Is astral projection / obe the same thing as lucid dreaming?

[Windwalker.]

Think about what you're saying here...

When you're ALREADY SLEEPING and ALREADY IN REM, you experience lucid dreams.
And when you're NOT ALREADY SLEEPING and NOT ALREADY IN REM, you experience obes.

Think about those two statements for a second.  They don't mean what you think they mean.
They don't mean that lucid dreaming only happens in REM and obes happen only outside REM.

This is the MAJOR issue with these inaccurate labels people have been using... they've caused people to stop thinking critically.

Ok Xanth. When DO lucid dreams happen if not in rem sleep? Also-i didnt say all obes happen in non rem rather I said “many” obes happen in non rem.

[Xanth]

Ok Xanth. When DO lucid dreams happen if not in rem sleep? Also-i didnt say all obes happen in non rem rather I said “many” obes happen in non rem.

Ultimately, you're asking the wrong question, because to me, "lucid dreams" aren't anything which actually exist.  So asking "when do lucid dreams happen" is like asking me to find you a pot of gold at the end of a rainbow.  It's a misinterpretation of the data available. 

Also, in that same thread of thought, OBEs also don't exist either.  Dreams don't exist.  None of them *objectively* exist.

People get stuck in the box of attempting to label these experiences and it causes them to have myopic vision regarding them.
It's only when you lose the labels that you will begin to see the forest for the trees. 

There are only non-physical experiences consciously aware or not.  But then, even those don't really exist as this physical reality experience we're currently having is also a "non-physical" reality.  One of an infinite.

[desert-rat]

On lucid dreams , its a dream you know that you are dreaming and take controll .  I have done it a few times .  Lets say in your dream you walk through a door , turn around and its a solid wall .  You think to your self , this makes no sense . What i do is chose to wake up . 

[luffy28]

Thanks for all the replies,
I wanted to ask should I try to go to sleep for 2 to 2 and a half hours and then wake up? The reason I'm asking is that I've tried awakening after 4 to 6 hours and I at least stay awake for 2 to 3 hours. Also I'm still trying the obe4u technique.

https://obe4u.com/how-to-lucid-dream/

Thanks.

[luffy28]

Hi,
Last night I set my alarm to awaken me after two and a half hours. The alarm didn't awaken me and I ended up awakening after 4 hours. I did the SSILD technique and was partially lucid in a dream. I ended up talking to a dream character and the dream then ended. I also recalled 5 or 6 dreams and had subsequent awakenings. Any advice on how to obe with the SSILD technique?

https://www.thelucidguide.com/Techniques/Senses-Initiated-Lucid-Dream-(SSILD)

Thanks.

[Yodad]

Hi,
Last night I set my alarm to awaken me after two and a half hours. The alarm didn't awaken me and I ended up awakening after 4 hours. I did the SSILD technique and was partially lucid in a dream. I ended up talking to a dream character and the dream then ended. I also recalled 5 or 6 dreams and had subsequent awakenings. Any advice on how to obe with the SSILD technique?

https://www.thelucidguide.com/Techniques/Senses-Initiated-Lucid-Dream-(SSILD)

Thanks.

Seems like it all depends on HOW you use the technique, or what you try after the lucid dream ends.
 
SSILD was designed in a way for people to do the cycles very casually, then simply go to sleep. That's exactly what CosmicIron suggests. However, some people may attempt to LD/OBE directly from waking state while performing the cycles. The other option is to attempt some (Raduga) phasing indirect method after the lucid dream ends.
 
Cosmic.Iron gives some insight how people may have had these. Here is part of his initial post on SSILD...

"Theory

 We do not know why exactly SSILD works.  One user pointed out that the method shares some resemblance with the self-hypnosis method introduced by Betty Erickson, wife of the late Dr. Milton H. Erickson.  Another theory is that by repeated stimulation of the various senses in a trance-like state, we incubate our mind and body into the right condition suited for entering a DILD, WILD, or OBE.

 Regardless the theory, it is utterly crucial to keep in mind that SSILD is not strictly a WILD technique.  While many users report successful LD/OBE induction from the waking state, this method is equally effective at inducing DILDs.  In fact, I strongly suggest users treat it solely as a DILD technique in order to use it in the most effective manner."

In case you didn't know, a DILD is basically when you are dreaming and then become lucid while dreaming (dream induced lucid dream). However, I put in bold the part where he mentions that some individuals simply change how they perform the technique and keep mind awake, body asleep can induce OBEs.

[luffy28]

Seems like it all depends on HOW you use the technique, or what you try after the lucid dream ends.
 
SSILD was designed in a way for people to do the cycles very casually, then simply go to sleep. That's exactly what CosmicIron suggests. However, some people may attempt to LD/OBE directly from waking state while performing the cycles. The other option is to attempt some (Raduga) phasing indirect method after the lucid dream ends.
 
Cosmic.Iron gives some insight how people may have had these. Here is part of his initial post on SSILD...
In case you didn't know, a DILD is basically when you are dreaming and then become lucid while dreaming (dream induced lucid dream). However, I put in bold the part where he mentions that some individuals simply change how they perform the technique and keep mind awake, body asleep can induce OBEs.

Thanks,
I'm going to try the Raduga technique instead. Could've done it last night because I had school canceled because of a snowstorm.

Thanks.

[Yodad]

Thanks,
I'm going to try the Raduga technique instead. Could've done it last night because I had school canceled because of a snowstorm.

Thanks.

I didn't say abandon what is working.    I said there are options to try while using SSILD. I hope that is what you mean. If you're having some success, then run with that man. Consistency is what you need right now.

[luffy28]

Yeah, I ended up having two or three subsequent awakenings. Also, I had a dream that I was in times square NYC. Other than that I forgot to practice the exit/cycling techniques. Next time I'm going to practice so I can do it correctly.

Thanks.

[luffy28]

Tried it after awakening after one hour and 20 minutes last night. For some reason the past two nights I haven't been able to get the subsequent awakenings. When I sleep should the last thought be getting the awakenings? The hardest part is getting the awakenings.

Thanks.

[Phildan1]

You should invest months and years seeing constant results and stopping doing this get fast results thing. You will see it.

Your first "sleep cycles" or rather the first NP experience chains you get from falling asleep each night, are containing all your mind noise mostly with a great chance so don't expect so much. Rather maybe from the second half of your sleep time. True for everything, even for being silent in your mind and trying out something like phasing or others. It is simply because you live up your crap each time you fall asleep as a beginner and you need to investigate the configuration about what and when to do. Don't rush like a busy spider here and there lol. If you try to know and do everything at once, it will be not so satisfying or you will lose interest quickly.

[luffy28]

You should invest months and years seeing constant results and stopping doing this get fast results thing. You will see it.

Your first "sleep cycles" or rather the first NP experience chains you get from falling asleep each night, are containing all your mind noise mostly with a great chance so don't expect so much. Rather maybe from the second half of your sleep time. True for everything, even for being silent in your mind and trying out something like phasing or others. It is simply because you live up your crap each time you fall asleep as a beginner and you need to investigate the configuration about what and when to do. Don't rush like a busy spider here and there lol. If you try to know and do everything at once, it will be not so satisfying or you will lose interest quickly.

Thanks, like I said the only problem I have is the subsequent awakenings other than that I don't' have any problems. I just need to get the subsequent awakenings and I'll be good. Also, I might even do a Skype with Raduga so I can get first-hand info on how to do subsequent awakenings.

Thanks.

[luffy28]

I also got a reply on this forum

https://www.forum.obe4u.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&p=22847#p22847

the person said

"Other option , different from the above, you can use the alarm which can shut down immediately by itself after ring. When you are waken by the alarm , apply the indirect method routine immediately. Try your best to stay motionless and do not open your eyes . If motion accidently happened, just try to do the cycling for 4 round."

I don't know what they mean by "you can use the alarm which can shut down immediately by itself after ring"?

Thanks.

[Yodad]

I also got a reply on this forum

https://www.forum.obe4u.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&p=22847#p22847

the person said

"Other option , different from the above, you can use the alarm which can shut down immediately by itself after ring. When you are waken by the alarm , apply the indirect method routine immediately. Try your best to stay motionless and do not open your eyes . If motion accidently happened, just try to do the cycling for 4 round."

I don't know what they mean by "you can use the alarm which can shut down immediately by itself after ring"?

Thanks.

He means an alarm app that makes an alarm sound then auto shuts off without you pushing anything on the phone to turn off. All I did was search the reddit LD sub because that question is asked a lot. Alarm Clock Xtreme by AVG Labs is suggested a lot for this purpose. You can program it to sound for X seconds and auto shut off it sounds like. I have iOS so I can’t even endorse that app, just giving you one.

[luffy28]

He means an alarm app that makes an alarm sound then auto shuts off without you pushing anything on the phone to turn off. All I did was search the reddit LD sub because that question is asked a lot. Alarm Clock Xtreme by AVG Labs is suggested a lot for this purpose. You can program it to sound for X seconds and auto shut off it sounds like. I have iOS so I can’t even endorse that app, just giving you one.

Could you or anyone else interpret his comment and tell me how to do the Raduga technique with the alarm he recommended?

Thanks.

[Xanth]

He means an alarm app that makes an alarm sound then auto shuts off without you pushing anything on the phone to turn off. All I did was search the reddit LD sub because that question is asked a lot. Alarm Clock Xtreme by AVG Labs is suggested a lot for this purpose. You can program it to sound for X seconds and auto shut off it sounds like. I have iOS so I can’t even endorse that app, just giving you one.

Ha!

I was working on an android app for that very thing about 7 years ago when I was out of work.
Had the whole thing designed out and half programmed.  You could select an alarm sound yourself and set a timer which went off at a random interval of your choosing along with a setting for a standard timer which went off then turned off after a predetermined time by the user.  Never did finish it... now I have no idea where all that code is nor how to program in java anymore.  LoL

[Yodad]

Could you or anyone else interpret his comment and tell me how to do the Raduga technique with the alarm he recommended?

Thanks.

1. Program the app alarm to make the sound after 4-6 hrs of sleep (or, however many hours after falling asleep that works for YOU). Maybe do a test to find what sound and how long the sound plays before you go to bed.
2. Also set the alarm to auto-shut off, so you don't have to move to turn it off.
3. When it is bed time, set your alarm and go to bed.
4. Sleep.
5. During sleep, you will hear the alarm go off. Don't move! Keep eyes shut. The alarm should turn off automatically if you set it up right!
6. Perform Raduga technique.
7. Do same steps 1-6 for any days of the week you want to try.
8. Do not change technique for at least 1-2 months.

[ForrestDean]

I used to use the "Insight Timer" for my iPhone.  It has excellent timer profiles you can set up to wake you up at certain times throughout the night.  You can even use different tones or even vibrate if the tones wake you up too much or there happens to be someone else sleeping next to you that you don't want to wake up.  I still have it on my iPhone actually, but I don't use it anymore.

[luffy28]

1. Program the app alarm to make the sound after 4-6 hrs of sleep (or, however many hours after falling asleep that works for YOU). Maybe do a test to find what sound and how long the sound plays before you go to bed.
2. Also set the alarm to auto-shut off, so you don't have to move to turn it off.
3. When it is bed time, set your alarm and go to bed.
4. Sleep.
5. During sleep, you will hear the alarm go off. Don't move! Keep eyes shut. The alarm should turn off automatically if you set it up right!
6. Perform Raduga technique.
7. Do same steps 1-6 for any days of the week you want to try.
8. Do not change technique for at least 1-2 months.

Which app can I use to do this technique? And also how do I set the app to turn off after a certain time?

Thanks.

[Yodad]

Which app can I use to do this technique? And also how do I set the app to turn off after a certain time?

Thanks.

I gave you an app suggestion only 5 posts up! I feel I am being pranked!  One more time dude, pay attention...
Alarm Clock Xtreme (by avg labs)
Download:
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.alarmclock.xtreme.free&hl=en_US

And here is there support page on how to use it:
https://support.avg.com/SupportArticleView?l=en&urlName=AVG-Alarm-Clock-Xtreme-FAQ&q=Alarm+Clock+Xtreme+FAQs&supportType=home

You want to set the alarm for auto-shutoff.

[luffy28]

I gave you an app suggestion only 5 posts up! I feel I am being pranked!  One more time dude, pay attention...
Alarm Clock Xtreme (by avg labs)
Download:
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.alarmclock.xtreme.free&hl=en_US

And here is there support page on how to use it:
https://support.avg.com/SupportArticleView?l=en&urlName=AVG-Alarm-Clock-Xtreme-FAQ&q=Alarm+Clock+Xtreme+FAQs&supportType=home

You want to set the alarm for auto-shutoff.

Thanks,
Just wanted to say the feature is called auto-dismiss.

Thanks.

[luffy28]

I gave you an app suggestion only 5 posts up! I feel I am being pranked!  One more time dude, pay attention...
Alarm Clock Xtreme (by avg labs)
Download:
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.alarmclock.xtreme.free&hl=en_US

And here is there support page on how to use it:
https://support.avg.com/SupportArticleView?l=en&urlName=AVG-Alarm-Clock-Xtreme-FAQ&q=Alarm+Clock+Xtreme+FAQs&supportType=home

You want to set the alarm for auto-shutoff.

Hi,
I wanted to know if there are any other alarm apps? The reason being that the alarm clock isn't loud enough.

Thanks.

[Xanth]

Hi,
I wanted to know if there are any other alarm apps? The reason being that the alarm clock isn't loud enough.

Thanks.

Can you not use a sound which is a bit more "sharp" sounding?  You can't turn up your phone a bit more?  Just thinking out loud. 

[luffy28]

Doe's anyone knows what

For 11-20 attempts (3-14 days) – 90%

means?

Thanks.

[luffy28]

Tried it last night. Went horrible I was only awaked once in the night. This was using xtreme alarm. I'll trying using alarmy but alarmy doesn't have a feature for auto-dismiss like xtreme.

Thanks.