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I think I know what you're experiencing. I was there a few months ago. You say you're unable to clear your mind? Well before I was able to clear my mind, I couldn't get anything accomplished. From what it seems to me, thoughts lead to either falling asleep or staying fully awake. If you think to hard on something, you can't relax to the point to get everything else started up. If you just let your thoughts carry you along, you get lost in thoughts and then fall asleep. So the solution to this is not thinking about anything.

How do you not think about anything, you may be asking? Well, I read somewhere to concentrate only on breathing for 3-4 minutes. Once you can do that, you can focus your mind on breathing for as long as you want. The trick is in training your mind to stay silent for that long. Before I started practicing that I couldn't go more than 20-30 seconds without my mind wandering into another thought. If another thought comes into your mind, just push it off to the side and ignore it completely. Do this for every thought that comes up.

Once you can hold the thought of ONLY breathing for as long as you want, stop focusing on breathing and just focus on nothing. Ignore any thought that comes into the mind. This is what it means to hold the mind clear.

I don't know if they have it in Chile, but there is a game that children play here in the United States called "Connect-the-Dots". According to Wikipedia, its called "Une Los Puntos" in spanish. Maybe this can help you understand what I'm talking about if you don't already:  http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Une_los_puntos.

Anyways... I like to use the analogy of connect the dots. Imagine the dots as thoughts that might come up in your head when you are trying to clear your mind. Imagine the pencil or pen is your consciousness that connects the dots. As long as you don't draw on the paper, the dots cannot be connected, and there is no image. This is the same as what you need to do in your mind. Sometimes a random thought might come up in your mind, but as long as you don't focus your consciousness on it, it will just fade away and your mind, like the paper, will be blank.

I would say practice this before you do anything else... I made almost no progress until I was able to clear my mind fully. Although it is a little bit harder because of distractions, you can practice focusing on breath or nothing while waiting in lines, while traveling to places, or other times during the day when you normally aren't actively using your mind. This can get you more practice during the day during periods of time when you normally wouldn't be doing anything. If anyone else is reading this, I HIGHLY advise against doing this while driving, because driving requires your full concentration. This should be obvious.

You asked if it is it going to take long to do? Well honestly I've made nearly all of my meaningful progress in the last month after I learned how to clear my mind. Now... I don't claim to be able to experience them regularly, but I did have one last night, and last week. How long it takes depends on how much you want to do it. If you REALLY REALLY want to do it, and you spend a lot of time practicing, you could do it in a few weeks. Just don't practice too much because you can throw off your sleep cycle. About the magnetic thing that you mentioned... I've read a little about it, and I think it has some truth to it, but I don't think age will prevent you altogether from OBE's. Every time when I've been very sick for as far back as I can remember, I would get these strange feelings of having my body shrink to a microscopic size or grow to an unimaginable size. I started noticing this feeling during OBE practices. Once you start feeling this, you're on the right track. If you can't get past this, you might not be fully relaxed, or you might not have your mind fully clear.

As to asking questions, it's not annoying. Albert Einstein once said: "The important thing is to not stop asking questions". When we stop asking questions we become close minded and ignorant. Questions bring knowledge when they are answered, and knowledge is power.

Well, first off, your drawing was quite entertaining. But anyways... I've never actually felt any pain when trying to project. Are you sure its not numbing of your body that happens after 40 minutes? That's exactly when the numbing starts getting really strong for me. I could see how it might be "painful" when you first start doing it, but after a while it's not that big of a deal anymore. Once you get past the numbing, everything else starts... or at least that's how it is with me.

On a side note, your English isn't bad at all. Anyone could understand it, and that's the main point. Not trying to put anyone down here, but most adults in the United States can't even speak Spanish properly, let alone write it. Feel proud that you clearly got your message across in another language!

I had a cold a few weeks ago. It really messed things up for me. Not only does it interrupt meditation and sleep with coughing, but it also drains your energy. Once you get over it, hopefully you'll get it down.

Heard about it from reading about a band called "maudlin of the Well". They apparently used astral projection to bring back music with them. The song in the link that I posted below was claimed by them to have been composed entirely during astral projection. I really enjoyed a lot of their music, so I got interested in how they did it. At the time I was really into playing guitar and making music and I wanted to do the same.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PC7HBpSaxno

On a side note, I will mention that a good number of their songs have a death metal aspect to them. I was quite surprised when I was listening to one of their albums and started hearing random screaming and other stuff like that going on.

They reformed into a new band called Kayo Dot in 2003. Not sure if astral projection is still a major influence for them, but judging by how it sounds, I would guess that they still use astral projection to make music. Definitely cool stuff. They have their entire new album online at http://www.bluelambencydownward.com . Check it out to see what I'm talking about.

What makes you so sure what you experience here isn't a hallucination?  How do you define "hallucination"?

To answer SkepticBoy, No_leaf_clover has a point. Although other people can prove things experimentally, how can you prove that they or their experiments really exist? The mind is conditioned to equate object permanence with reality. Lets go to the topic of lucid dreaming, which is an experimentally proven real phenomenon.

Lets say you had developed the skill in lucid dreaming to the point where there was object permanence in your dreams because you willed it (this certainly is possible). Would this not qualify as reality?

If not, what is reality? Perceptions? These happen in dreams and astral projection. Existence of other people? How can you prove other people have consciousness like you?

Point here is, experimental techniques are limited in how you define reality. If reality is only what can be objectively experimentally proven... well then, you must not really have dreams... or a consciousness... these things are immaterial and cannot be quantifiably shown to exist.

(EDIT: I'm putting this here in case you try to make the point that every hardcore skeptic I know makes. Science can prove that we dream or that we are conscious, you say? Well, EEG's can prove WHEN you are conscious or dreaming, they cannot prove or show the intrinsic nature of what consciousness or dreams are. That is to say, someone CAN prove that you had a REM brain activity at 2:00 in the morning. Someone CANNOT prove that you had a dream about eating anchovy ice cream during that time. At least, this cannot be proven with modern technology or methods. And yet, we still acknowledge the existence of these things because it would be foolish and ignorant to dismiss them as false.)

If you think this is all just a load of babble, try out lucid dreaming. It is scientifically shown to exist. After lucid dreaming a few times, your whole viewpoint on what reality is will change, especially if you have highly vivid lucid dreams. They are indistinguishable from the "real world".

Things can exist despite lack of objective experimental proof. Example: Did other planets exist before we discovered them? Or did they suddenly appear into existence when we found out that other worlds beyond earth existed?

Maybe astral projection is merely something created solely in the mind. Maybe it's not. I haven't come to a conclusion just yet. However, instead of automatically assuming it is false, I am keeping an open mind on the issue until I see something that proves it one way or another.

Taking the view that something is false until proven (skepticism) is just as ignorant as taking the view that something is true until proven false (belief). Blind faith in skepticism is still blind faith.

There's 2 flashy things that I know of. There's one that covers my entire field of vision and usually has accompanied vibrations and one that is localized in one area of my field of view and does not have vibrations. The latter is also usually a bit brighter and seen, while the former is usually not "seen" per se... more like "perceived" in what feels like sight, but is not really.

The entire-field-of-view one happens when I start having vibrations. Honestly, it feels to me like a visual form of vibrations, while the "regular" vibrations are more tactile. The two types often happen in combination for me, but not always. Focusing on the pulsations seems to bring on "regular" vibrations for me.

The localized one seems to occur just before I hit REM sleep. I think its probably some sort of precursor to dreams. You're starting to form images, but they're not quite organized or detailed at all. The urge to black out and lose consciousness is usually quite strong just before REM sleep for me.

If you are experiencing the second one, that's probably what is happening. But honestly I can't really say; I can only use educated guesses when speculating upon the experiences and sensations of others.

After experimenting with trying to induce OBE this week, I've been trying to compare the sensations I get from my attempts to what is scientifically known about how sleep works. What I've seen so far is there seems to be a definite order to the sensations. It is as follows:

Begining of relaxation -> Slight Numbing. Vibrations occur. -> Feeling of my body becoming infinitesimally small and the room around me expanding. Sense of being disassociated from the body -> Numbing until complete body disassociation. Vibrations continue. -> REM/Projection

I noticed that it ALWAYS happens in this exact order for me. Seeing this I thought that maybe this has something to do with sleep phases and brain waves.

This is what the brain does when you sleep:

(Check this out if you don't quite understand what these terms mean: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-rapid_eye_movement_sleep)

Awake relaxation -> Stage 1. Normally causes wandering of thoughts, and relaxation of the body. -> Stage 2. Normally loss of consciousness begins here. Sleep Spindles and K-Complexes show up on EEG's. -> Stage 3. Deep sleep begins here. Delta waves show up on EEG's. -> Stage 2 again -> Stage 1 / REM

Is it possible that the two correspond like this? :

      AP                                 EEG/Scientific Understanding of Sleep

Numbing & Vibrations              Stage 2/Spindles
Begining of Disembodiment       Stage 3/Delta Wave
Numbing & Vibrations              Stage 2/Spindles
Projection                             REM Sleep


If that's the case, then could that mean that sleep spindles are the neural representation of vibrations, delta waves and stage 3 represent the beginning of disembodiment, and REM represents projecting (this part is quite obvious).

Something that would seem to support this is that later in the night you stop having stage 3 sleep. If you are already disembodied you would not need to do it again, so this would make sense.

I thought this was very interesting. I've always seen the study of sleep as the bridge between science and the supernatural, and from what I've seen, this seems to confirm it for me. What do you all think about this?

Also, if anyone has something that would refute or challenge anything I am saying here, please feel free to post it in here. I always like to see things from a different perspective and prove myself wrong if I can in order to see the truth. Links to websites with related material or research would also be greatly appreciated.

After experimenting with trying to induce OBE this week, I've been trying to compare the sensations I get from my attempts to what is scientifically known about how sleep works. What I've seen so far is there seems to be a definite order to the sensations. It is as follows:

Begining of relaxation -> Slight Numbing. Vibrations occur. -> Feeling of my body becoming infinitesimally small and the room around me expanding. Sense of being disassociated from the body -> Numbing until complete body disassociation. Vibrations continue. -> REM/Projection

I noticed that it ALWAYS happens in this exact order for me. Seeing this I thought that maybe this has something to do with sleep phases and brain waves.

This is what the brain does when you sleep:

(Check this out if you don't quite understand what these terms mean: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-rapid_eye_movement_sleep)

Awake relaxation -> Stage 1. Normally causes wandering of thoughts, and relaxation of the body. -> Stage 2. Normally loss of consciousness begins here. Sleep Spindles and K-Complexes show up on EEG's. -> Stage 3. Deep sleep begins here. Delta waves show up on EEG's. -> Stage 2 again -> Stage 1 / REM

Is it possible that the two correspond like this? :

      AP                                 EEG/Scientific Understanding of Sleep

Numbing & Vibrations              Stage 2/Spindles
Begining of Disembodiment       Stage 3/Delta Wave
Numbing & Vibrations              Stage 2/Spindles
Projection                             REM Sleep


If that's the case, then could that mean that sleep spindles are the neural representation of vibrations, delta waves and stage 3 represent the beginning of disembodiment, and REM represents projecting (this part is quite obvious).

Something that would seem to support this is that later in the night you stop having stage 3 sleep. If you are already disembodied you would not need to do it again, so this would make sense.

I thought this was very interesting. I've always seen the study of sleep as the bridge between science and the supernatural, and from what I've seen this seems to confirm it for me. What do you all think about this?

Also, if anyone has something that would refute or challenge anything I am saying here, please feel free to post in here. I always like to see things from a different perspective and prove myself wrong if I can in order to see the truth. Links to websites with related material or research would also be greatly appreciated.

I had what seemed to be my first OBE a few days ago. Had all the typical body exit sensations. But then suddenly I found myself in what felt EXACTLY like a lucid dream, which I've had several times before. Additionally, this happened just as I slipped into REM sleep from what I could feel. From what I've read the steps for achieving wake induced lucid dreaming (WILD) and astral projection are the same, minus the body exit part for OBE. Are WILD's and OBE's essentially the same thing?

Anyone read this? I think that this is the only source of info that I've had tangible success from. I would highly recommend it. 

I've never achieved OBE yet, but last night I finally felt vibrations and a spinning sensation. The spinning became very intense and I knew what was about to happen, so I didn't resist it. After about what seemed like about 10 seconds, there was a sound like someone screaming. It was the most horrible and disturbing screaming I can possibly imagine. I decided to persist through the vibrations and spinning so that I could OBE, but after a minute or so, the screaming became too intense for me to handle, so I stopped. I've read about hissing, popping, and other weird sound while in vibrations, but has anyone ever experienced screaming like this???

Over the last few weeks I have managed to become lucid in dreams. However, within a minute or two of becoming lucid I lose it and completely forget that I am in a dream, so I slip back out of lucidity. Anyone know how I can fix this?

Last night I had a dream that I was the co-pilot of an f-14 fighter jet. And a few nights ago I dreamed that I was a ghost flying inside a rather large mansion, and a few days before that, I dreamed that I was flying in air force one with my head sticking out one of the windows... some of them are rather odd.

I think they're fairly common for everyone from what I've read. As to whether or not it was an OBE, I cant say... don't have enough experience in that area lol.

Anyone ever heard of Vitamin b6 helping dream/OBE vividness? For the last few nights I've been experimenting with it (at safe levels of course). Sunday night is when I first used it. I had read that 75-130mg yielded best results in most people, so I took 100mg. That night, I could sleep for about the first 4 hours (11pm-3am) and then I could not sleep at all., until 7am. I felt restless, alert, and terrible. However, I did notice that the vividness of the dreams that I had during those 4 hours that I was asleep was much more than I usually have.

I took 25mg last night 4 hours before going to sleep (7pm). I was able to remain conscious all the way to a point that I've never reached in my OBE practices: My body was acting independently of my mind. I've had a slight cold for the last few days, and have been sniffling quite a bit. I could feel my body sniffling on its own as I was in this state, without my mind telling it too. Additionally, I felt like I was not breathing at times. When I checked to make sure that I was (don't want to die yet! lol), I dropped out of this state. I stayed in this state for hours, but was not able to achieve an OBE. I did not feel any vibrations, but I did hear random sounds every now and then that were coming from inside my mind. Eventually, after about 5 hours of no progress, and feeling like I hadn't slept, I decided to give up and fall asleep unconsciously. It took longer than normal to fall asleep because I had the same restless feelings that I did Sunday night, though at a much lesser magnitude. This morning when I woke up, I felt as if I had very little sleep last night.

I feel as if I'm either taking the wrong dosage of Vitamin b6, or taking it at the wrong time, seeing as how it seems to be acting like a stimulant that is preventing me from sleeping normally. It does seem to help, since I've never had that sort of experience before, but I don't want to destroy my sleep cycle or schoolwork because of it. Any ideas/suggestions/comments?

Just curious... how intense are the "vibrations"? I think I felt it today, but it was pretty weak. To put it in more quantitative terms, my normal heart beat was a lot more noticeable than the vibrating feeling I felt.

I'm fairly new to this... so i have a few questions ... I would really appreciate it if someone could answer my questions. Let me describe the situation I had today and yesterday before I list the questions:

For the last few days, I've been attempting to have an OBE. Yesterday afternoon, I managed to remain conscious until I reached REM sleep. However I was still had auditory and tactile perception (could hear the air conditioning and my computer fan, and could feel my eyes moving uncontrollably). I began to feel a tingling sensation and a rush of energy over my whole body. I realized I was coming closer to having an OBE, which caused me to become extremely nervous. My heart then began beating rapidly out of nervousness which woke me up. I felt slightly dizzy after I woke up.

This afternoon, I attempted the same thing.

My first attempt I managed to hold onto my consciousness through the entire hypnagogic imagery. After a few minutes, the imagery disappeared and I felt as if I was fully awake, and just lying in my bed. I was just getting ready to open my eyes and look at the clock when the muscles in my neck went limp. My head drooped over to the side and my eyes started twitching, indicating I was in REM sleep. Once again, I was still fully able to perceive auditory and tactile sensory. After what seemed like 30 seconds I felt a rush of energy and tingling. Once again, my nervousness and my rapidly beating heart brought me out of this state. I was able to re-enter REM a few seconds after that, but it lasted only a moment. Immediately after that I decided to get out of bed and check something up on an IM that I received while I was asleep. These events happened in a period of about 25 minutes.

While I was at my computer, I still felt as if I was asleep.

After about 10 minutes at my computer I decided to make another attempt. On my second attempt I reached REM much quicker than on the first attempt. Just like in the last two attempts, I had full sensory awareness through the whole event. This time however, I was able to prolong REM without waking up. The energy and tingling feelings came and went every 15 seconds or so. After a few minutes, I noticed that I no longer had any normal feeling of my arms or hands. They felt as if they weren't part of my body, but were still there. What was odd, was that I felt as if my right hand were on the side of my body, when in fact I had both my hands on my stomach. This annoyed me greatly, because I knew that was not where it belonged. I focused on having my right hand in the correct location. After a few seconds of concentrating, it felt like it snapped into place over my stomach. The energy I was feeling seemed most concentrated on my hands. I started trying to focus on building up the energy more. The more I focused on it, the more it built up. Eventually I got to a point where I wanted to see if I could lift up my disembodied hands. I started lifting my hands, but could not tell if it was my astral hands or my physical hands that were moving. My hands felt cool, as if I had dipped them into water. I came out of REM sleep immediately after this and looked at my hands, which were still on my stomach. For some reason I think I was actually lifting my physical hands, which caused me to wake up.

Ok, now that you've read my rather in depth story, here are the questions:

1. Does this sound more like sleep paralysis than the beginning of an OBE?
2. If it sounds more like sleep paralysis, how can I prevent myself from having sleep paralysis instead of an OBE?
3. Is it normal to still be able to have physical sensory perception of things around me before an OBE?
4. Does anyone else reading this see anything similar to what they've experienced?
5. Does anyone have any suggestions for getting my astral body out of my physical body, without moving my physical body?