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During my first few attempts at OBE on the same night i got vibrations for the first time i remember rubbing my hands together, E.g one hand fisted the other cupping it and vica versa.

Only after a few seconds i realised i was lying flat, and my arms were by my sides!  So i had been using my astral body!

Not at all.  The astral plane, to my understanding, at least the one you typically visit while in "obe/AP" mode is a astral version of our world, but is created by thought.  So straight away it is subject to individual interpretation.

The big rule of thumb there seems to be "thought is action".  So the fact that you saw a train could just be someone elses memory of a time when there WAS a train there.  Or it could have been your own or someone elses dream just for fun.

Or on an even different level, it could have been placed there by a higher entity as some kind of lesson stage or exdperience for you.

The whole Astral experience is relative to thought and interpretation.

Hope that is understandable lol..

You gotta love it when things happen just when your not expecting them lol! Aah I'm so happy today XD
Today LD, Tomorrow who knows!

OK so i was only lucid for a very short period of time, but the dream in itself is worth note, even though its kinda boring. lol. I'll list as much of the dream as possible, and you can make of it what you will! YAY ME!

The earliest part of the dream i remember is reasonably near the beginning. I was at a house of a family i have known my whole life, as my mom went to school with their mom and we are friendly in that way. I also used to have cub scout meetings at the house when i was 8-10 years old. So i know it reasonably well.

The interesting thing about it was straight away i realised this dream was old. I'd had it before. Same place, same 'theme', just new characters filling some of the roles. I can't recall who 'played' the parts before, but in this version they were mostly work mates and some guy i saw on a TV ad. So straight away i was happy because i felt this was familiar and i was enjoying the repetition of a dream i already knew.

It starts off with me down the end of their driveway with the shell/frame a car. It seems real old, almost like a 'classic'. As if I'm remodeling or restoring it. I begin by laying down some floor boards (?) so i will have something to rest my "(name?)" motor on. The motor itself is apparently even OLDER still technologically, but it comes across as something the world has forgotten.

The dodgy guy from the TV ad explains to me that this "(name?)" engine has an eternal flame and never goes out, but its slow so nobody uses it anymore. And for my car it will only be used as a 'starter' engine. Once my vehicle reaches a certain speed, my secondary engine (which is no-where in sight) will kick in and then I'll have something to write home about (feels like a high-tech new engine that needs momentum, or a 'starter' force to initiate itself, as in it has no drive itself, but can multiply force exponentially?).

And we all feel really proud that we're about to make this revolutionary car from parts and ideas that the world has ignored or forgotten.

The dodgy TV guy, and another guy who just started at work are helping my drive some wedges along the frame to support my "(name?)" engine, and they are explaining as we go. We finally get some in, and they leave. At which point i suddenly realise i have NO IDEA about cars or mechanics and i need help.

I go inside the house, which is suddenly a HUGE warehouse, and is larger by 100x inside, than it could possibly be outside. (Doesn't seem odd at all in the dream XD).

I briefly tell the dodgy TV guy that I'm lost and he laughs and says "oh yeah, of course! I forgot you know nothing! I 'spose i better do it for you or your going to be here past dark!". At which point he leaves and is met at the Frame of my car by the new guy from work.

Then i realise its getting dark, and I'm going to miss the alarm (?)

It was at this point i was awoken at about 4am by my Dictaphone STOPPING. I realised i hadn't waken up in time so i woke up disappointed because it wasn't the alarm that had woken me, but the fact it had stopped. I seemed to have acknowledged it in my slumber, but become annoyed that i 'missed' it.

So i reached over and grabbed the little guy and pressed play to begin the recording on it, which is currently about 4 minutes of me talking to myself and encouraging myself to go back to sleep but remain lucid yada yada. But something told me "meh i don't need it, just go back to sleep". So i did.

I remember not dreaming for a LONG time after going back to sleep. Because i shifted back awake at about 7ish and decided to go back to sleep again, thinking "I really need to remember my dream, and re-start it so i can go lucid".

The next thing i remember, I'm back at the house. But there are a lot of people there, however neither my car nor the two guys from before are there anymore. A lot of stuff happens real fast, or at least too hard to remember. It involves me chasing or fighting some people as part of my training (ninja training?) and that I'm doing well enough to surprise people.

It finishes with my trying to squash these little Pokemon type things that go rock hard if you try to stomp them, but can only be killed by stomping them. Someone is trying to explain to me the special meaning behind this, and that i must wait until they are trying to attack me before attacking to catch them off guard.

Then someone arrives and says to stop playing around. So i thank the little turtle creatures for enduring my lame attempts to kill them, and they seem very happy that i tried.

Suddenly I'm outside again, where previously i was talking to the dodgy TV guy about not knowing anything about cars. There seem to be a lot of people around with no real importance, just watching me leave.
Then out of nowhere i feel a shift, and Neo from the matrix turns very suddenly from around the side of the house and stands in from of me.

At the same time i get the feeling he is also Wolverine from X-Men and someone else, but i also get the feeling he is none of those people, and all those feelings serve only to give me an impression of his status.

He approaches me in a very happy but "inspective" way, and seems pleased with my progress. He tells me he is glad to see the other "one" is coming along, and will show me a technique. His eyes suddenly seem a lot larger although they aren't. Its just... er... they became the 'focus' so it was easy to pay attention.

He quickly looked to his bottom right (my bottom left) and as he did the whole dream slanted in that direction. Pleased that i had understood, he disappeared.

Then it was time to go, and i got on my motorcycle with my brother (?) and a whole lot of other people climbed aboard their own vehicles and we filed out of the driveway and started on our way home.

STARTS TO GET LUCID HERE:

As we turn right, out of the driveway towards my house the whole dream scene 'shifts' to my bottom left (just as 'Neo' had done), and i think to myself "oh $h!t, i shouldn't do this while I'm riding its dangerous!". Because shifting the dream makes me swerve left on my bike. It happens AGAIN another few seconds down the road and i get nervous cos i can't control it.

Then i notice I'm coming up to a round about, and if i lose control there, it might be fatal. So i think to myself "if I'm lucid, i can stop the dream shifting AND make a sweet turn on the roundabout".

I feel myself timing the next shift, and just as i reach the roundabout i FOCUS on my bike, and it becomes instantly solid/clear. Its almost like... before it was in normal, and it suddenly became high definition?

Anyway, i felt incredible joy! I thought "YES! I'M lucid, TURN ON THE INDICATOR! UP THE ACCELERATION!"
As i turned out of the roundabout i was suddenly alone, as if when i became lucid everyone else disappeared. I got nervous about whether or not i was lucid, so i said "if I'm lucid, there will be a blue car in the next driveway".

Sure enough, as i pass some hedges, there is a blue car in front of a garage. Still un-satisfied i say "if I'm lucid, a car will pull up from that dead end and stop at the give way" Sure enough, a light brown car does just that.

When i pass the brown car, i suddenly feel TOO lucid, because i recognise everything so vividly as my street, and i become afraid that if i do anything weird, it will be in real life and I'll look dumb! Straight away i notice a parked truck in my way and i swerve to avoid it thinking "SEE! This is real i have no control!" And when i swerve, both my tires go flat and i struggle to stay in control while thinking "F*ing tires!

This MUST be real life, tires ALWAYS do this to me!!!"

At that point i lose control of lucidity because i went from thinking it is a dream, to thinking it was lucid, to thinking it was real and i was in trouble.

Then i pull into my driveway and instantly I'm walking (?). I get to the neighbours letterbox and see 3 CD's on the gravel. One is "Bad Boyz" (i think a copied movie i have downstairs? neighbour left it here). Another is "Vid clips". Again, the neighbours. I think "Trashy neighbours!" and suddenly i see the neighbour kid and i feel real bad, like I've been snapped out.

He asks what I'm doing and i say "Nothing, just waking up" And i do!

Sorry for the length of the dream but that's all i can remember! And i didn't want to forget any of it!

What do you guys think?

This is a link that may help you to clarify your somewhat obstinate position on OBE/AP being "a lie".  And it will further explain the point i was trying to make earlier about the difference between the two.

http://www.saltcube.com/out-of-body/chat-forum/viewTopic.jsp?t=lucid-versus-obe

This comes from a master thread of:

http://www.saltcube.com/obe-guide/

Hope this helps...

I wouldn't be so negative and dictatory Jay Dawg.

We're all here to share information and learn from each other.  Not disregard and flat line people.

It would seem the difference they are trying to make between AP/OBE and Lucid Dreaming is the control factor.  AP/OBE is considered a 'conscious' exit, whereby a person relaxes to a state permissive of exiting without having to go to sleep first, whereas a Lucid Dream is where you enter a dream either fully aware from the go, or attain a level of awareness at some later stage in the dream and take control.  WILDs take Lucid Dreaming a step closer to OBE and they may actually be the same thing depending on who's arguing the point.

But regardless of that, i wouldn't go around posting as if your the lord and master of all things astral.

"Get a clue guys"
"Get a grip guys"

Go easy Jay Dawg.

As i was reading through the message board i came across a post ( http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=19857 ) in which the user Faceless noted that he saw faces while 'noticing' what came up when he was observing the black of his eyelids as part of Franks' noticing exercise.

Tried it last night, very relaxing. After a while I saw a face and my eyes freaked out flying all over the place... this is gonna take some practice Smile
(Faceless)

So i noted my own experiences:

I haven't done this in a while, but typically when i focus on the back of my eyelids i start seeing faces after a while. Usually in greyscale, or at least what i could only describe as being... er... ethereal?  They aren't in colour. Usually a shiny Grey/white scale of colour that gives some surprising definition. Once or twice they have been a brown colour that's extremely close to a gold sheen.

I find i can focus on them, by bringing them into more of a priority, but if i make an 'alert' observation of them, that is to say i try too hard to focus on them, they go away.

They typically mouth words or make expressions, but that's about it.
(Guthwulf)

So far I have had one more comment from sk_nh:

just the other day on a ride back from a 2 day canoe trip i was basically doing the noticing exercise and i began seeing all kinds of faces and such. its happened many times before but this time they were clearer. like movies in gray scale. i saw a guy fly fishing on a river, people playing volleyball and of course numerous faces that pop up and then fade away. they were all very clear. i am curious as to why i see this kind of imagery sometimes and other times i don't see anything.

And finally, while just going over simple relaxations last night, i started watching the black of my eyelids just for fun.  I was very tired and didn't expect anything much, plus i had relaxation music playing which makes me very sleepy (exactly what i wanted a nice sleep).  But just before i nodded off i started seeing some very distinct images.  I can't now recall most of them, but one stuck clearly in my mind.

The first image to show up, and the only one i remembered, was of a small cube.  I looked 'closer' and it came into focus.  I realized it was a dice of some sort.  As soon as it became clear, the dice stood up on one of its corners and started stretching and getting taller and slimmer.  When it had about doubled in height, and halved in width, it split at the top and turned into an amazing dice butterfly!  It had the 'four' and 'three' dots on the top of its left and right wing, and the 'one' and 'two' on the underside.  The 'five' dots ran along the top of its body, and the 'six' ran along its underside.   It flapped away into oblivion, and heralded the start of more images which i cant recall.

So i thought i would turn my initial query into its own thread and see just what everyone else is coming across when they do Frank's exercise???

Any experiences are much appreciated..

I ha vent done this in a while, but typically when i focus on the back of my eyelids i start seeing faces after a while.  Usually in greyscale, or at least what i could only describe as being... er...  ethereal?

They aren't in colour.  Usually a shiny Grey/white scale of colour that gives some surprising definition.  Once or twice they have been a brown colour that's extremely close to a gold sheen.

I find i can focus on them, by bringing them into more of a priority, but if i make an 'alert' observation of them, that is to say i try too hard to focus on them, they go away.

They typically mouth words or make expressions, but that's about it.

I was just extremely curious to note you have had a similar experience...

Anyone else?