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Author Topic: Jeff's OBE Tips  (Read 31351 times)
kiauma
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« on: January 13, 2004, 15:23:38 »

WOW!  Very well written.  I can't wait to try these suggestions out.

Thanks Jeff.

Heey!  I just thought of a sig.  I think I'll call myself, 'The Experienced Student'.  [Smiley]
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« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2004, 15:36:08 »

On the 'mind aware/body asleep thing', while I agree with the spirit of what you're saying it IS possible for the body to sleep, that's what happens when you get sleep paralysis.

It seems like the common thread in all AP techniques is that they have the effect of making you forget about your physical bosy and begin focuing on your astral body.

You point that the body does not have to be asleep to AP is correct, however, since there have been threads about accidentally APing while driving a car or flying a plane.
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« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2004, 15:36:08 »

logoVisit the website of Astral Pulse creator Adrian Cooper.

Home of the best selling book Our Ultimate Reality.

Astral Projection, Metaphysics and many other subjects.

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« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2004, 15:47:51 »

quote:
Originally posted by cube

On the 'mind aware/body asleep thing', while I agree with the spirit of what you're saying it IS possible for the body to sleep, that's what happens when you get sleep paralysis.


I see what you're saying, but I may even contend that it's your MIND which convinces you that your body is asleep.  It's called disassociation.  If your mind was not disassociated from the body, then you would be able to move just fine.

The whole "paralysis" thing is nothing more than your mind in a disassociated state NOT KNOWING that it is disassociated, and then trying to move a body which it's not in control over!

Think about that for a minute.

This is why people can disassociate their mind and then have needles and other painful things pierce the body, with no signs of discomfort.  This is also why a lot of people can be hypnotised.  Their mind is disassociated from their actions by the power of suggestion.

quote:
It seems like the common thread in all AP techniques is that they have the effect of making you forget about your physical bosy and begin focuing on your astral body.


Most techniques have you focus on your physical body first, and then your mind.  I'm suggesting you focus on your mind, and your physical body will follow naturally.
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« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2004, 16:06:04 »

Yeppers..you absolutely ROCK!

Nay [Wink]
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« Reply #4 on: January 13, 2004, 20:46:27 »

Thanks for your tips Jeff,

your very right about eye movement, it can be a pain to control.

Good point about the sleep trigger, its usually when i give up trying to ap and go to sleep that i get vibrations, problem is when i try to reach this state on purpose it works too well and i either fall asleep or snap myself awake too quickly.
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« Reply #4 on: January 13, 2004, 20:46:27 »



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« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2004, 20:50:49 »

Thanks for that post Jeff [Smiley]

The part about "your eyes must be asleep" really does make sense to me. However I'm not so clear on the body not asleep part.

Is what you are suggesting an alternative way of getting into the trance state? i.e. let yourself fall asleep but in a way that allows you to keep a strong intent/thread of consciousness going that allows you to "jump out" when you get deep enough.
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« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2004, 21:45:55 »

quote:
Originally posted by math

Thanks for that post Jeff [Smiley]

The part about "your eyes must be asleep" really does make sense to me. However I'm not so clear on the body not asleep part.

Is what you are suggesting an alternative way of getting into the trance state? i.e. let yourself fall asleep but in a way that allows you to keep a strong intent/thread of consciousness going that allows you to "jump out" when you get deep enough.



Yes, it is a trance state that you get into, but you get into it naturally.  You don't have to TRY and get there.

You see, most techniques give you a billion and one physical things to do in order to get into a trace, like relaxing all your muscles from head to toe, and then back again, etc.

This is all well and good, but for me, I find that relaxing the mind and conditioning my mental processes is all that I need to do in order to achieve a good trance state.  Think about it.  The more you are focused internally (mentally), the less you're going to think about your body anyway.  You could have four arms sproating from your torso and you could care less, because you aren't focused on it.

So I'm merely suggesting that the next time you lay down, immedietely start working on the above three tips and work on your MIND and not your body.  Your body will naturally shut down without you helping it, but your mind needs to be hand-held and monitored in order to have a successful conscious OBE exit.
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« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2004, 22:47:18 »

Superb advice Jeff!

I will try out those tips. While I have fairly regular obes they are random and I still cant project at will (I usually wake up in the correct mental state around once a week on average).

Also, almost all my obes are direct into the astral, which is good IMV.

I almost never remember being in the '3d blackness' stage. What happens with me is i wake up randomly with the 'astral cinema screen effect' (Monroe focus level 22?); when this happens I just 'sit back' and observe the scenes until they fade or (as I do now) I will myself to step through it, and enter directly into the astral scene. The last time I was in the astral i observed my hands and got the 'melting hand' phenomenom as described by RB. However, I havnt decided whether this is a 'real' effect or if it happens simply because I expect it to.

From what i understand the astral screen is usually the part that follows on directly from focusing on an anomaly in the 3d blackness phase.

My next experiment when I'm out is to request a guide and see what happens (that's if i remember, but that can be the annoying part, as awareness can vary depending on the quality of the obe).

All for now,
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« Reply #8 on: January 14, 2004, 01:52:32 »

It's a good thing you wrote that all out for many to see, for not many learn those things by themselves. I have, but not everything you wrote there. Much appreciated!

[|)]FT
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« Reply #9 on: January 14, 2004, 02:16:27 »

quote:
Originally posted by Jeff_Mash
The whole "paralysis" thing is nothing more than your mind in a disassociated state NOT KNOWING that it is disassociated, and then trying to move a body which it's not in control over!



My feeling is that if you're in sleep paralysis, then you haven't dissociated. However I need more experience to make a firm judgement on that.

Basically I agree with math's post in that I don't understand how you can say that the eyes are asleep but the body is not.

quote:

Most techniques have you focus on your physical body first, and then your mind.  I'm suggesting you focus on your mind, and your physical body will follow naturally.



I agree, and that agrees with my point in that the end effect of the techniques is to forget about your body and focus on your mind or astral presence which is always there.

My feeling is that we are not actually projecting anywhere as much as we are refocusing our consciousness to an aspect of our spirit. That spirit aspect is already somewhere, so we are not really projecting it.
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« Reply #10 on: January 14, 2004, 05:13:13 »

Thanks a lot Jeff.  I agree, you really described the sensations well.  I have experienced them all, and you described them to a T.  I would just like to add a little something about the eyes.  Just recently I discovered myself how important this was.  You will notice when you are at the day dreaming state and your mind is wandering that your eyes may tense up a little, like become a little more tightly closed I guess.  It's important to keep that in the back of your mind and periodically check them to make sure they really ARE as relaxed as they can be.  One thing I did want to ask your view on.  Recently I have stopped trying to feel the vibrations as a signal to try and leave my body.  After about 30 minutes to an hour I am very relaxed and in a good frame of mind, with no sign of the vibrations (I have never felt them).  It's at this stage that I visualize myself floating out of my body, and suddenly my heart beats faster and I get an excited feeling, as if I'm very close.  Do you yourself have a similar experience, or do you use the imfamous vibrations that everyone else talks about?  I'm beginning to think they are not necissary to have an OBE, simply a common experience that many do feel WHEN they have an OBE.
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« Reply #11 on: January 14, 2004, 13:54:23 »

quote:
Originally posted by cube
Basically I agree with math's post in that I don't understand how you can say that the eyes are asleep but the body is not.


I use the term "asleep" as a way of saying that the eyes are not being used.  You see, even when you close your eyes, you are STILL using them.  Just because they are not seeing anything doen not mean that they are not LOOKING at anything.

THey are, in fact, looking at something: the back of your eyelids.  Well, I have noticed that this LOOKING process needs to stop.  As long as you are looking with physical eyes, you will not get to the pre-OBE state as I mentioned above.  There is a slight transition, very subtle, where you relinquish your physical looking ability and swap it for the astral looking ability.

That is what I was trying to convey when I said the eyes need to be "asleep."
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« Reply #12 on: January 14, 2004, 14:01:13 »

I would like to echo what Jeff said, about the importance of the eyes, exactly how he describes it.

Secondly, what TAO said about his heart speeding up.  I have experienced this too.  I have read that it is because of a tremendous energy buildup as a person prepares to project.

Anyone have any other explanation?
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« Reply #13 on: January 14, 2004, 14:02:09 »

quote:
Originally posted by The AlphaOmega
One thing I did want to ask your view on.  Recently I have stopped trying to feel the vibrations as a signal to try and leave my body.  After about 30 minutes to an hour I am very relaxed and in a good frame of mind, with no sign of the vibrations (I have never felt them).


I rarely feel them too....and when I do, it's not like an immediate BAM!  HERE THEY ARE!  It's more like, "Oh hey, I seem to be vibrating here."  

I have often felt them as a buzzing, numb feeling.  Never violent or disturbing.

quote:

  It's at this stage that I visualize myself floating out of my body, and suddenly my heart beats faster and I get an excited feeling, as if I'm very close.


I know what you're talking about....and here is how I look at it.  When you try and relax, and you're going 30 - 60 minutes with just laying there, clearing your mind, etc., you're still very much awake.  True, you can't really feel your body, but you still SENSE it, and this is the problem.

So what we end up doing is that even though we feel that our body is asleep, we try and do some physically-minded exit techniques, like the ROPE, or floating our of our BODY (see, another body reference).  However, since we still sense our physical body, the physical body starts reacting to our visualization.  The heart will start to beat faster...we may feel an adrenaline surge through our veins....we may twitch.  I'm sure most of us have experienced this before.

The key is to get to the point where you don't even sense the physical body.  Don't worry about whether you FEEL it or not.  Worry about whether or not you can SENSE it.

This is why I stress so much on the MENTAL aspect of OBE-preparation. If you get immersed in your thoughts and base all your progress on mental benchmarks (instead of physical ones), then you will find it easier to lose all awareness of the physical body.

quote:

  Do you yourself have a similar experience, or do you use the imfamous vibrations that everyone else talks about?  I'm beginning to think they are not necissary to have an OBE, simply a common experience that many do feel WHEN they have an OBE.


Feeling the vibrations are NOT necessary to have an OBE, you are correct.  IMO, focusing on the vibes is a good way to keep your focus on the physical body, which is what you DON'T want to do.
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« Reply #14 on: January 14, 2004, 18:36:43 »

If this whole thing pops you into the Astral (which I'm assuming you're not refering to the whole "Real time Zone"), how do you get to  a "Real Time Zone" projection?
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« Reply #15 on: January 14, 2004, 19:53:53 »

quote:
Originally posted by Risu no Kairu

If this whole thing pops you into the Astral (which I'm assuming you're not refering to the whole "Real time Zone"), how do you get to  a "Real Time Zone" projection?


I believe that this technique will automatically pop you into whatever environment that you "see" prior to phasing there.  However, once you're there, you should still be able to focus on a real time place (like "home") or a real time person (like "Nay") and then expect to be taken there.

Just because you may be in the technical "Astral Realm" does not mean you can't shift to the RTZ....just as you can shift from the RTZ to the astral.

I don't have a lot of practice with shifting from one level to another, so I can't really answer those questions.  I usually just explore wherever I end up without trying to change my location.
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« Reply #16 on: January 14, 2004, 20:31:53 »

quote:
I believe that this technique will automatically pop you into whatever environment that you "see" prior to phasing there. However, once you're there, you should still be able to focus on a real time place (like "home") or a real time person (like "Nay") and then expect to be taken there.
Hahahahahahha..why thanks Jeff! I am gonna be afraid to take a shower now..[Tongue]

I pretty much had the eye thing down..I realized it awhile back when my eyes kept "looking" around in the darkness behind my eyelids, it just didn't feel right.  Last night when I tried for a projection, something did happen that has never happened before.  In the darkness I all of a sudden saw a bright red dot, in the distance.  It actually made me jump because I didn't expect to see anything.  Have no clue what is was, just weird.  I ended up going to sleep..*sigh*

Oh..side note.. I get this jolt and buzz, just for a split second, but it doesn't continue, any ideas? (How am I doing on the comma's Jeff?)[^]

Nay

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« Reply #17 on: January 14, 2004, 20:55:28 »

quote:
Originally posted by Nay
Oh..side note.. I get this jolt and buzz, just for a split second, but it doesn't continue, any ideas?


Hmmmm...no idea.  Weird flashes of energetic activity?  That would be my guess.

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« Reply #18 on: January 15, 2004, 01:40:23 »

Jeff, this post is genius! GENIUS

I've always wanted to know how to relax my eyes, and didnt want to ask this question because I thought it would be a 'stupid' question, but now it seems appropriate to ask:

     When training yourself looking through your closed eye lids,, keeping them still, relaxed, try to unlock  you astral eyes basically.  So the question I have is this almost like training your eyes to see 'Auras'? because in order to see auras, you have to relaxed your eyes, keep them focused, dont move them, and eventually you'll be trained to see them?

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« Reply #19 on: January 15, 2004, 02:26:58 »

"It's kind of like staring at a wall or something. It keeps you occupied, but your mind really isn't moving in a downward, relaxed state."

SOMEONE FINALLY DESCRIBES IT LIKE I DO!! lol.........I get that feeling quite often........anyways....good stuff!
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« Reply #20 on: January 15, 2004, 10:57:29 »

Hi Jeff

I've been thinking very carefully about your post (thanks for your last reply), particularly as I'm just about to start trance work in my 90 day Astral Dynamics (AD) programme. The question I have been asking myself is what exactly is the trance state and has my idea of what it is been wrong. I think your post has provided the answer for me [Smiley]

Image this scenario of someone trying to fall asleep [Wink]
"I must get to sleep, relax a little. Am I aware of being awake in by bed? I know I'm in my bed but it doesn't feel like it, maybe I'm asleep - no not yet. I just saw an image was that a dream? Maybe I'm dreaming now, no I'm still awake...relax more..."

This is clearly ridiculous, but my attempts at trance work have been a little like this.

What you seem to be suggesting is that the trance state is in fact *falling asleep proper* (not just body) while maintaining some level of awareness. Robert Bruce in AD talks about keeping your surface mind clear, so instead of getting lost in meaningless images and ramblings (as often happens when falling asleep) you can maintain a clear mind and remain aware (NOT awake).

Now if this is the case and the trance state is asleep but aware then... because you are asleep, but not dreaming in the normal sense of the word, you percieve (not see with your eyes) what people often refer to as an astral screen that displays swirling colours and lights. I think this point is very important. i.e. The astral screen replaces what would be under normal circumstances be a dream/dream imagery. This also explains how dream imagery can intrude into your view of the RTZ. It is in this state that phasing/projection is possible.

This appears to be backed up by my own limited experience. I have managed to project twice from from a semi-aware state (both projections were very short as I got stuck in my bedroom wall). On each of these occassions I had been trying to project from what I thought was the trance state but gave up. I then rolled over to fall asleep but then on the very borderline of entering a dream I just stepped out of my body - I didn't use the rope technique or experience buzzing/vibrations I was just very easily able to step out.

Would you agree with this?

Cheers
Math
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« Reply #21 on: January 15, 2004, 13:44:59 »

quote:
Originally posted by Kerrblur
So the question I have is this almost like training your eyes to see 'Auras'? because in order to see auras, you have to relaxed your eyes, keep them focused, dont move them, and eventually you'll be trained to see them?


You're on the right track.  Here is what I do to relax them if they are not cooperating with me.

Since I usually try to OBE in a really dark bedroom, I OPEN my physical eyes and just stare into the darkness.  I don't try and look for anything.  In fact, you really can't see anything, just blackness.  So since you aren't focusing on anything in particular, your eyes just start to zone out.  Your eyelids soon get heavy, and before you know it, it feels sooo gooood to close them that they relax on their own.

When I say "stare" into the darkness, I don't mean without blinking.  This isn't an astral staring contest!  You can blink if you need to.  I simply mean that you should "zone out" while keeping your eyes open.  Again, this is to help relax them.

If you don;t have a dark room to do this in, then I suppose you could do it by looking at a particular part of the wall or ceiling....but try not to stare it down.  Just be aware of it....like you're just some fly on the wall or something.  The key is not to use your eyes and make them active, but instead, to wind them down and let them relax.

Hope that helps.
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« Reply #22 on: January 15, 2004, 13:54:59 »

quote:
Originally posted by math
Would you agree with this?


I'm not quite sure I fully understand your question, but I'll give it a shot.

For me, the trance state can only take me so far.  When I say trance, I mean getting my mind into an altered state of consciousness.

A lot of times, I feel that we as individuals can only consciously go so far before an "autopilot" reflex takes over.

Imagine a person rolling a bowling ball up one side of a hill.  He has to exert some effort to push and roll that heavy thing upwards, right?  

Then he reaches the top, and he doesn't have to push as hard anymore.

As he nears the descending slope of the other side, he lets go, and the ball slowly starts to roll downward on it's own.....then faster. and faster.

Sometimes I feel our OBE preparation is like that.  Getting into a trance state is like pushing the bowling ball up the hill.  It takes some practice and effort on our part.  However....the MAIN GOAL is to get the ball in a position to roll on its own.

Once we get to this position, we can usually allow ourselves to LET GO a little bit, allow that forward momentum to continue, and then snap our consciousness back into place as an OBE is taking place.

Remember, you can enter this astral/RTZ realm on the border between sleep and the imagination.  It's a very fine line you have to walk, which is why we usually just fall asleep when we try to do it.  Not only that, but passing through this doorway is very subtle.  You may not even realize it when you do it, especially if you don't feel any vibrations or anything like that.

There is just this 'knowing' feeling that comes along with this state of mind, where you KNOW that you can have an OBE at that moment.  Hope that helps somewhat...I know I was long winded but my mind keeps going and going and.....
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« Reply #23 on: January 15, 2004, 21:04:46 »

Okay, I tried this, and it seemed to work pretty well, but I failed because I couldnt figure out how to get to 'Astral Planes' like you said, I started to see the 3-D blackness shape up, and make inward forming circles (Circles would appear, and shape its self smaller and then start over).  But I didnt really know when to start thinking about (i.e Astral Pulse Island) the astral planes.

  I started getting vibrations, and heaviness, the eye thing and mind set was great! but this thing you said about it 'sucking' you in, wasnt catching to me, and then part I mentiuoned where I could figure out when to think about the astral planes, cause 'I DO NOT' like the RTZ anymore lol starting to get to me. If there a way to bypass the RTZ, I wanna learn it in its simplest terms if you can! thanks alot!
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« Reply #24 on: January 15, 2004, 23:47:59 »

quote:
Originally posted by Kerrblur

Okay, I tried this, and it seemed to work pretty well, but I failed because I couldnt figure out how to get to 'Astral Planes' like you said, I started to see the 3-D blackness shape up, and make inward forming circles (Circles would appear, and shape its self smaller and then start over).  But I didnt really know when to start thinking about (i.e Astral Pulse Island) the astral planes.

  I started getting vibrations, and heaviness, the eye thing and mind set was great! but this thing you said about it 'sucking' you in, wasnt catching to me, and then part I mentiuoned where I could figure out when to think about the astral planes, cause 'I DO NOT' like the RTZ anymore lol starting to get to me. If there a way to bypass the RTZ, I wanna learn it in its simplest terms if you can! thanks alot!


Ryan, when this happened to me last, I wasn't PLANNING on going anywhere in specific.  In both instances, I just observed the 3D shapes that were forming in my field of vision.....and once I locked onto one of them, it eventually solidified into an colorful environment.  

From THAT point, you can go wherever you want, or simply explore where you ended up, like I did.
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