I exit into this area, but I can not leave my house, as soon as I leave my room, I end up in the astral.
the longest I have spent in the RTZ is like 1 minute maybe.
I think the longest I have been in the RTZ is about 3 minutes.
I think last time, 30, maybe 40 minutes. but that was 2 years ago, i havent stayed out longer than that.
Quote from: knightlightI think the longest I have been in the RTZ is about 3 minutes.
I am starting to question if this place can be called a "real time" zone.
First off, time doesn't exists. Second, its not even in our real time.
Its a very strange place indeed. I mean, for argument purposes I guess we can call it that.
What I dont understand, is that when people have a NDE, they see everything around them, in "real time" but when we OBE, we go to a "real time zone" that can turn into alice and wonderland.
I would guess that is because when we die there is no energy left in the body, so you are your whole self and that makes the RTZ alot more stable. Also when i first project when I'm in my room i think i am probly in real time, but once i get far away from my body, i think less etheric energy can reach me and it starts to turn into an astral projection.
I also agree that the Real Time Zone is a bad name for it, i ususally call it the etheric plane.
it varies in my time out - sometimes i can be out for 30mins or 5 seconds.. depends on the mood/day/energy.
tvos
I could probably be in the RTZ at a maximum of 30 mins, or so it seems.
The clearity and "reality" of the Real time zone only exists for 10 mins or so.
Atleast for me.
Quote from: AgntneoI could probably be in the RTZ at a maximum of 30 mins, or so it seems.
The clearity and "reality" of the Real time zone only exists for 10 mins or so.
Atleast for me.
well 30 minutes seems like a long time, serious. Thats enough to go a pretty long distance.
Before I ever made it to the RTZ, I thought it would be in real time, but its not.
When you say the reality of the RTZ last for only 10 minutes or so, what do you mean by that?
Probably means before it turns into the alice and wonderland thing you mentioned.
I do believe we can enter the *real* time zone because I've proven it to at least myself but I think I've only managed to stay there for maybe 3-5 minutes at the most.
I've often contemplated the nature of the real time zone as opposed to the astral.
However, I wish I had more experience of it. I've stayed in the RTZ for 1 or 2minutes at most, but without fail, the RTZ will become the astral - the familiar surroundings dissolve away, or change and suddenly the differences are everywhere.
The question of the RTZ vs Astral is closely linked to subjectivity vs objectivity in this environment....which is an extremely complex subject, to say the least.
One thing I have noticed - Astral experiences are very sharp, and real....sometimes, more than 100% real (if that makes sense). Whereas, RTZ experiences (for me anyway) are typified by a very clear, awake mind, but slightly fuzzy vision/movement/other senses.
Kind regards,
Mark
Quote from: clandestinoI've often contemplated the nature of the real time zone as opposed to the astral.
However, I wish I had more experience of it. I've stayed in the RTZ for 1 or 2minutes at most, but without fail, the RTZ will become the astral - the familiar surroundings dissolve away, or change and suddenly the differences are everywhere.
The question of the RTZ vs Astral is closely linked to subjectivity vs objectivity in this environment....which is an extremely complex subject, to say the least.
One thing I have noticed - Astral experiences are very sharp, and real....sometimes, more than 100% real (if that makes sense). Whereas, RTZ experiences (for me anyway) are typified by a very clear, awake mind, but slightly fuzzy vision/movement/other senses.
Kind regards,
Mark
I have notice this too. That when I am exiting the body I know whats going on. I know I will soon be out of body. I tell myself, that I will explore the "real time zone" and will not get distracted.
As soon as I exit though, things become..alice in wonderland type. This is why I question it being a real time zone.
I havent seen anything happening in OUR 'real time' Sure, it looks like our world, but where are all the things happening in 'real time'. Maybe this is why the famous card trick never works, because its not really there, or rather, its just not a real time zone.
I always thought I could go out of body and go out side and watch things in real time, this is not the case, and now the questions of if our OBE are nothing more then lucid dreams are even greater. Not to say they arent real, but if its not in REAL TIME, how can it really be called that?
hey there Izalco,
well, the thing with the "card trick", is that there are several aspects to it that we don't consider at first glance.
I used to think along the lines of "why can't it just be proven with a card experiment ?"
However, there are several points to consider :
a) It seems that people who can regularly project, do not wish to seek this kind of proof.
b) Several people (including some on this forum... I think Selski did it a while ago? maybe I'm wrong) have conducted the card experiment successfully. Not under rigorous scientific conditions, mind you... but they have proved it to themselves. Or at least, claim to do so !
c) More often than not, the card experiment seemingly cannot be replicated in lab conditions...When success does occur, it is discredited anyway.
I'm going off topic... Suffice to say, the issues we have been talking about (e.g. RTZ dissolving into Astral) are major problems when attempting the card experiment.
Folks,
TVoS (The Voice of Silence) is doing some really great work in the area of proof. S/He has had some success with the card trick and is keeping good records of OBE's, dreams, and other events. (TVoS, I'm expecting a book from you one day!) :lol:
Izalco, I agree with you about OBE's; they aren't really "real." They are just a form of lucid dreaming. That doesn't mean they have no value; it just means you have to interpret your experiences in light of a dreamworld environment -- not easy!
I've had just one "real" OBE into the RTZ and it lasted just a few seconds. That transition was an instantaneous switch of point of view, but everything else was perfectly normal. In that form, had I been able to maintain it, I am absolutely convinced I could have gone anywhere I wished in our real world. Some folks have said it could have been remote viewing, but call it what you will, "I" was a completely separate entity existing in an otherwise perfectly normal "real time" state.
The bad news is that the methods we are pursuing to achieve OBE's are not necessarily the ones that will bring on a true OBE -- they are all designed to transfer us to the "astral." I think perhaps working on meditation and switching our perception might be productive, but to do what I did you don't have to be asleep, or anywhere near it.
What I ment by that is you get the alice in wonderland effect after 10 mins or so.
This is pretty hard to unvoid, it seems like the real time zone is a pretty fragile place, and as Robert Bruce calles it a buffer zone.
For those who haven't already read it, here are mine and TVOS's experiences with the playing card.
http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=18497
Enjoy :D
Sarah
I tried the playing card aslo, I guess the alice in wonderland effect had kicked in already before I reached the cards..
I picked up the first card on top of the rack and I remember checking later, it was non correct.. the second and third card from the top was wierd because they had the classic windows start menu on it and someother wierd imagery..
:)
I think we must question the mechanics of this so called real time zone and not label the experience by filtering it through the environment, many sayings, some dating long ago, say this is world is a dream world within a dream, and this reality that we see with our eyes is just in fact energy being decoded by our brains and DNA subjectively, both on a conscious and mass conscious level that we call 3d, if thats the case, it is not suprising to see these so called Alice in wonderland affects when in a non physical state of being, perhaps we are seeing things as they really are.