The Astral Pulse
News: http://www.astralpulse.com/aup.html. Acceptable Use Policy for the forums. Please read and ensure that you respect these policies. Thank you.

Please note that due to the amount of spam posts we have been receiving over the past few months, we have switched Registration to require you to be approved by a moderator.  We will go through the approval list as often as we can, but if it's been 24 hours and you haven't been Approved yet or you've received a rejection email, please email myself or one of the moderators immediately so we may correct the application.

We apologize for any inconveniences this may cause, but it's the last resort we have to fighting the spam for now.
 
*
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register. October 16, 2017, 23:06:42


Login with username, password and session length


Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 5 6   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: The Vehram System is truly brilliant!  (Read 43373 times)
OBEvideoguy
Astral Energy 2
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 87



View Profile WWW
« Reply #25 on: March 26, 2009, 23:18:28 »

Hey faxman,

I will also be working with the noticing, and will update this thread with any progress.

As far as practicing OBE, anytime it gets in the way of a healthy, regular sleep, it should be temporarily stopped. Maybe pick it up again on a night when you don't have to get up early, like a weekend. This OBE stuff should be fun and should NOT get in the way of sleeping soundly. I'm sure many OBEers on this site, beginner and advanced, would agree with me.

Don
Logged
dbmathis
Astral Energy 3
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 338



View Profile WWW
« Reply #26 on: March 26, 2009, 23:20:17 »

I was able to have an out of body experience the first time I tried this technique. The Author also says to imagine yourself feeling heavy (which I did) and I watched my body transition into the hypnagogic state.

I would like to point out that focus on breathe is not required, you can focus on anything. I have had several successful OBEs now and each time I focus on whatever. The key is to key mind in the present by focusing on something.

My suggestion is that you alternate your focus between breath and feeling your body float or feel heavy. That's how I am always successful and it's actually mentioned and overlooked in the VEH system.

Best regards

David
Logged

“Imagination is more important than knowledge. For knowledge is limited to all we now know and understand, while imagination embraces the entire world, and all there ever will be to know and understand.”

My AP Progress -> http://www.malleablelight.net
The Astral Pulse
« Reply #26 on: March 26, 2009, 23:20:17 »

logoVisit the website of Astral Pulse creator Adrian Cooper.

Home of the best selling book Our Ultimate Reality.

Astral Projection, Metaphysics and many other subjects.

 Logged
faxman
Astral Energy 2
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 92


View Profile
« Reply #27 on: March 26, 2009, 23:43:39 »

Alternating the body feeling and the breathing is an excellent idea. Doing both at the same time may be the reason why I can't reach the hypnagogic state...too much to do in a half-sleep mode.

thanks for this suggestion.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2009, 23:49:41 by faxman » Logged
dbmathis
Astral Energy 3
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 338



View Profile WWW
« Reply #28 on: March 26, 2009, 23:51:50 »

hehe, it's is a lot to swallow when half out of it.

I notice that on some nights when I wake up around 3, my mind is somewhere else and I can't seem to get my mind centered on what my goal is, which is OBE. Perhaps some mental conditioning during the day?

I have noticed that thinking about it all day and repeating mantras sometimes help to keep the goal in your subconscious.

I am just happy to see people trying to learn this skill, to me this is a very exciting moment in history. You will succeed if you keep trying and I will see you all there.

Best Regards

David
Logged

“Imagination is more important than knowledge. For knowledge is limited to all we now know and understand, while imagination embraces the entire world, and all there ever will be to know and understand.”

My AP Progress -> http://www.malleablelight.net
marika
Astral Energy 1
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 9


View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #29 on: March 27, 2009, 09:47:04 »


I would like to point out that focus on breathe is not required, you can focus on anything. I have had several successful OBEs now and each time I focus on whatever. The key is to key mind in the present by focusing on something.

Best regards

David

Now this is something I'll give it a shot this weekend. Since focusing on my breathing gives me 'breathing problems' and I'll stay awake for a long itme with nothing but sleep deprivation, I'll be focusing on something else instead.
Logged

The Astral Pulse
« Reply #29 on: March 27, 2009, 09:47:04 »



 Logged
dbmathis
Astral Energy 3
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 338



View Profile WWW
« Reply #30 on: March 27, 2009, 14:45:29 »

Here is my favorite version of focusing on something else than breathing.

I have a nice Feng Shui'd cubical at work with a nice window view of the Austin greenbelt. While I am falling asleep I visualize myself sitting in my cubical at work. I know most people would never do such a thing because the last thing they want to think about when trying to relax is think of work, but it's a place I am very familiar with and can visualize easily.

I remember I was doing this once and at first it was a blurry visualization and then after about 20 minutes the cubical actually became real, like I was really there and then I realized that I was really there, out of body. I was then able to float through the wall next to me and out into the lobby of the building. This abruptly ended and I came back to my body. This was one of my first OBEs and I don't think I actually documented it.

When you focus on something, make sure it's something you are very familiar with and really make yourself feel like you are there with no doubts.

I hope this helps some and keep up the good work and practice every chance you get. The key to success is practice.

Best regards

David
Logged

“Imagination is more important than knowledge. For knowledge is limited to all we now know and understand, while imagination embraces the entire world, and all there ever will be to know and understand.”

My AP Progress -> http://www.malleablelight.net
jub jub
Astral Energy 4
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 586


View Profile
« Reply #31 on: March 27, 2009, 16:24:37 »

Thanks for the info OBEvideoguy! I purchased the eBook and I had mild success last night. Felt the vibrations but wasn't successful at separating, but, it's a start.
Logged

“A moral being is one who is capable of reflecting on his past actions and their motives - approving of some and disapproving of others”  -  Charles Darwin
faxman
Astral Energy 2
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 92


View Profile
« Reply #32 on: March 27, 2009, 16:30:02 »

Getting vibrations is already a big success, especially for a first try.

my last night was a failure, I still couldn't go further the breathing stage. But I know it's just a matter of time !
« Last Edit: March 27, 2009, 16:36:13 by faxman » Logged
VessenHopkins
Astral Energy 1
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 33


View Profile
« Reply #33 on: March 27, 2009, 17:11:53 »

Hi everyone,

Just wanted to provide clarification on the breathing technique.  I actually like better the phrase "notice your breathing" over "focus on your breathing" because of the implied connotation that you want to make sure you do not wake up completely.  A high level of awareness can stimulate the body and prevent you from easily entering the hypnagogic-state.

As mention in dbmathis's posts, it isn't necessary to do anything, except actively be aware of something.  You can use any kind of visual imagery, etc.  What you are really doing is focusing inwards, and to a small extent, letting go of the physical world around you.  You simply want to maintain an active level of awareness of what is going on in your mind so that you are awake for the event.

Having said that, there is still a powerful capability provided to the practitioner, in the breathing technique, that is the true secret to controlling the transition, as opposed to being at its mercy.

The true power behind the breathing exercise is in the physiological principles governing the body's transition into the sleep state.  By properly following the technique, you are able to control, and actually force the transition, and this is the reason it is such a critical part of the methodology provided in the guide.

Now, if you are too strongly "focusing" on your breathing, your high level of awareness, as mentioned, may well be counter-productive to slipping across the threshold of hypnagogia, so instead you should try to just notice what is about to happen.  But, also keep in mind that the chemical state of the body is still relatively that of a sleeping body.  You still have much of the same harmones present in the blood-stream and your nervous system will remain suppressed.  It requires several minutes for the chemical nerve blockers to break down and the body to completely wake up.  (Adrenaline can speed this process up considerably, which is why excitement about what is going on is highy counter-productive to success)

Rather, because of the body's chemical state, it requires just a moment of relaxation to transition into sleep.  Utilizing the breathing technique enables you to maintain a relatively active role mentally (you are having to complete a mental task, or process,) thus, allowing you to retain lucidity across the transition into hypnagogic.  The real key is, each time you breathe out, you are actually forcing the transition by limiting the nervous stimulation to the body that is normally caused by breathing in.

So, that was the technical explanation.  Here is the explanation in a nutshell:

When you first wake up, remember that the transition into hypnagogic will always happen during an exhale.  Take a slight pause between breaths to really "push" across the threshold.  This is where you control it.  Allow yourself to feel the weight and total relaxation of your body, and watch as your body slips into the sleep state.  Takes three to five seconds, usually - 10 seconds at most.

Hope this added info helps.  Thanks to all for continuing to share your experiences!

Vessen Hopkins
Author, "Out-of-Body Experiences: the Vehram Energy System"

Logged
OBEvideoguy
Astral Energy 2
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 87



View Profile WWW
« Reply #34 on: March 27, 2009, 19:20:20 »

Hey Vessen,

Thanks so much for your detailed insight; you are offering excellent guidance and I appreciate it greatly.

My problem is not staying too awake, but the opposite, falling asleep too quickly. Last night I woke up 9 times. I tried 2 things, changing from one to the other back and forth. I would try focusing on my breath, and noticing. Both methods were not strong enough to maintain conscious awareness as my body fell asleep. My mind fell asleep along with my body every time.

I'm wondering if I play a music CD or a CD with a voice talking, after waking up, my mind will have something to focus on.

What thinkest thou?

Don
Logged
faxman
Astral Energy 2
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 92


View Profile
« Reply #35 on: March 27, 2009, 19:25:49 »

I'm wondering if I play a music CD or a CD with a voice talking, after waking up, my mind will have something to focus on.

Of course I'll let Vessen answers as I am not an expert but I am afraid that a CD or voice CD wakes you up too much and hence annihilates the chemical reaction described in the Ebook.

just my 2 cents Wink
Logged
OBEvideoguy
Astral Energy 2
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 87



View Profile WWW
« Reply #36 on: March 27, 2009, 19:38:54 »

Hey faxman,

I see your point, and have thought of that, however, if the audio volume is too high and I became too awake, I could turn it down a bit for the next time. If the volume was too low, I could turn it up just a bit. There might just be a happy medium. I'm thinking this might be training wheels for me. I'm looking forward to Vessen's comments.

Don
Logged
jub jub
Astral Energy 4
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 586


View Profile
« Reply #37 on: March 28, 2009, 10:41:07 »

No joy tonight. Set my mental alarm clock for 3am, woke at 4:30am. Now I'm wide awake!  sad

Oh well, there is always tomorrow.  grin
Logged

“A moral being is one who is capable of reflecting on his past actions and their motives - approving of some and disapproving of others”  -  Charles Darwin
marika
Astral Energy 1
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 9


View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #38 on: March 28, 2009, 12:46:21 »

Lol, similar to me as well. Woke up again, and became wide awake almost instantly. At least no breathing problems and anxiety this night, so it's some kind of progress, I guess. I'll keep trying...
Logged

faxman
Astral Energy 2
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 92


View Profile
« Reply #39 on: March 28, 2009, 15:43:33 »

Me too, nothing special to report excepted a big headache this morning after many breathing technique tries during the night.

Maybe the title of the book should be changed : it may be not 'The Easiest Method to Learn Astral Projection! '

 grin
« Last Edit: March 28, 2009, 15:45:58 by faxman » Logged
OBEvideoguy
Astral Energy 2
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 87



View Profile WWW
« Reply #40 on: March 28, 2009, 15:45:05 »

I tried using audio, both music and voice, at different volumes. It did not work. When I listened to it after waking up, it was too much stimulus and I remained awake. After a while I could get back to sleep, sometimes, but soon after, the audio woke me up again. When I turned the volume down, it had no effect. I had a restless sleep as a result. Oh well, won't try that again.

Back to observing the breath and noticing. I am confident that practice will perfect this method. I believe the concept is valid. I'll post any results on this thread.

I still think VES is a breath of fresh air. I am dedicating weeks and months to working on this system. The whole idea of waking up at night and consciously entering the hypnogogic is brilliant. I am excited about the prospects of getting that part of the System down, and continuing to master the other aspects. From what I've been learning from Vessen's posts, when it clicks, it will be an easy method to replicate any time I want to OBE. For me, that is a valuable goal, so I am not giving up anytime soon.

Don
« Last Edit: March 28, 2009, 15:54:27 by OBEvideoguy » Logged
OBEvideoguy
Astral Energy 2
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 87



View Profile WWW
« Reply #41 on: March 29, 2009, 20:34:19 »

Hey everyone,

VES is a four part system. The first part is programming the subconscious mind to wake the body/mind up during sleep. The second part is consciously entering into the hypnogogic state. Third is bringing in energy from the Vehram Array in order to stimulate the vibrations. Last is executing an exit technique.

So far I have stage one down - I am waking up numerous times each night, during sleep.

Entering consciously into the hypnogogic is a challenge for me at this time. Being aware of the breath, in and out, as recommended by Vessen Hopkins, the author of VES, is tricky for me. I think the reason is this - breathing is so immeshed within body activity that the body falls asleep while breathing and takes the mind with it. I will continue to work with breath however. I'm convinced that practice makes perfect.

This morning I was video chatting with Line Salvesen from Norway, using Skype. We have been chatting on and off for over two years. She is a natural lucid dreamer, having 4 or 5 lucid dreams each and every night. She can have WILDs at will in the early morning hours. A WILD is a Wake-Induced Lucid Dream - entering into a dream, lucidly (unbroken consciousness) while falling asleep. Line (pronounced LEENA) is in the process of participating in more than one European scientific study on the brain/dream state. In one of the sessions she will have numerous lucid dreams while sleeping in an MRI machine - very exciting research.

I filled her in on VES and my problem with stage two, entering hypnogogic. She suggested the following, a method she came up with a while back, that she personally uses to enter a WILD. She suggests getting almost a full night's sleep before trying to WILD. For me, who sleeps 8 - 10 hours per night, she advises to get at least 7 hours sleep first, before programming my subconscious to awaken. She does not recommend an alarm as that might wake the body/mind too much.

After waking up slightly, she suggests observing your finger, in front of your face, waving back and forth, while your eyes follow. Do this physically for a few seconds, then rest the arm and close your eyes. Now, imagine/visualize the finger moving in front of your face, waving back and forth, while your eyes follow. This must be done in the mind's eye. Keep concentrating on the imagined movement and your body will fall asleep naturally, while your mind enters into the hypnogogic state and your moving finger will materialize as a dream image - you will be lucid at that time, and ready for part three and four of VES.

I'll be working with this method for the next two weeks.

Don
Logged
jub jub
Astral Energy 4
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 586


View Profile
« Reply #42 on: March 29, 2009, 22:24:39 »

I also appreciate everone's input here.

I had limited success last night. Instead of having a conscious OBE I had a LD instead. I won't go into details but it was pretty crazy.

I think the fact that I am stimulating my subconscious with these discussions is doing a lot to help me find a way to project. I just need to stick with it and talking with you guys gives me motivation.

I think a common problem with older people like myself is, the lack of melatonin. Without melatonin the body does not feel the need to sleep. I remember when I was younger I could sleep at the drop of a hat! No longer. There are melatonin supplements but I never found them to be very effective.

Anyway, glad we're having this discussion.
Logged

“A moral being is one who is capable of reflecting on his past actions and their motives - approving of some and disapproving of others”  -  Charles Darwin
Stookie
Guest
« Reply #43 on: March 30, 2009, 16:52:23 »

For me, an increase in vivid dreams and lucid dreams indicate I'm very close to achieving projection as well. I also tend to randomly wake up early in the mornings then too, I think because I get so close to lucidity that I accidentally wake myself up. It's a good window to put all my effort into it. Perhaps this system is a good way to hold that window open.
Logged
VessenHopkins
Astral Energy 1
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 33


View Profile
« Reply #44 on: March 30, 2009, 16:53:06 »

Hey all,

The use of sound (for some) can be effective, but it needs to be the right kind of sound.  Meditational music is great, but there does remain the pitfall that music is distracting, may cause you to lose focus and fall asleep, or not be able to tune inward enough to let go and allow yourself to go back to sleep.   It also provides physical stimulus and diverts attention from the breathing exercise, which I believe is the most powerful tool one can use to effectively control entry into hypnagogia.

I would rather see someone with the specific problem of falling asleep too easily to try instead to remain focusing on your breathing.  The principles at work are physiological in nature and cannot be taken out of the equation with any real benefit.  I am convinced that you are much closer than you realize to success.  More practice will soon lead to that aha moment.

If you are the kind of individual who, when awakened, can easily slip back to sleep (maybe too easily), then this technique will work wonders.  Some people have the exact opposite problem in that they cannot go back to sleep, once awakened.  I will share a solution to this as the post continues below.

Recognizing a tencdency to fall asleep easily, (if that is your particular issue) simply remember to play a more active mental role when you wake up.  Do not allow yourself to mentally relax and become passive, waiting for IT to happen.  This is where the tug has more strength than we do.  Instead of waiting for it to happen, make it happen - control your breathing and use the exhale to actively force the transition.  The chemical pre-cursers are there. (Have faith that you are going to fall back asleep)

Follow the breathing exercise until your body moves into hypnagogia.  You are in control, but it is so easy to let that control go by mentally relaxing or otherwise forgetting about the process (the technique you are suppose to be using).

The moment we relax the mind, consciousness will very quickly slip away.

Sometimes, and I am very guilty of this myself, you may wake up, get excited about the prospect of leaving your body, and wake up too much, resulting in an inability to fall back asleep very easily.  

For many, because we are seemingly too awake, we simply try to go back to sleep.  The tendency is to lose concentration during this period.  What I want to reiterate here, is that the body still has the chemical precursors to sleep circulating within the body.  ***It depends directly on the amount of rest the body feels it has had, as to how much more of these chemicals will be released into the body, once you relax.  (one note to Jub: melatonin does play a critical role in this process of falling asleep and lower levels of this harmone is certainly an issue that we deal with as we get older.  However, you still are able to sleep like we all do, so don't feel like you cannot use this method.  You may have to do it after less sleep than others may need.)

So, if you are waking up and feeling wide awake, try to get less sleep next time before waking up.  Allow your body to be very sleepy when you first go to sleep.  One may also want to wake up after a shorter sleep period than otherwise (two hours instead of four, perhaps.)

It is extremely difficult for a fully rested body (or a body that “thinks” it’s full rested) to fall asleep, even for someone who is adept at the techniques. There are times when I am unable to force the transition back into hypnagogia because I am too well rested.  On the other hand, it is extremely difficult to prevent a sleepy body from going to sleep.  Whatever your case may be,  use this info to your advantage.  Somewhere in the middle of this is the sweet-spot, but remember, the real power to this technique lay in the breathing exercise.

It simply has to be controlled.  You have to be in control over the process the entire time and play an active role through the transition.  Do this with the least amount of awareness possible without falling asleep to help prevent yourself from waking up too much.  Kinda just noticing what you are doing, but purposeful in your execution.

Breath out, and each time as you are exhaling, relax deeply, watch your body go to sleep.  If it doesn’t go to sleep on that particular exhale, you will have at the very least pushed the body that much closer to the transition.  So, breath in, then exhale and relax deeply, again.  Notice the tug, but don’t fight it.  Go with it and maintain “noticing” your body slipping into sleep paralysis.

One thing that practitioners want to be aware of is that when this tug occurs, we may have a tendency to kinda say to ourselves, “Whoa, what’s going on here?”  We have to learn how to go with it and not tell ourselves to stop.  The mind, if it becomes over analytical during the transition, will stop the transition and instead wake up.

So, go with it, without questioning it.  Just let it happen, but also, “force it” by using the prescribed breathing technique.

Once across the threshold of hypnagogia, it is much more difficult to then awaken the body (it’s not like you will slip out of it very easily.)  You would have to strain quite hard to roll over and move the body to wake it up.  Or, get really excited about something and release adrenaline.  This often happens in the hypnagogic-state when fear enters the mind.  Fear, for instance, of not being able to move, or getting “stuck” in that condition.

Just remain calm and follow the rest of the method to obtain the vibrations and separate.

I hope this helps.  Don’t give up and keep a positive attitude.  Use that breathing exercise to full advantage.  Its power is unbelievable in terms of how it will open the door to oobe’s at will!

Thank you all for exploring this and sharing your feedback.  I wish you the very best on your continuing journey!

Regards,
Vessen Hopkins
Author, "Out-of-Body Experienes; the Vehram Energy System"
Logged
jub jub
Astral Energy 4
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 586


View Profile
« Reply #45 on: March 30, 2009, 17:54:06 »

Let me just say real quick Vessen, you have an extraordinary ability to explain yourself. Very clear, concise an easily understood. I noticed it in your book as well.  smiley
Logged

“A moral being is one who is capable of reflecting on his past actions and their motives - approving of some and disapproving of others”  -  Charles Darwin
faxman
Astral Energy 2
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 92


View Profile
« Reply #46 on: March 30, 2009, 22:08:12 »

Thanks for those explanations Vessen.

We do keep a positive attitude but it's true , the process is not that easy. Staying awake enough when waking up during the night is difficult...but of course, not impossible.

So let's keep this thread alive and share our successes soon !
Logged
marika
Astral Energy 1
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 9


View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #47 on: March 31, 2009, 08:51:56 »

Thanks Vessen for shedding some more light into my problem of being too wide awake when I awaken. I'll give it a shot tonight, as tomorrow we have a public holiday around here, so 'i can play' during the night without being afraid that I'll fall asleep tomorrow at work  grin
Will post back if I had any success tomorrow.
marika
Logged

jub jub
Astral Energy 4
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 586


View Profile
« Reply #48 on: March 31, 2009, 13:31:38 »

3-31-09

It seems my internal alarm is working well. I set it for 2 am and woke at 2:20. Not too bad. Unfortunately, as soon as I woke, my expectations ran high and the monkey chatter started to set in. I did feel small vibrations at one point but was unable to strengthen them so they faded. I listened to a clock in the kitchen as my focal point, counting each tick, all the while my mind started thinking about what I was to expect. I just didn't feel the sleepiness.


Next thing I know it's 6:00 am and my alarm goes off! Must have dosed without even realizing it! Frustrating to say the least!
Logged

“A moral being is one who is capable of reflecting on his past actions and their motives - approving of some and disapproving of others”  -  Charles Darwin
faxman
Astral Energy 2
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 92


View Profile
« Reply #49 on: March 31, 2009, 16:37:07 »

I think jub jub we almost had the same experience the same night !

I confirm, it's really frustrating Wink
Logged
The Astral Pulse
   



 Logged
Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 5 6   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines
SMFAds for Free Forums


The Astral Pulse Copyright © 2002 - 2014
Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS! Dilber MC Theme by HarzeM