The Astral Pulse
News: http://www.astralpulse.com/aup.html. Acceptable Use Policy for the forums. Please read and ensure that you respect these policies. Thank you.

If you wish the join The Astral Pulse, please create an account and then email myself or one of the moderators your username and email address (do not send us your password please) and we will activate your account for you. 
If it's been over 24 hours and you still haven't been approved, please send another email, we are just people too and sometimes we get busy.
http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_astral_chat/member_registration_requiring_approval-t42962.0.html

We apologize for any inconveniences this may cause, but it's the last resort we have to fighting the spam for now.
 
*
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register. April 20, 2021, 21:27:48


Login with username, password and session length


Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 ... 8   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: What's wrong with Psychic Self Defense?  (Read 29745 times)
Lockmar
Astral Energy 1
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 27


View Profile Email
« on: January 29, 2004, 11:56:09 »

Hi,

I have several questions. Is psychic self-defense bad in all situations? Do your guides believe negs and demons really exist and if they did, how should they be dealt with? Moreover, if a person was really attacked by a neg, how should they be dealt with? I will contend that there are certain methods which provide psychic self-defense while fostering a positive attitude.

Thanks.
Logged
kiauma
Astral Energy 4
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 661


View Profile Email
« Reply #1 on: January 29, 2004, 12:50:28 »

Hello Edi,

I would simply like to say that I applaud your voice of insight and reason among all the doomsayers who frequent the PSD forum.

'Spirit' is what we are, which is why love, or focused violence, defensive or otherwise, will always be reflected in our experience of the spirit realms.

I look forward to all your advice and guidance on this matter.
Logged

Non semper ea sunt quae videntur.
The Astral Pulse
« Reply #1 on: January 29, 2004, 12:50:28 »

logoVisit the website of Astral Pulse creator Adrian Cooper.

Home of the best selling book Our Ultimate Reality.

Astral Projection, Metaphysics and many other subjects.

 Logged
Li Yun
Astral Energy 1
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 32


View Profile WWW Email
« Reply #2 on: January 29, 2004, 13:50:29 »

I think thats great advise for everyone as this forum may at times seem abit like neg central....however I found this place beceause i've experienced a strong pressure on my face and eyes and mouth for ages and after too long with it I used google serch engine to see if it came up with anything....and enity attchment turned up linked to this forum...
I am not strictly under attack as that sound perhaps victimised but it is bloody ennoying!! however it has to be said if i don't give it time in my mind it isn't very strong, but if i think about it it is strong..anyway I hope i'm not drifting from topic, but yes in the mind it may be...but i pretended it was nothing for two years and am still feeling...
I am in no way trying to contradict but i am just trying to explain the situation. I am still a happy active person though which counts for alot!!![Wink]
Logged
Edi
Astral Energy 3
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 112


View Profile Email
« Reply #3 on: January 29, 2004, 13:56:33 »

Hey,

Kiauma, you are so right in what you say about 'Spirit' - and I think this does not only apply to the spirit realms, but also to life on earth, only that the 'reflections' need more time to manifest here.


Lockmar,

those are very good questions for this thread, and are exactly what needs to be talked about. I'll step back and let my guide Perena continue:



"It is necessary to reevaluate the whole concept of psychic self-defense. For this it is necessary to see what you are trying to defend against, and what effects this has in turn. Basically, psychic self defense is about trying to prevent someone else from making you uncomfortable, be it a spirit or a person in the flesh. Now people often are confused about what is a neg, what is an illusion, what is 'real' and what is only projected outwards. We will come to more technical issues later and will talk then what common phenomena (negs, poltergeists etc) are about, but for now let's concentrate on one person. I will again use an example situation to illustrate my point.

Imagine you have a certain insecurity: you don't feel comfortable with an aspect of yourself. You might feel and think "I am not loved", with some other related negative thoughts. So you go around in this world, constantly trying to find acknowledgement, and if you don't get that you're down and depressed. Because you want to be happy (of course) and think you need outside acknowledgment for that, you get upset if someone deliberately shows antipathy towards you and rejects you. Because this fear of rejection is always present within you, you also mistake 'neutral' situations for a personal 'attack' on you. But because you do not want to acknowledge this as your own problem, you start to think like "Other people are always picking on me. I have to be strong, I have to compete, I won't let them hurt me!"

So what do you think: do you really have to defend yourself there? There is nobody attacking you, it is just that certain influences from the outside remind you of the things inside yourself you didn't come to terms with. Those influences can be anything: random 'thoughforms' floating around; ideas by other people you pick up intuitively; someone who wants to harm you; or a spirit who himself has troubles. But remember that all those things, conscious or not, evil or not, can do only one thing: point the finger on you and say "Hah! Nobody loves you, eh?" Can you see how you automatically then fall into the mechanism of denying yourself, 'attacking' in return, trying to fend off that 'neg'?

Of course nobody is perfect, and everyone knows that he has potential to grow. But you also have to accept this then, to see any shortcomings with love and compassion. "So what, I'm not perfect, but I can handle that!" should be the reponse that keeps you out of trouble and emotional unrest with a smile. Nobody is bad or worthless only because he is trying to stretch his limits by experiencing and overcoming some difficulties in his life - that's evolution.

There are no negs out there just waiting for the innocent. Forget the concept that the universe is a dangerous place. There are spirits, though, who sometimes are attracted to people in order to point fingers, in the sense of "give me your energy, do what I want, and (maybe) I will stop bugging you!" What you call a 'neg', though, is normally not more than emotional garbage hanging around. By fearing, you pump it up like an air balloon and create the exact thing that you fear. And what's more, any spirit, with whatever intentions, can not reach your attention and stay there without your consent.

If you fear, you attract and manifest the very thing you fear. If you put resistance to it, it will continue to stay there. But if you're calm and relaxed, you decide what you want to see and what not.  If you're stable and content with what you are, any negativity that would like to reach you would just slide off and you would remain unharmed. And even if something disturbs you, say 'hello' to it, see what it has to tell you and all will be okay."




That's it for now, I and my guide prefer to do this from a common-sense point of view at first. This lays out some ground for more detail later on and keeps it all clear and intelligible. We also leave some things uncovered so others can give their contribution, this way a natural discussion can evolve... and after all I'm interested in how others see those things.

With love and light,
  Edi
Logged

it's love you're looking for
kiauma
Astral Energy 4
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 661


View Profile Email
« Reply #4 on: January 29, 2004, 14:14:59 »

Thank you again Edi.  Everything you have said correlates perfectly with my experience.
Logged

Non semper ea sunt quae videntur.
The Astral Pulse
« Reply #4 on: January 29, 2004, 14:14:59 »



 Logged
Dark Knight
Astral Energy 4
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 564

batmaneternal1 batman_eternal1@yahoo.com
View Profile Email
« Reply #5 on: January 29, 2004, 16:35:56 »

I've had just about enough of this. THis is a conversation Mayatnik had with me at the end of December 2003:

MAYA says:
Greetings !  
I saw your recent post on the Reptilians thread...... Eccellent, balanced and just what was needed !  Much appreciated by me... and hopefully will hit its mark with those who have not thought about all this that is happening now.

Dark Knight says:
Yes

Dark Knight says:
Thank You

MAYA says:
I could have sent that by email, but I much appreciated your thinking and foresight, so value your friendship on Messenger anytime you want to chat about any subject.

Dark Knight says:
Thank you

MAYA says:
Please don't feel we have to talk about 'spiritual' matters (whatever that word means).... I have many contacts on Messenger from the AP, and with quite a few we don't even approach that 'subject'...... nevertheless, there is great value in interchange of any kind, and we all gain much by interaction.

Dark Knight says:
It's nothing personal...I just walked in the door after driving from the American Midwest all the way back to the American East Coast. Tomorrow I have to go back to a job I'm unsure about and somehow have got to make work, given all the debt I'm in thanks to the last two daffy dimwits I received "help" from. I've had to compromise so much of myself to stay afloat, I'm not sure there is much left

Dark Knight says:
of "me".

Dark Knight says:
I'm tired, and would like to just take a break from life for about 5 years. It's not going to happen.

Dark Knight says:
I'm trying to figure out whether or not to talk to you right now or not. I don't know, that's the problem.

MAYA says:
I understand completely.   I didn't want to disturb you, since you'd only just come 'online' on my list.....and I merely wanted to show my appreciation of your input on the AP in general, and that one I mentioned in particular.  As to you being unsure, tired and not knowing whether you 'want space' right now, all I can say is that sometimes a chat for as long as you feel like, is often a 'reviver'

MAYA says:
but I am happy to talk now, or at another time.  I am here for when you want to talk, without pressure.

Dark Knight says:
Can you help me with one thing for a moment

MAYA says:
Anything you want.  

Dark Knight says:
I made a small breakthrough only a few blocks from arriving at my house. I started hearing someone talk to me, but I have learned too often that the ones on my case impersonate and take advantage of situations to so I constantly stay tuned in to them. Can you at least ask my guide, the greys, whoever, with whom I was hearing just a few short blocks from home. I am trying to differentiate between

Dark Knight says:
energies. I don't like asking for outside help, becomes to easy to become addicted instead of doing it myself. But I have no reference, it all feels the same. That's why I ask.

MAYA says:
I know your 'situation' in all this......and the first thing I have to say is, that I merely help people to examine what is there before them, not give the 'answer' - because that would defeat the object of the lessons given to you by the guides.  I can ask the guides, mine OR yours or others.anything specific you want to ask...and then we could talk about it if you wish.

Dark Knight says:
Go head

MAYA says:
What would be your first main question about this then?

Dark Knight says:
Maybe I should just let them supply whatever. Can you open and see if they have any comment about anything (including saying nothing at all).

MAYA says:
Yes.  Let them 'supply whatever', certainly.  Because closing or blocking or even differentiating by 'conditioning' would not take you forward, quite obviously.  But, what is being presented is subtle, and not 'face value' in many respects, so don't look for the 'obvious' as it seems to come over here.........there is a reason why the guides are presenting things to you in this way at this time.  

MAYA says:
And that we could talk about here, or you could ask specific questions of your guide here (through me -- or even direct..... but relay to me the 'response' they give, so that we can discuss what is so presented).

Dark Knight says:
I need my guide, honestly

Dark Knight says:
I'm not even sure if I have one

MAYA says:
You DO have a guide........and your guide wants to have communication with you.....but it is at the moment not easy for you, for varioius reasons, so your guide is 'presenting' scenarios... often 'impersonating' in order for you to walk through  various 'experiences' that will lead you eventually to clarity in this...... there is a strong element of 'conditioning' breaking that is being done here.

MAYA says:
What I can do here, to help, is to 'monitor' any dialogue you have with your guide.....so  that I can verify to you whether you are receiving correectly, and what the 'content' is about.

Dark Knight says:
Of course, I was brainwashed for God sakes, I have to be deprogrammed. I assisted my perps the first 4 years and didn't even know it

Dark Knight says:
Hang on

Dark Knight says:
Give me 3 minutes, unless, how much time do you have?

MAYA says:
I'm fine for time......you do what you need to do........ I'll be here wheever for as long as you like  

Dark Knight says:
Give me three minutes.

MAYA says:
 
Dark Knight says:
Hang on, but while yo're waiting does my guide have a name

Dark Knight says:
Or too many names

MAYA says:
At the moment you do not have a 'specific' guide.  You have a number of guides (which amounts to the same thing, except that they are working to a 'plan' for your benefit, according to a 'supervisor' guide).  I know the name of your 'current' guide, Mela, but it can be any number - and at this time it is not important as they work a 'shift system' ... but each knows ALL about you.

Dark Knight says:
Oh lovely

Dark Knight says:
Human, ET, angelic

Dark Knight says:
ALL

MAYA says:
How you 'view' them is according to your perception, and your will to cross frontiers.  As you know, many like to think they are talking to their 'higher self' .....all talk THROUGH their higher self, and beyond that........well, that we can talk about for a moment....to see how you view things....ok?

Dark Knight says:
I'll live without it

MAYA says:
Ok

Dark Knight says:
Who is attacking me, or is it a guide effort

MAYA says:
Nobody is 'attacking' you as such......but you feel attacked......that is the 'effect' due to how things have been in the past........ You are not under threat from them at all, but in the past you have been 'imprisoned', severely repressed and even tortured BY HUMANS.  The guides are not like that, but you are being presented with scenarios for you to break free of those past chains.

Dark Knight says:
No government involvment, or am I taking you too literally

MAYA says:
I know exactly how they work,  because when I first started I was presented with ALL those things you have described in your posts....and I had to work through the various 'experiences' and treat them as a 'task'.

MAYA says:
There is no government involvement in RV-ing you.........they can not RV an individual UNLESS the guides permit......they knoow this, and it is well documented by them anyway that they are often frustrated when they have tried.  So don't worry about that.

Dark Knight says:
But there IS government involvment?

MAYA says:
There is no government involvement in this, Karek assures me on that.

Dark Knight says:
Jet black leathery skinned looking things?

MAYA says:
Me: Are such beings confronting DK?
K:  No.  It is a 'front face' that is being presented by a guide.  This along with 'words' paints a picture for DK to examine in a practical way by interaction with these 'beings' presented.  The task here, is to interact.....and to talk only if those 'beings' are polite.....otherwise there is no point in conversation.

Dark Knight says:
I'm in a holodeck confronting things that aren't real...like a training

MAYA says:
Very much so.

MAYA says:
You can benefit greatly from those situations.  They are closely monitored as to how they progress or not......and the next 'scenario' will be the result of how you deal with each.  

MAYA says:
I have interacted with ACTUAL beings (not my guide 'impersonating') and can deal with those diplomatically too with benefit to THEM by that interaction.........but you will NOT be given that opportunity until you are fully ready and can deal with ease in any such situation.  This is merely 'training'.

Dark Knight says:
So the government may actually come after me at some point, or is it just a convenient scenario

MAYA says:
Yes......the government may indeed become 'interested' in you, but it will not be a problem - and it will not be permitted in any case unless there is a good reason (hardly likely!).  I have had interaction (very much so!) with the government people - many times, from MI5 - but I am very highly trained, and they are not in any way a problem.

MAYA says:
If you accept this as just a 'training' then please do not think "ah, well it isn't that important, just an exercise" ..........treat it as if it were REAL, and in that way interact....... ask them their purpose, and deal with it decisevely with them....above all, INSIST politely but firmly on etiquette at all times, otherwise tell them they must go until they can address you properly.  That's it.

Dark Knight says:
DO I Have to do this

Dark Knight says:
Do I have to go to 4D

MAYA says:
Well, the 'doing' is simply for you to have a good attitude to all this......if you have the attitude then you will not be confronted in the same way, simple as that.  But there will ALWAYS be various kinds of 'scenarios' as you proceed, these are 'tests' to see how you are progressing towards higher 'status'.....rather like 'exams'    I've been there, I know  

MAYA says:
When you 'engage' in interaction you ARE engaging in 4D.

Dark Knight says:
SO if I had died last year during the download, what would have happened

MAYA says:
Firstly, you will die when it is time - not before.  Secondly, please explain this 'download'

Dark Knight says:
The forced channeling of information that occured last year, I'm assuming to get me away from the last two dimwits

MAYA says:
I went through a similar situation, regarding 'downloads' and 'uploads' of various kinds....this occured within the first two weeks of my  'training', and then different kinds later on.  They seemed very dramatic at the time..but I went with the situation with curiosity....and learned many things as a result.  They said they were making a 'copy' of me on the ship, in case I died ... to transfer me

Dark Knight says:
I heard something similar

Dark Knight says:
Transfer you...do you mean soul or personality, traits, etc

MAYA says:
........this was for me to understand more of what was then a completely unknown realm......I had never even heard of channeling at that time!  I was suddenly thrust into the 'alien' thing when I started to investigate it with my Pendulum, and the telepathy came suddenly there and then.

MAYA says:
'transfer' is the <normal> way they travel.......what we would call 'teleportation'........ it is actually what happens when we die.... but they can just transfer their 'soul' (or transfer ours on death), and this is all done via their 'computer' ... which makes a new body at the new location, hence the 'old body' is redundant.  

MAYA says:
But, it was being 'presented' to me as a 'scenario' based on Truth.......for me to explore and ask questions.

Dark Knight says:
The greys, or all of THEM

MAYA says:
Essentially, it is the Greys (the Zeta Reticuli) who are in charge of the 'practicalities' at this time.....the Pleiadians are supervising...... each 'species' though has its own 'computer', and each of the main ones can incarnate on the Earth through their computer (done by 'birth' as we know it).... but they can 'transfer' themselves to any location............

MAYA says:
but in the case of their 'normal' (i.e. not incarnating) travel by teleportation, they create a silicon-based 'vehicle' (since a computer cannot replicate a carbon-based one, due to the inherent random-ness in carbon structure)

Dark Knight says:
So I have been picked up by the greys

MAYA says:
You have been in communication with the Greys (the Zeta .........only the US Government refer to them as the 'greys' in a derogatory and fear inducing sense)

Dark Knight says:
I call them the greys too, sorry but they'll have to deal with it

Dark Knight says:
They used Edi didn't they

MAYA says:
Me: Has DK been 'abducted' by the Zeta at any time?
K: Yes, this was done long ago....and is routine for checking DK's genetic and other related things, and also ongoing for DK to develop.  We are aware of Dk'S difficult past situations.

MAYA says:
I assisted Edi to make contact with her guide, and then later assisted him to be put into contact with the Zeta........this was carefully done VIA his guide.

MAYA says:
Some people have Zeta guides, some have Pleiadian....... they all work together.

Dark Knight says:
They used Edi didn't they

MAYA says:
The difference is in the 'computer'........so, Edi had to be put in touch telepathically with the Zeta by connection THROUGH the Pleiadian interface (like a telephone exchange)..........

MAYA says:
It dpends what you mean by the word 'used'  

Dark Knight says:
They used Edi to further the "government/ET" holdeck play

MAYA says:
No.   I monitored ALL the initial conversations, and I in fact keep a close check on all ongoing conversations with the Zeta that Edi and Fuzziwig and TruthSeeker have had.

Dark Knight says:
Edi was wrong about the government issue, or played along, or talking to someone from a different vantage point

MAYA says:
I followed your posts also........and I am satisfied with the 'state of play' that members are engaging in at this time......it is necessary for eyes to be opened on the AP, and a time of 'diversity'......which is why I went into the background for all that to take place, on the instructions of my guide.

MAYA says:
Edi was trained by me to become a Teacher.......so Edi is still learning (although very proficient by now) many things ongoing.

Dark Knight says:
Did Edi know or not

MAYA says:
Edi has Free Will, to learn at his own pace, and Edi is happy with his progress.

Dark Knight says:
I don't approve of vagueness and free will is not an excuse

MAYA says:
I am not trying to avoid any questions here...... but I cannot discuss another person like that.  So, I am talking to you about YOUR perceptions here, and will answer those direectly in whatever way I am permitted to your benefit.  The truth may or may not be acceptable to you, so it will not be given in that way......only pointers for you to think about, of YOUR OWN Free Will (which you have)

Dark Knight says:
The truth is already unacceptable

MAYA says:
Then talk about what you want to talk about, since Truth is subjective.

Dark Knight says:
Boundaries and morality are not

MAYA says:
Morality is devised by society for people to conform.  Boundaries are fences put up for people to be kept within.   What we are discussing in these subjects lies BEYOND those things.

Dark Knight says:
Boundaries are not fences, and you either have no idea what my concept of a "boundary" is or you are playing with something not so light and nice

MAYA says:
What is 'light and nice' is entirely a matter of perception.......even the most 'evil' people (as perceived by society) did what THEY thought was right, all through history.  Some have been found to be 'right' since, and others society still does not understand why they did those things....and therefore classes anyone as 'evil' according to what a 'church' says.  Each person has their own Free Wil

MAYA says:
and if they restrict their thoughts to what others say they ought to do, then they are giving up that Free Will.   We are not even talking specifics here.

Dark Knight says:
If you recognize only self, what about service to other

Dark Knight says:
And personal responsiblity

Dark Knight says:
I'm being played with and it is inaapropriate

Dark Knight says:
This conversation is ending now

MAYA says:
If you do as others wish, rather than what you wish.......then you are being controlled........it is not good to be controlled, in fact to control is SERVICE TO SELF, by definition.

MAYA says:
I would suggest you stay well within your 'boundaries' (set by others) till you feel differently.......that is Free Will.

Dark Knight says:
I am being played with...I'm blocking you from any further conversation


I couldn't care less if you believe the gov't is attacking me or not. Who is attacking me is not important as how.

If what Mayatnik says here is true, then guides will do anything, break any boundary to teach you a lesson. I cannot and will not believe that, it goes against everything I ever was taught about guides...before all this crap happened to me.

Remember how the Nazis used Jews as test subjects in some of the most inhuman experiments ever devised? They believed the means justified the end, that it was acceptable to sacrifice and torture a person, if the information gained would lead to valuable information with tackling disease or advances in weaponry. The lesson was more valuable than the person.

There has to be trust for growth to occur. There has to room to walk away. If you make the lesson more valuable than the person, then you defeat the entire purpose of coming to the planet (and you are no better than a Nazi yourself as far as I am concerned). There are limits, boundaries which should never be crossed. The wrong sacrifices are made when those limits and boundaries are crossed. NO guide would ever make the lesson more valuable than the person. Of all the voices I hear, the one I trust the most is the one that says, [Dark Knight] do what you think is best. Then I take all the benefits and blunders and claim responsiblity for my actions.

I'm seeing too much crap of people pulling into themselves instead of reaching out to others.

In order to defeat a problem, a person cannot be less than the problem, cannot be equal to the problem, they must be greater than the problem.

People on this site only want to give so much than get upset and whiney when it isn't enough, as if people should be gracious you gave so little while you're bleeding to death (as if it were your hides on the line).

The only one that knows your best interest is you, you are the expert on your own experience. Any positive entity guide will say that. I'm suspicious of the ones that don't (especially the ones that choose to be deliberately vague...vagueness can lead to circular arguments and you can justify just about any action without consequence).
Logged
Dark Knight
Astral Energy 4
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 564

batmaneternal1 batman_eternal1@yahoo.com
View Profile Email
« Reply #6 on: January 29, 2004, 16:41:47 »

I know some of you will ask...

I am doing great! Something interesting happened the other night and it has improved my situation dramatically (along with Spectral Dragon's Help).

I went to bed Monday night after reading several chapters of Carol Rutz's book, "A Nation Betrayed" (you know, the woman I keep talking about that was a child test subject of MKULTRA http://my.dmci.net/~casey/ I highly recommend the book and you can get it off of her website). I was really depressed when I went to bed...this woman had electric shock therapy done to her to create multiple personalities, personalities that could be programmed to be a spy, an assassin, whatever. Among other things, she was brought to the Michigan Upper Penninsula, stripped naked, all had limbs dislocated and was repeatedly raped by her doctor while the men around her told her what a "good little girl you are, We love our little girl." On another occasion she was driven by her father to an airport hanger and brought to a place where child subjects of MKULTRA were stripped naked and placed in hanging cages for long periods of time,...every time a child nodded off, they would be prodded with electric prods by some guy with long finger nails, I mean just gross. I recognize some of the techniques that were being used...my emotions were repeatedly cloaked so I couldn't feel them but I was astrally raped and molested and felt my body react. I couldn't feel anything, was having all my boundaries annihilated, but I was repeatedly, sexually touched in the right way to produce a pleassant reaction that I was allowed to feel. You're human, you can't just not live without emotions. You have to feel something. I resisted for the most part, but I won't lie, I cracked every once in a while. I went to bed feeling sick, feeling like all the hell and torture I am going through was based on researching the torture of a 4yr old Carol Rutz done some 40yrs ago. It made sick!

I had problems falling asleep, finally did, but then woke up in the middle of the night. I felt a presence and some how realized it was a group of positive greys. Something was being done to my energy and the protective seals around me. Then I heard a voice speaking to the negs in the room saying, "We're going to let you in." I was really wondering what was going to happen. I felt the grasping and clawing and pushing on me and occasionally heard, "I want in" but they didn't get in, they couldn't get in!

The next day I told Spectral Dragon, he did a search on me after noticing that the seals had been altered...apparently my will is strong enough now, I am keeping them out. But there is also something else. SD found a device attached to me that is giving me energy...neutral energy not positive or negative. IE, I am being given energy but I decide which polarity to use it for. My free will has been honored and respected for the first time in 6 years.

All in all, I feel great and positive about the future for the first time in a long time.



Logged
shaman
Astral Energy 3
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 389


View Profile WWW
« Reply #7 on: January 29, 2004, 18:24:58 »

As posted in the Religions section of AP, from the Zohar, things that a person thinks and do, if they are (say) "bad" or "mean" (e.g. feeling of hatred) can "come and join the demonic forces / join forces with the demon spirit, molding itself into the exact image of that human, moving into his house to torment him. Sometimes his stay is for the good, if one purifies himsel. If not is is a horrible visitation."

This is clearly an allusion to some form of Negs, created by the person him/herself.

There is allusion also that the opposite is also true where the person who does right God will guide hims always and satisfy his soul with sparkling of flashes.

From there we can explain someone who radiates golden light on one side in contrast with some who radiates Negs, probably of dark appearence (in contrast to the sparks).

It is clear then that to get rid of Negs and other "horrible visitations", one has to have positive thoughts and has to "purify" him/herself. These things are just projections that we make from here into the astral realm.

May the light shine upon you and on your way!
Logged
kiauma
Astral Energy 4
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 661


View Profile Email
« Reply #8 on: January 29, 2004, 18:52:49 »

I really do not know what to say to such a virulent negativity as yours DK, so I shall not even try.

I am glad you are feeling better, it can only mean you are feeling much more in control of yourself.

Indeed, may the light shine upon you and on your way.
Logged

Non semper ea sunt quae videntur.
Nay
Guest
« Reply #9 on: January 29, 2004, 19:20:57 »

I know what I want to say, of course....I can't.. but I have one question, does Maya know that you posted a conversation that he thought was between just you two?  If he did..wonderful, if not..how totally rude and disrespectful of you.

I really hope you get the true help that you need.  I would like to come to the forums and read one of your posts and actually come away with a good feeling and not the anger, hate, confusion, and defensive feeling I get from reading your words......*sigh*

I guess that last post was a bit more upbeat, but eh...still had the left over feelings from the first one.

I will try and do better...
Nay.[Sad]
Logged
taom1234
Astral Energy 1
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 33


View Profile Email
« Reply #10 on: January 29, 2004, 19:52:16 »

To edi's spirit guides message;
From my own experince with APing and entering endless realms of consciousness, I agree wholeheartedly with your words.  When I APed, I always oberved rather than reacted so as not to build any fear into my mind and it has worked every time for me. There are what appears to be and infinite amount of energy in all types and forms visible and invisible flowing through the universe.  If we were to preceive all these forms as so called "enimies" or "negs", then we would react with a sense of threat and end up creating our own perception of them into a real and tangible force that will haunt us. Hence, we end up hauting ourselves through our own reactions.

Obviously your guides are very aware of all the posts in this forum which have motivated them to respoind, and they must be aware of some of mine too in regards to helping my girlfriend.  I don't know if they would feel that is worth their time and effort to more clearly elaborate on a common problem that many people have, but if they are so inclined to do so.... my question to them would be   "how can one remove a subconscious spell cast upon them in their time of innocence when at that particular time in their lives they had no real means of knowledge for dealing with the outcome"Huh  as was with my girlfriends case and I am very very sure as with many who have had the same thing done to them, she did not have anyway in her younger years to react but to react with understandable fear when the loud and rude voices instaneuosly appeared in her mind.  Becasue of her innoncence in not understanding that it would have been better for her if she would have reacted in a calm and unfrightened manner, this thoughtform has grown with her for 15 years and it seems such a waist of her life in having to be tortured relentlessy, because a few idiots long ago decided to perform a ritual on her?  Is the universe so cruel as to allow this type of torment to continue without any real remedy?  I myself feel that there must be a simple way to undo what has been started.  If her persecutors had the knowledge to instantaneously deliver rude and obnoxious voices into her mind, then there also must be simple knowledge available to reverse the damage that has been done. Please take the time to answer this through this forum or through my own guides.  You obviously have intent to help us grow through sound knowledge. Thanks
Logged
need
Astral Energy 2
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 53


View Profile Email
« Reply #11 on: January 29, 2004, 22:14:50 »

I've read this thread and I think this is one of the most important and mind expansive issues ever raised. Indeed what is wrong with Psychic Self Defense.

I've found many techniques that are supposed to work do not work. So what do we have to work with, we go around trying what is supposed to work, it doesn't, then keep reading everywhere that this one, or two or three techniques will work, but it's only repeating the same stuff. Repeatedly we see visualizations to do, or meditations but what happens when all the techniques you know do not work. There is a complete lack of synergetic provable scientific knowledge. We're operating on hearsay no matter what our experience is. From what I've seen and experienced the psychic business really has a bit of a way to go before it could ever be taken seriously.

There are many issues in great need of discussion to determine what is the point of it. Too many people are going around in need of major help and wasting their money on professional psychics and healers who in many cases make everything much worse at great mental and financial cost. Have a look around and you will see that there are too many people who have been ripped off or haven't be helped. One too many in my opinion. Some of our life stories sound so bizarre that let alone "normal" people ,even supposedly psychic people can find it hard to believe us. At worse those in need of help are told the same repetitive stuff brainwashed into us on what to believe and what to do to solve problems and their "text-book" knowledge does not work. Where does this leave us , inside the box, never able to think outside the box, we don't have the ability to go beyond and everyone is telling you ,you have it wrong ,or that you're , in so many ways not following  what has been set out for you in all these books, soceities and God knows what else. The psychic industry has been thought out well before any of us ever got into it. Start searching and you'll realise how much it doesn't do ,in contrast, to what it is advertised to do.
Logged
SpectralDragon
Guest
« Reply #12 on: January 29, 2004, 22:32:19 »

This is a channelling I am putting out with my Guide and guardian, a pheonix called Kereen.

"fear leads to fear, this is the problem with this place at this particular moment, nothing more, nothing less. It is entirely possible to be possessed by a neg or demon, but the chances of this happening are "slim to none," and at most only about 20 or so people should be possessed in the world. Other psychic problems caused by people practicing magic and other arts are a different story altogether.

As far as lesser negs go they are too weak for the strong human soul to conquer. You should not fear these entities. They are made simply to survive."

She will say more later, and she would have talked to your guide directly on this, edi, but she feels that this conversation should come out in the open.
Logged
Anonymous
Guest
« Reply #13 on: January 30, 2004, 01:52:29 »

Hi Perena

I understand I am guilty in some aspect of the very thing you are talking about here, but I would also like to stress that I think the problem of the relationship between man and grey needs to be taken into account here. Correct me if I am wrong, but from what I have learned, greys do not feel emotion the way humans do (but I do not say that you lack emotion). I have been doing battle with energy draining spirits such as Litches, and with negs and/or demons (depending on how you define them). I do battle with them only when they are harming another human being. I will never harm another human being because I understand that each of us is an aspect of a great Source or Spirit, and to destroy each other is offensive to this Spirit or Source. We humans, from what I have learned through practice of qi gong, are here to interact with each other. We have to do what feels natural to us, good or bad. I am sure you understand the reason for this already but I'd be happy to explain if you wish.

What I see here are two extremes: your (Edi's) post expresses one extreme, and I guess mine or others' posts would express the other. There needs to be a balance found so that it accomodates man's mistakes. We still must learn to grow, however. Everything that happens will happen and there is nothing anyone can say or do to change it. It is the equation of destiny. Even if one were to go back in time to change something, it is still written into the equation that that would happen. This seems to negate free will. So the question is, are we free? My guess: we are free to follow the ways of nature, because that is the only choice available to us. So, maybe we aren't free after all.

Then again, maybe we are...
Logged
Nick
Astral Energy 5
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2795



View Profile
« Reply #14 on: January 30, 2004, 02:28:35 »


quote:

Originally posted by kiauma

'Spirit' is what we are, which is why love, or focused violence, defensive or otherwise, will always be reflected in our experience of the spirit realms.





 
quote:

Originally posted by Perena (via Edi)

Where a natural approach to explore those things in a calm and positive way would do the job, the fear and negativity instilled by people who like to 'fight' and 'attack' for whatever reason does nothing to alleviate the problem - in fact it makes it worse!




Well I just came across this thread. I try to visit all the forums but have not spent much time here at this one. I have to say that I agree with what kiauma and Perena/Edi wrote above.

There must be some genuine self-defense that is needed from time to time. I fully respect what Robert has written, and posts I have read by Nita, a skilled astral healer, for example.

My sense though is that some individuals tend to focus on the negative, looking and finding 'negs' everywhere. Yet others seem to not be preoccupied with or focused on 'negs'. Perhaps they may be more centered on the 'positive', helping others, sending out goodwill and so forth. As a result, I believe these positive people are utilizing the first line of self-defense by such actions and mental outlook.

Certainly, if something truly negative manifests, (in addition to Robert's book) an astral healer can be sought out. There are methods employed by skilled healers that can be used successfully. Nita has a website and is an exceptional healer.

Lastly, the above represents my humble view. It is not meant to discredit those who hold a belief in a contrary view, merely to compliment those resposible for the quotes above, and present my own opinion.


All the best,
Logged

"What lies before us, and what lies behind us, are tiny matters compared to what lies within us...." - Ralph Waldo Emerson
Tayesin
Guest
« Reply #15 on: January 30, 2004, 02:53:28 »


Hi All,
I applaud Ender Wiggin for showing the extremes that are spoken here, whether by humans or 'Guides'.  Very obviously the middle perspective is what is needed here.....isn't it highly possible that both sides of this discussion are actually correct, but only so far as the concepts being adhered to will allow ?  

Let's take the concept of using a protective shield.  We would not allow a baby to crawl near a road without an adult being there to insure it's safety while it learns to walk and digest the information about what is safe behaviour and what is not.  SO too with Potection.  It has a place in a persons early practices while they become acquainted with the ability to Journey at will and then to work with their own Guides until they become Self-empowered.  At which time they will know how to deal with what comes in the most effective manner.

I was taught back in the 70's that one should come to all practice 'as if naked',  meaning free from expectations, free from our own belief system rules and perceptions,  so that we can simply experience what comes while we are Journeying.  This is how I prepare to Journey.  And in the many years that I have been regularly Journeying I have come across all kinds of Beings in the Astral realms and beyond.

Each Being had a unique feeling to them, making it easy to read them and their intentions.  At no time were any of these my projections as I was there without concepts of my own, simply being what I am and seeing what is.   And so I have a little difficulty with some of what is portrayed here, as it makes no allowances for the existance and intentions of other beings in this Universe.

At the same time a lot of Fear is expounded here too.  And ultimately our own fears are our worst enemies, and it may be possible to manifest them in the Astral as 'negs', although this cannot be and is not the only explanation.  Certainly the Universe is populated with the widest possible array of life forms...many embodied and many that are not, and in my own experience I see that there are some who choose to use their energy for the welfare of others and then there are those that choose to do the opposite!!  These then may well be what we could call 'negs'.

The fear approach is one in which the experiencer will attempt to attack the Being that is seen to be 'negative' to them, or to run away and hide from it, or many other possibilities that are regularly read in this section.   Ultimately, there is only one truly effective way to deal with these beings, and that is to Love them for the fear lessons that they are actually helping you with!!  There is no 'defence' for this, nothing can prepare a 'neg' for this sort of interaction, and in my own experience it will begin to change the Being from within....and that is doing service for the Creator.

While here, I am astounded by the unusual concepts that are being expounded by some people about Guides.  We all have Guides, we have primary guides who are with us during our entire life, we have others who I call helpers who are with us during phases of our life, we can have guides who are ancient friends of the Soul we truly are, and we can have guides that are manifestations of Earth energies.   Alien guides are quiet normal since we are all Souls of this Universe.

But, my problem here arises from the concept that we are assigned these Guides,  that they choose what lessons we MUST have, and that another human being can be involved in the Assigning procedure.  To start with, none of us need to have Guides assigned to us, as we already have Guides who we previously made contracts with before coming to be born here!  We all have a Primary Guide, the higher-self, and that is truth as born out from almost thirty years of Journeying.  

DO not allow anyone to disempower you by getting you to believe that this is not the case, for YOU are not a little soul in need of so much assistance and help from outsiders,  YOU are a Great Spirit in you own right, very capable of all that you chose to experience here.  IN fact, all that you NEED to do is to remember what you are and the way will be very clear.

SO please enjoy the conversations as they are written here, but remember that there is no substitute for having the experience for yourself, remember that much of what is written here is by people who have limited experience of their own,  including some that SEEM to be 'so spiritual'.  Rely on your own Guides for their support and help and do not be blinded by clever words and actions into being a pawn in something much larger than you are currently able to percieve.

That's me few cents worth.
Love Always, Tayesin[Smiley]
Logged
kakkarot
Astral Energy 5
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1777


View Profile Email
« Reply #16 on: January 30, 2004, 04:01:49 »

well i've stuck my foot in my mouth and gotten myself in trouble before by doing this but i'm going to post after having merely skimmed through the rest of the posts.

to all who think that you can't be hurt without your "permission", i think that's silly. the astral may be different than the physical in some regards, but some things are applicable everywhere. in the physical you could try and say that noone can hurt you without your permission by giving examples of someone slapping you or punching you and you just ignoring the pain.... except of course that if a truck runs you over, whether you gave it permission or not, it's either gonna hurt like hell or kill ya.

i think the same is true in the astral: for small and weak attacks, you can just ignore them and the pain they cause, but if an astral "truck" hits you (aka any being with enough force behind their blow to make you think it was akin to a truck) it doesn't matter whether you let them or not, it's still gonna hurt.

just my two cents. take it or leave it: as always, the decision is yours ^_^

~kakkarot
Logged
Fuzziwig
Astral Energy 2
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 86

Fuzziwig@hotmail.com
View Profile Email
« Reply #17 on: January 30, 2004, 04:28:16 »

Hello everyone
I, as Edi have contact with my guide, who helps me in my development and in helping others. My guide Jopeha and I communicate through telepathy and that has led to work with channeling information. I havent had use of psychic selfdefence or similar myself, allthough i have worked quite a bit with rescuing spirits in many ways. Recently my guide has shown an interest in channeling information regarding psychic selfdefence, and so a piece of channeling done by me and my guide, will follow when i have commented with my guide on the previous posts.
Qoutes are marked in blue
My guide Jopeha is marked in maroon

Nay, you say:
(in reference to Dark Knights post)
"I know what I want to say, of course....I can't.. but I have one question, does Maya know that you posted a conversation that he thought was between just you two? If he did..wonderful, if not..how totally rude and disrespectful of you."
Mayatnik is currently moving to another house, and as such he can not speak on allegations made towards him in this time of moving. I know for a fact that Mayatnik didnt know of the conversation being posted untill they were posted, as i spoke to him on this matter. He has agreed to be qouted here from a conversation i had with him on msn on Dark Knights posting of the conversation.
Mayatnik says:
"I had no idea whatsoever.  James S had contacted me just after that conversation had taken place and he told me he'd been PM'd by Dark Knight, who'd sent him a copy of that conversation that night.   James S told me he'd sent a rather brief PM to Dark Knight in response saying that I was completely trustworthy and he told me that there were clear indications of paranoia in her reaction
I was merely commenting on her 'balanced' input to the forum in that particular post, and then she brought up issues in the conversation which led into me giving her   counselling - so it was sad that she suddenly blocked me, but that was her choice and I can only help if people want to talk, and her fear controlled her in that.
As for the publishing of that conversation, I have nothing to hide but it is not done to publish private conversations without permission.... and I think Nay expressed that well about DK's action there."

I have the relevant transcript of that conversation between Mayatnik and James S (that Mayatnik has just mentioned) but the actual conversation is of course private, a fact that Dark Knight does not seem to uphold.

Dark Knight you say:
"I've had just about enough of this. THis is a conversation Mayatnik had with me at the end of December 2003"
You post a personal conversation afterwards that has to do with some of your personal issues.  I dont see the relevance in what you present here on a thread as topiced : "What's wrong with Psychic Self Defence?". I understand that you want to write about this, but maybe another thread would be more suited for what you present.

"If what Mayatnik says here is true, then guides will do anything, break any boundary to teach you a lesson. I cannot and will not believe that, it goes against everything I ever was taught about guides...before all this crap happened to me."
What Mayatnik is trying to tell is that the guides have a plan for each individual, and from that plan acts are carried out by the guides. The guides follow that plan to ensure the well being of the individual, as well as the best possible development. When it happens that an individual is in a need for help, its provided as much as possible but still in accordance to the plan. If the plan is not followed by the guides, then the lessons in life are not initiated properly to the individual, which would cause the individual to miss out on lessons. This would mean that the lessons in life are not properly met, and as such the life the individual would live would be incomplete.

"I'm seeing too much crap of people pulling into themselves instead of reaching out to others."
The pulling you see is an expression of ppl being afraid of whats around them. They find that the immediate surroundings are too much for them to cope with, and so they hide within themselves.

"People on this site only want to give so much than get upset and whiney when it isn't enough, as if people should be gracious you gave so little while you're bleeding to death (as if it were your hides on the line)."
As my guide said, ppl that cant cope with their surroundings hide within themselves and offcourse some will try to extend their arm to reach whatever help they can get. I take it that you refer yourself as "bleeding to death", and if that is the case, im so sorry to hear that. You have your free will to use, and choose whether you want to give to others. I know that ppl may seem ungratefull for the help they recieve, but its by looking at the change in them that you see the benifits of that help given. That, in a way can be the appreciation for you, that is shown in the acts of the person. Ppl may not be strong enough or maybe too proud to be gratefull for the help they recieved. What matters is the change that we can make by helping each other out in many ways, and learn from each other.

"The only one that knows your best interest is you, you are the expert on your own experience. Any positive entity guide will say that. I'm suspicious of the ones that don't (especially the ones that choose to be deliberately vague...vagueness can lead to circular arguments and you can justify just about any action without consequence)."
The guides are often those who know the individual best, as they have access to the knowledge both conciouss and subconcious in the individual. When the individual experience something, a connection is created that combines the existing memories and the new ones, so as to create the illusion of a coherent life. When this happens, those same memories are stored in a database of a sort. This database is the one you know as the Akhasic records and stores all memories of living beings. The Akhasic record is used by the guides to establish a course of action in the individuals development to help the best way possible.

"I am doing great! Something interesting happened the other night and it has improved my situation dramatically (along with Spectral Dragon's Help)."
"All in all, I feel great and positive about the future for the first time in a long time."
Im glad to hear that your doing better, and i wish you the very best in the future.

Blackstream, I noticed that you made a post, but later edited it.
Here is what you wrote:
"I'm curious, why did you put this post here DK? This post is about whether or not Psychic Self Defence is more harmful than good. Are you trying to say that because he got his info from a guide that it should be discounted? Because otherwise this is a bit offtopic and should be in its own post"
You changed that post to :
"EDIT: Never mind"
The post you made stated your opinion, which is the right of all the members at the Astral Pulse. When you later edited the post to something like "never mind", you changed your opinion (which is as valid as anyone elses) to something unhelpfull. So what i would like to hear from you is, why you altered it ? Were you persuaded to alter your post by others ? What ever your reasons are, then i think that no voice should be held back or forced upon by others will. Its a free will world, and it should let us express ourselves without the restrictions of others. So i welcome your contribution as well as others to a constructive and open minded dialog.

taom1234 says:
"how can one remove a subconscious spell cast upon them in their time of innocence when at that particular time in their lives they had no real means of knowledge for dealing with the outcome"
The guides can usually not intervene without the consent of the person asking for the advice (this is mentioned too in Mayatniks conversation at page 1 ). Since this advice is for your girlfriend,  its adviced that she follows this thread and reads the advice. She is the one being healed from this spell, and so she must have a wish to be healed herself.
The spell that you speak of is something that can easily removed, because its a mere thoughtform that reacts upon new impressions. The impressions will remove the thoughtform and make sure that it doesnt return. The thoughtform consist of thoughts that hinder the individual in various things, but common for them are that they can be removed by exposing them to certain kind of information. Information that makes sure that the thoughtform is not needed anymore.
In the light of this, it would be benificial for her to gain such information. The information that could help her in this, would be channeled information as recieved by the help of the guides to make sure its accuracy and correctness.
This channeled information could come from many websites that claim they have such channneled information, however accuracy is of the essence when channeling and this is not allways the case with these websites.
I would recommend the channeling threads in the Communications section that Edi and myself are channeling at. We channel information through our Pleiadian guides who provide a telepathic connection to two alien species called the Zeta and the Reptilians. These being two species who work in joint venture in helping individuals on their own path to find the answers for themselves. They do this by providing answers to questions on any subject that the members might find interesting.

Channeling on psychic selfdefence provided by my guide:
The spirits that exists in the world today, has long been the subject of fear and misunderstanding. The spirit in itself is not a frightfull beast, but as it manifest itself through the use of energy that is sucked from its surrounding then it can become the subject of fear. When a manifestation like this takes place then its a clear indication that there is a need for help. A need for help that can be hard to deal with, when your surrounding are affected by these manifestations.
The ancient civilizations had these problems too, but instead of scaring the spirits away they would sit down and talk to the spirit and find out the problem, as to solve it. They didnt allways understand these spirits, but they expressed a will to understand, and that was sometimes enough to help the spirit on its way. There would be a wish to help the deceased beings, now spirits on the other side, because they knew that they would be in the same position one day, and such an understanding that they expressed, was much the same as the one they wanted to be met with as they crossed over. So by putting him/herself in the spirits shoes so to speak, there could be a constructive process of helping the spirit on the other side. Not only was this a way for the old people to know the afterlife, but also for young ones to gain an understanding of the afterlife, which they didnt know when they would meet.
When a conversation could be initiated with the spirit, there would often be a group of ppl that would listen as it happened and learn from these conversations. Not all could hear the spirits, and so the word was carried from the listeners to the non-listeners. Eventually they would gain the second sight and communicate with the spirits as well and create friendships, because the spirits would be in touch with nature. The nature was very important for some of these ancient civilizations, because the ppl in them yearned after a balance with everything. To gain the understanding of harmony was to gain understanding of nature, and by this idea they would explore and find out ways upon improvement.
The spirits were a part of that balance in nature which made sure, that they could be safe from harm in nature. So by understanding and helping the spirits, they would help themselves, and recieve help from the spirits in protection as well as guidance. The better the relationship could be, the better the balance with nature would be. This was the attitude of these ppl, and it took them far in spiritual development. They would seek out the problems that occured, and solve them often with the help of the spirits, but allways with a thought of returning the favor if that should be necessary. By a mutual understanding, much wisdom was made and an advanced civilization could be build on such a foundation. It developed in a steady pace where the individual could develop in a harmonious way without fear of spirits.


This shows me yet again, that fear is limiting to oneself, and creates negativity towards the feared. Negativity that not only takes it out on the possesor, but also his/her surroundings. By being open minded and tolerant, there is a truly a chance to walk on our path without the concreteblocks on our feet. Be light as a feather and become more than ever thought possible.

Light and Compassion
Fuzziwig
Logged
Blackstream
Astral Energy 3
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 398


View Profile Email
« Reply #18 on: January 30, 2004, 05:20:14 »

quote:
Originally posted by Fuzziwig

Blackstream, I noticed that you made a post, but later edited it.

The post you made stated your opinion, which is the right of all the members at the Astral Pulse. When you later edited the post to something like "never mind", you changed your opinion (which is as valid as anyone elses) to something unhelpfull. So what i would like to hear from you is, why you altered it ? Were you persuaded to alter your post by others ? What ever your reasons are, then i think that no voice should be held back or forced upon by others will. Its a free will world, and it should let us express ourselves without the restrictions of others. So i welcome your contribution as well as others to a constructive and open minded dialog.


I did receive a PM, but the choice to remove it was mine (I wasn't asked to remove it).  I had simply thought that DK's post had a purpose here as I realized you guys went a bit further back than I, so I thought there was some hidden purpose behind DK's post.  I see now I was mistaken.

I am however honored you noticed that I removed my post (and somehow knew what I originally said... did you save a copy of the thread or something?)[Smiley]
Logged

There is no spoon
SpectralDragon
Guest
« Reply #19 on: January 30, 2004, 10:27:47 »

Kereen:
"readers must keep in mind that any subtle thing you hear from a guide, especially the differences in statement, makes a difference.

I have stated something very close to what edi's guide has said. But the fact is that though some changes are necessary to avoid future people becoming confused, this has not happened on the scale that is suggested. There is no need to say things that demean a place of learning that has done much people good. Everyone should consider the people who have come here for help as people who are still learning and who are scared and try to find out if they are simply just scared or it they genuinely need help.

As stated before, actual demons are rare, but cases of humans attacking humans are increasing. I see through the eyes of this one that many like to label such things as what you call "thought forms," when a good amount of them simply cannot be."

More later.
Logged
kiauma
Astral Energy 4
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 661


View Profile Email
« Reply #20 on: January 30, 2004, 11:21:47 »

I hear what you are saying Tayesin, and I appreciate it.

I feel perhaps I am getting too caught up in the defensiveness myself, so I find your post a breath of fresh air.

Thanks you.
Logged

Non semper ea sunt quae videntur.
Edi
Astral Energy 3
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 112


View Profile Email
« Reply #21 on: January 30, 2004, 16:30:37 »

Hey all,

SpectralDragon, thank you for bringing in the viewpoint of your guide. The more opinions we see the better will we be able to understand the whole issue. As Tayesin said, "isn't it highly possible that both sides of this discussion are actually correct?" - yes, in my opinion this discussion is not about who is right or wrong, but about trying to understand each other's viewpoint, because every viewpoint is 'valid'... the fact that we're not alone in the world however imposes upon us the need to get along with each other, and to eventually discuss things.

Tayesin, the protective shield you mention is per se not the problem, it is the attitude that can come along with it. 'Protective shield' clearly implies that there apparently is something to protect against, and for many this can bring along a feeling of fear and defensiveness. If you get out to experience the universe, in whatever way, hygiene is necessary... physical, energetic, emotional, mental, you name it. By that I do NOT mean going out with an defensive, fearful attitude, expecting all sort of things to happen - I simply mean taking care of yourself. if you want also by consciously clearing your aura and keeping together your energy.
As for "no allowances for the existance and intentions of other beings in this Universe" ... this was not what me and my guide intended to put forward here, and I don't think the previous posts suggest so. We concentrated on a person who's new to matters of the spirit and how attitude affects him. There are lots of all kinds of beings in this universe, but this is the last and not the first thing we should worry about. We should first care about ourselves and our surroundings before we can step out to explore unknown fields.
On a personal note, I don't talk specifically about you here (especially regarding projecting fears), because I believe your experience to be valid and your perception to be accurate. I don't know you personally, and you too have limited experience as we all do, but to me you SEEM to be 'spiritual' and I welcome your contributions here Smiley

quote:
Originally posted by Tayesin
But, my problem here arises from the concept that we are assigned these Guides, that they choose what lessons we MUST have, and that another human being can be involved in the Assigning procedure.


I'll let Perena comment on that.


"Although a human being can be involved, the decisions about who gets assigned which guide are done solely at guide level, and the person is only involved to help others meeting their guide and has no influence whatsoever at the decisions the guides might make. All is planned according to the needs of the individual who wishes to get assistance. To comment further on the lessons that are brought forward by the guides for incarnated humans to experience: yes, we indeed choose these lessons. We do not force anyone to go through those lessons, though, and it is the free will of all involved with us to experience lessons for personal growth. Those lessons are no more than opportunities to find out more about yourself. What Tayesin writes about contracts made before life is true; these 'contracts' are the plan for life about the things a person chooses to experience. This includes persons someone is going to meet on earth as well as guidance that will be in the background all the time. But apart from this roadmap for life, there is a lot of room for personal journeys into whatever area is desired."


Regarding exaggeration in the way we present things, suggested by EnderWiggin and SpectralDragon's guide Kareen: it was the guides' clear intention to state a firm counterposition to the common viewpoint, so I find your remarks understandable. But I attribute this to the fact that there are many things that were not explicitely discussed yet, which would be necessary to see how it fits into the bigger picture.

Have a nice weekend,
  Edi
Logged

it's love you're looking for
Dark Knight
Astral Energy 4
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 564

batmaneternal1 batman_eternal1@yahoo.com
View Profile Email
« Reply #22 on: January 30, 2004, 16:51:37 »

Nah, don’t worry, this is definitely the last one…

And since channelings are going to take place in this forum maybe it would be a good idea for Spectral Dragon to start channeling Kereen every once and a while here, just get another “guide’s” opinion beside the ones hand picked by Mayatnik. I’m assuming the almighty guides would be open to another point of view besides theirs from another “service to other”, servant of the Creator guide? That’s not a problem is it?

quote:
You post a personal conversation afterwards that has to do with some of your personal issues. I dont see the relevance in what you present here on a thread as topiced : "What's wrong with Psychic Self Defence?". I understand that you want to write about this, but maybe another thread would be more suited for what you present.

Nooooooooooo way! This thread is perfect, thank you!

quote:
I take it that you refer yourself as "bleeding to death", and if that is the case, im so sorry to hear that.

No, I wasn’t referring to myself (and I haven’t felt like I was bleeding to death for a long while now).

 
quote:
“I applaud Ender Wiggin for showing the extremes that are spoken here, whether by humans or 'Guides'. Very obviously the middle perspective is what is needed here.....isn't it highly possible that both sides of this discussion are actually correct, but only so far as the concepts being adhered to will allow ?”

 Tayesin is right. What I see happening here are generalized, all inclusive boundaries. All the sudden PSD becomes polarized to black and white, each situation logged into either one of two categories with no respect paid to individuality (people are not black and white polarized). Hey polarize something to that grand an extent, you stop questioning, stop feeling things out,…becomes mindless dogma. Each situation is different, each person’s situation is different, and each person deserves more respect that to be mindlessly tossed into a black or white category.

Why all the focus on negativity? I think that depends on your definition of negative. Why no displays of positive? I guess that depends on your definition of positive too.

So now I’m quoting my old sensei again, “There will always be someone better than you, stronger than you, smarter than you, faster than you, and even if you think you are the best, everyone has a bad day.” There are a lot of people that have come to this particular forum in the past to find help and understanding, if I can quote Tayesin again:

 
quote:
“Let's take the concept of using a protective shield. We would not allow a baby to crawl near a road without an adult being there to insure it's safety while it learns to walk and digest the information about what is safe behaviour and what is not. SO too with Potection. It has a place in a persons early practices while they become acquainted with the ability to Journey at will and then to work with their own Guides until they become Self-empowered. At which time they will know how to deal with what comes in the most effective manner.”

Whether many of you like to hear this or not, we are linear entities, our focus and energy can only be divvied up so much. That’s why things like compromise, communication, and community are important. Many of us have been overwhelmed by our experiences and came here looking for all three c’s so we could cope. It was never meant to be forever, just until, as Tayesin says, we could stand on our own. Where is the positive!? We reached out to each other, consoled each other, learned from each, and it made the fear of what we were all experiencing more workable. That is the positive! It’s called coping skills. You don’t avoid fear and you sure as heck don’t deny a person’s right to feel fear, you move through it…and you can’t move through it without acknowledging it, feeling it, and experiencing it. Fear only destroys you if you hold onto it,…and that happens when you don’t acknowledge it or stop yourself or others from feeling or experiencing it. It creates a blockage of energy flow, and when that blockage occurs you experience anger. Blocked too long…it turns to hate. This is why it is important to allow people to feel and to validate feelings, their right to feel joy, happiness, pain, suffering, anger, fear. That’s what keeps the energy flowing.

Why acknowledge it, why not “be positive” at any cost? Because there are no substitutions for emotions. Same way you can’t replace any emotion with alcohol or drugs or food or shopping, you can’t avoid fear by “be positive” at any cost attitude. It’s a block…looks, walks, quacks, is a duck.

Oh but then comes the problem…like I said, you can’t reach out to help others without acknowledging fear is there…or that we can be overwhelmed by something. And a good chunk of you don’t wanna hear it. Suffering or any insinuation of being overpowered should stay in a closet some place and any acknowledgement of fear’s existence is seen by you as a negative attitude. And those of you out there responsible for this mentality neither recognize nor take ownership for the blockage in energy you create. Energy flows where the focus goes, and when a block forms, focus is gonna go directly to that blockage…and on the a**hole to blame for trying to keep it in place. And that focus won’t leave until the blockage is removed, in fact if anything, it will intensify. And when you try to shift the blame off of yourselves by telling the angry person how negative and lacking in personal responsibility they are…

If people reached out to one another, the way many of us who were suffering attacks tried to, showed compassion to one another, we’d all be safe even when overwhelmed. Suffering is not an opinion or theory, it is a situation with real life consequences that impacts every aspect of life…some of you refuse to even acknowledge that.

Do you really believe you have the right to block others to keep yourselves safe from moving through and confronting fear? Who really has the negative attitude here? The ones on this forum who keep claiming to have positive attitudes put all their focus and energy into ignoring the compassion and understanding that those suffering from attacks tried to give each other, but you put a lot of energy into trying to deny that a person can be overwhelmed to the point of breaking, bleeding, or dying…lord knows keeping your own hides safe took priority above all. Hey but there’s no negativity or fear on your part when you do that now, is there?  

Hey, you’re right, energy flows where the focus goes.


Logged
Sam
Astral Energy 3
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 108


View Profile Email
« Reply #23 on: January 30, 2004, 18:30:25 »

I guess i'm jumping in the deep end here, being new and all, but the water seems lovely and warm Smiley

Before I go on and state my opinion, I'd just like to say that everything I write is just what I think, I'm more than willing to change my attitudes if someone can show me that they are, for want of a better word, inferior.  Also I make various assumptions about people in a conversation from what they have said or written and if I'm wrong, please correct me rather than let me go on thinking such and such is a whatever.

I know DK you said that its your last post, but you've gone and taken us (i think) in a new and interesting direction.  I think we should all be trying to help each other as much as we help ourselves.  Thats the only way any of us are going to learn anything new.

DK, my initial response to reading your latest post was to empathise with your situation, because it seems to me that you are frustrated that the majority of people don't understand the weight of your problems (past or present).  Like dealing with depression, the majority of people who have never experienced it say "stop being so negative, think positive" yet no matter how many affirmations, how many positive thoughts you come up with, there's always ten reasons why those positive thoughts should be ignored.  So while the person with depression is trying to cope through a situation literally beyond their control and so mentally destructive, the well meaning people around who are confused and say "but you should be happy" eventually end up being irritating unless you ignore them and try to understand that they ARE trying to help, but they honestly have nothing in their range of experience that is really of any use to you.  But considering the only way they'd REALLY understand your suffering is if they themselves had suffered like you, and I know I wouldn't wish my own suffering upon anyone else, I don't know about you.

Its easy to mistake anger for negativity, but imho thats a hallmark of a person who needs to learn a bit more about negativity.  Negativity is something that hurts people.  If anger hurts someone then maybe they need to look at their own self confidence issues, because anger is real, and it can be weilded positively, as I believe DK has been trying to do (anger was the emotion I sensed in your posts, correct me if I'm wrong).  Anyway if it is the case that you're angry about something then just say what it is so then we can all work through that issue rather than seeing the same old arguments over again.  You need to help us understand what it is you're trying to achieve here, so then we can help you in return.  

Other than that, everything everyone here's said makes sense in its own right, its just there's an undercurrent of unacknowledged emotion thats threatening to push people apart rather than reconcilliate and promote understanding.
Logged
taom1234
Astral Energy 1
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 33


View Profile Email
« Reply #24 on: January 31, 2004, 05:42:40 »

On behalf of myself and my girlfriend, we would like to sincerely extend our sincerest gratitude to all of you here at Astral Pulse and your guides for so swiftly helping to cure her.  

Special thanks to Fuzziwig and your guide Jopeha for giving clarity and insight into her condition.......

and to Bluelight for teaching me  how to attempt to dissolve the thoughtform and for praying for her.......

and to Dark Knight for helping me know the gifted ones here.......
and to all of you unbeknownst to us for reading our pleas for  help and responding inkind with your prays.  

For the first time in 15 years the voices have communicated to her in a deeply kind and loving manner which has never happened to her before and simply can not be a co-incidence.  We just want everyone reading this post to know that there are many dedicated people in this forum who sincerely have prayed and offered to help us with their knowledge and understanding.

Within about 1-2 weeks after my first post here, a dramatic change for the better has risen within her and we are both deeply thankful to all of you for helping us in our time of need.  We don't know what else to say.  It is somewhat overwhelming that a turnaround has occured within such a short period of time.  For all of you who read this post and suffer from some form of ailment, we want you to know that the reality exists, if you are receptive and open, to have a turnaround take place within yourself for the better.  Thank you again. We will never forget this.
Logged
The Astral Pulse
   



 Logged
Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 ... 8   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines
SMFAds for Free Forums


The Astral Pulse Copyright © 2002 - 2014
Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS! Dilber MC Theme by HarzeM