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Grooovy, now that I know I'm getting somewhere, I won't give up again heheheh or roll over and fall asleep[|)].

Thanks guys!

WHOO HOO![8D]

It took me around an hour to get to that point. Does the proccess speed up, slow down, or move about the same? Or does that depend entirely on how 'in control' of your mindset you are?

I tried the recorder awhile back, then listened to it the next morning after trying it. That was the most hilarious thing I have ever listened to in my life! I hate the sound of my voice on recordings in general but listening to myself murmer and mumble and the occasssional snort was just too much! <giggles> I never did discover what it was I had said! At least I can read the badly spelled typed notes..

If you actually use such devices in waking life, don't worry too much about it. I often see glimpses of such scenes. Sometimes it's simply an IM window, or a download window. Just a glimpse at whatever it is I'm working with. I'm on a computer constantly so waking up during the night and remembering only a vivid picture of a computer screen is common. One night I recall having an IM conversation with Nitetravler. I had no idea who this person was until I remember I had seen the name from this forum. There was no reason I could fathom that his name should be the one to appear as we do not converse beyond the occassional thread.
Nitetraveler, if your interested in what the converation was, I recall you simply typed Hello and goodluck. LOL That was the extent of the IM.

I won't be so bold as to brush off possible meaning from your dream. This is simply my opinion from my perspective. Maybe there's something about the memory port you were thinking about at the time?
As I drift to and from light sleep I find my drifting thoughts taking a visual form; sometimes in such detail as to make me beleive I had actually been dreaming when the "dream" had consisted only of a single or multiple unrelated images whose only purpose were to serve as a visual "inner dialog". I hope you find some use from this.

quote:Originally posted by gothpyre

I wrote this and I want to know what everyone thinks of this.  I would like to know if it is helpful and of any typos, errors or misinformation I have presented, but remember this is all based on my own personal experiences.  We all know that accounts all differ from person to person so just keep that in mind.  I know it is long but I hope you read it and if it helps even just one person then it was worth writing.  So here it is.


   This article was written by me Dante Cure to explain the perspective and observations made by me and my personal experiences in astral travel.  I explain here the exact way I project and all the details of it.  Remember this is my personal account and experiences differ from person to person so take that into account while reading this, and good luck.

   The most important thing to Remember when attempting to project is 2 things must be accomplished in order to project.  First, your body must be at least 90% relaxed or more, meaning your body must relax in order for you to forget your physical body so your astral can take over.   Second, your mind must be focused on one of 2 things, either on nothing or on one solitary thought to focus the mind away from the physical.  All stray thoughts must be silenced in order to focus the mind away from the physical body. Third is not a must but it helps and makes a conscience exit possible, it is easier to project if the mind is awake and the body is asleep allowing the mind to move from the physical body to the astral counter part without a break in consciences.
   
   One of the first things I am going to explain is a very important part of projecting and it was one of many reasons that so many people fail to project.  When attempting to project it is important not to judge anything that happens from the point you lay down to the point of separation and beyond.  With that in mind remember when we judge things, it is our ego, and our ego keeps us from projecting.  The opposite of ego is lucid, and lucid is seeing something, anything for what it truly is without judgment of color, shape, size, or any other descriptive factor.  Just kind of sit back and watch everything that happens and you will project, and project for a longer period of time the more lucid you are.
   
   Next I will tell you exactly what I do when I project and I will be honest with you and leave out no detail.  I don't have a set way of projecting but I will describe some of the ways I go about it.  The first bit of honesty I am going to bestow upon you is I do at times, (and I don't condone it) smoke marijuana.  I know most people will tell you it is impossible to project or it will be a bad projection when you smoke, while that is possible it is not always so.  If you only smoke a small amount it tends to slow down your mental processing and you are more easily able to clear you mind.  For some people it does prevent projection but for other it does help.  It is a fact that shamans and many others considered to be in their time, holy men, of sorts would smoke marijuana to meditate or speak to god(s).  I only share this information to combat the misinformation you may have been exposed to you from people who are controlled by their egos. Most of the time when I do smoke I don't try to project at first but I wait till the buzz wears off and then my mind is so clear I normally try to project then.

   I have also used some other tools to help in projecting, but remember that tools are ok to use in the beginning but don't become too dependent on them.  Ear plugs help a lot when you are in a loud area and I have also found determining if the sounds I hear are external or from the separation process.
So, if you use ear plugs you know the sounds you hear are coming from you or the astral and eliminate some of the fear of projecting.  I also use something to cover my eyes so I can leave a dim light on without distracting me.  Having a light on is comforting but distracting so covering your eyes does help.  The last tool I will mention is brainwave and hemisync software or mp3s.  These programs are designed to alter brainwave activity and change the frequency of your brain using binary beats.  I will not go into detail of how this works. There are millions of articles explaining it, but I will say that by using these programs it can train your brain to more easily change your brainwaves than without it.

   I will now explain from beginning to end my projecting process. First, I lay down on my back. Second, I close my eyes. Third, I relax every part of my body, especially my face.  Fourth, I start taking slow deep breaths through my nose. Fifth, I move my eyes around in the darkness until they are comfortable.  Sixth, I move my attention to my breathing, or my heartbeat, or to the darkness behind my closed eyes or to a scene or an object, what ever I feel like at the time.  Seventh, by doing all of these things I find that my mind is already clear, if not I continue paying attention to one particular thing or nothing and stick with it. Eighth, I wait and observe what ever new feelings come my way, and just wait but do nothing else. I don't judge or try to figure anything out, I just go with it. Ninth, once I am at the stage where I start to feel disassociated with my body I remain calm relaxed and keep a clear mind for about 30 seconds.  After that everything stops all of a sudden and I feel I am floating or I feel I am in a different place than were I was projecting from.  That is my account in simplest details of my projection process.

   In the following paragraphs I will address important parts of the process in more details but not in order, but I will clear it all up in the end of this document.  I will start addressing fear in all its forms and what part it takes in projection.  Fear is caused by many factors; the most popular cause of fear is fear of the unknown.  For some reason fear of the unknown is buried in most of the populations psyche and has been for thousands of years.  It is not known why we fear the unknown, it could be imprinted by society over a period of time or it could just be an inborn trait.  The point is not why we fear the unknown but how to overcome this fear, but this fear is a big roadblock on the road to astral travel and must be overcome to visit the astral.  The reason we must overcome this fear is because the astral is unknown territory, and no amount of reading can prepare you for the real experience. So, you must discover it and overcome this fear by eliminating the unknown, thus becoming the known.

   Next I will go into more detail with the term lucid and ego.  I am sure most of you reading this have heard the word lucid and ego before but may not understand its meaning.  I will attempt to explain what lucid means, lucid is when something is seen, heard, smelled, tasted, felt, or sensed but is not evaluated to discover its meaning.  When something is seen lucidly you see that object for what it is, not what it was or could be, but its true form.  When we experience something we mostly evaluate it with our ego.  Our ego is all of our wants, needs, desires, dreams, and goals; basically who we are built up from birth to now.  Our need for labels is a product of our ego and when we label we lose sight of what is real, the astral is just as real as the physical but can only be viewed with a lucid outlook.  So, if our society is all driven by our egos, then that explains why the astral plain is so unknown and why we know so little about it.  We all wear masks of our ego built from birth; we are born lucid but lose it as we are taught to want and need material things and so starts the process of building our egos and destroying our lucidity.  This is yet another roadblock in the road to the astral.  All of this means to experience the astral we must be lucid, and the more lucid we are the longer we can stay in the astral (I will go into more detail a little later).

   Knowing what to expect before, during, and at the point of separation may help eliminate the unknown factor with projecting.  Let's start with sight, when I speak of seeing things I don't mean imagined or thought forms but I actually see these things behind my closed eyelids.  The most common things I may see when my mind quiets and gets closer to the border of mind awake body asleep is little flashes of color. The color could be one or many, sometimes the color flashes, swirls or makes shapes (geometric shapes are a popular occurrence for some reason, and not just with me). Other times I will see real pictures of people, places, pretty much anything. It has no rhyme, reason, or pattern that I have found yet, it just seems random.  Other times I will see nothing till separation, but 99% of the time the blackness takes on a 3d look as the first change if any I see.

   What I hear varies just as much as what I see.  Starting again with the most common occurrence, I hear buzzing like most others you hear about.  This buzzing sound is hard to describe but I will try my best, if you put a phone up to your ear and listen to it ring on vibration mode then imagine it coming from inside your head is the best way to describe it.  I also feel this but I will explain that in the next paragraph.  The other sounds I hear can range from anything to nothing, I know that's not very descriptive but I have heard so many different things while splitting, before and after.  One time I heard an old record playing a song from the 30's. Others times I have heard footsteps, voices, chains, rushing wind, screaming, and every other sound you could imagine and some others I have never heard before.  There is no limit to what you may hear but this may give you an idea of what to expect so your first time or first few times, you won't be so freaked out by strange sounds (this is why I use ear plugs so I know these sounds are from projection).

   I will now describe the feelings and sensations of the whole process as best as I can describe.  The first thing I want to touch on is what I mentioned before about the vibrations.  Too many people say they experience vibrations but never describe it very well but yet again I will give it my best shot.  These vibrations feel to me like my whole body is independent from everything else, and in this independence it shakes at a very high rate on the inside, like inside a shell.  I know that sounds very strange but if you experience it you would understand.  This is normally accompanied by a rushing feeling, like falling down a wind tunnel at an extreme rate of speed.  The description I gave gives this feeling no justice, it is more intense than anything I have ever experienced physically, so be prepared it may or may not happen but just keep this in mind.  Whether I go through the rushing feeling or not the next thing that happens is, I get a dual body feeling, meaning I feel two independent but connected bodies.  My physical body feels heavy, but my astral feels weightless.  The astral body feels to me like the physical body but what it would feel like if it were made of a body of condensed air into a form. Although this is hard if not impossible to imagine, for those who have felt this it is as familiar as our physical counterpart.

   Our other two senses taste and smell don't seem to have much if any part of the experience we call the astral.  While in the astral I do remember tasting something once but that's about it.  There is not much to say about these things because they are not present in any of the process of projecting personal.  I am not saying that you will not use these but I have not so I have nothing to tell you about it.  Just keep your nose open and maybe lick something in the astral and who knows.

   There is something I must mention and may be the scariest thing that will ever happen, or might not happen at all.  What I am talking about is for most of us when we first get out of our bodies we meet our inner most fear, or another shade so to speak of ourselves.  To explain this I will describe my experience with my shade.  The first time I left my body I saw what appeared to be a shadow, I was scared beyond belief by this and I am not sure why. I somehow discovered that this shadow was me; it was all of my fear, regret, anger, negativity in general that was deep within me.  This was my first battle, a self battle I had to overcome.  I did not let this keep me away, instead of running in fear which is what my first instinct was I tried to understand myself in all aspects good and bad, and in knowing this it disappeared and so did a great weight on my shoulders.  I discovered that by understanding all my own negativity I was set free to wander the astral without this weight; this wall.  You may have to combat yourself when you first leave your body consciencously and I just wanted to let you know that there is no reason to fear this shadow because it is you and you must come to terms with this or it will follow you till you deal with it, it won't just go away.  This may or may not happen but like I said before just be prepared.

   I hope what I have described here in this article helps and prepares you for the astral journey.  Remember, everything here is from my own personal perspective and experience, and may be similar or something the complete opposite. So, also keep that in mind. I hope this lengthy rant of mine sheds some light on the grand journey of astral travel and better prepares you for your new experiences.  In understanding ourselves we are better able to understand the world in all aspects.




                     Dante
                         Cure

Fixed a few basic typos I saw. Repeated words, missing commas and such. Not everything of course, my own grammer and spelling are too terrible to nit-pick. Excellent article BTW. I found it very insightful; your description of the shade in particular.

Note to self: Highlighter ink, while very effective under a blacklight, does not dry on keyboard keys...
I've found it's easier to simply pick the laptop up and plop it on my lap during the night. The laptop weighs very little and that action takes no more work than hunting for the kepyboard and verifying a connection. With the strong light from the screen I can see the Keys as well. This can work as long as I remember where the table is for the LT. I think I would notice if I dropped it three foot...

Phong, I like the idea of a coincidence journal. Is there anything more you can tell me about it? I rarely notice coincidences so maybe I could think of a varient for something I do notice that's out of the ordinary.

They do seem to get longer with every book. They may have changed their minds and decided to do two films for the fourth movie. I haven't checked any of the information on it for at least 5 months, I simply recall an interview with the director saying he was making  it in one film.

I don't mind if a film isn't exactly like a book, but there seemed to be so much info, crucial to the fourth books understanding, missing from the film. Maybe I'm wrong, maybe I'm just considering the FUN details crucial LOL. Is it just me, or does the film seem to go extremly fast? Zip Zam Zoom and it's over.

I can't beleive they left so much out of the third movie, then tacked on that broomstick scene on the end to try and make up for the lost points... How do they ever expect to fit the next book into such a small time frame?

I attempted some energy work last night and had some progress! I was able to be aware of falling asleep for a longer period of time than normal.

Of course this may have been due to the fact I was up two extra hours trying to set up a last minute system for recording dreams. Those who have read my previous posts know I'm adamant about recall and want to remember as much as possible. SO! After scribbling incoherent notes in the night and then trying to get on the pc every morning to record them, failed me. I stumbled upon a brilliant box of light bulbs! Discovering which bulb goes to which fixture, is the Key.

I have a Logitech cordless keyboard and mouse for which I've discovered no use. I also have a 3 yr old laptop which is getting outdated more with every month. My brainstorm; set up the laptop with the bare minimum required to use it as a dream journal in order to maximize speed. Set the LT up beside the bed at an angle and level I can see and reach easily by simply rolling over in bed. Next, program the computer to save on battery power and to hibernate at the touch of a key. Then program the keyboard with this same key.

If this were to work, all I have to do is roll over in bed, grab the keyboard, press the key to get the LT to "wake up" and then type in as much as I'm consciously able to using the keyboard. Hit the hibernate key, and roll back over in bed. No more backward chicken scratch.
Great huh? To bad I have to hit the hibernate key on the LT to wake it up because the keyboard connection is lost once it goes into hibernation. That in turn leads to fumbling for connection buttons to re-establish a link between the LT and Keyboard. If I ever figure that out, I'm set.

How does this tie in to this thread? Maybe, at long last I can stop messing with technical details and get down to business. What's the point of having an OBE and remembering it even, if your too sleepy to write it all down? My lazy solution, almost solve. Now if only I could keep that keyboard connection active...

And to get back on to the issue at hand, my own state of mind last night was that the OBE wasn't actully as easy as I would think it should be. That, in fact, it would possibly be the most terrible thing I've ever experienced instead of this dillusion I've set up in my mind that I'm gonna love it. And wouldn't you know, I actually saw a millimeter of progress. What do you think? Do I have a little reversed psychology at work here? Whatever the reason, I'll work with it some more and see what happens. Thanks for all the great advise. Good to know I'm not stumbling around in the dark alone I'll try not to step on anyones toes lol!

EDIT:
DATE: 06/06/04
UPDATE on project: "Dream Machine"
I gave the set up it's first test run last night. I've discovered if I'm awake enough to scribble a note, I'm awake enough to hit three buttons in sequence easily becuase the locations are easy to find.
While the other problems are now eliminated I have encountered a new problem. My typing is several times worse at 1:00AM. This is worsened by the fact I cannot see the cordless keyboard in the dark and can't even glimpse the keys after looking at a fully lit up LT screen (dialing down brightness not and option on LT model). Solution, locate light colored blacklight sensative ink or paint to coat the tops of the keys with (Neon highlighters perhaps?). The black lettering will show easily with the aid of the blacklight already in place.

Over all opinion thus far: Not bad, fix the key problem and I'm ready to go. Best idea I've had so far, and journaling may continue as usual. YAY!

You wouldn't happen to have any hints on how to focus out of the physical do you? I'm one of those people who can't sit still if they tried. So, naturally every single physical sensation is like a fly buzzing circles around my head. I let it annoy me and am not sure how to get past it. An itch that needs scratching, a twitching muscle, a nervous tik, too hot, too cold, oh the how the list rolls on! How do you ignore it all?

OK.
Maybe THAT'S where I've went wrong. I've been expecting an OBE to be some sort of exceptional thrilling and pleasant experience, or an instantaneous occurrence as was the case with my prior success. I was also pretty much asleep then anyway, I just happened to catch my self before going under.

So, in other words, if I can't learn how to catch myself on the verge of sleep (a shot in the dark), I simply need to get used to or ignore the feeling of having glass jabbed through my skin whenever I'm 'desensitizing' so that I can initiate the vibrations? It's sounding like that's what I need to do. For all I know the vibrations may occur naturally if I can get past the unpleasant apprehension that I'm having a stroke.

Feel free to straighten me out if I'm getting this wrong...I'd love to know I'm simply going about this the wrong way.

Just thinking about his is making my hands go numb AGH!

Black Box just brought a question to mind. What do the so called vibrations actually feel like? When ever I try to do energy work, all I get is this prickly sensation that compares only to that horrible sensation you get when your foot has fallen asleep.

quote:Originally posted by Nay

Hehehehehehe...[]

That was funny Manix!  oh..wait, I'm sorry if you didn't mean for it to be funny..[]

It kinda reminded me of some conversations I've had with myself while meditating [^]

Practice makes perfect comes to mind.

Nay

Yeah, that was my attempt at humour. I find it best to make light of ones own failures, otherwise, your back starts break from the load.

There's gotta be either something wrong with me or this "easy as you think it is" theory, cuase its not nearly as easy as I think should be, or else I wouldn't be representing the bottom rung of the latter.

<A conversation with Self>
<Me: Look! I think I see the next rung!>
<Self: Really? Where?>
<Me: It's RIGHT there you idiot. RIGHT THERE.>
<Self: No it isn't.>
<Me: Yes it IS. Are you blind?>
<Self: No.>
<Me: Then what's the problem?>
<Self: Your in my way.[xx(]>

It is easy for some. But's it's alot easier for some than it is others. For the others catagory (I fall into it) success varies. I must be on the FAR latter end becuase I've been trying for around 5 years and haven't had but one planned OBE. Even the unplanned ones are few and far between. But don't give up hope. I'm used to representing the end of any line no matter what the subject lol!

For me to live is:

...cruising on my bike without dumping it in the road[:I].
...going to my first bike rally hehehe.
...hanging out and enjoying a good laugh with a few good friends.
...staring in awe at yet another amazing sunset.
...finding that my car has not chosen today to be it's last! YAY!
...playing with my dog, Sandy.
...seeing my family actually enjoying each others company.
...racing along side the frieght trains on Raytheon Rd.
...watching a storm.
...painting, sculpting, and expressing myself thorugh art.
...seeing the first shocked expression when someone sees my art =).
...watching my aquariums.
...going out to a good sci-fi or horror movie.
...eating out.
...water skiing.
...deep sea fishing on the worst day of the year.
...spending 3 years in college and being told I'm in over my head.

and last but not least...
...surviving today long enough to get to tomarrow.

Your not missing the point at all, in fact I think you're closer to solving this that I am.
Asking God to eliminate them for me switched on a light bulb. The tornados are there for a reason, one I need to work out. "The Something Wicked This Way Comes," may simply be a warning. The 20 minute warning may emphasize this notion. As would the old friend (from the past) coming to warn us. My sister being there and referring to ghosts; things of the past coming back to haunt her and then warning me not to make the same mistake. The black and white figure (though a little 80's !!! ALSO past!!!) Crawling out of an old <~~~!!!!TV set. I'm seeing a theme here, putting it all together isn't going to be fun. Then there's the digging through junk that shouldn't be there because it was sold LAST week.
Then there's the tornado symbolism; the creature like tornado on the set, and the overwhelming threat on the horizon that I'm too cowardly to deal with. This is pointing somewhere and I think it's just too obvious to see! Dad saying he's hanging around a bit before running away...Hmmm Maybe the tornadoes aren't coming back, maybe they're are simply wanting the rest of the mystery solved. Thus I'm sub- consciously NEEDING the rest of the mystery solved and am creating the new tornado scenarios as a result. In other words, they represent something I have no control over that my sister instigated that bothers me on a sub conscious level, but they exist because I haven't solved the problem or even came close to pinpointing it.

There has to be an event that I simply can't remember that this whole mess ensued from and created a snowball effect. If that's the case; if I could remember the event and get past it, the rest of the related problems would start to disintegrate, hypothetically. Remember that event, possibly blocked from memory is not going to be easy to find.

It's not the dream in general that bothers me. It's the possibility I was wrong in the interpretation of the tornado symbol. The last few weeks have been sheer bliss. I can actually sleep through the night without waking up in a cold sweat. Something I haven't done in 5 years as least. But even if the interpretation was correct and they are still tied to my relationship with my sister. How do I get rid of them? It's starting to look like simply acknowledging them for what they are is not enough to disempower them completly. They are the only thing that ever stands in my way from simply enjoying a dream. Before I gathered enough courage to confront them I was afraid to even look at the sky in my dreams, for fear of seeing one. Even if there weren't any any sight, there would be if I looked at the sky. Now that I've had a taste of freedom, so to speak, going back to being paranoid is an unhappy notion. I need to fix this or find a way a deal with it.

Maybe I was only partially wrong about the origional interpretation. The tornados may indeed have something to do with my sister, but maybe I was too quick to connect their reasoning with the actual emotions between us. Maybe they represent something else about her. In the initial confrontation they said "We are here at no fualt of your own, but becuase of your sister." This is nerve racking, if they don't embody the malice I feel for her, then what could they represent?

Excellent Link Mystic Cloud!

One time I was drifting to sleep and suddenly heard somebody screaming. A single shriek, that sounded like it came from a woman. It was so sudden and real but it didn't sound like it was in my room or even in the house. It sounded like it came from across the street. I sat straight up in bed wide eyed as soon as I heard it. When I asked my parents about it, they said they heard nothing. Then I read Astral Dynamics, a year later. That had to be an astral noise of some sort, a very convincing one.

My connection is so slow I had to watch that poor kid bounce on the concrete in slow motion...frame by frame by frame. Oh...that hurts. Funny but painful LOL!

I'm not making light of your dream, but I couldn't help but be reminded of the only Grim Reaper dream I've had. I was actually battling another dream symbol, tornadoes, at the time and trying to find out their meaning. This was in a lucid dream, I see some tornadoes in the distance and I get ready to challenge them, to find out what they are. Then out of no where I see the grim reaper flying towards me, Sythe in hand. I'm startled and stare wide eyed at him as he aproaches. what could THIS mean? When he starts to pass me up, I grab his bony arm and ask him what up. He cocks his hooded head to the side and says I'm running from tornadoes you idiot! What does it look like I'm doing! I was rolling with laughter while I waited for the tornadoes to catch up. I guess he was in the wrong place at the wrong time hehehe.

[:I]thanks

Thanks! The bike is a Honda Goldwing, I forget the year. It's advertised to handle like a sports bike, and that's the truth. You can lay it down on it's side when rounding curves. I'd be too chicken to actually ride it though, I was just posing for a picture Leon wanted to take. My bike is much smaller, a little black Honda Shadow. Wish I had a picture of it =).

Right, I'll be brave.
Helmet Hair...

Me on dad's Bike...

Prom 2004