I don't get it. Are they one and the same or are they different? From the Internet I gathered some people believe they are the same while others do not. From the quantity and quality of what people have said it looks like it is leaning to both are not the same. I want to know if AP is just a dream or is it a real experience? That will prove that consciousness can escape the body and perhaps survive death. Perhaps there is a soul. But if its not real and is a dream then all those are not true.
astral projection is a location
a projection to the astral
lucid dreaming is a dream that is lucid (clear), often where your in control
but the location could be the rtz or the astral or above the astral
:NoY:
WHAT ?? there is a HUGE difference between them. lucid dreaming is just knowing that you are dreaming and being able to control everything in that dream. astral projection is when you get out of your physical body with your astral body/soul and travel in different dimensions and planes and it is ALL REAL
Quote from: TheDarkChakra on October 20, 2012, 14:33:43I want to know if AP is just a dream or is it a real experience?
It is both. Because a dream is a REAL experience too. You can prove it to you by producing precognitive dreams or group dreams / telepathy. I had countless ones.
Dreaming is btw also a (astral) projection of the subconscious mind. Remember Monroe's books where he found many 'dreamers' in the Astral, they were not 'conscious' but rather self-absorbed in their mind-play but they were 'there'. Dreams take "place" in the Astral too. The astral is "(human) mind land". (Mental / higher planes are more than that although occasionally (according to K. Leland) dreaming can happen on a mental plane, too).
If the conscious mind is at the steering wheel we call it AP or LD (or MP if you reach the higher/mental planes). If we see what correlates mostly (or entirely) to the physical we call it OBE or a "RTZ"-(astral)-projection (RTZ = real time zone).
Not this conversation again! :roll: One thing I am sure everyone can agree with, is that both take place from a Non Physical state of mind and in a Non Physical Reality. That's the only thing that's important here! :-) How you get there, either by Lucid Dreaming, Climbing Out of Body, Phasing, even by a basic Trance state used for Divination, doesn't really matter as long we achieve said goal, which is to experience the Non Physical. All of those methods are just basic "tools" to help us get to our "intended" or chosen destination.
Lionheart is correct. It does not matter how you get out as the end result is the same.
Call an experience whatever you want to call it... the label is ultimately completely meaningless.
The point is that you have experiences. Call them whatever you want.
It's all just Consciousness. Or different states of it. Is this physical world real? It's just another state of Consciousness.
Exactly.
And you go through different states of consciousness on a constant basis throughout your "waking" physical day here too!
Think about how each part of your day "feels" in comparison to the rest.
The big problem is that people are too limiting in how they label experiences. I say completely forget about the labels!
I don't use labels in regards to my own experiences anymore. Dreams... Lucid Dreams... Astral Projections... they don't exist. To me, there are only experiences of varying levels of awareness. Which, yes, in and of itself IS a label. LOL I'm aware of the irony. ;)