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Author Topic: Goetic-namely, Vassago.  (Read 10931 times)
alusdair_rua
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« on: January 23, 2013, 06:01:54 »

I wish to speak with Vassago.  I've had the Duke on my mind for years, and I just can't shake it.

Would those with a wealth of information be so kind to help me by example?  If you have guidelines on how you do it, I would like to hear it.

This doesn't mean I'll try everything I hear, of course.  I'm not coming here with anything exceeding the healthy amount of skepticism, and I'm by no means naive. 

I could really use your help, Astral Academy magic community, so I'm reaching out to you for your support.

Thank you for taking the time to read this; I hope to hear what any of you have to say on the subject.
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Quasartic
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« Reply #1 on: January 23, 2013, 08:24:54 »

My best advice would be that once you enter your OBE. Ask to speak or locate this person or being you are talking about. In other words , desire , you have to want it to happen in order to happen. 
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« Reply #1 on: January 23, 2013, 08:24:54 »

logoVisit the website of Astral Pulse creator Adrian Cooper.

Home of the best selling book Our Ultimate Reality.

Astral Projection, Metaphysics and many other subjects.

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alusdair_rua
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« Reply #2 on: January 23, 2013, 08:43:11 »

Thank you very kindly for the feedback, however I believe it may not be so simple.  Vassago isn't one who should be taken lightly.

This is a small excerpt I pulled from wikipedia:

Vassago, in demonology, is a mighty Prince of Hell (see Hierarchy of demons), ruling over twenty-six legions of demons. He can be persuaded to tell the magician of events past and future, can discover hidden and lost things, and has a "good" nature.[1]

He is described in The Lesser Key of Solomon as follows:

    The Third Spirit is a Mighty Prince, being of the same nature as Agares. He is called Vassago. This Spirit is of a Good Nature, and his office is to declare things Past and to Come, and to discover all things Hid or Lost. And he governeth 26 Legions of Spirits, and this is his Seal.


He may be of good nature, but seen as a demon by many.  This is something I want to do very consciously as opposed to OBE, with a more uniform ritual if possible, need I some protective device of some kind.  I suppose I should have clarified that in my first post.

Hitting the sack and getting some shuddeye for now  wink I'll check back with you all tomorrow.  Thanks again.
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omass
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« Reply #3 on: January 27, 2013, 17:06:22 »

Have you read the Goetia? Anyhow, I would recommend a Grimoire. I have NOT done this and I'm still studing the works of other authors on other types of magick. Out of Grimoires, you could use the Lesser Key of Solomon, Grimoire of Pope Honorius e.t.c but do not use the Necronomicon. If you have not done much magic, I dare say your success rates will be somewhat limited. Alot of people tend to think that there is a "limit" to which magick can be done but I would disagree on that. Have you never heard of Buddhist monk levitation? Or perahaps telekinesis, which was studied by Soviet scientists who found no fault, and could not explain their findings. The very first spell I cast this year brought a huge snowstorm...anyway I'm going stringly off-topic here. So then, here is a list of some if the Grimoires: * The Key of Solomon
  * The Lemegeton (or Lesser Key of Solomon) also know as the Goetia

  * The Goetia or Theurgia the same as above... the Lemegeton

  * Grimorium Verum (based on The Key of Solomon)
  * Grimoire of Honorius or also called the Grimoire of Pope Honious

  * The Book of Sacred Magic of Abra-Melin the Mage
  * The Book of Black Magic and of Pacts
  * True Black Magic (or The Secrets of Secrets, draws on The Key of Solomon)
  * Grand Grimoire (or Red Dragon)
  * The Magus by Francis Barrett
  * The Black Pullet (or Treasure of the Old Man of the Pyramids or Black Screech Owl)
  * Verus Jesuitarum Libellus (or True Magical Works of the Jesuits)Supposed Fake 

  * Three Books of Occult Philosophy
  * Mysteria Magica
Along with those I would suggest the books by Cornelius Agrippa.
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omass
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« Reply #4 on: January 27, 2013, 17:08:45 »

By the wsy I do not reccommend all of those books-just a small list.
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« Reply #4 on: January 27, 2013, 17:08:45 »



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M4RT1N
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« Reply #5 on: January 27, 2013, 18:26:08 »

How do you know that this "Vassago" is real ? and why do you think that it would have a physical body ? if that demon is real then why don't you just AP and talk to him ?

"This is something I want to do very consciously."

you can be more conscious while out of body than in the physical.

BTW you can do all the things that vassago can do, in the astral.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2013, 18:28:01 by M4RT1N » Logged
omass
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« Reply #6 on: January 27, 2013, 20:55:07 »

He wants to do this in the physical...not astral. BTW how much magick experience have you had?
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M4RT1N
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« Reply #7 on: January 28, 2013, 16:47:42 »

He wants to do this in the physical...not astral. BTW how much magick experience have you had?

But that's impossible, he doesn't even know if it has a physical body.
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omass
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« Reply #8 on: January 28, 2013, 20:39:29 »

Impossible? A very interasting observation. The only problem with that is, that nothing is impossible. Now, since this isn't really my speciality, I can't really talk about this as boldly as I would like but there are many ways this is possible:
1)Let him write with your hand-automatic writing.
2)Channelling.
3)"Hearing" an inner voice.
And perahaps the hardest:
4)An *audiable* sound.
Then there are many other ways the Grimoires suggest. Untill I had a Paranormal encounter, which someone else witnesded, I too though much was impossible. Now I think it's just a question of time-which is limited, since we tend to die off within 60-100 years, more or less. But a sceptic remains a sceptic unless something big happens. We live in an interasting time...
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alusdair_rua
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« Reply #9 on: February 11, 2013, 09:28:41 »

Thanks for your help everyone.
« Last Edit: February 11, 2013, 11:10:34 by alusdair_rua » Logged
Astralzombie
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« Reply #10 on: February 11, 2013, 09:56:14 »

Can anyone decipher what might have happened for me?

That's an easy one to answer. You messed around with something that you didn't understand, yet you put a lot of belief into it. Whether or not these beings are real matters little. What matters is that they are real to you. And that is powerful enough. Believe that none of it can hurt you and that will be true. Are you hesitant to take the jobs because you think they come with strings attached? If so, I believe you are right but they are your own strings. I'm curious as to why you continued making the deal with this being even when you were losing your awareness. Did you even consider that this entity may have intended or even caused your lack of awareness? If you didn't, you should consider it, . It can't hurt you physically but once you believe it can cause you bad luck, you will in turn cause your own bad luck.

Good luck in all of this. You may need all you can get if you give this too much belief. I'm sorry. I'm just hate demon talk. I don't believe in them anymore and it keeps to many people from trying to learn the truth. There are negative entities but you can escape their influence anytime you like and none of them can drag you into any type of hell that you can't simply leave from.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2013, 23:46:46 by its_all_bad » Logged

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Selea
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« Reply #11 on: March 31, 2013, 11:52:21 »

I wish to speak with Vassago.  I've had the Duke on my mind for years, and I just can't shake it.

Would those with a wealth of information be so kind to help me by example?  If you have guidelines on how you do it, I would like to hear it.

This doesn't mean I'll try everything I hear, of course.  I'm not coming here with anything exceeding the healthy amount of skepticism, and I'm by no means naive.  

I could really use your help, Astral Academy magic community, so I'm reaching out to you for your support.

Thank you for taking the time to read this; I hope to hear what any of you have to say on the subject.

One of the best books to reach a so called "Physical Manifestation" is Ceremonial Magick and the Power of Evocation of Lisewski.
While he is too dogmatic on certain points the book is a must to understand what are the dynamics to a successful "materialization" (it is more an etheric - not astral, note well - materialization, than a purely physical one but to all practical purposes it is exactly the same) and why many people cannot have those results. What he speaks about of the subjective synthesis (in psychological terms, that in occult/shamanic term is the "framework") it is one of the most important aspect of practical magic, and why a correct functioning framework is indispensable to have reliable results (that it is what I was speaking about some years ago in this forum too, with not many results I must add  rolleyes).

So study that book well, after you have done so you can either change procedures as you want (keeping the structure of them and changing things according to their nature) but until you cannot understand well that point you will not be able to do anything of really constructive (as it happens, sadly, with most new-ages practitioners).

EDIT: To help you a little further to understand the "structure" I was talking about before: every Grimoire has a certain structure, a sort of skeleton that it is at its base. For example the structure of both the Heptameron, Liber Juratus and the Clavicula Solomonis are for evocations to multiple spirits (and in fact the modus operandi in them it is really similar). The structure of the Goetia is based on the Heptameron but made appositely for a single spirit evocation. Still the "skeleton" is the same as the afore-mentioned books and it is based on an hermetic/qabbalah framework.  So, to understand that framework well (and extract it) the best thing to do is to study the Agrippa works (Three Books of Occult Phylosophy) and then you can adapt the framework of the same to your ends (in case you want to change it because it is not your cup of tea; naturally it is much easier to use a different Grimoire than to adapt one, but if you like the structure of a certain Grimoire best, it can be done in this way).
The Grimorium Verum and the Grand Grimoire, instead, have completely different structures and to understand them you should instead study Vodoun or Sorcery systems (the Grimorium Verum in structure is almost the same as a Vodoun working, with either the calling of an intermediary spirit - as  it could be Legba there - to help on the evocation) to extract the modus operandi fully.

I hope these two examples clarify what I meant by "structure".
« Last Edit: March 31, 2013, 12:10:37 by Selea » Logged
Selea
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« Reply #12 on: March 31, 2013, 11:56:13 »

Believe that none of it can hurt you and that will be true.

So you really think that if you "believe that nothing can hurt you that will be true"? You can try to fly from your window and see if "believing you will not hurt yourself" will do something at all.

Surely daring and not having fear is a good approach, but in the same way you always have to have respect and humility with what you encounter. Luckily for certain people they never reach a certain threshold, elsewhere with this attitude only you would be in real trouble after a while.

On simple example: if you will ever practice necromancy even once in your life maybe you will change a little idea.
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Astralzombie
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« Reply #13 on: March 31, 2013, 12:11:19 »

Hi selea. My quote that you were referring to was only in context to demonology. You had to take it out of context to imply that I believe that jumping out of windows is harmless.

I have seen and spoken to many entities that have been given power to them through the beliefs of others. Most have only been manifested through belief. The rest are just as harmless.

They are not real to me because I don't give then enough attention to sustain their existence for any time in my reality. My belief makes this so.

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Selea
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« Reply #14 on: March 31, 2013, 19:02:41 »

I have seen and spoken to many entities that have been given power to them through the beliefs of others. Most have only been manifested through belief. The rest are just as harmless.

They are not real to me because I don't give then enough attention to sustain their existence for any time in my reality. My belief makes this so.

It depends on the types of "entities". Many people when they refer to "entities" in reality have just met so-called thought-forms that they exchange for "real" entities. Those are indeed harmless since they are your creation in every point.

There are other kinds of "entities" that possess more "objective" reality (nobody knows naturally what they are, but they differ in practice from a simple thought-form), and many systems have listed their categories differently depending on their framework. From the hermetic/qabbalah category they are subdivided in angelical/demonic and lastly the spirits of death. In decreasing order they get from the least close to the material world to the closer.

It is not easy to meet a real "entity" (one that seems and act in a way that can be included in that term fully), especially if you do only certain things (as astral projection), so it is difficult to talk about these things because many will just think that you are just creating a belief structure that then it becomes true because you adhere to it. I can understand it, in fact, but I know that's just a matter of ignorance on certain experiences, nothing more.

I used the example of Necromancy because it is probably the most easy way to see (if one is interested) how what you think/don't think and your approach change very little; it's easy because the so-called "spirits of death" (if they are really such or not it's not important) are, as I said, closer to the material world and they have a major impact on it, even of "demons". Just for this, however, they are extremely dangerous to handle and to do so you have to pay a steep price.
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Astralzombie
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« Reply #15 on: April 01, 2013, 01:54:58 »

Hey, Selea.

I might not be using the correct terminology here. To me, a thought form is a manifestation of my own that does not exist apart from me, it's subjective. Now, if I can see and interact with your thought form, created by your beliefs, I then call it an entity. It has no power over me because I give it none though it may be extremely powerful to others that don't recognize that this is a possibility. I believe that there are all kinds of consciousness that exist objectively of our individual beliefs as well.

In my early explorations, I constantly feared demons and such until little by little, I stopped believing in them. I have since learned why but I do not at all wish to influence your beliefs. You are comfortable and have no fear exploring. My mini rants are only because so many new people won't try these different states of consciousness because they are too scared of something that doesn't have to exist if they don't let them.

I understand your lack of desire to speak openly about some of your beliefs because other will say you are trapped in a belief system. But we subjectively know our own objective truths. Who can tell us otherwise?

The reality is that we all are. We can't escape that.
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Selea
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« Reply #16 on: April 02, 2013, 11:40:00 »

In my early explorations, I constantly feared demons and such until little by little, I stopped believing in them. I have since learned why but I do not at all wish to influence your beliefs. You are comfortable and have no fear exploring. My mini rants are only because so many new people won't try these different states of consciousness because they are too scared of something that doesn't have to exist if they don't let them.

That's perfectly fine. Having not fear of what you encounter is a must, but it is also a must to respect what you "see" and not treat it as you are the master and what you see is your slave. Many people do that, and for them it works because what they encounter is something that doesn't go beyond a certain point. If you do that with certain other things you would be in trouble fast. Even in the case the "entities" are just part of your unconscious do you really want to treat it badly just for a false egomaniac feeling? So, IMO it is better to always approach things with respect.

I understand your lack of desire to speak openly about some of your beliefs because other will say you are trapped in a belief system. But we subjectively know our own objective truths. Who can tell us otherwise?

Practical results can. Until what you do has a validity only within your mind, you can fake to be or do whatever you like. There are so many people that delude themselves of having done whatever experience, just because of that.

I will give you an example: in the raise of the so-called Kundalini there are certain "siddhi" to be obtained. These are practical "gifts" that you receive. They are there appositely to let you know if you are just deluding yourself or not (every spiritual results has also a practical development, there's no way out of that). Now, if you talk with 99% of people that insist that they arose the Kundalini till the Samsara nobody of them usually posses either ONE single of those siddhi, yet they are convinced that they did really arouse Kundalini till the top. Their mind delude them so much that they either come to the point of ascribing a positive result on not having obtained those practical results, because they think they are "over the material so much that these things didn't manifest".

This is how much powerful your mind is, especially on deluding yourself you are doing the most powerful feats even when you are doing nothing. All ancients traditions are tied to practical results just for this. If you have some practical achievements then you know if what you do is really working or not; if you leave the deduction of the results only to your mind you will be in a great danger (everyone is, nobody excluded).

The reality is that we all are. We can't escape that.

True, so use a working framework instead of being a slave of one that doesn't work without either comprehending it
« Last Edit: April 02, 2013, 11:41:33 by Selea » Logged
Icedelta
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« Reply #17 on: April 10, 2013, 14:50:01 »

Okay i stumbled upon this place and have been reading on these forums for the past week or so. I didn't register until i came across this post. I happen to be practicing magic for a little time now (5 years) and i believe he wishes to summon the spirit as it is referred in the lesser keys of solomon and doing so staying in the physical world.

I don't know what books, translations or whatever you came across so far. But there is a complete set of tools, medallions and special equipment that you need to craft for yourself in order to do this and remain in the physical world. Indeed there are some protection that you need to get for yourself. And there is a lot of preparation, in doing so. You need to understand that this science uses all of the six senses in order to make a complete experience and manifest your desires and intentions. It uses visual, smell, touch, taste, sound and psychic references to anchor your intention and fixate it so you can project it.

May i refer you to this website, where you can find all you need to know about the subject, it is a translation in latin languages of the Clavicles of Solomon. Please keep in mind that all of the invocations are there to fixate your mind only, and that you could make your own invocations.

http://www.esotericarchives.com/solomon/l1203.htm

I hope this helps. If not there is another interpretation of the Goetia from Aleister Crowley here :

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B_u8j3RzsdomYWM5ZTA1ZDctZjM2Ni00MzdmLThiMjYtYzQyODZjOGRkNTc2/edit


Good reading, pal ! And i hope you will realize the amplitude of the enterprise you are getting in. Best wishes

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