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Author Topic: Our Future In The Physical Universe  (Read 21523 times)
Wi11iam
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« on: March 11, 2013, 01:50:29 »

This is where human beings are heading...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&list=UUiL3S6IS15fYdcNS8HOn2cw&v=PjpC6GmeLGI&feature=endscreen
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« Reply #1 on: March 11, 2013, 02:51:30 »

Nope, every new technical advance gets used first in Military applications, then for Control techniques.

 I listened to a guy that spoke just like this, but he was on Coast to Coast AM. I went to his website and posted a simple question. I asked where Ethics is held in his equations. On his site you can a question, but then a Moderator decides what should go on or not.

 I went back a few days later and saw that my question was not posted. He didn't want anything negative posted, like Ethics for example  rolleyes. He just wanted us to drink the Koolaid and "sign on the dotted line".

  Once we change our mindsets on what's important and what isn't, then and only then can I see a bright future ahead for Humanity!

  I see that you posted your view there Wi11iam.  shocked

 
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« Reply #1 on: March 11, 2013, 02:51:30 »

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Wi11iam
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« Reply #2 on: March 11, 2013, 04:40:16 »

Nope, every new technical advance gets used first in Military applications, then for Control techniques.

 I listened to a guy that spoke just like this, but he was on Coast to Coast AM. I went to his website and posted a simple question. I asked where Ethics is held in his equations. On his site you can a question, but then a Moderator decides what should go on or not.

 I went back a few days later and saw that my question was not posted. He didn't want anything negative posted, like Ethics for example  rolleyes. He just wanted us to drink the Koolaid and "sign on the dotted line".

  Once we change our mindsets on what's important and what isn't, then and only then can I see a bright future ahead for Humanity!

  I see that you posted your view there Wi11iam.  shocked

 

Where?

Yes ethics is important Lionheart and in relation to technology of this sort, I doubt it will work without ethics.  Sounds like you did watch the vid - is it that you don;t see ethics in what Jason is saying?
The thing about 'what is important and what isn't' is that there are different povs about this subject.  I am coming from the pov of 'what consciousness is doing in relation to this universe which transcends the human drama - the arguments about what is important.'

Mind control is an interesting subject but exactly what is it you are saying?  That we will lose our 'free will'?  Is it not 'free will' which helps keep us separate, because someone uses theirs to make $$ off the backs of those who use theirs to step in line?

We are moving away from biological form and into a less 'needy' one.  Most of our problems stem from the needs of biological bodies.  They have been a necessary bridge from where we came from and to where we are going.

The only real ethic we need to adopt is to recognize our equality as Consciousness.  It seems the human form is incapable of seeing things this way (in general) - indeed you had a lot to do with me seeing things this way.  I once thought it were possible for human beings to work things out and build a better system for everyone.  You told me that my heart was in the right place but unfortunately it was a dream (or words to that effect.)

Eventually I had to agree with you - because it was the same response I was getting from a variety of individuals from different and sometimes even opposing povs...even from hard line sceptics - so all these different aspects who don;t normally agree with each other, agreed with each other on the point that human beings are not going to get their act together and wise up and create a workable plan of action.

But..well Consciousness isn't ruled by human beings and their dramas...it - obviously is capable of working with but also allows the ego whatever the ego deems important, ethical or not.

And if not, then it can work around the ego and leave the bulk of humanity to its ego induced fate - as per free will ...

Me - I just want to assist Consciousness with its explorations in this universe free from the drama of ego based bull-dung.

I find that to be central to being Ethical.

Smiley
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« Reply #3 on: March 11, 2013, 05:23:05 »

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Eventually I had to agree with you - because it was the same response I was getting from a variety of individuals from different and sometimes even opposing povs...even from hard line sceptics - so all these different aspects who don;t normally agree with each other, agreed with each other on the point that human beings are not going to get their act together and wise up and create a workable plan of action.

This doesn't have to be a bad thing just because it is true. In order to grow, we need to experience all the pain and suffering. Without these experiences, a consciousness has no way to relate.

How can we know what it means to feel really good if we do not know what it means to feel truly bad. A utopian world may be great for those currently existing in a physical form but they are being shortchanged on experiences need to grow.
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Wi11iam
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« Reply #4 on: March 11, 2013, 06:30:53 »

This doesn't have to be a bad thing just because it is true. In order to grow, we need to experience all the pain and suffering. Without these experiences, a consciousness has no way to relate.

How can we know what it means to feel really good if we do not know what it means to feel truly bad. A utopian world may be great for those currently existing in a physical form but they are being shortchanged on experiences need to grow.

Consciousness is able to relate.  Consciousness is growing within its experience but is not limited to the human form or condition.
It can just as easily have the form of a planet.

Utopia is not necessary - a fair and just and equal system would do.  But anyway, that was then and this thread isn't about that.
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Wi11iam
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« Reply #5 on: March 11, 2013, 07:19:36 »

See the point of the thread is the observation of where Consciousness is going in relation to this universe.

The only way this future will be avoided (in relation to human beings on planet earth at least) is if human beings for one reason or another become extinct.

That wont stop Consciousness from doing this because the math suggests it is already doing it - it is the way all biological species which become technological to the point where they create ways of moving away from their home planet and explore the interstellar neighborhood.

It is natural, in relation to Consciousness and the physical universe.


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Wi11iam
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« Reply #6 on: March 11, 2013, 07:28:47 »

This doesn't have to be a bad thing just because it is true. In order to grow, we need to experience all the pain and suffering. Without these experiences, a consciousness has no way to relate.

How can we know what it means to feel really good if we do not know what it means to feel truly bad. A utopian world may be great for those currently existing in a physical form but they are being shortchanged on experiences need to grow.

So to focus the point, Consciousness is not what needs to relate.  It is involved with all biological species in this universe, and is intimate with feelings and pain and suffering.
What you are speaking of has to do more with some kind of addiction to pain and suffering in the name of learning.  It may even be an excuse to keep things the way they are, but whatever the reason, it is not something Consciousness needs to learn, although you within your identity with the human form and condition, may have need to learn it.

 

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« Reply #7 on: March 11, 2013, 10:35:17 »

If you have the time watch the film Comedown.
This depicts the argument of are we ready?
The attitude within will not easily be eradicated.
Very unfortunate.
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« Reply #8 on: March 11, 2013, 11:13:19 »


What you are speaking of has to do more with some kind of addiction to pain and suffering in the name of learning. 
 

I think you nailed it will. This must be why I keep responding to your posts!! grin

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« Reply #9 on: March 11, 2013, 15:52:58 »

How can we know what it means to feel really good if we do not know what it means to feel truly bad. A utopian world may be great for those currently existing in a physical form but they are being shortchanged on experiences need to grow.

This is so true... If I didn't have some of the lows I've encountered in my life (and it has gotten pretty darn low), I would have been missing valuable lessons. As much as those times trialed me and how bad I hurt, I would not be the person I am today without them. And I'm no masochist. Smiley
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« Reply #10 on: March 11, 2013, 17:09:26 »

If you have the time watch the film Comedown.
This depicts the argument of are we ready?
The attitude within will not easily be eradicated.
Very unfortunate.


Is this the film you are referring to Szaxx?
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1376168/
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« Reply #11 on: March 11, 2013, 17:25:11 »

I think you nailed it will. This must be why I keep responding to your posts!! grin



While I see the funny side [whats your name?] your responses here are motivated by something else.

But I can run with that, as the saying goes.

For you at this time, this experience of life on earth is a school for learning whatever you want to learn.

For me it is the same, except that what I want to learn is whatever I can.

Some things I have learned to unlearn...like 'who I am'...

But anyway - the following is about the thread topic.

From a purely physical reference point 'we' are Consciousness - that which identifies itself as "I AM" - we can look back over our continued existence and see our 'mind-print' like a wake of a ship behind us. We are the ship, the ghost in the machine, and we have already created something greater than our individual selves. We are reaching to leave this earth behind and set sail in machinery which will become our new body. From there we will add to that body from the resources.


It tends to look like Consciousness is not even what we understand it to be - I get the impression that as we evolve to understand ourselves as that which is within the form, remove the superstition of belief systems, engage more and more with our technological creations and understand that we are all truly 'One Thing' = "Consciousness" we will also see the pattern that we have done this before - we created the human instrument as a means to achieve what we are achieving...









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« Reply #12 on: March 11, 2013, 17:51:54 »

One of the challenges and beauties of our life here on this planet is that there is so much we do not know and understand. I think a lot of the point would be lost if we knew. Our experience here is an adventure.

On a personal level, I don't want to ever fully understand everything. That would be too boring. Exploration is just too much fun!

What is that saying? It's not about the destination, it's about the journey there.

Hm... The last video he shared sums it up pretty much in a nutshell. Smiley Awestruck!
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« Reply #13 on: March 11, 2013, 19:22:38 »

I think you nailed it will. This must be why I keep responding to your posts!! grin
  grin grin grin
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« Reply #14 on: March 11, 2013, 21:43:10 »

My name is Simon and I'm glad you recognized it for the joke it was.You are right about me learning just what I want to learn but I still pick up useful knowledge along the way that I never intended to. That's just life I suppose.

I am an optimist but only for my own little world and not the world as a whole. I agree with Silva when he says a society's technology is representative of their culture but this is not a good thing. As Lion already pointed out, any advancement in tech is always applied militarily first.

This is not gonna change any time soon or in the distant future I'm sorry to say.
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« Reply #15 on: March 11, 2013, 21:43:59 »

One of the challenges and beauties of our life here on this planet is that there is so much we do not know and understand. I think a lot of the point would be lost if we knew. Our experience here is an adventure.

On a personal level, I don't want to ever fully understand everything. That would be too boring. Exploration is just too much fun!

What is that saying? It's not about the destination, it's about the journey there.

Hm... The last video he shared sums it up pretty much in a nutshell. Smiley Awestruck!

Boredom might be a reason beginnings were created and Consciousness injected itself into these simulation adventures.  

Another reason might be that it doesn't really understand where it came from and all these fractal-like simulations are its way of trying to discover the answer to that question.

I do not think that it is boredom which compels certain biological creatures to reach for the stars because there is an obvious adventure to be had  out in the Galaxy and eventually we will simply run out of things to discover on this planet and we utilize the resource on this planet to make that future real.
It is more the challenge to overcome our limitations.


In the case of this thread topic, it is not about understanding everything - it is about understanding the relationship Consciousness has with the physical universe and what it is able to do with this universe.

It is not too hard to understand that Consciousness already knows everything about this universe from the perspective of Observer even before it worked to create biological instruments so that it could be a participator.

Interstellar exploration cannot be done effectively with biological instruments.  What is needed is something more hardy, less needy and - in the case of our particular specie evolution, by experiencing the human form with all its collective data, compassion, understanding, empathy - these things are advantageous to 'Our' Collective Consciousness in relation to that moving into this next phase - merging with the machinery as it were - moving from needing the biological instrument and in appreciation for the necessary bridge it was.

'Personal levels' won't be an issue.  These are inventions of individual human experience and are taken with you wherever you go, even as you understand AP-ing - very subjective, very personal.

The other aspect of AP-ing is the frequent calling for others who can also AP to 'meet up' and have the experience together.  This is quiet a natural impulse or desire because it is at the heart of Consciousness - even when fragmented into countless individuation the core impulse is that which recognizes the holistic nature of its being and desires a configuration which behaves as a whole thing, even as it parts work their separate roles.

It is the principle reason the world has developed civilizations from the scatterings of cultural families, as surely as the reason for the decline of these civilizations is the human inability to allow consciousness its most natural state of being, through the collective specie called 'humanity' - politics, religion, culture, beliefs, families, organisations, corporations, patriotism, philosophies, - all devices which are used to keep humanity separate from itself are all part of why civilizations decline and why Consciousness cannot work effectively with this biological form.

Ultimately it does not matter, because while the drama unfolds through the separating systems there is still an aspect which has learned to work together toward a particular goal setting aside  and working around those things which are counter productive and Consciousness supports that and protects it from the more irrational separatist behavior of base human ignorance, pride, greed, boredom and what have you.

The destination can be surmised, but the journey is the focus, and what might be experienced and learned and that data accessible to the wider Consciousness which resides outside the physical universe.

Once the 'awe' settles down the work proceeds.  There is little doubt that Awe will play its part along the way - and I would think it is a far better propellant than boredom.

Smiley














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« Reply #16 on: March 11, 2013, 22:01:34 »

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The destination can be surmised, but the journey is the focus, and what might be experienced and learned and that data accessible to the wider Consciousness which resides outside the physical universe.

Uh...That's what Chopsticks said.

Does 1+1=2 only after you say it does? It seems as if we all agree on a whole lot but it comes down to semantics with you a lot of the times.

Will, you have some fascinating ideas but it's hard to see your point sometimes because you constrain the topic. I understand that you are talking apples and not oranges but to understand the oranges we need to know the seed. Why won't you just give us a generalized idea of why you think consciousness uses physical forms. You already said it's not to relate or understand cause and effect, so what's left? Just a curiosity to contemplate a death perhaps?

I promise that you can get right back on topic after you do so don't fear it, just go with it.  wink
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« Reply #17 on: March 11, 2013, 22:22:47 »

Thats the one.
It irritated me most the way through. The acting of the characters is quite realistic.
How does one teach finer values to the presented mindset of others?
 A task of magnitude.
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« Reply #18 on: March 11, 2013, 22:39:48 »

Will, you have some fascinating ideas but it's hard to see your point sometimes because you constrain the topic. I understand that you are talking apples and not oranges but to understand the oranges we need to know the seed. Why won't you just give us a generalized idea of why you think consciousness uses physical forms. You already said it's not to relate or understand cause and effect, so what's left? Just a curiosity to contemplate a death perhaps?

We are being taught at... do you not see this Simon?

William... why don't you set up your own forum like Tom Campbell? You seem to have specific ideas that need a very specific mindset and way of thinking.

Unfortunately... the mindset you require is that of total compliance to your ideas. Free thinking, humour and other ideas seem to irk you.
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« Reply #19 on: March 11, 2013, 23:16:05 »

My name is Simon and I'm glad you recognized it for the joke it was.You are right about me learning just what I want to learn but I still pick up useful knowledge along the way that I never intended to. That's just life I suppose.

I am an optimist but only for my own little world and not the world as a whole. I agree with Silva when he says a society's technology is representative of their culture but this is not a good thing. As Lion already pointed out, any advancement in tech is always applied militarily first.

This is not gonna change any time soon or in the distant future I'm sorry to say.

Yes – Simon...

So Consciousness works with what it has to work with. (bold for emphasis)
It occurs to me that the fragmentation process extends much further than I have thought about in a consistent manner up until now.

It has been fermenting in the ‘back of my mind’ (interesting saying) I have been aware of it, and the implications – but the focus has been more with the general aspect of consciousness to which I (as William in bio-form) am part of.

Your ‘little world’ is your gift of individuation, and extends into the ‘Astral’ in the outward expression of subjective creativity and adventure, learning etc.

Yet you awaken consistently within this domain – planet earth and the physical universe.

This is where your little world is most affected, and to some degree this reality affects your subjective reality of Astral experience – perhaps even more so than the other way around.

Your little world is subject to the greater reality of ‘our little world’ the physical goings on here upon this planet.

This is where subjectivity meets objectivity – this is where you meet resistance and have to deal with things not going the way you want them to...same as me, same as most of us.

This is why the great attraction to Astral, because there is a place where you are the boss because it is all your own creation.  I am of course open to correction and certainly can be forgiven for thinking this as I am only going on what is being said and may be totally misinformed or simply misunderstanding what is being shared about Astral.

Zooming in now to what Lionheart said about the military in regards to technology – one would have to be stupid or have some sinister agenda not to acknowledge the military aspect of controlling new technology for its agenda, but please make no mistake – the military is a creation of said culture.

The gadgets we now have which didn’t even exist 10 years ago...

The internet was first used for military purposes and has since been given over for public use.
I have written songs bemoaning the existence of military – war, the profiteering of weapons manufacturing, and while these songs are relative to ‘my little world’ and how I would like thing to be...which is not how they are - and are a record of my own personal journey and attitude, as I said in a previous post, some things I have learned I have found it necessary to unlearn.

Back to the internet...we can map not only what Consciousness is up to but also what individual human egos (unaware of that greater Consciousness) are up to.
Porn is probably in the number one position for popularity, and likely games are way up there as well...this is just a reflection of millions of ‘my little worlds’ doing their individual thing, and it is quiet understandable for that.

Criminals are also taking advantage of what the internet offers.

In every sense, the internet has allowed me to see that ‘my little world’ is not the only ‘little world’ out there.

But also it has shown me that I share a lot of things with others – that my experiences are not as unique as they were before the internet made this quite clear.

So the military is a creation of culture – and extends back to the age of flint spears and other tools of protection...hey we don’t really need to detail the history of technology and military.

What we may need to do though is to focus on when technology began to show itself as coming to the fore – and this happened at the time of Hitler and the Nazis.

For example – never before had there been such a thing as amplification.  To be a mere mad genius warlord is one thing but to project your manic voice to a multitude in such a way that every one of the thousands of soldiers from the front to the very back ranks could hear you clearly!  How profound and magical and god-like!

Who provided these tools?  The Scientists did.

So when the Nazis were overthrown the scientists were kept.  Some by the Russians and some by the Americans because both these nations were instrumental in the overthrow, and had to share the spoils and the Scientists were the cream.

Moving on, we see the push to perfect rocket propulsion, we see a flag poked into the surface of the moon, we see craft being sent into our particular neighbourhood of the Galaxy, and more recently we land a robot on the surface of Mars.

Consciousness is working with what it has to work with.

We also see other uses for technology – maybe they have no particular significance to the military, and pose no particular threat to the military – but whatever, they are being created and used by human beings for purposes which are all working to increase lifespan, food production, fight diseases, etc etc...and there is an increasing push from many directions for human beings to start thinking about ourselves and each other as One, rather than as from the older paradigm of ‘countries, cultures, politics etc....

Of course, this is still a pretty quiet voice in the wilderness which isn’t really getting through the fog of indoctrination...but it is there nonetheless.

Meantime, Consciousness continues because its agenda is to move from this rock and out into interstellar and while the military may have first grabs to whatever science develops, it is the science itself which comes from the impulse Consciousness itself provides.

For its purpose.

It can be argued that while humanity resists the more co-operative/collective philosophies in favour of profit and consumerism and competition, that it will never be leaving this rock at all...but the truth is, it simply won’t be...at least not in its present form.  It can’t.

It would be wonderful to see the biological critter work together for the good of all, but I can say with some great certainty that this will NOT prevent Consciousness from using what it can use in order to create for itself a form which it can leave this world behind.

One might rephrase that to say...Consciousness too, is its ‘own little world’ but it has the advantage of knowing exactly what it wants, how to get it, and how to work with what it has and what supports it and work around that which has no interest, compulsion or desire to support a far greater thing than their own little worlds, dramas, ambitions, politics beliefs etc.

In regard to the military in relation to interstellar exploration etc, it will be unlikely needed in that larger part of this reality.  Well the fighting killing part won’t be needed – but the planning, and ability to protect and build upon work as a ‘well oiled machine’ will be an advantage.

I am really only scratching the surface here.  But I think the underlying thing is that this is going to happen with or without the majority support of humanity.

It would be nice to think when it finally eventuates that human beings will be living in peace and collective prosperity on a planet which has been shaped into a proverbial paradise – that would be an ideal platform in which to launch from – but as nice as that would be, individual free will etc may mean that the launch happens on the ashes of civilization hell bent focused on their individual little worlds purposefully ignorant of the bigger picture...a sad thing yes, but all is not lost.

And that is the real point.  All is not lost. The military will play a big part in ensuring this – as much as it is about protecting citizens and countries etc, the military will above all protect the agenda of Consciousness, especially if the citizens prove to continue to choose death and mayhem for the sake of their little kingdoms, beliefs and manipulations.

I personally don’t see it going that way...but understand for now, that I am among the few.

Smiley
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« Reply #20 on: March 11, 2013, 23:33:59 »

Uh...That's what Chopsticks said.

Does 1+1=2 only after you say it does? It seems as if we all agree on a whole lot but it comes down to semantics with you a lot of the times.

Will, you have some fascinating ideas but it's hard to see your point sometimes because you constrain the topic. I understand that you are talking apples and not oranges but to understand the oranges we need to know the seed. Why won't you just give us a generalized idea of why you think consciousness uses physical forms. You already said it's not to relate or understand cause and effect, so what's left? Just a curiosity to contemplate a death perhaps?

I promise that you can get right back on topic after you do so don't fear it, just go with it.  wink

Yes - that is what chopsticks said - I was agreeing...but as with all things, the destination need also be questioned...is it a good thing?  What exactly is it?  Even as vast the journey, the physical universe, what can be done, learned, applied, built upon?  Why does Consciousness want to explore in such a hands on way, even being human?  Why does it want to develop ways of moving into the Galaxy, self replicate its new form, add to that form and transform the Galaxy...and do this through using the bridge of all bio logical forms in all Galaxies?

'The Journey not the destination' is too flamboyant..too...impulsive, reckless, aimless even.  This Universe affords something of a means in which to project the most likely destination before even embarking...but let us face it, we (Consciousness) has already embarked...and while 'learning from pain and suffering' is inclusive, it is not - by any means - the only reason.

Smiley

Yes there is more of a point -  my rather impatient friends - to this unfolding thread.  But first the groundwork has to be prepared yes?  The contradiction is that you want the 'destination' explained by skipping the 'journey' to 'get to the point' and then show your disapproval/frustration by your impetuous responses.  Cheesy

A better way of approach perhaps - that both the journey and the destination are equally relevant. 


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Wi11iam
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« Reply #21 on: March 11, 2013, 23:41:37 »

Thats the one.
It irritated me most the way through. The acting of the characters is quite realistic.
How does one teach finer values to the presented mindset of others?
 A task of magnitude.


No I haven't seen this film.  But I understand what you are referring to.  No easy task but then I guess ultimately from our own little world perspective we are only responsible for our own education - that is the bottom line - but as part of the bigger reality we do care enough to persist with helping where we can, as insignificant as that help might be...it is our nature...more importantly we don't actually have to feel irritated by those mindsets...we can learn to let that go...



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« Reply #22 on: March 12, 2013, 02:06:07 »

Quote
The contradiction is that you want the 'destination' explained by skipping the 'journey' to 'get to the point' and then show your disapproval/frustration by your impetuous responses.


The problem is that I'm not sure we are on a journey. But I'll hang in there until you finally convince me otherwise.
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Wi11iam
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« Reply #23 on: March 12, 2013, 02:37:44 »



The problem is that I'm not sure we are on a journey. But I'll hang in there until you finally convince me otherwise.


Fortunately it is not my job to convince anyone.  I am simply pointing out the facts as they surface.
 wink


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Wi11iam
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« Reply #24 on: March 12, 2013, 02:42:38 »

http://vimeo.com/61236149#

A nice wee vid on the mind.
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