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Author Topic: Simulated Lucidity - Explained!  (Read 2849 times)
12padams
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« on: May 06, 2012, 00:59:10 »

So many people have asked me about this so here it is... An explanation of simulated lucidity explained in as little words as possible:
-Remember that "lucid" just means "conscious"

If you are conscious within an experience then should you only do what you planned to do while awake and nothing else until you have completed your goal. If you plan to "fly to the moon and search for life" yet you become conscious in a dream and say "I'm dreaming" and go flying around destroying cities then you experienced: Simulated Lucidity!

It differs from low lucidity however it's often mistaken as low lucidity. Low lucidity can be noticed if you do your goal but with quite an unfocused mind. For example you may become conscious and go "what was my goal again? Oh yea... Fly to... Where was it again... Oh yes, the moon." Then while flying you keep getting distracted with other things but eventually get to your destination and maybe achieve your goal.

So to clarify: You are not conscious if you are experiencing simulated lucidity! Your goal of becoming lucid has become so dominate in your conscious mind that it has leaked into your subconscious mind resulting in the creation of a dream simulating the awareness of being conscious within a dream. Often within a simulated lucid experience you may notice that you have memories that you don't actually really have in real life and seem to be familiar with unfamiliar things. If you awaken and think "huh, why did I do that or think that" then it's a huge sign of simulated lucidity!

Finally its time to give some examples of my simulated lucid and real lucid experiences. Below I will post a link to my free ebooks. "Teenage Phase Adventures" contains only my conscious experiences in which I attempt to complete an exact multistep plan during an experience. My other book "Entering The Phase - A 17-Year-Old's Journey" logs every single experience including sleep paralysis, dreams, simulated lucid experiences and real lucid experiences.

I highly recommend you read a few experiences from "teenage phase adventures" to get the idea of how you can follow plans within lucid experiences. Then go to the back of my other book to see a huge list of my simulated and real lucid experiences. You will see the level of lucidity listed next to lucid experience and the unplanned actions performed in each simulated experience. Read a few simulated experiences to get a feel for how they can sometimes seem extremely convincing/logical/long and vivid yet obviously lacking in consciousness other times. The fact of the matter is that none of the simulated lucid experiences are conscious experiences even though some seem more conscious than others.

Heres a link to my books: http://forum.obe4u.com/index.php?topic=842.0

Last of all just remember that you can still learn from simulated lucid experiences. For example in a simulated lucid experience "I" (not me since I wasn't conscious) came up with a method to fly. Ever since then I have known how to fly because of that experience. I remembered my thoughts and the feelings I had during simulated consciousness and am able to use them during real conscious experiences.
« Last Edit: May 06, 2012, 01:17:31 by 12padams » Logged
Lionheart
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« Reply #1 on: May 06, 2012, 01:33:24 »

So to clarify: You are not conscious if you are experiencing simulated lucidity!
Just curious here. If you are not conscious or consciously aware during this "simulated lucidity", then how do retain total recall of the event?  huh
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« Reply #1 on: May 06, 2012, 01:33:24 »

logoVisit the website of Astral Pulse creator Adrian Cooper.

Home of the best selling book Our Ultimate Reality.

Astral Projection, Metaphysics and many other subjects.

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12padams
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« Reply #2 on: May 06, 2012, 02:30:46 »

Just curious here. If you are not conscious or consciously aware during this "simulated lucidity", then how do retain total recall of the event?  huh

Just like you are not conscious in normal dreams yet remember them! While dreaming the subconscious stores memories then when you awaken your conscious part instantly grabs the memories from storage section. Please don't tell topic me this is going to cause a huge debate... That's why I avoided it in the first place Sad

Look, read a few of my simulated experiences and you will get the picture. For example look at day 124... Me and my friend Daniel believed we were lucid in a shared experience but really I wasn't conscious. I said I was and spoke of my "plans" but we did things that I never planned in real life and I had memories of things I don't actually remember.

It can be less obvious like day 125 which seemed pretty realistic yet this experience also lacked consciousness. Other times it's much more obvious it's simulated such as day 166 (meeting someone who said I could get evil powers while lucid) and Day 15 "Got off computer chair and found myself in the phase"... Really? That's obviously impossible so it did lack consciousness because I didn't notice how stupid/strange it was and didn't perform my plan of action.

« Last Edit: May 06, 2012, 02:45:57 by 12padams » Logged
Xanth
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« Reply #3 on: May 06, 2012, 05:12:41 »

Ok!  I understand your metaphors now.

If you are conscious within an experience then should you only do what you planned to do while awake and nothing else until you have completed your goal. If you plan to "fly to the moon and search for life" yet you become conscious in a dream and say "I'm dreaming" and go flying around destroying cities then you experienced: Simulated Lucidity!
Having full recall of your physical life, remembering the "goals" you set for your non-physical time... is what I'd call a Non-Physical Astral Awareness Experience.

What you're calling simulated lucidity I call a Non-Physical Lucid Awareness Experience.  It's when the only thing you're aware of is that you're experiencing a reality that isn't this physical reality.  You probably don't have any actual awareness of your true, physical self.

My States of Conscious Awareness:

non-physical dream awareness experience” - you’re the actor not realizing you’re in a play. You’re simply going along with the non-physical scenario that is being played out, regardless of how whacky or strange it may be it’ll be perfectly normal to you.

non-physical lucid awareness experience” - you're the actor who realizes you're in a play, but that's it.  You’re in the non-physical and at the very base level, you know it. Most people commonly refer to this as a Lucid Dream.

To describe the next awareness state, I’ll need to first explain the term “waking awareness”. Right now, while reading this, you have what I call a waking awareness. You know who you are (your memories), what you are (physical being), and where you are (physical reality). Now, take that waking awareness and bring it into the non-physical and you have a “non-physical astral awareness experience”. You're the actor who knows they're in a play and knows who their real life physical counterpart is.

There... now we can talk apples to apples.  Smiley

The three designations listed above describe the same experience, but with varying levels of conscious awareness.  Which is what I believe accounts for people misinterpreting them as being separate "events".  They all "feel" differently, in the same manner in which you "feel" different first thing upon waking in the morning compared to how you "feel" mid-afternoon.  But you wouldn't say that the difference between first thing in the morning and mid-afternoon are completely different experiences/events... your consciousness is just more awake and alert at those different times.  Well, same holds true for your consciousness while in the non-physical.

http://unlimitedboundaries.ca/2010/10/04/my-new-consciousness-designations/ <-- you can read it more in depth here, or in my eBook.

As I mention in that article... the line between lucid and astral awareness can be very blurred and difficult to discern.  In which case, it really doesn't matter though... just enjoy the experience.  Smiley

And: http://unlimitedboundaries.ca/2011/08/23/the-muliple-consciousness-awareness-levels-of-physical-and-non-physical-realities/

Thanks for the clarification!
« Last Edit: May 06, 2012, 05:22:28 by Xanth » Logged

12padams
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« Reply #4 on: May 06, 2012, 06:35:34 »

Quote
“non-physical lucid awareness experience” - you're the actor who realizes you're in a play, but that's it.  You’re in the non-physical and at the very base level, you know it. Most people commonly refer to this as a Lucid Dream.
Xanth says the above is the same as my term "simulated lucidity". If I were to give a definition to simulated lucidity it would be: A dream of being conscious within a dream that lacks consciousness.

Very very borderline of becoming debate of disagreement here... Ahh this is driving me nuts because I partly agree and partly don't. I really don't wanna start a fight here but boy you got me unable to decide whether I accept your terminology.

I'll just state the part I mostly disagree with... You say that people call "non-physical lucid awareness experience" a "Lucid dream". Lucid dreamers make goals or plans that they want to do when they awaken in their dreams. The problem is that your terminology states:
Quote
" It's when the only thing you're aware of is that you're experiencing a reality that isn't this physical reality.  You probably don't have any actual awareness of your true, physical self."

If they are not aware/remember the real world then how exactly do they recall their goals and completed them in the nonphysical world. That's why I call it "simulated lucidity" because you are no more conscious than you are during a normal dream. It's simply a dream with the topic but not awareness of being conscious.

Sorry about this... Looks like we started a never ending debate
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« Reply #4 on: May 06, 2012, 06:35:34 »



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catmeow
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« Reply #5 on: May 06, 2012, 15:08:55 »

Xanth and padams, you both make very valid points. However, after thinking about it a bit (my brain hurts!) if we accept Xanth's classification, then I don't think that "simulated lucidity" maps onto "non physical lucid experience". Instead, I think it is a special case of "non physical dream experience". padams expressed it extremely well by saying it is simply a dream where the TOPIC is consciousness, but consciousness itself is absent:

That's why I call it "simulated lucidity" because you are no more conscious than you are during a normal dream. It's simply a dream with the topic but not awareness of being conscious.

So padam's "simulated lucidity" is a special case of Xanth's "non physical dream experience".  Dreaming of lucid dreaming.

I have quite often dreamt of having an OBE. So in my dream I actually lay down, go into a suitable trance condition, and then with some difficulty, exit my body and have some sort of "OOB" adventure. But my awareness is very poor, critical faculty is absent, memory of physical life absent, etc. Basically jut a regular dream where the topic is "having an OOB". I wouldn't classify it as anything more than just a regular dream.

Xanth does make very good points though. It may just be a matter of awareness. So if my actual awareness during my "dream of having an OOB" becomes very clear, then the "simulated lucidity" becomes "actual lucidity" and would then become either a lucid awareness experience or an astral awareness experience.

So, in summary, I do think that padam's "simulated lucidity" experience maps onto Xanth's "non physical dream awareness experience". It's simpy a dream where the topic is lucidity.

imo.

Great post padams.
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Xanth
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« Reply #6 on: May 06, 2012, 15:54:21 »

If they are not aware/remember the real world then how exactly do they recall their goals and completed them in the nonphysical world. That's why I call it "simulated lucidity" because you are no more conscious than you are during a normal dream. It's simply a dream with the topic but not awareness of being conscious.
It's simple... they don't.  Lucid Awareness isn't the optimal state to be in in order to achieve SPECIFIC NON-PHYSICAL goals.  But that doesn't mean you still can't gain general goals, or even practice some techniques and still have fun at the same time!  Smiley

My last projection which I posted on my website illustrates this point clearly. 
http://unlimitedboundaries.ca/2012/05/02/morning-lucid-experience-wednesday-may-5th-2012/

In the end, I still fully enjoyed the experience regardless if I did any goals or not... actually, even though I didn't have an astral awareness in that experience, I still managed to get some practice in!  I think you're putting too much emphasis on specific goals and not taking a look at the bigger picture.  You're "too focused" right now... pull your focus out a bit, widen it, and just enjoy!  Smiley

I just wanted to point out one, kind of off topic thing:
Quote
Very very borderline of becoming debate of disagreement here... Ahh this is driving me nuts because I partly agree and partly don't. I really don't wanna start a fight here but boy you got me unable to decide whether I accept your terminology.
You won't start a fight here regarding this.  LoL
This would be how Raduga's forum has conditioned you to respond.  Nobody here is going to blast you for wanting to discuss these things... as long as they're discussed in a civilized manner, it's all good.

Also, feel free to disagree with me all you want.  I promise to not take it personally.  In the end, each person needs to come to their own personal truth in regards to all this... what I've listed above is "my" personal truth.  It's the conclusions that I've come to due to my direct experiences in the non-physical.  I give them to you and others to be a guide map to assist, not a rulebook to follow.  Smiley

And thank you catmeow for attempting to bridge the metaphors too.  It's much appreciated.  Smiley

I also wanted to touch a bit on Lionhearts post above.
Just curious here. If you are not conscious or consciously aware during this "simulated lucidity", then how do retain total recall of the event?  huh
In my experience, there's a very base level of conscious awareness required in order to experience the experience as it's happening.  In order to retain the memory of the experience, you do have to be consciously aware ever so slightly WHILE you're having the experience.  Otherwise you won't actually be experiencing it... another part of your consciousness, which isn't aware is experiencing it and doesn't become a memory.

That "base level" of awareness is what I refer to, at the very least, a "dream awareness".  Any awareness lower than a dream awareness just isn't remembered beyond brief flashes of images that you might remember throughout your day.
« Last Edit: May 06, 2012, 16:03:46 by Xanth » Logged

todd421757
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« Reply #7 on: May 06, 2012, 16:48:58 »

If you are conscious within an experience then should you only do what you planned to do while awake and nothing else until you have completed your goal. If you plan to "fly to the moon and search for life" yet you become conscious in a dream and say "I'm dreaming" and go flying around destroying cities then you experienced: Simulated Lucidity!

Here is a quote from Michael Raduga from obe4u.com: "Simultaneously, the degree to which practitioners perceive the phase environment affects the level of sensory experiences therein, which often occur in a higher form than the sensory experiences of wakefulness. This concept is difficult to imagine without firsthand experience of the phase. And so, it is not without reason that this practice is considered to be a higher state of self-hypnosis or meditation"

http://obe4u.com/?page_id=8

This is all the phase you are describing is. You are programming you subconscious mind to perform certain actions in a dream sequence. When you do not perform your goals as outlined, you are doing a simulation instead. Your subconscious isn't doing the exact program you set forth.  The phase is nothing more than a higher form of self-hypnosis or guided meditation. The programming of your subconscious can occur with binaural beats, guided images, affirmations, certain action sequences like pinching your nose or looking at your hands in a dream, and many other ways.

It is very similar to the past-life regressions that Michael Newton performs in his books.

I have nothing against this phase experience. If it helps you enjoy life, then that is wonderful. I just don't like how the phase is used to explain ALL obe related categories. I have never programmed my subconscious to perform a classic OBE. If anything, I am frequently controlled by an unknown current that directs me where to go. I have never had to perform a guided visual meditation to get a classic OBE separation.
« Last Edit: May 06, 2012, 17:29:54 by todd421757 » Logged
Lionheart
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« Reply #8 on: May 06, 2012, 23:25:16 »

 In my view and from research I have done on this subject, I found that Phasing came into play when people started to realize they could leave the physical reality at will. They didn't need to systematically climb out of the body piece by piece to reinforce their belief that they were actually achieving something. All this nonsense of this is in this book and that book is ridiculous. Those books are all based on opinions and personal experiences of the Author. No one has proved anything concrete as of yet.  Remember Pluto was once a planet and we were the only planetary system in the universe, this was all taught to me when I was younger too, from a book.
 To Phase as Frank puts it " Phasing, therefore, entails initiating a 180-degree phase shift between the physical and the non-physical realms of reality. The way this is done is rather different from the traditional ways of initiating an out of body experience. In fact, Phasing does not incorporate any kind of out of body feelings at all. The normal bodily vehicle can remain and all that changes is a person’s environment."
 Sometimes we spend too much time questioning it instead of experiencing it.
 Dr, Steve G. Jones uses hypnosis methodology in his programs to help people have OBE's. His program is based around energy work and "climbing out of the body".
 With Phasing you are not programming your mind to enter a dream sequence. Anyone that says has never Phased before! It all has do to with focus, will and intent.
« Last Edit: May 06, 2012, 23:45:43 by Lionheart » Logged
catmeow
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« Reply #9 on: May 06, 2012, 23:50:24 »

In my view and from research I have done on this subject, I found that Phasing came into play when people started to realize they could leave the physical reality at will. They didn't need to systematically climb out of the body piece by piece to reinforce their belief that they were actually achieving something.

And yet, the exit technique is a very powerful metaphor. For me going through the ritual of an "exit technique" is the easiest way of deepening an early morning drowsy state into full blown MABA. I didn't learn this from any book, because when I started projecting, this technique (a bit similar to WBTB) was not actually in any book on the market. So for some reason, the body metaphor is highly effective. Perhaps there is more to it than just a metaphor?
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Xanth
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« Reply #10 on: May 07, 2012, 00:20:12 »

And yet, the exit technique is a very powerful metaphor. For me going through the ritual of an "exit technique" is the easiest way of deepening an early morning drowsy state into full blown MABA. I didn't learn this from any book, because when I started projecting, this technique (a bit similar to WBTB) was not actually in any book on the market. So for some reason, the body metaphor is highly effective.
It certainly is a powerful metaphor for those who use it.  No doubt.
I say if it works for you, then use it!  Smiley
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