Drugs

[Babar]

Has anybody tried using drugs as a means to attain the experiense like: ie Nitrous Oxide, dmt, Ketamine  etc etc?

[schotzi]

I really wouldn't call it drugs but I like to take Melatonin sometimes. It helps make dreams more "vivid" and it is easier to lucid dream when taking it. Doesn't seem to help much on OBEs though.

[Selski]

Personally, I find that if someone has had an experience whilst on a particular drug, I don't qualify it as a "genuine" experience.

I mean, if you chomp away on a handful of mushrooms, and then start seeing things and so on, wouldn't you always think to yourself "well, hey, that was some experience, but it was the mushrooms - it wasn't really me."  And you could end up relying on mushrooms, which is pretty grim, cause they taste horrible (so I've been told...)

I believe drugs totally invalidates an experience.  That's my opinion anyway.

Sarah

[data]

Yeah, I agree Selski. In fact not only will it invalidate the first experience, it may even cause doubts of future experiences not caused by drugs.

Finally,  I advise not to circumvent the natural order of things, but try astral projection the natural, albeit, hard way. As with all quick fixes, there is always some price to pay - and it may not be worth it, it could even forfeit your success in astral projection forever.

[FEMMSTARR]

Yeah, I agree Selski. In fact not only will it invalidate the first experience, it may even cause doubts of future experiences not caused by drugs.

Finally,  I advise not to circumvent the natural order of things, but try astral projection the natural, albeit, hard way. As with all quick fixes, there is always some price to pay - and it may not be worth it, it could even forfeit your success in astral projection forever.

so you would say the same thing about the brain wave entrainment programs?

[alexd]

Brainwave files entrain your brain, to the best of my knowledge they do not hinder your natural potential.

I have read that people often project naturally when in hospital and given certain sedatives or drugs.

I'm not sure if drugs make it easier to project in the future (from what I have heard it is easier in future once you have left the body the first time), but I wouldn't take them just for the sake of projecting. If I was already using something like this I would use it as a "push" and then try to do it without depending on anything, like with brainwave files.


Alex

[FEMMSTARR]

Brainwave files entrain your brain, to the best of my knowledge they do not hinder your natural potential.

I have read that people often project naturally when in hospital and given certain sedatives or drugs.

I'm not sure if drugs make it easier to project in the future (from what I have heard it is easier in future once you have left the body the first time), but I wouldn't take them just for the sake of projecting. If I was already using something like this I would use it as a "push" and then try to do it without depending on anything, like with brainwave files.


Alex

lol I know you are going to think this is crazy but when I got out of the hospital just recently they gave me a pain med called talwin I dont know what kind of pain med it is but I had back surgery and do you know when I was on that medicine I could actually tell what my dog was thinking

well I can tell you I only told one person of that incident    and I wont tell another soul about it

but that medicine was very strong and I took a double dose as I hurt myself right after surgery I actually reopened my incision and had to go to the emergency room but the person I told will never let me hear the end of that one

mental telepathy with a chihuahua

but it was real she was telling me there werent any bones out in the place where I put them out for them

well I got up and went into the kitchen and sure enough there wasnt any bones in there so I put her a few out

it was really nice to know what she was thinking for a change but I wonder what she thought of me getting up and getting the bones for her?

I did stop taking the medicine though because that was too strange for me

[data]

Femmstar, that sounds very interesting.

As regards to:

so you would say the same thing about the brain wave entrainment programs?

No, but within limits as well. The purpose of mind entraining music/sound, is to acclimate your mind to different states of awareness, so that you recall these states more easily. However, if you overly use it to do this, or need to use it to create these states, you may become dependent on them. Much like one becomes dependent on drugs.

To use sounds, is not unnatural. The importance of sounds to cause shifts in awareness has been known for a long time, hence why we use mantras.

All drugs will do, will undermine your own control over your mind, and you don't want that. You want to have presence of mind. You want to be in control over your mind. Drugs, will impair your consciousness, especially hallucinogens, and make you more susceptible to negative influences, and according to many, insidious negative entities.


I personally do not take any mind altering substances, from alcohol, nicotine, tobacco, and very minimal(if any) caffeine. I have almost eliminated all soda and pop drinks from my diet, and gone to drinking fresh juices and water. Water in particular is full of life energy and it essential for psychic development and meditation.

[Nay]

mental telepathy with a chihuahua

Hehehe..that made me chuckle!   My mom has a chihuahua..I call it rat just to tick her off..  I'll add a photo of "Coco" dressed in her finest..

Anyhoo..  have you ever heard of the Pet Psychic?  I totally believe that lady is hearing thoughts from animals.  So, maybe you did too?  Try it when you are not on the pills.  I had a dog that I swear was my best friend...I talked to him just like I am to you and he understood.   He protected me when I needed it and I for him. (eh, abusive ex-hubby)  I think the more we interact with our "pets"  the more aware (more human) they get.   Now if I could only feel that connection with the two cats I have....*sigh*

Ok..I got off topic....ummmm..don't do drugs..and shrooms?  don't do them..did them ONCE and freaked out on wallpaper... dang thang came to life right in front of my eyes!!  And that is not a good thing when it comes to country style wallpaper..... all those chickens, ducks and wheelbarrows...... I was in hell..

Nay

[schotzi]

Selski

I agree 100%. I don't even try anything if I had something to drink no matter how small amount.

[Selski]

Ok..I got off topic....ummmm..don't do drugs..and shrooms?  don't do them..did them ONCE and freaked out on wallpaper... dang thang came to life right in front of my eyes!!  And that is not a good thing when it comes to country style wallpaper..... all those chickens, ducks and wheelbarrows...... I was in hell..

Nay

Nay - that's hilarious - I love it!!!  Glad to see you back in the swing gal.  (I once spent 6 hours giggling on shrooms... (took far too many) - my jaw ached like hell the next day)  

PS  Love the pooch.

Sarah

[Nay]

Ok..I got off topic....ummmm..don't do drugs..and shrooms?  don't do them..did them ONCE and freaked out on wallpaper... dang thang came to life right in front of my eyes!!  And that is not a good thing when it comes to country style wallpaper..... all those chickens, ducks and wheelbarrows...... I was in hell..

Nay

Nay - that's hilarious - I love it!!!  Glad to see you back in the swing gal.  (I once spent 6 hours giggling on shrooms... (took far too many) - my jaw ached like hell the next day)  

PS  Love the pooch.

Sarah

LOL..that was the thing..   No one told me that I didn't need to eat two of them!!  I kept waiting and waiting for the effect to take hold......Oh, boy...those were the days..lol   Friends that gave you stuff for free and then failed to tell you the outcome..     I did have a funny moment though, that I will never forget.  

My girlfriend was in on this retarded high with me.  We got a ride into Atlanta...and goodness the lights were grand..but then she started yelling..and I mean YELLING that the girl in the other care was on fire..   I look over and calmly mind you, say....."ummmm, she is smoking a cigg"  LOL..  She saw the smoke and honestly thought this chick was on fire!!  Funniest thing ever.....LOL...I still chuckle after twenty some odd years.

Nay

[Ben K]

Drugs allow for a more subjective reality. Depending on the drug there are different levels of subjectivity, and different senses involved. I think, for example, Acid affects your visual senses, ie. hallucinations. It also affects your audio(so im told, never done it ;P) in the form of audio hallucinations. Much weaker drugs, like marijuana, offer barely any subjectivity, but it is still there in some forms.(Eating maybe? )

Some people like this. Some people op for the more objective reality. Some are scared of the unkown. But it is not anyones right to tell anyone else what to and what not to put in there bodies.

Just my 2 sense.

[jilola]

Perhaps the correct metaphor in regard to entheogenic drugs is Mt. Everest, a helicopter and what happens when one gets suddenly  dumped on top on the said mountain.
Altitude sickness. Eh?

The point being, one can get there in many ways but some are less drastic tha others and the same more constructive.

One can get to the Titanic hugging an anchor and in a submarine. Choose.

2cents & L&L
Jouni

[FEMMSTARR]

mental telepathy with a chihuahua

Hehehe..that made me chuckle!   My mom has a chihuahua..I call it rat just to tick her off..  I'll add a photo of "Coco" dressed in her finest..

Anyhoo..  have you ever heard of the Pet Psychic?  I totally believe that lady is hearing thoughts from animals.  So, maybe you did too?  Try it when you are not on the pills.  I had a dog that I swear was my best friend...I talked to him just like I am to you and he understood.   He protected me when I needed it and I for him. (eh, abusive ex-hubby)  I think the more we interact with our "pets"  the more aware (more human) they get.   Now if I could only feel that connection with the two cats I have....*sigh*

Ok..I got off topic....ummmm..don't do drugs..and shrooms?  don't do them..did them ONCE and freaked out on wallpaper... dang thang came to life right in front of my eyes!!  And that is not a good thing when it comes to country style wallpaper..... all those chickens, ducks and wheelbarrows...... I was in hell..

Nay

The dog is most beautiful looks like my sugar only she is white and yes I do understand her I am sure I know this dog from another life without a doubt but she usually lets me know what she wants with her body language hearing it out loud in my head freaked me out

I dont use drugs to meditate or astral or the brain wave entrainment either but I am considering getting a cd as my obe's are far and few between and its not always easy getting out but I do manage sometimes

I really wish you could send that pic of that dog to my email acct I am at work and cannot download and my pc at home has to go to the shop but I would love to use that pic for my wallpaper on my pc

if you look at my yahoo profile its femmstarr@yahoo.com you can look at my photo album and see my little chihuahua

I will admit I have some pictures from a gallery called nature is a freak so just letting you know mr and mrs carrot will be in there I hope you dont get offended at naughty nature pics lol they are too funny

I have heard of the pet psychic and I think she is real but it felt too freaky to me I just switched over to ibuprofen that is better for me

I thinnk dogs may astral too though as I think one time a long time ago I saw a dog while out