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Author Topic: A Consideration  (Read 4410 times)
View578
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« on: January 25, 2010, 22:10:23 »

A Consideration

By Paul Vrabel

When a person gets a cut, the white blood cells rush into action to heal the cut, and a scab is formed. The heart beats to keep alive the human body. All the complex systems that make up the human person do so in such accuracy. The earth rotates around the sun perfectly. The earth is not being terminated by the extraordinary flames of the sun; it is not close enough to be. Human beings do not float about in space due to the law of gravity.

Is this all the result of mere chance?

Whether it is or not, there seems to be good arguments for both sides.

The most convincing argument that I’ve heard from the side of “Atheism” is that as a result of infinite possibility, yes, such complexity can come into play. And it appears to make some sense to a certain degree. I mean, imagine just nothingness. Just complete nothingness. Are the chances not infinite of just about anything happening, including anything complex?

Yet, the very IDEA of this, in and of itself, can be nothing more than a figment of the imagination, a mere attempt of someone to explain what he or she does not know or/and understand.

The VERY IDEA of infinite possibility in and of itself can just be an idea that someone has, and an idea that can very likely be false.

Such complexity MAY be the result of an actual cause. The question would then be what the complexity is a RESULT of.

Such irrefutable laws,…that set forth into motion in this Universe. The rotation of the planets around the sun,…the growth of vegetables and fruits, the shocking but solidified, absolute complexities of the human body and systems at play within it, …the fact that we do not float around in space due to an absolute law that keeps our bodies on the planet earth. …Is something going on here besides just the “animal side” of us? Does “meaning”, actually even exist, possibly? Perhaps we’re souls actually visiting earth in an evolving process. On the other hand, perhaps eternal unconsciousness awaits us all, regardless of any matter our lives were lived. What is it that really goes on in this Universe, and Why?

What are the ACTUAL origins of planet earth? Are we where we’re at now as a result of molten rock that grew grass, trees, and had formed oceans on it out of mere chance and scientific details, or was all this formed for a purpose, or/and the result of a purpose?

Is what we have “scientific evidence” for, all that exists, or has skepticism possibly been taken to a degree where it should actually be considered “close-mindedness”?

"CHANCE", in and of itself, may very well just be an idea that was created in someone's mind in an attempt to explain something they have not comprehended, and possibly never will comprehend. The occurrence of the overall grand scheme of things may not be comprehended from the attempt of using scientific instruments and tools alone. After thousands of years of still attempts to explain the Universe, what may possibly still be learned? IS there anything actually significant enough of, and worthy enough of, our learning as the human race? Or are we merely limited to the likeness of animals, only to end up in eternal "sleep", no matter what kinds of lives we lived?
« Last Edit: February 15, 2010, 20:11:08 by View578 » Logged

Xanth
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« Reply #1 on: January 26, 2010, 14:28:27 »

If you think about it this way...
Say everything that can possibly happen has a percent chance of occurring (however infinitesimal that chance is), in a "nothing" that lasts an infinite amount of time, can not *EVERYTHING* that is possible ever happen, happen?

In other words, it's all been done already.  Smiley
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« Reply #1 on: January 26, 2010, 14:28:27 »

logoVisit the website of Astral Pulse creator Adrian Cooper.

Home of the best selling book Our Ultimate Reality.

Astral Projection, Metaphysics and many other subjects.

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View578
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« Reply #2 on: January 26, 2010, 19:32:17 »

If you think about it this way...
Say everything that can possibly happen has a percent chance of occurring (however infinitesimal that chance is), in a "nothing" that lasts an infinite amount of time, can not *EVERYTHING* that is possible ever happen, happen?

In other words, it's all been done already.  Smiley

ugh. lol. Lost me there. To me it kinda seems like you took what I said to an extreme that was just done in a confusing kind of way. Confusing for me, at least.
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kurtykurt42
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« Reply #3 on: January 26, 2010, 20:14:08 »

To be honest I don't understand either of you guys!  grin
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Stookie
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« Reply #4 on: January 26, 2010, 21:22:50 »

I'm having a hard time as to what's being discussed as well.

Either nothing is chance, and EVERYTHING is 100% exactly as it should be and can't be any different, it just IS.
or
Everything is complete chance and our minds naturally grasp for patterns through reasoning.

We're either God or a fluke.

Anywhere close?
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« Reply #4 on: January 26, 2010, 21:22:50 »



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NoY
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« Reply #5 on: January 26, 2010, 22:37:08 »

So to recap

just because we have art science religion higher realitys and god

dosent mean that the other 99.99999% of the superverse isnt pure chaos

:NoY:
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Xanth
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« Reply #6 on: January 27, 2010, 18:14:10 »

Basically, what I was trying to say was that in an infinite system... everything that can happen, has already happened an infinite number of times.  Smiley
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AmbientSound
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« Reply #7 on: February 01, 2010, 04:24:58 »

I get what you're saying, Xanth, and I agree with it. It sounds like you just described 10-D in a sentence.
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personalreality
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« Reply #8 on: February 01, 2010, 21:45:46 »

Our existence is based in infinity, in that it is an infinitely complex and infinitely extending infinite collection of systems, all interpenetrating each other.  Together they form a continuum of "reality" that moves infinitely in either direction.  For example, the distance between an electron and the nucleus that it orbits is greater to scale than the distance between many galaxies.  That system of an atom is likely another world like our own, and in turn we are likely a universe inside of an "electron" that exists inside the leg of some being. 

When we consider the "expansion" of our universe it seems that all things are born out of one cause.  There is no cause and effect, but rather one cause and one continuous effect (which might be interpreted as intentional creation).  But all of the folks in this forum have come across experiences that have shown them how much more vast our "reality" is.  It exists in multiple dimension simultaneously. 

However. When it all comes down to it, what can you possibly KNOW besides your subjective experience?  Which leads me to believe that such a thing as objectivity, something that we could measure and be sure of its existence independent of ourselves, is absolutely and utterly wasteful.  I don't see waste anywhere else in this universe.  In fact, everything being equally made of energy, the universe never wastes any of it.  Energy just get moved around.  So why have an objective reality if all consciousness is a subjective experience? 

Point being.  It's all in your head.  You created it.  You created me, you created you, and you created the entirety of the universe for the sake of your experience.  As I did too.  Just so happens that you and I are the same consciousness experiencing itself subjectively from a different scale and position. This wasn't founded on nothingness.  We are nothingness, we are just a thought being thought by ourselves.
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« Reply #9 on: February 05, 2010, 17:52:24 »

When a person gets a cut, the white blood cells rush into action to heal the cut, and a scab is formed. The heart beats to keep alive the human body. All the complex systems that make up the human person do so in such accuracy. The earth rotates around the sun perfectly. The earth is not being terminated by the extraordinary flames of the sun; it is not close enough to be. Human beings do not float about in space due to the law of gravity.

Is this all the result of mere chance?

You just cited one of the 5 ways of saint. Tomas de Aquino to proove that god exists. There are other arguments as well (roughly translated to english by me):

1. Everything that moves, must be moved by something else. If we continue to use this logic for every being, cell, particle, we arrive to the conclusion that something must have started moving everything else. (Call it big bang, or "God's breath of life") (Note that this was way before the big bang theory)

2. Everything in this world is governed by the laws of cause-effect. (Laws of physics, Chemical equations, etc...)
It's impossible that something can be the cause and effect of itself, and we can't have cause-effect to the infinity... hence some being must have started it all (God)

3. Things can exist and stop existing. Those things that have the chance of stop exisiting, at some point they will not exist. If everything had that property, then at some point nothing would have existed, and nothing can proceed from nothingness. But as we exist at this very moment, we arrive to a contradiction. Hence, there must be something that does not follow this fashion (God)

I really dont like the last one, but i'll put it anyway

4. There are things that lack of knowledge, nevertheless they do their purpose on the universe. (He mostly refers to animal and plant life that sustents us). These beings are not sentient, but they carry out their purpose as if led by some superior force. This intelligent, superior force can't be anything else but God.

BTW, i don't consider myself catholic (I never go to church...) so don't flame me. I just thought this was interesting
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