The Astral Pulse

Hi David
  If you read the new article that Robert has written then you will find methods that will work against most psychic vampires. The only ones that might be a little more difficult are those into ritual or shamanic magic that are willing to use those methods against others.  The methods can still be used to remove the chords and resolve some of the basic issues that allowed them to be attached.
  I have had quite a few cases of psychic vampirism over the last 20 years and all of them involve people who are trying to push their bad karma off on someone else. They also try to push their illness's  into someone else's energy system that is willing to take them and supplant them with the good energy the other person has accumulated. It is almost a reverse process of healing.They are all people full of anxiety and fear of death and illness's. I have noticed a definite increase of cases over the last 5 years including some really complex ways of vampirizing others.
  Good defensive systems are the best protection against psychic vampires. I also think that self-understanding is another. You know what is yours and what is not yours. You don't have to accept anything harmful  from anyone if you have good wards.
  Nita

are psi vamps really a problem?

As a psi vamp myself, I don't concider myself a great burden to those around me, in fact I strengthen the auras of those I know  personally. I also gather much of my energy from alternative sources  such as the enviroment, while I do make a lot of targetted feeds to I do not do so when on a real empty stomach so to speak, this is when I find myself becoming parastic.

excellent to find some individuals interested in the metaphysics of this.

Hello Mescalin
  I think the way to look at this is would you want to have someone else pull all your good luck and good health out of you. They then work on the persons life having the energy they need and make it where the negative stuff is left so they are easy to feed off .
  I have had people who had the psychic vampire push there illness's onto them. They unbalanced their energy and put them into early menopause and having blood clots in their legs.
  I feel that maybe you think you are not harming anyone but feeding off of others is something that will get back to the person doing so.
  Nita

Hi Fenris,
to be brief and to the point the most effective and radical way to deal with this type of parasite is to call down the Cosmic Fire.

create your magic circle, set up your wards; then facing south, raise your two hands (the major and index fingers pointing upwards) and call down the Cosmic Fire to deal with your pesky parasite. The call is made in Enochian
" QUAAR RATI-ZOMIA JOZ " Remember to vibrate the words, The JOZ is pronounced more like YOZE. The Cosmic fire will cut all attachments and your vampire will receive a nasty shock almost instantaniously. Remember that at this level, all magic is effectuated by visualisation.

As for you Mescalin; one day you are gonna try to suck from the wrong person and get your buns well and truly toasted!!! it will happen sooner or later and then you just might change your filthy habit.

BTW; the cosmic fire isn't a plaything so please remember the old saying.......If you paly with fire!!!!!!.......???

Fenris. Using this is a bit over the top perhaps. Its like swating a fly with a high yeild nuclear warhead Use this at your own risk..............you have been warned.

Alchimiste

BTW: The above is a form of high magic that requires the correct experience and initiatory background to make it work.

Remember you need the keys to start the car!

I've probably covered my butt on this one ?

Alchimiste

First, psy-vamps don't pull out "all the positive energy"...they take energy period, they're not capable of picking the pattern.  Whatever you have, that's what they take, in the same measures.

Yes, if your energy is drained below a certain point, it can cause depression and immune system reduction, as a temporary effect, until your energy level rises back to normal levels.
Most psychic vampires these days do not do this as a matter of course, if they are aware of what they are doing.  In fact, there is a movement in the psy-vamp community toward consentual feeding, meaning they only take energy from those who they have specifically asked, and gained consent from.  It's an ethical move that should be encouraged, IMO....in other words, don't condemn all psy-vamps without regard to their behavior, and don't ostracize them....if you cast them out, why should they care about you?

Now, if someone does try to drain you, in the vast majority of cases, they are not going to be looking for a fight.  A sharp tug back on the link, then release, is enough to cause most of them to give up and seek elsewhere.  It lets them know that you are aware of what they are doing, and will put up a fight.  A tug of war is just as uncomfortable for them as it is for you, whether they win or not...it's not worth the effort when easier targets are around.

In the case of a deliberate vamp attack--that is, the person intends to hurt you by vamping, they're not merely after your energy--then other tactics are in order.  

Most of these tactics require a fairly high amount of knowledge and experience with energy working.  If your shields are not adequete to prevent vamping, and pulling back does not work, you can attempt to overload them by rapidly changing the speed of the energy flow.  You may also try throwing earth energy into the link, or grounding the link to a ley-line, then blocking your end (ouch).

By all means, attack back--if you can hurt them, they may just decide to give it up as a bad job.


--Winged Wolf
"I will stare at the sun until its light doesn't blind me, and I will walk into the fire, 'til its heat doesn't burn me, and I will feed the fire...."

Hey Nita & Winged Wolf.

You two seem to have different definitions for things.

I am guessing from your definition Winged Wolf, that you only refer to people that choose to leach energy off of others rather than developing their own sources as vampires. They have no real skills when it comes to the removal or trading of energy.

Nita is refering to anyone that takes or trades enenrgy with someone else as a vamp, with intentional posion used to cause bad effects in the victem.

This is my guess any way.

Take care, all

Hi Ides
  You are correct on different interpretations. The stronger emotions make better energy for feeding so most vampires cause them. They hurt the victims by all the negative energy that is put into them while the vampire is drawing off of them. They always give a fight and they are not just something harmless.
  There are groups of people who play at being vampires and draw energy. I feel just like Alchimiste zap the connections. I also think that it is indicative of our society that evil has become cool. I hope they meet some of the expert ones I have met and understand what it is like to be the victim.  The ones I have seen do not draw off of people who just agree they try to draw off people who have brighter energy. They make their lives miserable and cause them health problems.
  I personally don't feel that my approval is not important.  Harming others and attacking others will always get the person trapped in a cycle where I wouldn't want to be.
  Nita

It may be true we have different definitions, but your categorization is off.

First, aware psychic vampires tend to be rather GOOD energy workers.

The reasons a person becomes one are generally one of the following:  most common, when their abilities were awakening, they dumped and drew energy randomly (ie, their abilities were out of control), and no one was there to train them.  They dumped energy, then figured out that they felt better when they drew to replace it, and so got locked into that cycle.  Eventually, their own capability to generate energy reduced dramatically, so that now, if they stop, they get withdrawel symptoms and cannot maintain their own energy level.

Next, they may have a parasitic entity which reduces their energy level, and forces them to draw energy to maintain it.

Third, they may have an injury or congenital defect of some sort which reduces their ability to generate or to capacitate (store) energy, so that they need an outside source.

And finally, there are some folks whose genetics key for very low energy production with very high ability and instinctive use of ability, so that they must take psi from other sources in order to fuel their abilities and maintain a normal level.

The above are psychic vampires.  People who use a vamp attack as a combat technique are NOT psychic vampires....that is just a skill.  Psychic vampires are defined by their need for drawing energy.

And no, they cannot suck up "universal energy", or "earth energy", or any of that garbage, because that is not the same type of energy, and they cannot use it.  That is why you can use earth energy to fend one off.

Nita is correct that some psychic vampires, mostly among the 'addict" types, will cause strong emotional responses in others in order to get their energy more easily, and because they are addicted to the added "flavor", and emotional high, that it brings.

However, as I also said, there is a movement in the psy-vamp community away from attacking people, and toward consentual behavior--asking for energy, and gaining consent before taking it.  Before you judge across the board, learn a bit more about it first.


--Winged Wolf
"I will stare at the sun until its light doesn't blind me, and I will walk into the fire, 'til its heat doesn't burn me, and I will feed the fire...."

Hmmm, interesting all the way around.

Winged Wolf:

Out of curiosity, why can they not access the various life energies? My personal experience is energy is energy, but is flavored different.

Is it possible that these people are just addicted to a quick fix, like a sugar addict, instead of learning how to gain it from proper sources?

Why do you refer to earth energy and universal energy as garbage?

I refer to them as garbage because they are not useable by the body.  I'm fond of the following explanation--if all energy were the same, you should be able to plug yourself into a light socket rather than having a nice bowl of cereal, or sunbathe in favor of chowing on an egg roll.  Obviously, all energy is not the same, and not all energy is utilized by the body in the same fashion.

It's more than "flavor".  Different types of energy require different handling to achieve the same effects, though generally speaking they CAN all be used to achieve the same effects.
Outside energy sources can be used to fuel magick/psychic abilities.  However, they cannot be used to fuel a person, the way life energy is.  (One type, soul energy, is life energy--the others are not--even psi is only necessary to the body because we have to maintain a certain level of it to keep our energetic systems functioning properly, not because we use it as fuel).

It's the outside energy that is a "quick fix" with no substance, and trial and error in the vamp community have made this common knowledge by now.  There is a REASON that esoteric systems that involve taking outside energy in generally tell you to ground it after you are through with what you are doing.
My school of thought never uses outside energy at all--we build up our own energy generation ability instead.
You cannot convert one type to the other, that would be like trying to convert heat to electricity without benefit of machinery.  You can change the pattern, but you can't change the type.  So, psychic vampires who require life energy can ONLY get it from living things, or spirits which contain it.  Those who require psi can get it from animals, some plants, or public places where people have shed a great deal of it.
Earth energy, ambient energy, etc etc, all of those are nothing but a "temporary fix", to actively uncomfortable.  Particularly for born-psis, whose systems are more specialized.


--Winged Wolf
"I will stare at the sun until its light doesn't blind me, and I will walk into the fire, 'til its heat doesn't burn me, and I will feed the fire...."

Hey, Winged Wolf.

Interesting perspective on it. My personal backround is more occult than psi, though I seem to be able to mix the two. It did not occur to me that people could not tap the universal energy source. It is definately something that has to be devoloped, but as the source of the universe it is available to anyone. Well, thats my take on it, anyway. I have been lucky enough to develop some sort of internal system as well, and pretty much freely trade between types as needed.

Energy "dumps" into storage areas seem easy enough from any source. The only time it does not feel like "me" is when I have not "digested" it. Then it seems to work very well to pull in what I need, mix with mine for purpose and good measure, and create what is needed. With the people that have needed a little help, for one reason or another, it is easy enough to open up there own channels, and just guide their personal energy source. The only thing I have noticed, is people firmly rooted in the material and/or firmly not believing in a higher being (God, Bhudda, etc...) take a lot more work to open up there channel.

I have yet to ground anything. If it is more than I need/want, it goes to a storage area. It is also a continous supply, and can be plugged into with a little practice and maintenence.

I am really not being argumentative here, this discussion reminds me of the issues I found when researching the whole "energy" thing (psi, magick, ki, etc...). Not trying to offend ANYBODY here, to me the problem is most people think their system is the best, and the "only" system that is "worth while". After reading up on most of the non dark systems, to me the answer is in all of them. Almost every system has a great core to it, and the mechanics are generally very similiar across the board. I never really got started, until I figured out raw energy, how to source it, and moved up from there.

I use reiki, NEW, universal, and internal. Probably ki also, but that seems pretty close to NEW targeting life force. I live in the forest, so it is pretty abundant. The only time energy even hints at being down is if I do a LOT of work.

Good conversation. Keep it going.

Next time you encounter a vampire just smurf em.  First form a golden bubble around you.  Then turn the vampire blue and make him small like a little smurf.

Hello Aries
  I loved the smurf comment. The only reason psychic vampires can't draw from the sources everyone else uses is because they aren't trying. Energy is out there for everyone in digestable ways and any psi vamps can ask me and I will give them ways to connect. I can't see where a person doesn't study to use the energy properly there are many books out there that tell how to use it.
  If you start using energy in any other fashion you are not harmless nor are you good. You are taking something from a thinking being and affecting them.  Evil is not some big monster out there but is present in the little and big things we do in life. You set the tone for what energy you can and can't use by your actions. I am sure this is why psy vampires have to use someone elses good energy because they don't make the right choices where they have energy of their own.
  No parasites or any other excuses here just facts that if a person does that consciously to others they are wrong in what they are doing according to the universal laws of cause and effect. They are doing the cause and they will see the effect. The effect is what will be done to them because of the actions and reactions that they cause in the lives they affect.
  Nita

I'm sorry, but now you're just being ignorant.
Most psy-vamps are rather GOOD at energy working, and they have already tried your suggestions for taking energy from various other sources, and they have rejected them FOR A REASON:  Because they did not work.  Not because they could not acquire the energy, but because they could not USE it in the way they needed.  They could use it to fuel other abilities, but not themselves.

They are not stupid, they are not lying, and they are not ignorant of how to do it.
However you wish to explain that is up to you, but do not make the mistake of assuming that every single one of them is lying, or completely inept, just because YOU don't think that's the way it's "supposed" to be.

Your retort of "well, _I_ can do it" is pointless, because YOU are not a psy-vamp.  You don't use the energy you take for the same purposes.
Your superior, self-righteous attitude is highly misplaced.


--Winged Wolf
"I will stare at the sun until its light doesn't blind me, and I will walk into the fire, 'til its heat doesn't burn me, and I will feed the fire...."

My view is that these vampires are parasites or to describe them better THEIVES. So winged wolf if these people steal they should be punished, its as simple as that. Sympathy for these pathetic beings is unconceivable. End of story!!!!

Alchimiste

Yeah!  If they take that loaf of bread, WHACK off their hand!

Ok, now that we've heard from the Dark Side of the Force, anyone else have any comments?  :D


--Winged Wolf
"I will stare at the sun until its light doesn't blind me, and I will walk into the fire, 'til its heat doesn't burn me, and I will feed the fire...."

In my experience most physic vampires are not aware of what they are doing ,they only know that they feel better  after  interacting with others .Often but not always they are the old ,sick and I suspect the mentally ill even babies  will siphon from their mothers. Except in the case of  young children this exercise is futile as these people have holes in their auras and the energy leeks out  very quickly. Maybe this is the reason for the need to tape others  as any energy  gathered  from those around them and natural sources are easily depleted
Physic vampirism is a nuisance but  really off no threat  and the fact that it  is happing is very easy to spot  ,the source off the energy  is left feeling very tired I have found that  this also happens in crowded places goodness only knows how many are tapping you there.
I have found no harm in being another's source of energy as its very easily replaced, a afternoon nape a walk in nature ,meditation and RB method  are all very reliable and refreshing.
I am not dismissing the fact that some individuals  are very aware of what they are doing only suggesting that they are in the minority and that  the vast number of vampires are totally ignorant of their effect on others.

yoki

you know, for a long time now i have been hearing about people having "holes in their aura", but i don't understand how that would work. could someone please explain?

i think that there are different types of "psychic" vampires: some feed off emotional energy, some off life energy, some off psi energy, etc. i have never met a psychic vampire myself (well, maybe one) so i will say upfront that this is just theory and with NO experience being put into it, just logic. however, i have noticed that when other people are happy around me, after just a few minutes i become VERY happy and they ALL become sad, and then a few minutes later, they all become happy again (but not quite to the degree they were at before), and i loose most of my good mood (but i am still left happier than when it starts). that would be an emotional vampire right?

i have also been able to suck others peoples' chi from them when i tried to, or i have absorbed the energy that is permeated by large groups of people who are expending large amounts of energy. i have also been to a church where, both times i went, i left with very little energy. i had a headache and i went to a park both times to absorb some chi, which got rid of most of the headache but i was still drained.

and there is a certain person in the group of people who i play d&d with who has told me that he sucks up energy off of people who are in states of high emotions (and i know that i have left the gaming some nights with almost no energy). and then there is my best friend, who i taught how to use chi and how to absorb it. but i didn't tell him why he shouldn't keep absorbing all the time so by the time that he met someone who could tell him that he shouldn't absorb energy all the time, they had to TEACH him to stop. he didn't know how, eventhough i think it is a pretty basic skill to just know how to not absorb energy.

::sidenotes::
winged wolf: you said, "Different types of energy require different handling to achieve the same effects, though generally speaking they CAN all be used to achieve the same effects". thanks for saying that; i have been trying to put that thought into a good sentence (or two) for a while now.

but you said later that "You cannot convert one type to the other, that would be like trying to convert heat to electricity without benefit of machinery", but i have to disagree with you on this. i am able to convert chi to ki, chi to kundalini, and kundalini to what i call psi (mental energy) and more. i realize that most people probably can't do this, but that doesn't mean it is impossible, just hard to learn. and please realize that i am talking about converting energy, not just changing the flavour.

~kakkarot

Secret of Secrets

Hi Kakkarot
  Holes in the aura happen because people pierce holes in it trying to gather energy and weaken parts of it. It can be repaired readily and a lot of people don't know it when they feed off of others. I think that the ones that are conscious of it can change the energy that they can draw off of to something that isn't infringing upon another persons energy.
  Everyone can convert different types of energy once they know how. It is no problem to do so but some people are just lazy or uninformed. It is no congential defect but a learned behaviour when they know what they are doing.
  Nita

I've been looking for someone who could actually convert one type to another for a long time, but everytime one of them tries to demonstrate it for me, it turns out they're just causing one type to emulate the pattern of another type, and not actually changing the type.

As for ki, chi, and kundalini....I don't really know how to translate those into types I am familiar with, in fact, I thought they were all the same thing anyhow.  Just different languages.


--Winged Wolf
"I will stare at the sun until its light doesn't blind me, and I will walk into the fire, 'til its heat doesn't burn me, and I will feed the fire...."

Hello Winged Wolf
  I have found many books upon energy and how to use it. The information is out there and it is just knowing how to draw different energy types in for the persons use. Converting energy to the persons pattern is just that repatterning it so it is actually attuned to the person. If they can't absorb that then they aren't trying.
  Energy conversion from bad to good is mentioned in buddhist and other magical literature. The information is out there and all people have to do is look for it.
  Nita

quote:

---

Originally posted by Nita:
Hello Winged Wolf
  I have found many books upon energy and how to use it. The information is out there and it is just knowing how to draw different energy types in for the persons use. Converting energy to the persons pattern is just that repatterning it so it is actually attuned to the person. If they can't absorb that then they aren't trying.
  Energy conversion from bad to good is mentioned in buddhist and other magical literature. The information is out there and all people have to do is look for it.
  Nita

---

Though this wasn´t written to me it made me curious... is there methods to take someones (human or animal) bad, negative energy and turn it into positive and good energy and then return this to them? In other words helping them gather energy.

Wouldnt this be like a dream come true!!!

Love and light,
Wb

WATERBREATHING: yes there are methods to take a person's "bad" energy and make it "good". but it isn't a gathering method. just changing the "negative" aspect of a type of energy into its "positive" aspect. with some forms of energy, it doesn't help to much with anything, and i would also venture to guess that not all types of energy have more than one aspect to them.

unfortunately it would be more like a nightmare: having all that "filthy" energy so often? plus it sometimes takes effort to convert energy, especially large quantities of it. and it takes time, not always alot, but at least enough to be annoying if you are doing it constantly. plus, you don't get anything in return, not even a thank you, when they don't know you're doing it.

NITA: kay thanks.

WINGED WOLF: well, i am very certain that i am changing them from type to type. when i change one to another it is usually on a "permanent" basis, at least it is permanently changed until it gets used up: ie i don't have to "hold" it in the new form, and it doesn't change back on its own. plus it has all the same properties as the form it changed into AND it mixes with the energy i already have of that type. for instance, when i change kundalini into chi, i can feel that i have more chi and less kundalini, and over the next few days i feel more healthy (because with more chi comes more health) but i can't do the little things i can do with kundalini so easily or quickly (like getting a rush of energy up and down my spine that feels akin to an orgasm). the biggest exception to this is that i can't convert anything into ki because when i use ki i just burn off another form of energy to fuel the "fire", as it is usually described.

~kakkarot

Secret of Secrets

To first person:  pattern and type are not the same thing.  You cannot use outside energy types to "fuel" your body, only your psi/magickal work.  Saying that if people can't "they're just not trying hard enough" is incredibly ignorant.   Consider for a brief moment that you just MAY be wrong.  You're not a psychic vampire, and you have no need for any energy sources other than what you produce, so how can you possibly use your own experiences as a base for others?  Your faith bears absolutely no resemblence to the reality of others--open your mind and stop spouting dogma.

To the second person:  You have still failed to even attempt to define what the difference between "ki, chi, and kundalini" is.  As I said, as far as I am aware, they are all exactly the same thing, only the languages are different.
I'd like to see you try converting earth energy into soul energy, or something like that.


--Winged Wolf
"I will stare at the sun until its light doesn't blind me, and I will walk into the fire, 'til its heat doesn't burn me, and I will feed the fire...."

actually winged wolf i defined them all according to their cultures on a different thread a while ago. but the basic differences are:

ki: internal energy that can enhance physical abilties and do a few limited spiritual things.

chi: form of energy that flows through all living things bringing with it life, and even death. the life-flow of the universe.

kundalini: energy of the spine. can give you a good feeling and enlighten you (i don't know how, i just keep reading that it does). don't know of any practical uses of it.

(my version of) psi: mental energy. definately different from spiritual energy, but it seems that most people think that chi is psi. (ie. if you feel like you have to move your arm to do something, then it most likely isn't psi.)

magick: a form of energy that feels very manipulatable. haven't found much reading on the actual energy, just the different rituals that people use to use it. isn't natural to the mortal body, which is why people are always saying "Ground after energy work", because it messes with your spirit.

need more?

~kakkarot

Secret of Secrets

Hey, kakkarot.

I used to define magick as all energy types (old description: causing change in accordance with your will beyond explanation of modern sceince).

I would still like to hear someone comment about the grounding thing. I use kundalini, chi (I think), reiki, and Akasha. I have never felt the need to ground. If there is more energy than I need, I just send it to a storage area, or give it a mission. I (try anyway) to keep myself using only positive energies, so maybe that is why things don't mess with my spirit.

Winged Wolf

The energies sure do not feel the same (chi and kundalini). From experiences others have had with me doing energy work on them, I would say that Kundalini, chi, and Akasha can fuel the body. On more sensitive people I have (unintentionally) thrown there metabolism into high gear for a couple of days. (I use a lighter touch now).

A thought to all:

We all come from different belief systems, and we all (think we) have seen insurmountable evidence to back up our position(s). Explanation instead of provocation will make all of us wiser. I still think the key is we all put our individual pieces on the table, a more complete puzzle can be assembled.

Best to all

Psi energy is apparently produced by or associated with nervous system activity, and it can be used to do all of the above, depending on how you apply it.  It is light, static-like, tingly, and reactive.  The bulk of your energy field is made up of this energy.

Life energy is very heavy, almost solid-feeling, and may be slightly easier to use for healing or other things that involve amping up the body, but, like psi, can be used for anything, depending on how you apply it.

Most martial artists, because they are taught to draw energy from the center below their navel, use life energy.  The rest usually use psi energy.  Kundalini is PROBABLY life energy, but I'm not certain.  Chi is fictional, in the sense you describe it, because energy from outside does not normally flow through the body that way.  Most chi workers use psi or life.
Ki is usually life energy.

There are a wide variety of outside energy types used by magickians, in addition to one internal type, faith energy, which is apparently produced in the brain and dissipates rapidly--it may be ideal for probability alteration, but not everyone produces it (even those who have faith).

In any case, the energies you've described could very well all be the same type, just in varying densities and patterns, so I'm entirely unconvinced you can alter energies from one type to another.


--Winged Wolf
"I will stare at the sun until its light doesn't blind me, and I will walk into the fire, 'til its heat doesn't burn me, and I will feed the fire...."

Hey, Winged Wolf.

Thanks for the breakdown.

I will clarify what I am calling chi, or life energy, and maybe somebody can correct me, or at least give me their version. It is directly related to living things, or feels so. The abundance seems greater when I work it in the forest. Generally I intake it using the NEW full body circuit through my hands, feet, and skin/pores. Then loop it through, and down into the subnavel storage area. It is not Akasha (or not in the "pure" sense), as I have not been able to smoothly combine the intake of both at the same time. The qualities are different.

For a while now, my use of chi (or whatever) has been to fill storage areas, and/or feed chakras and stoke them once fired up. I guess, on looking at your description, what I am calling chi you call psi. And what I call Akasha resembles what you call life energy which would make sense. It is definately much more solid. I have yet to notice a connection between it and the amount of "life" around me. But then the connection is not to material life (well, directly anyway).

The "amping" of the body was a by product of healing given, combined with an energy body awakening. Generally I use Akasha (life force) to work with others. Everybody I have worked with is capable of generating (well channeling actually) their own, so it keeps my personal energy demands lower, and on more sensitive people they can learn how to do it themselves.

Thank you for the breakdown. With so many different systems out there, it helps to know what terms each group uses for a specific type of energy.

Take care

Hello Winged Wolf
  I think it is incredibly ignorant to say that people can't draw in other types of energy. Read Intitiation into Hermetics by Franz Bardon, Buddhist manuals etc. You were born with the energy of life and you can live off of chi or any of those energies. Energy is converted by changing the energy signature and can be used in any way.
  There is a tibetian buddhist house protection item that is linked to changing bad energy to good. Dozens of meditations do the same thing. No one has to be a psychic vampire and harm others. Anyone that does do this consciencely is harming themselves worse than others.
  I will give a whole reading list upon request if you still don't know the difference or how to change energy.
  Nita

but ides my belief system doesn't say anything about explaination, only provokation  :)  just kidding.

WINGED WOLF: don't tell me chi is fictional because i can and DO use it. it is the primary energy form that i work with and it has caused me enough trouble here in calgary (due to the lack of it) that you can't possibly prove to me that it doesn't exist.

next, i have studied the martial arts for half my life and have NEVER heard of any martial art using a "life" energy. the chinese martial arts usually use chi energy, which they secondly call life energy. and the japanese use ki which they secondly call something like internal power or spiritual energy. they almost always use the words chi and ki and then translate them "roughly" into life energy or something else that silly north americans can understand.

it would seem winged wolf that while you do know much, you don't know everything. you seem to be like a teenager who believes he knows everything and that he is always right just because he has only experienced certain things, but since he has experienced lots of them, he figures he has experienced everything. grow up and open your mind.

~kakkarot

Secret of Secrets

well, it seems as though you haven't read the previous post yet, so i guess i will apologize in advance.

I'm sorry for being so mean. but i don't like it when someone who i respect acts in the way you are acting. this is the reason i rebuked you. it is not easy for me to respect someone, and i don't respect a lot of people, but you are one of the few that i do respect, because you (usually) know what you are talking about and are normally mature in the way you deal with things, as well you exibit passion about the things you are interested in and that is something i value in people.

but you have insulted nita in an uncalled for manner, and have tried to deny the information that i have posted as being garbage when i am posting information that is found in cultures that have developed these ideas for hundreds or even thousands of years. this information is not my own, unless i specifically say it is my own experience. and i am far more prone to believe ideas that have been in use for more than ten times my life time and almost completely unchanged for much of it than i am to believe someone who has taken a heavy slant in his learning towards one method and how he sees the world through it when he is talking about things that have nothing to do with that method.

please understand that the names of the energies are merely used as a reference, but none-the-less the fact that they are different IS a significant truth that you have not experienced yet, so i feel that it is uncalled for when you claim that these things i have posted are incorrect or misinformed. these are not things that i have just gone and looked up over the past couple of days, but are things that i have been studying since i was 13 and i have learned how to tell the crap out there from the truth.

~kakkarot

Secret of Secrets

Lord have mercy...

Is not! Is so!  Is not!  Is so!!  You're ignorant!  No - You're ignorant!!!  

Neener-neener phthhh!

hushed voiceover:  let us observe now as the alpha female of the pack is confronted by this newcomer to her territory....  the one we have called winged wolf assumes a classic dominant posture.  Note how the intruder reflects this behavior back at the alpha female.  The interchange continues, the two circling each other as they mark their territory.  This is a classic stylized dance of enchroachment, threat, and retreat that we have dubbed "the dance of the dire wolf."  While there is no clear winner today, we are certain that there will be other confrontations, other battles for dominance to come.

This is Kristen for Scientific Geographic Frontiers... join us next time as we study the behaviors of the monkeys of Borneo.

You most likely could have found a more effective way to insult a therianthrope than accusing them of behaving like their phenotype.

As for ki, chi, and kundalini....the words ki and chi come from two different cultures.  Using both of them to refer to two different things is far more absurd than using the term life energy, or soul energy.  

You have STILL failed to define what sets these energies apart from other types, where they come from, and what properties they have.  Just because they "feel different" does not mean they are different types.  I never said chi was fictional, I said the idea that energy comes through you from the universe, and that's what chi is, is fictional.  It doesn't happen.  Your body doesn't draw energy from outside unless you do it deliberately.  People who say they are using chi are using life, psi, or some outside-derived energy that they drew in.  But most martial artists--by OBSERVATION--use life energy.
Observation being a hell of a lot more important than what they choose to call it.  There can be no communication if people refuse to hold up something and say "we call this 'substance x', what do you call it?"

You seem to be insisting on using your own labels (even though they are hopelessly cobbled together from different cultures, and are not distinct from each other in an objective sense), and won't entertain the idea that they could be the same thing that someone else calls by a different label.


--Winged Wolf
"I will stare at the sun until its light doesn't blind me, and I will walk into the fire, 'til its heat doesn't burn me, and I will feed the fire...."

Hello Winged Wolf
  You are not alpha anything. Anyone who is a alpha female doesn't have to state it everyone knows it! The next thing is you may have a fantasy and mental illness trip going on about being a Winged Wolf but you make a lot of mistakes in your methodology of energy.
  I really feel a lot of compassion for you because I know what you will have to pay in this lifetime for your mistakes. You should do some reading and try to learn something  besides thinking that because you can attack people without warning that you are a martial artist and great magician.
  Nita

Nita, you don't know enough about me, or my school of thought, to judge any "mistakes" I might make.  Your belief that your way is the "right" way is your most obvious downfall.
Nor have I ever claimed to be an alpha, really, that was Kristen's statement.
Besides, if you think the alpha does not need to declare it, you need to study behavioral psychology a lot more closely.  An alpha wolf continually declares his/her status.  As for therianthropy.....it's irrelevent, I simply made a passing comment based on that feeble attempt at an insult.

I am not a martial artist.  I know nothing about it, really.  I am not a magician of any sort.  I am a psion.
Anyone can attack people without warning.  In fact, if you really mean to take them out, it's best to attack without warning.
However, I'm not in the habit of making UNPROVOKED attacks.  And I'm well content with whatever consequences there will be for my actions, because I MEANT those actions.  (I do not, however, believe in the karma nonsense).

As for my "methodology of energy" having a lot of mistakes....I'm willing to bet beyond a shadow of a doubt that I can accomplish, with the system I was trained in, far more, far more quickly, than you can accomplish with yours.  Be glad to put it to the test anytime.
One of us would learn something.

And that's the whole point of it, isn't it.

--Winged Wolf
"I will stare at the sun until its light doesn't blind me, and I will walk into the fire, 'til its heat doesn't burn me, and I will feed the fire...."

To all.

My "labeling system" is generally meant for my own use, and what seems comfortable for me. No implication that everyone should use it, or that it is even correct, it is just functional.

I did not see much on this thread that should have been construed as provocation for most of it. I agree with and disagree with the perspectives presented here. I even learned a few things. I hope everyone else did also.

Personally I am done with this thread. Just about everyone here had good stuff to offer, but I personally have no need to get in a spitting match to determine who's way is the best. The best way for you is the one that works the best for you. If you don't figure it out this time, well, you will have the chance again.

Best to all

Hey, how's it goin everyone? I'm sort of new to this whole aura/OBE/astral world thing, which I find very interesting and informative, and I was browsing around for topics to learn about in the forum and I stumbled upon this one. Could someone please tell me what a psy-vamp is, exactly? From what I read it sounds like some people are unaware that they are psy-vamps and others are aware. The first impression I get is that they are like black holes for energy. I've been studying kung fu and I'm learning about the body's vital and subtle energies, such as chi (qi), and how to control them, so I thought this seems to tie in with qi. I often feel drained of energy when I'm in class in the morning, despite a good night's sleep, and this has been happening for about a year. Some mornings I can't get up or stay awake in class. I've tried dieting, exercise (kung fu and weight lifting), and a few other things. Nothing seems to work, and I wonder sometimes if I am a psy-vamp or if I know one. Is it possible to develop immunity to them? I agree from what I have read that they are NOT evil, but I think if we can learn how to immune ourselves from them (if it's even possible), maybe we can help them find another source of energy.

Get me my monacle! I want to look rich.

hello.  I'm a novice to the whole astral projection thing and related subjects. I'm curious about these psy-vamps because I get drained of energy a lot but I don't see it being consistent with any specific person's presence. I don't know what these so-called psychic vampires are. Could someone please explain this to me? thanks.

Get me my monacle! I want to look rich.

Ok then Winged Wolf And Kakkarot,

We all have our opinions and we are entitled to them;so without wishing to insult anyone in particular I'll forward an opinion for you to ponder and a method that you can both try.
I'll start with a sweeping statement that will probably get you both heated up but here we go.

All energy is the same!!!!!!!
It's just the frequency that gives it its particular flavour or name. So with this in mind I'll tell you how you can change one energy (or frequency) to another.

Winged wolf; you are no magicien as you have stated above, and Kakkarot you profess to be one and this excercise is very important for a magicien to learn.

High, evolutory magic in its purest form requires very little parafanalia or accessories as it is manipulated at this level by VISUALISATION & INTENTION and its by these two processes that one energy can easily be transformed to another. Your intention to change it WILL change it.
Please try this before you both bite my head off.

happy experimenting

Alchimiste

Let me explain a little further:

There are two main forms (or frequencies) of energy used by the body and by the magicien.

1: Earth energy or energy of the Divine Mother ( Isis, the Black Virgin, feminine in nature) that rises up in us. (8.0 on a Lecher Antenna)

2: Cosmic energy or energy of the Celestial Father (masculine in nature) that descends into us. (12.0 on a Lecher Antenna)


These two energies (in a healthy person) meet up and combine in the heart chakra.

In a normal healthy person these energies mix, circulate and do their own thing, but in the Magicien these two energies will combine and form any frequency the magicien so wishes whether consciously or unconsciously. ( you see, its how you feel it that dictates how your conscious mind interprets and names it)
The magicien can dictate the mix to raise or lower his conscience to work a particular frequency or type of energy.
These levels of conscience correspond to the different charkas:

1.   Center of security (root chakra)
2.   center of sensation
3.   center of power
4.   center of unconditional Love
5.   center of abundance
6.   center of the conscious observation
7.   center of cosmic consciousness (crown chakra)

To transform and manipulate energy to a higher level the Magicien must be able to vibrate at that level and it is only by raising his consciousness to that level that he/she will be able to do this.
It is much easier to transform higher energy to lower energy as we already exist at the lower vibrational levels (most unevolved people exist in the first three centers and stay there)
A magicien that exists in the heart center or above has the capacity to transform all energy to the level that he/she has attained and it is by INTENTION that this transformation of energy is made possible.

I hope this has clarified my above post. Any Q's please fire away!

Alchimiste

alchimeste: actually, i have never professed to be a magician. i don't use magic. i use chi, and ki, and am beginning to use psionics. and really, the energies i use are different. magical energies might be able to be thought of as one form of energy with different frequencies, i don't know since i don't use them, but chi and ki are definately two different things.

oh, and here winged wolf: http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1449 .  this is a thread where i gave fenris the descriptions of chi, kundalini, and ki based on the cultural beliefs of the cultures they come from. now i'm wondering if it is really likely that people who believe in such widely different descriptions of energy would be using the same energy. i highly doubt it. especially when you go even deeper into the cultures and figure out the many ways in which their individual energies helped to shape their culture or how their cultural habit helped them to find their specific form of energy.

~kakkarot

Secret of Secrets

Excuse me for noticing Kakkarot,
I've just read your last post to flying free bird and for a non magicien you certainly seem to give out a lot of so called magical advice, I remember back when you were talking about weather manipulation in a certain thread and Thats just two posts you've made ( I've not taken the liberty to read all your posts, interesting as they might be) I'm sure youve made many magical references and yes I'm afraid to tell you that you DO use magic even though you think not. Magic is not an energy it is a state of mind to manipulate energy so face it Kakkarot you are a magicien like it or not.
Take this as a complement, not an insult please.
The only difference between Chi and Ki is your intention, the way YOU feel it, the way YOU use it, the way YOU draw it in, as when you access it it is YOU that dictates its flavour, its frequency and in the end its name.Remember as one of this forums illustrious members Qui-Gon JInn would say in his tag "Your focus determines your reality"
Its a subtle thought!!!!!!
btw psionics is magic as well.

Alchimiste

first off, i do not define magic as just any old manipulation of the universe. i see magic as an energy (actually, i don't see the energy, i feel it). it has a very distinct "flavour" to it, so there is no mistake for me that i am not using it.

next, just because i don't practice and use magic, does not mean that i don't know anything about it. i have researched much, and when many people who seem to know what they are talking about all say the same things about magic and things relating to magic, then it is probably either true or close enough that i could believe it to be so. however, i don't recall ever getting into an argument with someone who shows a lot of knowledge about magic as to whether i am right about something regarding magic or if they are right.

and finally, psionics is not magic. it IS manipulating the universe, but then again, i can pick up my bag (with my hand) and move it and that is still manipulating the universe, right? is that then magic? if it were, then magic would become a catch phrase and would be heavily distorted from its original context. so to believe that EVERYTHING metaphysical is magic, is a true mis-statement. that would be like saying God's divine power is merely magic, or that reiki is magic, etc. and so far, the only people who i have found who define magic in this way are the ones who refuse to believe that there ARE indeed other forms of energy out there.

and if you could please refresh my memory, what was my last post to flying free bird? i'm not usually able to remember much about where and what i posted in these forums since most of my time is spent living in the so-called "real world", which i guess i'll just have to get used to  ;)

~kakkarot

Secret of Secrets

"and if you could please refresh my memory, what was my last post to flying free bird?" oh, wait... i found it!  :)

yeah. i find that many things that can be done with magic can also be done with chi, so i use chi in ways that might be considered similar to magic, but the biggest difference is that chi can't be used to say... cast a spell to get you a parking lot downtown. nope, you have to use magic for that one  :)  . chi can be used to create a shield however, since it is spiritual in nature, it is good to have to block out spiritual things.

plus, i play lots of dungeons and dragons (you should hear some of the stories about things i've done in that game), and lots of the ideas in that game can be, more or less, applied to real life situations. who'd of thought? :D

~kakkarot

Secret of Secrets

No one's going to agree, clearly. :D

The ONLY WAY you're going to resolve this is to get yourselves into a chatroom or something, and play show and tell.  You hold up an energy type, and you let the OTHER person tell you what THEY call it.  And you accept that.  Then you tell them what YOU call it.
By the end, each of you knows what the other is looking at, and what they call it.
Go on, I dare ya.


--Winged Wolf
"I will stare at the sun until its light doesn't blind me, and I will walk into the fire, 'til its heat doesn't burn me, and I will feed the fire...."

Hello Winged Wolf
  The reason why it is called so many different names is because there are that many different ways to access it. I suggest that you study some books. You will find some really thought provoking ones out there if you look.
  Alchimiste good description and  post. It also shows there is no reason to attach to a person and use their energy. Karma is something everyone can scoff at until they in retrospect look back upon their lives. It is a good subject to also readup upon. People are so into a lot of these subjects because of the Fantasy books and Hollywood subjects out upon the media. They should have to realize that doing wrong will continue you into a downspiral in life once the evil matures to the point where it occurs.
  Nita
Even the evil meet with good fortune as long as their evil has yet to mature. But when it's matured that's when they meet with evil. Even the Good meet with bad fortune as long as their good has yet to mature. But when it's matured that's when they meet with good fortune.
Dhammapada 9, Translated by Thannisaro Bhikku

I learned psionics from an actual mentor.  Not from a book.  Books are inferior when it comes to learning about energy-working.
I own over 3000 of them, myself.
I've read up on several occult systems, of course not all of them.  I'm not particularly interested in reading up on all of them.  I prefer real observation to relying on others' observations.

I'm not interested in how you ACCESS energy.  I'm interested in what TYPE you are using, because different types work better if you handle them differently.   The only way to be sure of type is to hold it up and let a person tell you what they call that TYPE.  Assuming they have perception developed enough to tell the difference.  Why is it you seem to have something against that notion?  Are you worried that someone else might perceive something more acutely and with more detail than you do?

I can look back upon my life, and see absolutely no evidence whatsoever to support the notion of karma.  Nothing.
If it's different for you, that's great--but don't assume I'm either lying or blind because it's not true for me.  That's the sort of nasty religious thinking that has led to warfare and torture throughout the history of this world--the assumption that your way is the right way, and if others don't see it, they're fools.

Nature does not recognize "good" or "evil".  Those are completely subjective things.  The Universe has no morality, it does not care what you do.  

Scary thought....you are FREE.  Very scary.  No one will stomp you if you misbehave--no grand force will smite you if you do wrong.  You have to rely on yourself to police your own actions simply because YOU believe it is right to do so.......
Very scary.
Amazing how people want to give up that responsibility--the ultimate freedom--in favor of a dogma that equates universal punishment with misbehavior.

By the way....if you really think that karma is about getting bad back when you do bad, you don't understand the actual concept of karma.  Just the modern newage one.




--Winged Wolf
"I will stare at the sun until its light doesn't blind me, and I will walk into the fire, 'til its heat doesn't burn me, and I will feed the fire...."

i dont think vampires are as bad as everyone makes out. i dont know any phy vampires but i am friends with a sang and he only feeds of people with their consent. he has a list of doners to supply him. i know that it is easier for a phy to feed without consent but i think most of them dont.

there is a list of rules fo the comunity which teach respect and honesty. i really dont believe phy vampires are the major cause of energy draining. there are a lot more non physical animals that are much worse.

#

Hello Everyone
  I suggest that you check out www.quinotar.org if you think they don't feed off of unwilling victims. I guess some people think that can rationalize things by claiming to be predators and it is OK to do this to others. They use psionics and all  sorts of methods to do it which are stated at the website.
  I guess the psionics and the thought of being a cool predator appeals to some people. I guess that is what has kept this going like it is a real energy problem instead of a selfish inhuman act.
  Nita

Winged Wolf I am not quite sure what you mean when you say that some people here don't understand the traditional concept of karma. You state that some people may only understand the new age concept of karma. Could you please state the difference as you see it. Particularly with reference to your idea that good and evil are meaningless. I'm not asking for an essay, just a paragraph or two. References to books are also acceptable.

Nope.  Because I find karma boring, and don't feel like doing your research FOR you.  I delved into all that 7 or 8 years ago.  Get yourself some REAL books--you know, written by people who are actually FROM that culture, and preferably ones that are old enough not to be contaminated by the Newage movement, and READ them.
Karma was never intended to be some sort of celestial punishment system where you get bad back if you do bad things.

As for House Quinotaur, I counter that with House Kheperu (http://www.kheperu.org).
There are a lot of houses, all with different philosophies.
I don't think that anyone intended to argue that SOME vampires are nasty, rude, and harmful.
The problem arises when you paint all people of a type with the same brush.


--Winged Wolf
"I will stare at the sun until its light doesn't blind me, and I will walk into the fire, 'til its heat doesn't burn me, and I will feed the fire...."

Hello Winged Wolf
  I want to mention that www.buddhanet.org is a good website for the original buddhist books which is where I learned my views on karma. Right action is still right action. It is not easy and all most of these people would have to do is study a few books on energy gathering. I don't paint people with the same brush nor am I inflexible. They paint themselves by their own actions. I have also never been a new ager.
  Nita

quote:

---

Originally posted by Nita:
Hello Everyone
  I suggest that you check out www.quinotar.

---

the link doesnt work what is it?

#

oops i cut off the .org.
is it worth looking at?

#

nita: like, winged wolf, i too cannot believe in such a thing as karma. if there were such a thing (getting in kind what you put out), then i would be living a VASTLY better life than i am now. and i don't mean better as in morally better, i mean better as in "higher standard of living" better. i've given a lot of myself to others through out my life, and i rarely got anything in return, but then again, i rarely expected anything in return. well, i didn't expect anything in return until a long while after i started giving of myself so much that it "hurt" to give. and still i got nothing. so i stopped giving so freely.

i could go on, but i'm sure no one wants to here a person whine.

winged wolf: unfortunately, i can't feel energy that isn't within a spacially close area. so i couldn't do that over a chat room. and there are others too who couldn't.

~kakkarot

Secret of Secrets

Kakkarot,
Don't get confused by the religious side of karma, its just a universal law that states every action creates a reaction. Whatever you do creates a cause - effect situation that is connected to you and that if you put out bad energy (ie do something bad) this energy will eventually come back to you in one form or another. The same for good things as well.
you quote: "then i would be living a VASTLY better life than i am now"
You must know that the wheel of karma as people like to call it, turns at its own speed so maybe you wont reap the benefits of your good deeds for many years or even until your next life if you go for the reincarnation thing.

There are ways to speed karma up as a form of purification but thats a whole different story.

Ciao
Alchimiste

alchimiste: psychologists have already proven that unless an action is rewarded or punished SOON after it is done, then the person doing it will not be encouraged to or discourage from doing it again. and if humans have already realized this, then surely the universe should know.   :P

or maybe, people hide behind the idea of karma because they don't want to take control of their life? sure it's easy to believe that doing good will get you good in return, and that might be the perfect way for some people to brain wash others into doing something: the promise of something good for doing something good. unfortunately, the christian religion has been harping on this very idea for one and a half millenia now, and it doesn't work. people have to do good because they want to, else there really is no reason to do good.

and finally, the reason you have given is a fallacy because it goes to say that the things that come about in your life are the result of previous things you have done, which both my and winged wolf's experiences have shown to be false. and not only ours, but also the corrupt governments, and the evil millionairres (spelling?), and all the other bad people who are getting such good things in life. and besides, it is also a fallacy to give reasons as to why random events happen in life. just like the celestine prophecy idea about "synchronosity".

and yes, i also realize that this entire argument can be thrown right back in my face with regards to my christian "beliefs", in case you were going to do that.  :)

~kakkarot

Secret of Secrets

Kakkarot--learning distance work isn't that difficult.  If you like, I'll teach you.  The phone lines make great carriers for energy, it's much easier to learn with an internet connection than trying to reach straight overland.


--Winged Wolf
"I will stare at the sun until its light doesn't blind me, and I will walk into the fire, 'til its heat doesn't burn me, and I will feed the fire...."

I give up,
I suppose the phrase "Your focus determnes your reality" is just too true.

btw. I'm not painting anyone with any paintbrush and I'm not making particular reference to you Winged Wolf (well maybe a little) but TAKE GREAT CARE when it comes to trusting ANYONE as regards connecting your energies or accepting anyones teachings over a phoneline or any communication medium for that matter.
It's better to refuse the keys to paradise 1000 times and discover things oneself slowly than accept once the invitation for fast learning and end up neck deep in the sh**.

As a friend of mine once said....."Go on, do it....it's your funeral"

Alchimiste

Fast learning?  Like, teaching someone how to make a psi-ball, that would be too fast, too?
It's not that difficult.  If someone's already capable of energy sensing and basic manipulation, they should be able to learn how to work at a distance relatively quickly.  
There's no way to make psionics training quick and easy, in general.  Some people may be able to charge their hand the first time they try it, others may take several days, even more than a week, to learn how to do it.
It all depends on the individual.  However, once a person has already learned several foundation skills, you can guage they are ready to move on to certain others.  
Yes, be careful who you trust, but if you are too paranoid to ever trust anyone, that's a problem by itself.
Has anyone said anything "bad" about me?  You may ask the others who have worked with me, and my students, if you like. ;)
And no, in spite of the conversations going on in this particular forum topic, I am not a psychic vampire.
If someone doesn't like the feel of my pattern, they won't show up to learn something I've offered to teach.
However, if I meant Kakkarot any harm, his pattern is already in his posts on the forum, and I wouldn't need to get him into a chat room to do whatever I liked to him.  Since I haven't, I think it's a safe bet I don't bear him any ill will.

You take a chance the moment you decide to communicate in a public forum.  I've yet to come across anyone with the skill (at least, who has chosen to exercise it) to completely avoid sending energy along with their posts on forums and mailing lists.  Some send more than others, but there is always a trace of the person there.  That is enough to give a skilled person a pattern-lock, and allow them to locate you psychically.  That is why there is no point in being too paranoid about having private conversations with energy workers online.  
Besides, I was only going to invite him to the public chat room for the Psion Guild--we have a practice room registered on the server for that purpose.


--Winged Wolf
"I will stare at the sun until its light doesn't blind me, and I will walk into the fire, 'til its heat doesn't burn me, and I will feed the fire...."

I always leaned towards the Alchemical learning process--single person slugging through books and "learning the Art the hard way".

The suffering, frustration, self-sacrifice, obsession, focus, etc [unless you are EXTREMELY gifted] is all part of the learning process.
If you don't KNOW yourself [and self-discovery, both the good and bad sides, is part of the process] BEFORE you achieve certain skills/powers, how will you KNOW you are doing the RIGHT thing and/or will not become corrupted?????

I am surprised to see so much conflict here, whoich points me in one direction--you [not all of you] haven't yet EVOLVED to a point where you realise that all "truths" [yours, his, her] are subjective/relative except One.....................................

Vendi, Vidi, Vici, Mucho denero.
[I came, I saw, I conquered, I got paid--my mercenary motto]

Hello Everyone
  I agree about the phone calls because I understand what Alchimiste is talking about on this matter. Now for energy patterns in the email and cleaning them off. A person should know as long as there are emotions in the message some will get through in the message. You pick this up when you read a message.
  A completely blank message attracts attention. The best way is to make it where the energy doesn't connect to you. It means you can see who plays games with others messages and take the appropiate measures.
  Nita

Well, it all depends on what you are trying to learn, and what your goal is.
If you goal is to understand yourself better--that is, self-improvement as an ultimate goal, then sure, you'd want to do it the "hard way".  

If you goal is to learn psionics or energy working, though, what is the sense in taking twice as long to reach it?
Are you too corrupt to own a knife?  A handgun?  An automobile?
They are tools.  Psi is another tool.  You COULD use your fist to punch someone in the face as easily as psi-blasting them.
If you can't trust yourself that far, you probably shouldn't be wandering around loose anyhow.

I feel I already know myself well enough that I don't need to spend time on "knowing myself".  It's just not interesting to me.  I prefer to turn my attention outward.  Everyone chooses what to spend their time on...we have a limited amount of time in this life, so we can't learn EVERYTHING.  Not this time around.

As for all truths being subjective, I wouldn't call them truths, is all..I would call them viewpoints, at best.
And the one that is true, of course, is the objective reality.  It's just  extremely unlikely anyone has even a vague line in on that.  It's the TRYING to learn about objective reality that is a goal in and of itself, to me. :)

It doesn't bother me that it's not possible.  

I'm not entirely sure what Nita means by "making sure the energy isn't connected to you" in a post.  Her post has a "hide me" pattern in it, making her harder to track, but it's a recognizeable quality--it's not a blank post, and it could still be used to track her, if someone really wanted to it.  It does make it more difficult.
I don't figure there is much point in making it a challenge.  But, I'm confident enough in my own defenses that I don't bother to mask or hide my posts.  If someone with enough skill to take me on uses them to find me, they would have been able to if I had masked them, anyhow.


--Winged Wolf
"I will stare at the sun until its light doesn't blind me, and I will walk into the fire, 'til its heat doesn't burn me, and I will feed the fire...."

:( I wish I were a psion, sounds cool.

Autocratic Totalitarian Dictator Supreme Lord Saint Kyle of the Squirrel I

btw, winged wolf. i would love to chat with you in your chat room, but my schedule is rather chaotic, so i will drop in every now and again, and i might see you. or if you want to specify a time that we could get together, i'll let you know if i can make it then or not.

~kakkarot

Secret of Secrets

I'm there from 3 PM to 10 PM most nights, sporadically at other times earlier and later.  I'm not that hard to catch in the room. :)
Let me know if you have trouble finding it.


--Winged Wolf
"I will stare at the sun until its light doesn't blind me, and I will walk into the fire, 'til its heat doesn't burn me, and I will feed the fire...."

"You know what is yours and what is not yours"
I dont know how to express how fundamental these words from NITA are. You have to be aware of when your thought is your own and when its not, when its your dream, and when its not. No way to defend yourself if you cant make the difference.
I applaud her straighforwardness and wisdom.

Mirador

Karma is as "real" as any "law of nature".
If you drop an anvil above your foot in earths gravity, and you don't move your foot, it's probably gonna hurt.
If you behave bad towards your fellow beings, it's very probable to hit back, one way or another
If you kill another person with evil intent, it's going to hit back on you, but if you on the other hand defend yourself and kill another person without anger and malice, my guess is (as well as anybodys guess, YES I know) it's probably won't haunt you (except for your sense of guilt perhaps).
It's all in the attitude of the person in charge of the action.

EVERYBODY knows in their heart what is somewhat "right" or "wrong". You don't even have to behave in an active fashion. Absence of appropriate action can be just as "bad". Let's say you encounter a situation where you could be of help, and didn't care. That in itself is "action" as well. It's a decision you made at that time. And that decision will also decide upon your future destiny and in the situations that will happen to you.

I get a little uneasy when people say they don't believe in karma and in the meantime spend much time developing their occult abilities (exchange "occult" for another definition of choice if you like). This COULD suggest an unbalance in their life, and in need of some perspective. I also sense a feeling of bitterness from some who perhaps feels that their freedom disappears because of karma. You still have your freedom - the freedom to choose between right and wrong. And that's what I feel life is all about sometimes...

Hi! I have red about the psy vampire here ,and found it very interestering,I have a question, could someone explain to me what kundalini yoga is,and the connection between psy vampire and kundaliniyoga?

white_eagle

Kundalini Yoga has excercises & techniques to help
one develop personal strength to face life challenge
and raise energy in the chakras. Psychic Vampires take energy from the chakras and/or aura.

I have been reading this post for some time now, seems to be a indepth deccusion about the types of energy, those who use it, and how its used. Granted i could never get as indepth about it as Winged, but i shall go ahead and apply what i know from experience. perhaps assist on a few untouched subjects. If nothing else give a different view point.

First the requirement of energy by a being whom by whaterver reason has a lack of, or inability to create enough. Is much like food everybody needs to maintain a healthy physical body. We are able to skip a meal here and there, but in time with enough skiped our bodys being to react to the lack of substance, and slowly shuts down. same applys to filling a requirment in the psychic energy sence. we are able to skip a meal here and there, and infact for quite a long while. more so then the day to day consumption of food substance. but just as well in time our aura's and emotinal energy degrades and shuts down.
Now apply this idea to the situation. those with high motabalizm use up energy quickly, hardly gain weight, and are always eating. Take this concept and apply it to the internal energys all of us use every day. even the simplest actions use more of this "pool" then others, and thus require an external source to replinish the loss. We can not produce enough energy for the amount used. Simply put it is burned to fast.
Point three. Retreving energy from sources. Can we eat rocks and subsatue it for a sandwich? same basicly applys to psychic sources. Mostly depending upon the energy burned it the source inwich it saught after to replinish it.

Personal experiences, Perhaps this will assist in your original topic.
Fast energy is driven from high emotions. Hate, Anger, Love, and all those common to sex magic. All are the most usefull and filling in my opinion. but for most of the time to gain those types of high emotions myself would make an effort to stimulate them. sadly stimulating intence anger and hate are by far simpler. Those who are unaware of there magical natures "spiritual awareness" are a danger to themselves, more to the point they don't understand what is being removed let alone how to protect themselves, or regain any losses. Even the few i have known who are aware, are only protected for the moment, or instant inwich they relize what is happening. but time weakens any wall. When sustained within the same home, or area with the person that is being taped for energy, over the course of even a week. the person commonly feels the effects. The limits at which i know to stop have been decovered by trial and error. the unfortnate mistake is reaching those limits, more over when it is someone you care a deal for. One instant to speek of , the person became ill and required medical attention. weakness,headachs,sick stomach, and sore joints are what ive noticed to be common when too much is too much. This applys to both aware and mundane. But we are all learning and though most of the time it is not intentional mistakes do happen.

I fear for what the future will hold with a child on the way, or atleast we hope. I must most assuredly watch over my own actions unlike my youthful days when i has little knowlage of what i was doing.
Perhaps some of this was intresting, or inlightning from anothers point of view. then again it could be entirely boring, all the same to me atleast i was able to talk to someone who understands my situation. Coming from a very closed minded group of people what i am is known to very few, and only those i trust with the information. I wish the best of life to every one here, and may you prosper in all that you do.

"Listen"

Something has been puzzling me about psy/astral vampires.
I have conversed with several psy/astral vampires on other websites. All of them claim to require psi (psychic) energy to fullfill their needs.
To which I respond by asking them why they cannot obtain their energy needs through other energy manipulation methods like reiki, pranayama, chi gong and kundalini yoga. Yet they continue to insisit that these are 'other' types of energy and that they MUST have psi.
I find their arguements both self-serving and contradictory.
I would appreciate comments, suggestions and/or personal experiences from anyone here.
Can prana, chi, ki, and kundalini be 'processed' into psi energy[?] Are astral/psi vampires Absolutely reliant Only on psi [?] Or are most of them just too lazy to do the required energy work and find it easier to steal/leach the energy of others[?]

arent there any psychic vampire hunters or professionals to call for this type of thing

This post is the first I'd ever heard of psychic vampires.  Very informative, but I still have some questions...
If a person were plagued by negs that drained too much energy, and knew enough about energy to steal it but not to get rid of the cause, would they be termed a psychic vampire?
Anyone deceased that has run out of their remaining etheric energy and wishes to stay becomes a vamp/neg.  If they stayed this way for a long time, then incarnated, is it possible this behavior pattern would continue?
For vamps that are simply 'born that way,' is there a common personality/ emotional trait that causes it?  Like a problem with the base chakra?

I've had to deal with a lot of stuff, and have heard a a lot of stories. However, Ive noticed that most energy draining occurs in a locale, a specific place, with boudaries. Whatever causes the effect cannot move beyond it. So it's up to you to become aware of it, and move out.

Mirador

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mirador

I've had to deal with a lot of stuff, and have heard a a lot of stories. However, Ive noticed that most energy draining occurs in a locale, a specific place, with boudaries. Whatever causes the effect cannot move beyond it. So it's up to you to become aware of it, and move out.

Mirador

---

You mean that the draining is in a certain area, or there's a certain radius around the person.

In other words, is it like a moving boundary around the person, or is it a set boundary, taht even the vampire can leave?

Moving out can end it but if the energy vampire is advanced, you may have to move to another state.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Risu no Kairu
You mean that the draining is in a certain area, or there's a certain radius around the person.

In other words, is it like a moving boundary around the person, or is it a set boundary, taht even the vampire can leave?

---

In my experience both are applicable, a location where someone spends a lot of time makes for an easy set up. Some might think they are being bothered via their computer or TV, another view to consider is that it is simply a place where they spend a lot of time and as such are easily located and the object and immediate area get overlayed by the perp sometimes giving strange efects.
From the person point of view once an access point has been established unless care is taken to clean the point it can be readily exploited by other passing energy seekers of all types.

quote:

---

Originally posted by MetalIce
Moving out can end it but if the energy vampire is advanced, you may have to move to another state.

---

Also it may be that some so called Psy Vamps or other bottom feeders in the new locale have picked up on the signature of the access point. To your point, point to point location does look to work with distance being no object, useful for finding the perps but also works for them as well :(

The good news is that most of them seem fairly low down on the food chain and if really dependant on these sources of energy this makes them even more vulnerable to defensive methods.

Since I have been attacked I traveled 70 miles away from my attacker and still it had no effect on me. I read that once corded you can reach them clear across the world. I haven't tried traveling farther then this so i'm not sure how far you can travel.

quote:

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Originally posted by CRIMINALMIND63

Since I have been attacked I traveled 70 miles away from my attacker and still it had no effect on me. I read that once corded you can reach them clear across the world.

---

I've moved 3000 miles away from mine and she still drains me. In this life I need to figure out how to break the connection so I don't have to be karmically bound to her.

quote:

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Originally posted by CRIMINALMIND63

I haven't tried traveling farther then this so i'm not sure how far you can travel.

---

Distance is not really seem relevant, I have worked in different places 4000/6000 miles apart and no difference. The point to point location seems relatively easy, I suspect that when one anticipates a person about to telephone may be an example of this. And distance does not look to hinder this due to the links being non relative to our physical space.

I am writing something about this for someone else but in short in my experience we initially tend to view using our physical terms of reference and also usefully we can respond using the same terms of reference. However with experience and practise the perception can become more abstract, some would mention other dimensions and so on. One effect is when working in the physical state from one location and interacting with another is they can seem to merge and the activity can suddenly be happening in your face rather than down a long cord and then switch back again as the physical mind plays with the perspective.
Has a certain entertainment value. :)

With your experiences you may well already had this or similar experiences with your own subjective viewpoint so appologies for maybe tramping over old ground.

Okay. I know this is a selfe defense forum but you guys seem to know more about psi vamps than the psi vamps themselves. I don't know if I am one and would like to know how to figure it out.

I do know that I suck energy out of people. Sometimes I pull so much energy that my body cannot physically hold it and shakes uncontrollably. I don't do this on purpose, but I do it all the time.

I can't even stand near people without taking their energy. They can't feel it leaving them, they only know that they get completely exhausted when I move away. I have no control over who I take it from, when, and how. I have tried to figure out how to give back the energy or get rid of the energy but it only increases the amount I take.

Does anyone know what I can do to control this and how I can teach the people around me to prevent me from invading?

I myself am a psychic vampire. If you want to know more about tehm I suggest you check out occultforums.com There's many of us there and its a great site about magic and other phenomena.

Read the rules FIRST. They don't suffer fools gladly.

Jessica.

quote:

---

Originally posted by picklehead

Okay. I know this is a selfe defense forum but you guys seem to know more about psi vamps than the psi vamps themselves. I don't know if I am one and would like to know how to figure it out.

I do know that I suck energy out of people. Sometimes I pull so much energy that my body cannot physically hold it and shakes uncontrollably. I don't do this on purpose, but I do it all the time.

I can't even stand near people without taking their energy. They can't feel it leaving them, they only know that they get completely exhausted when I move away. I have no control over who I take it from, when, and how. I have tried to figure out how to give back the energy or get rid of the energy but it only increases the amount I take.

Does anyone know what I can do to control this and how I can teach the people around me to prevent me from invading?

---

No actual message to speak of; just this:
******Raises eyebrow********
******Laughs Heartily*********
(Back to your regularly scheduled entertainment)

(^^ we laugh together [^])

hi all .winged wolf i would mot fee to bad obout what is been thrown at you and you others is this not a site where one shares love and compation and to disscuss and help those who mak mistakes,instea all i get on this page is judjemen and temrer be sure one always learns from mistakes to perfection, you all should appoligise to eachother and start helping each other.

picklehead: it seems that you are asking how you can control your energy, and for that i recommend robert's New Energy Ways (http://www.astralpulse.com/guides/new/new.htm). you can already feel it, which should be a big help, but when you learn how to manipulate it you'll start learning how to control it so that you can stop it from doing things on it's own.

in time, you might also be able to search deeper within yourself (if need be) and find out what it is about you that is causing it [:)].

good luck and sorry that i didn't reply earlier.

~kakkarot

Once a Psychic Vampire has been identified and has targeted you what are the best defences?

I have read one authors opinion that it is possible to draw your energy back down the 'cord' the individual has attached to you. But the likely hood of prevailing in such a tug-of-war with someone experienced with the process is slim.

Another defence is apparently to build up and rapidly release a big 'shockwave' of energy. But how could this possibly be beneficial when the person WANTS your energy?

I imagine that tactics involving breaking the individual concentration would only help for a brief period and only against a neophyte Vampire.

I would be interested to hear from anyone who has had experience with dealing with psychic vampires and has read of other methods. I know that Winged_Wolf could certainly add something here.

And also I have read conflicting views about how common conscious psychic vampirism is in society.

As individuals who work more with, and potentially have greater levels of personal energy are we as a subculture more at risk to such predators?

Best regards to all

David


Veni Vidi Vici