I watched it and it was pretty interesting. I know a little of the man and have skimmed his books but this documentary was pretty damning. There is no real doubt that he had turned into your typical cult leader/guru by the end, complete with sex slaves etc.
There was also not a shred of evidence for any Yaqui shamans being remotely involved in the kind of things Castaneda was talking about (i.e. conquering death and turning into pure energy etc). He appears to have culled most of his teachings from other sources and then rearranged them in a Mexican shaman style 'flavour'. Researchers did manage to track down the widow of the man who was probably the name behind 'don Juan' but she said that although Castaneda and her husband (who was a shaman) did indeed talk a lot, nothing concerning the kind of things in his books were talked about and also Castaneda would be pretty unlikely to be a shaman himself (as he later claimed) since shamans have to engage in long periods of fasting and abstinence from sex which she says Castaneda was unwilling to do as he liked his women!
Also his work is not representative of Yaqui or indeed any other Mexican shamanic practice.
Real shamanic practice is actually more concerned with more practical matters, like changing the weather for better harvests, and so on.
I suppose his hardened believers will always counter with the claim that his enemies have conspired against him to fabricate all the negative evidence, but even if you do accept this, the evidence is pretty solid that there was something fishy going on.
The wierd thing is, even if it is all made up, it is still amazing writing and many people have found genuine spiritual value in it. Mind you, if he has culled his work from countless esoteric works then maybe it is not suprising that there are some genuine spiritual truths in there.
Hey Gandalf,
What channel was this on? I missed it, but it sounds interesting!
It was on BBC 4.
Pretty tragic story really. In the end, the Yaqui tribe have ended up being screwed over by countless hippies over the years who have misinterpreted their culture, and 5 of Castenada's closest followers, 'the witches' are believed to have killed themselves.
The body of one of them has since been found in the desert.
Doug
I would have liked to have seen the programme - but I don't own a TV, so that's that then... :-)
I haven't read any of his work, but they are quite high on my "to purchase" list.
Sarah
I just checked telewest replay and it's on there. I'll watch it later tonight :).
Quote from: MisterJingo on January 30, 2007, 13:26:11
I just checked telewest replay and it's on there. I'll watch it later tonight :).
Oh bummer. Sometimes, NOT owning a TV is a downer... :x
Sarah
Quote from: Gandalf on January 30, 2007, 11:58:39
I watched it and it was pretty interesting. I know a little of the man and have skimmed his books but this documentary was pretty damning. There is no real doubt that he had turned into your typical cult leader/guru by the end, complete with sex slaves etc.
There was also not a shred of evidence for any Yaqui shamans being remotely involved in the kind of things Castaneda was talking about (i.e. conquering death and turning into pure energy etc). He appears to have culled most of his teachings from other sources and then rearranged them in a Mexican shaman style 'flavour'. Researchers did manage to track down the widow of the man who was probably the name behind 'don Juan' but she said that although Castaneda and her husband (who was a shaman) did indeed talk a lot, nothing concerning the kind of things in his books were talked about and also Castaneda would be pretty unlikely to be a shaman himself (as he later claimed) since shamans have to engage in long periods of fasting and abstinence from sex which she says Castaneda was unwilling to do as he liked his women!
Also his work is not representative of Yaqui or indeed any other Mexican shamanic practice.
Real shamanic practice is actually more concerned with more practical matters, like changing the weather for better harvests, and so on.
I suppose his hardened believers will always counter with the claim that his enemies have conspired against him to fabricate all the negative evidence, but even if you do accept this, the evidence is pretty solid that there was something fishy going on.
The wierd thing is, even if it is all made up, it is still amazing writing and many people have found genuine spiritual value in it. Mind you, if he has culled his work from countless esoteric works then maybe it is not suprising that there are some genuine spiritual truths in there.
I just watched it and it was pretty eye opening. I remember reading Castaneda's works when I was in my early teens and they did have somewhat of an impact on me, but as you said above, it seems most of it was creative writing with ideas and concepts stolen from various esoteric works.
Something I found myself thinking about towards the end of the program was how gullable people can be, and how easily people can be led when someone seems to offer them a path to something they desire (in this case spiritual truth). I've always been someone who reads others ideas but rather than submitting to them, I process them and utilise them if they resonate or prove useful.
There is no doubt he was an amazing writer, added to that he had a genuine knowledge of Mexican culture and shamanic practice. So all he had to do was graft in some esoteric concepts and practices from a variety of other sources and walaah! 'The art of dreaming' etc
I guess his work still has genuine value because many of the concepts are from other works and still have spiritual value. Its just that he has given then a Mexican 'flavour' as it were... hmm feeling hungry now.
Still feel a bit conned though!
Doug
Hmm, what about Tensegrity then? Did he made up those exercises?
Well, because he was such a good writer, it is hard to know what he made up himself and what he got from elsewhere so there will always be a question mark over exactly what was what, I think.
Doug
I did read "A Separate Reality" years ago and found it to be a superb read. I did not for one moment however think it was a true story. I did think that it might be some sort of retelling of Yaqui mystical ideas, and perhaps there was some sort of truth behind it, in this way. But I always assumed it was a work of fiction. I'm a little surprised that people take his words so literally. But undoubtedly his books are amazingly well written and a highly enjoyable read. Recommended reading even if it is all plaguerised!
I've read all of Casteneda's books and loved them all... This is sad and shocking. Was he really that degenerate? I did hear a story that came to me once third hand, from a neighbor of his he had in Colorado, U.S., that he used to roam his property with a "Sonic" (US fast food chain) styrofoam cup filled with half wine, half water. The cup was supposed to be a totem or icon of some sort.
Nevertheless, I still say there is deep wisdom in his books.
On the other hand, what was the name of that doc?
I just watched a BBC "doc" about Casteneda called "Tales of the Jungle" on Youtube, and it's pure crap. There are a bunch of people that act like they're experts on him, including the son of Cecil B. Demil, ???, and they never even finished his second book. I have to think they made that one just for the cash, to capitalize on his name.
And anyway, even if all his stories were made up, they still have incredible merit and value, because of the truth that sings out in the things he says, metaphorically speaking.
If anybody missed this or could not watch, here it is:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vg6baC0rPO8
It is divided to 6 parts.
I put link again, hope it will work now.
Cheers!
Haridas