I just wish there was more respect going around.  Ben

[Winged_Wolf]

Hm, no....I don't think AP is dependent on diet insofar as that is concerned.
I know psis who run the range from near-carnivory to veganism, and they're still fine psis.  This just doesn't seem to have a real effect on abilities.  It may for individual people, of course--eat what seems to agree with your body, and trust your instincts on that.

Interestingly, in a discussion on one of the lists regarding diet and psi, someone theorized that a diet high in salt may contribute to ease in using psi.  It'd be interesting to do a real study on that some day.  It's not healthy, but it might make psi work better.


--Winged Wolf
"I will stare at the sun until its light doesn't blind me, and I will walk into the fire, 'til its heat doesn't burn me, and I will feed the fire...."

[kifyre]

Just for general interest, some people think soy is unhealthy. Supposedly, industry propaganda is the reason everyone thinks its so good for you. For example, soy is a processed food (not "natural") and not a complete protein. I don't know, but I don't eat it to be safe.

http://www.thedoctorwithin.com/index24.html

Also, I don't want to start a vegetarian debate. I have to say though, that it's my understanding that certain essential human nutrients are not found in the vegetarian diet. Supplements are essential. This is just what I've read. I just want people to make an informed decision about their diet, and not stop eating certain things because, well, because it's new-agey and "pure."

I apologize if the above sounds simplistic or condescending. The idea of not eating meat truly appeals to me, and I'm sure it works for some people. Just please research carefully if you're undecided and haven't already been doing it for many years.

Mark

 

[distant bell]

I am a vegetarian and have been that for as long as I can remember.
Even if it would turn out that living as a vegetarian would shorten the life span (which it dosn´t), I would still not start eating meat.
For me it´s a strickt moral issue.

Conserning the soy- There are different kinds of soy. Ther is the good old fashion one, and the gene modified. Well- so whats the differense you ask? They did not only change the genes of the new soya, but at the same time changed the amount of toxics allowed in it. Thus, the gene modified soya is allowed to have something like ten times as much toxics as the naturall one- pretty practicall, ey!?

I have heard that soya is un healthy too- might be because of this.
(and the dehydratation..)

It´s wery tought though to get enough good proteins as a vegetarian- specially if you are a body bilding or doing some other sport.

Hallo Richard! Nu är jag uppe sådär tidigt igen - kalla det en dålig vana.. och så har jag mycket att plugga- tenta på fredag.




 

[A-M]

Thanks everybody for your replies!
It gives me hope for a better world when I read a message like Distant Bell's who (like me) values sticking to a moral issue (in this case eating meat) more than his own life!!
To me (like Goku22) it feels so wrong to eat animals that I would find it VERY strange that it would affect my energy-level. Intuitively I feel like Tom said that the contrary is true: that vegetarianism increases your 'frequency/vibrations'
But......as I am not able to project into the astral dimensions (yet) I was not quite certain about it. Somehow if you read it in a book it sounds impressive and you start getting doubts (call me naif).
So, thanks everybody for supporting my feeling about this and hope to see you all in the astal some day!
Anne-Marie


 

[Winged_Wolf]

Some of the healthiest peoples in the world eat lots of soy...however, that could be genetics, too.
Soy is probably just fine in moderation, and it has some health benefits.  But buy organic, because non-organic soy has one of the highest pesticide loads of any crop.
Soy also contains phytoestrogens--estrogen-mimic chemicals.  This is fine, and probably beneficial if you're a menopausal female.  If you're male, on the other hand, you might want to think about it.  And for children?  Hmmm....



--Winged Wolf
"I will stare at the sun until its light doesn't blind me, and I will walk into the fire, 'til its heat doesn't burn me, and I will feed the fire...."

[Mobius]

G,day A-M & everyone

This is a topic that makes for lively conversation every time I go
visit my Mother & my sister as both are vegetarians.

Anyway I,m not & each to their own I reckon, so it's all fairly
civilised & I don't tell her to stop eating grass & she doesn't
tell me to stop eating carcass!hehe.

I have read a bit into both,lately I've been reading some debates
between A.C Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada from the Hari Krishna's &
a meat eating Christian,very interesting.I also read an article
published in the latest Nexus magazine & website by Stephen Byrnes
Phd,RNCP 2000,2002, on "The Myths of Vegetarianism".
Check out the latest statement on;
http://www.nexusmagazine.com/vegemyths1.html

What do ya's think? does anyone have any URL's from the vegetarian
side of the debate that isn't covered in this latest article.

All the best on your journeys,vegetarians & omnivores.

It was recently discovered that research causes cancer in rats!

Mobius

 

[Qui-Gon Jinn]

Okay I´ve read the article Mobius, although I usually don´t care much for anyones opinion who sees animals only as a resource to be used by a more intelligent species (sometimes I question if we are intelligent but that is another story), like the author of that paper does (he said it himself). And to be honest with you, I didn´t find it very convincing, although I have thought to myself the Q the author states; if being a pure vegeterian (vegan) would be a natural thing for the human being - why wouldn´t she get the so famous vitamin B12 from the vegan kingdom, if it is so important as some say?
 Some peole say it exist in algaes, not this author though... but even if it does, not all humans lived by the ocean and could get B12 from the algaes...
  The stuff he is saying under "myth5" (as well as some things he sais in some of the other "myths" as well) "debunks" him though as far as I´m concerned though.... there is well researched material saying quite the opposite of what he is saying about many things there..  one book I can really recommend is "A diet for a new america", by John Robbins, if you are interrested in human nutrition that is and the likes of what the author is taking up in his paper.

  Be well //Qui-Gon

- Your focus determines your reality -

[A-M]

Thanks, Mobius, for the vegemyths-link. I have not had time yet to read all of it, but it looks interesting!
It will not make me change my mind, but I like to be fully informed.
What I do not understand is that a person that is spiritualy involved still eats meat. How can you want a living being to die for you if you know there are plenty of food-alternatives. And on an energy-level: you eat the pain, the suffering and the anguish of another being; how can that benefit you?
I know why the people around me eat meat, but I'm really interested what the answer is of a person that is involved with spirituality.
A-M
 


 

[Mobius]

G,day A-M & Qui Gonn

Look I am not trying to convert anyone & just provided that article
for this debate.I wont be changing my diet if an equally dismmissive
article is posted by a vegetarian,as I,m sure the article I posted
wont have the vegetarians rushing to eat meat.

The problem I see a lot of vegetarians run into is one of morals &
ethics.Vegetarians seem to only acknowledge life when it has legs,
blood or brains & somehow plants & great trees have none?
It is because the person has arrived at the decision that killing is
bad,but somehow distinguishes that some killing is acceptable as
long as it doesn't scream or writhe in pain.

All of this completely ignores the fact that we are part of the
food chain & a predator at that.Eyes in the front of the head for
best judging distances to throw something at or jump on something.
Canines in our teeth for cutting meat & nails on our hands that if
we didn't cut regularly would quickly turn back into claws to grab
things tight & pierce skin.

Death is an experience we all go through & it is most likely we
ourselves wont die as quickly & less painfully than animals.
What happens when you die? Whats this site (astral pulse) all about? life after death & we are more than our bodies.If you believe that
this is the case,why the moral stance on animals & not all life.

If you were forced up against a wall & asked to decide on a choice.
You are given a chainsaw & a gun,a sheep & a 300 year old 200ft tall
redwood tree.You have to kill one of them,which one do you choose?
To say plants & trees don't have feelings & because they dont scream
& pour blood it's ok,pretty one eyed I'd say.

I have tried going vegetarian before & it feels like my body is
starved of nutrients,I slow down,I can't process things as quickly in
my mind & just feel drained.

Are plants not living? just because they don't run or scream doesn't
make me somehow think they would enjoy dying less than an animal.
There has to be balance & we are it,so I don't completely agree with
abattoirs but if we didn't condense the killing we wouldn't enjoy
the relatively disease free life we have now.To convert everyone to
vegetarianism would create imbalance & destroy more forests than
present as more agricultural space would be needed,in turn needing
super phosphates to make it viable every year,in turn destroying
the soil & ground water as demonstrated from the old testament
& african continents that were thought to have contained the first
humans,pretty much desert now.

Anyway I,m sure I will get some livid replies,by the way Qui-Gonn
is John Robbins a doctor or is it just some ones opinion.

Good journeys to you all

Mobius