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901  Astral Chat / Welcome to Astral Chat! / Disillusioned Reality on: December 10, 2004, 08:07:09
Animals eat each other. I'm not saying that makes eating meat ok - actually, it probably makes it more savage. But, Sarah, has humanity ever had the plot in the first place?

Thank you so much for your posts. It's refreshing to hear that other people have the same concerns I do.
902  World Cultures, Traditions and Religions / Welcome to World Cultures, Traditions and Religions! / The Death of Robert Monroe on: December 10, 2004, 07:22:25
There's a significant amount of evidence which suggests a connection between dreams and illness. After all, according to the psychological model, when we are dreaming our awareness is 100 percent inward, so any uncontrolled imagery we see is the result of some bodily action. I'm reminded of a story I heard where a women goes into the basement in her dream, and pulls out a diseased fruit from her purse. Soon afterwards she was diagnosed with ovarian cancer. The basement represented the lower part of her body, the purse her feminity, the fruit her reproductive capabilities, etc.,

However, you really opened my eyes about something else:

Quote
Monroe's dogmatic claim that God does not require love is puzzling in view of his belief in love as the most important force in the universe.


You're absolutely right. Whatever your definition of God, be it the mindless substrate of reality or the collective human unconscious or something beyond comprehension - would it not need love? How could something exist in the universe and not need love? Doesn't everything that exists need love to survive, and doesn't everything that does not exist need love in order to exist?

I feel I'm close to understanding!
903  Astral Projection & Out of Body Experiences / Welcome to Astral Pulse Island! / Were is the picture? on: December 10, 2004, 05:46:33
Actually, Nagual, I've read every single post in the forum and the only example I've seen where someone visited another member of the forum was Tayesin seeing Adrian and Nita, and the meeting was not confirmed.

I hope that someday we'll have a confirmed meeting, though. Or was there one already and I just missed it?
904  Astral Projection & Out of Body Experiences / Welcome to Astral Pulse Island! / My first visit on: December 10, 2004, 05:14:56
This morning I left my computer on after recording a dream and went back to sleep. I had my desktop as the AP Island picture and was planning to use my computer screen as a portal. Well, I must say that it was a success!

I "phased," which I guess is the appropriate word. It was more like I softly snapped off of the confines of my physical body. I floated upwards and towards the glow of my computer screen. I reached my hands out to grab the inside edges of the screen like it was a window, and the frame vibrated and dissipated as my senses were overtaken by the warm moist air. I fell softly, touching my feet down into the water. They gently submerged and I could feel the cold and squishy sand beneath. I looked at the island and pushed out and flew across the water, towards the island a little bit and then veering parallel towards the left a little. Then I flew upwards towards the pyramid and landed about halfway up one of the faces. The Sun was to my left and the sky had gone dark orange.

I looked directly at the Sun, wondering what an astral sun looked like, unafraid that it would blind me. It darkened and retreated slowly over the horizon as I looked at it. As I noticed this, its energy was subdued and made an orb noise of self-constraint... I don't know quite how to describe it. Nonetheless, I wanted it be night. So I held my hand out and cooly pushed the Sun over the horizon as the stars began to show themselves. I felt a warm connection in my heart that was telling me the Sun was going to sleep and I wished it goodnight.

I didn't feel anyone's presence, save a few insects or birds. Perhaps they saw the sun setting and went to sleep? I felt bad that maybe I had scared them off or for imposing my dominion over the sky of the island. Was that improper etiquette? Oh well. Then someone startled me to my right. "What... who are you?" I said as I was retreating a little up the pyramid's edge.

"I am Narleece," he said calmy, looking somewhat amused. Just as I was thinking it, he held up his hand and said, "no I don't visit the Forum." He appeared to be wearing the robes of a monk, and glowed slightly against the sky in a teal-blue, but was no monk that I've ever seen. I felt a strong almost involuntary "blink" of my eyes and we were on the ground near the beach, and he started walking towards a group of people sitting around a campfire, motioning me to follow him. He brought me here. I had the feeling that these were people who also did no visit the forum, for they were way more advanced and probably treated the island as a forum in and of itself. I sat down on a log and was greeted warmly. Someone next to me offered me a beer and I gently refused saying no, I don't drink. Then I thought that was weird, so I said, "alcohol's supposed to impair your projection abilities, isn't it?" They laughed uproriously. Apparently I made a big funny, and I laughed with them. They continued what seemed to be their usual banter, and we shared a few more laughs, and I began to feel how special these people were.

I looked at the fire, and it seemed normal, if not more fluid. Then I looked at the people around me, trying to dedicate their images to memory. However, I feel that I drifted aimlessly into a dream during this process, as I let my imagination wander concerning who these people were. What else I remember after that is nonsensical, and I awoke shortly thereafter.
905  World Cultures, Traditions and Religions / Welcome to World Cultures, Traditions and Religions! / Trumpeter's Mission on: December 08, 2004, 21:46:27
I know what you mean. I was raised Catholic, went to Catholic school, was an altar boy, etc., so all of the confusion (read "paschal mystery") about the faith is ingrained into my subconscious :/

I heard one of Fr. Wingate's appearances on Coast to Coast AM, and he talk about how he first started having these visions as a young priest years ago. He said to God that he would need a more corporeal sign from him in order to take these visions seriously. I don't remember the details of the story, but out of no where he received a summons from the pope and a donation of money for the exact amount a plane ticket to get there. He was just a young, nobody priest at the time. The pope said to him, "you must proceed with the work God has planned for you," and encouraged him to keep the faith.

I find it all very deeply disturbing, especially knowing that priests are decidedly imperfect. I'll just have to "pray," and "strengthen my faith," whatever the hell that means. :/
906  World Cultures, Traditions and Religions / Welcome to World Cultures, Traditions and Religions! / Trumpeter's Mission on: December 08, 2004, 06:58:13
Father Wingate is a Catholic priest who appears to dabble in the art of astral projection on a regular basis. (Why do so many people think AP is a sin, I wonder?).

http://www.trumpetersmission.com

The site is mostly about the end times, however I made this post here in the general area because it also contains quite a bit on the afterlife in general.

So, what does everyone think of him?
907  Astral Projection & Out of Body Experiences / Welcome to Out of Body Experiences! / What does the Hall of Akashic records look like ? on: December 07, 2004, 09:20:51
Quote from: Caliban
What I am eager to find out is whether or not true knowledge could be attained and carried back to physical reality through visits to the Record.  Could one learn to play the guitar or command a knowledge of thermodynamics or mathematics or...  what have you?  That would be... interesting.


That's what I'm currently working on, and I'm convinced it's possible. However, I've reached a wall in my preparations :/ What should I learn? What information should I bring back? Perhaps I should start with something simple. But does that mean I am losing my "faith," which will compromise the experience? In principle, shouldn't it be the same as asking for something comparatively impossible?

Should I follow my interest? Well, my interests are in art, and, I must say, I have quite a vivid imagination, and beautiful and simple art forms enter my mind at will -> as if I was continuously accessing some grand repository. Concentration inhibits their reproduction, so the skills involved with producing the art are learned in the process of producing it.

So, to try and access the akasha for information other than art, I would have to concentrate on something else, and that would interfere with my "connection." Since I find art naturally appealling, I would have to reshape or divide my conscious attention to allow multiple streams. It's possible, although it may mean becoming schizophrenic.

Oh well, small price to pay for science.  Cool
908  Astral Projection & Out of Body Experiences / Welcome to Out of Body Experiences! / Finally did it! on: December 07, 2004, 08:59:45
Quote from: Caliban
Ive often wondered if there are levels of energetic vibration MORE stable than that of this physical reality we are born into.  Often I think of something and it manifests itself in my life.  Is there a level of reality where things are MORE concrete and stable?


Interesting thought! (and cool user name and signature Cool )

I would venture to say no. Our knowledge of this reality's stability is accelerating through empirical science everyday.

Also, my own metaphysical experiences verify this. When I have a particularly high energy astral experience, I sometimes "fall," either deliberately or mistakenly, and go through all of the energy sensations until a very observable "thump," which happens before I awake. This "thump" is quite abrupt, although painless, and before I open my eyes and realize I'm in the real world, I feel that I'm on the lowest point in the universe, the absolute ground - the first few times I thought I was in hell.

Imagine my supreme laughter at the irony when I realized I was in the real world!
909  Astral Projection & Out of Body Experiences / Welcome to Out of Body Experiences! / What does the Hall of Akashic records look like ? on: December 06, 2004, 01:24:03
I imagine the akashic records would look like a library just as easily as it could look like a computer terminal. What user interface do you prefer? Perhaps you prefer the most efficient interface, which is no interface. But then what would you be, but everything and therfore nothing?

In a lucid dream, I spun myself and flew upwards. I never liked the word "akashic record," because it is coarse mouthful. So I requested to appear in "The Library."

In a flash of light, I found myself in what was, to my subtle surprise, an ordinary community library. The carpet was a dull color and the air was crisp and dry from air conditioning. However, it was a library I had never seen before, and the archictecture was aesthetically pleasing if unremarkable. It looked solid and "real." I laughed at that thought, for this was supposed to be the library of reality. Why should it not look "real?"

I found a librarian, who was young and looked about as plain and attractive as the building. I stupidly asked for confirmation on where I was, "excuse me, is this the akashic record?" She eyed me curiously, wondering what I could be possibly doing there without knowing where I was, but then she knowingly nodded a smile, realizing I had a problem with the word. "You mean the Archives?"  "Yes," I said, thinking that that's such a more elegant word. "They're in the basement. I'll show you."

She led me down the hall towards a door leading down a small wooden spiralling staircase. We went down one floor and the walls were brick, old, and lined with torches. The ceilings were buttressed with wooden planks and there were cobwebs in only some of the corners. "Do you need any more help?" the librarian asked me. "No, thank you," I said. "I'm fine." She shut the door, and I was alone. The light was warm and all I could feel was wonder.

I walked into the first alcove of bookcases and found that there weren't actually books but, and this is very hard to describe, "ideas." I could say that they looked like crystal balls with images in them, but that would be grossly superficial. They were more like "access nodes," if one wanted to study the subject in detail. Many of them appeared to be on subjects I just did not understand, ideas that I could not possibly digest without some kind of reference in my real life. In a small "kids section," I found one of past and future Ninja Turtles episodes, but kept on looking for something more interesting. Then there was the Harry Potter series, especially the books which had not been written yet... ah, it was like a soft vibrant gem that had rained the imaginations of a million children. I put it aside because I felt it was better to simply wait. I realized that I had absolutely no reason to be there, and felt it better that I should return with an explicit purpose.

I have since been looking for an excplicit purpose. :/
910  Spiritual Evolution / Welcome to Spiritual Evolution! / Astral Projection and First Formless Jhana on: December 05, 2004, 09:31:56
Quote from: Leo Volont
... excluding Hinayana Buddhism which is a through back to old Roman Stoicism which was an indulgence of the leisured classes that isolated themselves from the World and sought their own peace even at the expense of everyone elses suffering.


Interesting that you describe Stoicism as an "indulgence." Stoicism was/is open to all classes of people,  for isn't the whole point not to indulge in feelings that cause discord with nature? Like Theravada Buddhism, isn't it possible that if everyone practiced Stoicism then the world would be self-enlightened?
911  Spiritual Evolution / Welcome to Spiritual Evolution! / Astral Projection and First Formless Jhana on: December 05, 2004, 06:57:30
I understand. Thank you very much!
912  Dreams / Welcome to Dreams! / The ‘Slowed Down’ Dream Sensation on: December 04, 2004, 21:16:55
More like what you call a "slowed down inertia," for I make the appropriate force to turn myself, it's just that momentum continues.

It's strange, my feet get a good plant in the ground (so they're not slipping) but the rest of my perception doesn't respect this, and I still have the feeling that I am moving [edit: and I continue to see myself moving]

I suppose it's like spinning until you get really dizzy, and you feel like you're still moving even though you're certain that you've stopped?

I find it incredibly frustrating when I'm becoming aware of the dream and trying to achieve lucidity, but my perception of the environment is such that I feel my pereptions are disabled.
913  Dreams / Welcome to Dreams! / Inertia problem on: December 04, 2004, 20:04:04
I have had the slowed-down experience, but also something which appears to be its opposite, which is a problem with inertia.

I would be running along a path and try to turn at a corner, except I'd just sort of keep on floating on my original vector and it takes a tremendous amount of effort not to lose control and be whipped around like a plastic bag.
914  Astral Chat / Welcome to Astral Chat! / James Randi - Why? on: December 04, 2004, 18:58:13
Quote
what tells you that randi would accept the the result of the test?


Because the applicant would have at least one contract lawyer present (preferably an entire firm) and bring the Randi Education Foundation to court in the case of a dispute. The contract does prevent the applicant from suing Randi for damages, but it does not prevent the applicant from challenging the awarding of the prize.

The most important rule, as stated in the criteria, is rule number one - that both parties explicitly agree on the precise and exact terms of the test. The most important term, I'd think, would be the agreement on who is considered an objective witness. In such a case, both parties may appear before a judge, who would either act as the witness or appoint a witness, in both cases the witness would be paid a fee by the applicant.

The applicant would already require an enormous amount of money, for rule 6 explicity states:

Quote
All expenses such as transportation, accommodation, materials, assistants, and/or all other costs for any persons or procedures incurred in pursuit of the reward, are the sole responsibility of the applicant. Neither the JREF nor JR will bear any of the costs.


So, people who have taken a vow of poverty are out. I don't see that as unfair because proving a paranormal event would have the possible outcome of moving all of humanity away from a dependence on money. Instead, they would be dependent on their own spirit and on the peaceful trust of one another.
915  Astral Chat / Welcome to Astral Chat! / James Randi - Why? on: December 04, 2004, 06:44:55
Even though Randi appears old and stubborn, he's done his homework. He has studied the exact methods people use to fool other people, and shows us how it's done. That's excellent. I want to know when I'm being fooled!

So, Randi isn't going to fool himself and think that he knows every method of fooling a person, so he's going to approach every paranormal phenomenon as another possibility that he's being fooled. And why not? Humans can be quite foolish, especially when they don't even know it.

I have studied the clauses in the contract and, from what I've heard of what's possible through OBE, there's no good reason why an exceptiionally advanced projector wouldn't or shouldn't win.

It would have to be a brave person. Someone who could stand the incredible press, attention, and religious following. Such a person would have to withstand the danger of being targeted by people who are afraid of such power, and the mass confusion of being labelled as an alien or, worse, the second coming. But such a person could be a leader and give hope to humanity and maybe, just maybe, usher in a new era of peace. There would be a renewed interest in science, knowledge of all kinds, and people would be understanding and rational towards one another. People want magic, creative power, and love - but what they need is a reason for believing they've got it.

The idea that experienced projectors aren't doing it because "it's wrong to work for money" is a load of garbage. Everyone knows that the news would spread to all corners of the world and people would feel hope and ask themselves "maybe I can learn to do the impossible?"
916  Spiritual Evolution / Welcome to Spiritual Evolution! / Astral Projection and First Formless Jhana on: December 04, 2004, 04:00:00
Fascinating article. I never knew about the Theravada form of Buddhism.

However, I'm interested to hear more from you about sloth. You describe the first formless Jhana as a state of "total relaxation." However, you mention later it is dangerous to become too comfortable because this can lead to one of the five hindrances (laziness).

What is sloth? The dictionary says "aversion to work or exertion." I don't mean to mince words, but isn't meditation towards out-of-body projection about letting the body enter a state of total relaxation? And is this not a state where we are averse to exerting ourselves?

Perhaps the dictionary is incomplete and it's more accurate to say that sloth is aversion to "good work," or "productive work." If that is the case, what is it about Jhana work that is good and productive?

Edit: That question was more directed at myself than you and others - I'm sorry if it sounded direct and insulting. I've just been questioning the usefulness of meditation to myself lately, because I've experienced such rapturous states - but who else has it helped, but me? What's so rapturous about it if I'm the only one experiencing it?
917  Astral Projection & Out of Body Experiences / Welcome to Out of Body Experiences! / Finally did it! on: December 04, 2004, 03:48:05
Quote from: markulous
I know dreams and I know lucid dreams.  This was NOTHING like either one.  It was an OBE.


I know precisely what you mean. I have had experiences identical to what you've described, and they've felt completely different from dreams and lucid dreams. Certainly, it is a wonderful experience, and congratulations!

However, like you, I don't see my body. Since we have never seen our bodies, how can we say that we've had an OBE... for how can we be out of body when we can't see where we left it? Is it because Astral Dynamics says so?
918  Astral Projection & Out of Body Experiences / Welcome to Out of Body Experiences! / Finally did it! on: December 04, 2004, 02:32:41
I don't mean to spoil the celebration, but...

If you didn't see your body, then you really weren't "out of body," were you?
919  Astral Projection & Out of Body Experiences / Welcome to Out of Body Experiences! / A different view on OBE/AP: an article. on: November 30, 2004, 04:12:21
Quote from: tombodenmann
Since when is a simulation more extensive then the thing simulated?


Quite often, actually.

Postmodernist philosophers have labelled this phenomenon "hyperreality." Some philosophers, like Jean Baudrillard, go so far as to claim that our original reality is gone and has been replaced with the hyperreality of modern commercialism, where everything has a sign-exchange value to something that isn't real.

Some examples of hyperreality from Wikipedia:
Quote

• a sports drink of a flavour that doesn't exist ("wild ice zest berry")
• a plastic Christmas tree that looks better than a real Christmas tree ever could
• a magazine photo of a model that has been touched up with a computer
• almost all video games
• a well manicured garden (nature as hyperreal)
• Disney World and Las Vegas
• pornography ("sexier than sex itself")
• The stock market


All that's left, according to Baudrillard, are simulations and simulacra. Actually, this was the book that Neo used to store his data disks in the opening scene of The Matrix. (That was the joke -> it was a book being used to simulate a container for data. In doing so it was no longer a real book that contained data on its pages, but a hyperreal book that housed more varieties of data on optical disks.)

Edit: I'm convinced AP et al has something to do with humanity's tendency towards hyperreality. Lucid Dreamers often comment that their dreams are "more real than real," regardless of whether they believe it's the product of their imagination. I don't know quite how to describe this relationship, however - other than lucid dreaming can be skillfully used to simulate something you want to do in real life (giving a speech, etc.).

Interestingly, however, there is a group of posthumanists who believe that technological advancement is heading towards a "singularity," where artificial intelligence achieves our level of sentience and becomes, as Badrilliard would say, hyperreal human. We ourselves would also become hyperreal as our brains and biological systems are augmented with nanotechnology. Aided with nanotech, we would be able to communicate wirelessly in a virtual reality. The way these posthumanists describe virtual reality, you'd think they were talking about the astral plane. Ray Kurzweil seems to gather the most press about this prediction and has a very extensive website kurzweilai.net, along with a few books. My username in the forums over there is "Cyprian."

More Edit: If you want to get really gee-whiz on simulation being more extensive than the object simulated, check this out. That's a NASA gallery of carbon nanotube models. Scroll down to where they simulate proteins and neurons. They're intended to perform better than the object they're simulating.
920  Astral Projection & Out of Body Experiences / Welcome to Out of Body Experiences! / comprehanding infinity (how to do it) on: November 28, 2004, 08:58:15
Sorry to resurrect an old thread, but I was reading some very profound literature on the subject - particularly Baron d'Holbach's paper The System of Nature. He quotes Hobbes with this:

Quote
Hobbes in his Leviathan, says, "whatsoever we imagine is finite. Therefore there is no idea, or conception of any thing we call infinite. No man can have in his mind an image of infinite magnitude, nor conceive infinite swiftness, infinite time, infinite force, or infinite power. When we say any thing is infinite, we signify only, that we are not able to conceive the ends and bound of the thing named, having no conception of the thing, but of our own inability."


And Sherlock (not Holmes, I take it) with this:

Quote
Sherlock says, "the word infinite is only a negation, which signifies that which has neither end, nor limits, nor extent, and, consequently, that which has no positive and determinate nature, and is therefore nothing;" he adds, "that nothing but custom has caused this word to be adopted, which without that, would appear devoid of sense, and a contradiction."


These views go with my experiences of infinity. There are times when I felt infinite comfort - but it actually makes more sense to say that I felt the total absence of discomfort. Likewise, I've felt infinite sadness - but it's actually just better to say that I felt the complete absence of hope. If you were somehow able to experiencie the totality of the universe and your imagination, then you're experiencing the universe without limits. Infinity really is "a nothing."
921  Astral Projection & Out of Body Experiences / Welcome to Out of Body Experiences! / A different view on OBE/AP: an article. on: November 28, 2004, 07:29:51
Quote from: upstream
Interesting thread. Makes me really hungry for some definitions. ...


Using mathematical terminology (like "plane" and "dimension") to describe psychic phenomena is inherently confusing. Many people who subscribe to the externality of the astral also tend to believe that our consciousness is actually part of a "God" consciousness which has divided itself in order to experience life.

Then why not use the word "division?" Saying, "I went to the astral division," makes sense to either interpreter. The spiritualist recognizes a division of the God consciousness, and the materialist recognizes a division of the self-consciousness.

"Division" may sound boring, but it's a soberingly apt word for the nature of the experience. Does anyone agree?
922  The Astral Library / Welcome to Book Reviews! / Creating Your Reality on: November 26, 2004, 22:31:08
Sorry I posted in the wrong spot. There are so many forums here, I can't find the ones I need.  huh
923  The Astral Library / Welcome to Book Reviews! / Creating Your Reality on: November 26, 2004, 02:12:51
I'm not sure if any of you noticed, but Anne Varnes of Astral Voyage released her book online a few days ago.

I've read most of it, and it's extremely thoughtful and well-organized. Her description of the "planes" is especially clear, as I've never quite understood them before. More importantly, she's very specific about her philosophy of "necessary illusion." Chances are, you've had some of the same thoughts that she's had regarding the paradox of illusion and reality.
924  Astral Projection & Out of Body Experiences / Welcome to Out of Body Experiences! / Key to OOBE? on: November 23, 2004, 08:26:41
Whenever I wake up from an AP, I always find that my body is supremely comfortable and balanced. I always try to recreate that feeling of comfort, and have been successful on a couple of occasions (from complete wakefulness), however it's easier said than done.

Perhaps it would be easier with a TempurPedic(TM) mattress? Does anyone here have one? Wink
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