(If I've posted this in the wrong section please tell me so I can remove and replace it elsewhere, i'm new to forums so I need knowledge :-P)
Somebody on YouTube keeps posting this comment on pretty much every AP video I research. I find it to be very unlikely, I haven't done my research on what he's talking about because I'd rather expand my learning of AP. I need people to shed some light. Mainly because it can deter people away from doing AP.
The Comment
"The Astral Plane, Astral Travel/Projection, OBE, 5th Dimension etc. is actually what is called Cloning Centers. When someone projects or travels, their consciousness is transferred into a clone (most likely a REM-driven Mark 2 clone) at a Cloning Center (in the 3rd Dimension) while experiencing MK Ultra visual and audio effects. Also, your clone may be pre-drugged to make it feel like a dream. These Cloning Centers are above and below ground (in DUMBs).
Look up: Donald Marshall, Cloning & Vril"
I don't know about you but, I'd be pretty freaked out if I just herd about AP and I came across this comment. Purely because it seems like your not "free" to do what you want like the experts say you can do. Its almost as if your details of your whole being is input into these "cloning systems" and "pre drugged" sounds to me that its something I wouldn't want to deal with if I was a beginner.
I have an open mind, but this needs clarification. I just don't see how the 3D can gather infomation about your spirit body? Doesn't add up.
Thanks, Sam :-)
Shoot me now, Please!!
Sam,
You have to understand that some people fear the unknown. This happens for many reasons but a biggie is because some people don't want you to gain the benefits. They want the masses to stay ignorant their whole lives.
First they will try to say that it isn't possible. But then people realize it is, so the strategy has to change.
Okay it is possible, but this can happen so don't do it. And actually, that's about it as I don't think they have ever dropped this strategy. They just change the "what" in what can happen.
If cloning was the real problem, why wasn't this the message presented from the beginning? Sure people could understand the concept but thousands of years ago the tech was so far out of their perspective that no one thought to use it as a tactic.
But really Sam, why would this even pass your personal "sniff" test? I think you already know garbage when you smell it. :-)
Haha :-D
That is very true. They're trying to drag us back into the pack of mediocrity.
Your right, I knew it was a load of crap, I'm thinking of deleting this post now :-P
whats your call? Worth staying up?
Thanks
Leave it be Sam. Everything is a lesson. We are bombarded with so much these days that it's only fair to question something you are unsure of.
Quote from: SpiritualSamwell on August 05, 2013, 20:58:53
The Comment
"The Astral Plane, Astral Travel/Projection, OBE, 5th Dimension etc. is actually what is called Cloning Centers. When someone projects or travels, their consciousness is transferred into a clone (most likely a REM-driven Mark 2 clone) at a Cloning Center (in the 3rd Dimension) while experiencing MK Ultra visual and audio effects. Also, your clone may be pre-drugged to make it feel like a dream. These Cloning Centers are above and below ground (in DUMBs).
Fear mongering tales.
Clone what? "their consciousness"
- is non-physical
- Who are you? Who am I?
- their, you, I are all personas, not the true self.
- True self, inner self, higher self, "the atman" is self awareness, omnipresent creative intelligence,
without any fixed self definitions
- One does not have consciousness, one and all is consciousness, source.
- All dreams and realities including the 3rd Dimension are plays in consciousness,
without any real permanence or substance (no solidity).
How do I know?
Let intuition be your guide, and your personal experiences be your knowing.
Quote from: SpiritualSamwell on August 05, 2013, 20:58:53
I have an open mind, but this needs clarification. I just don't see how the 3D can gather infomation about your spirit body? Doesn't add up.
Or you can take the attitude to "live your dreams" :-D
Yeah you can't let people drag you into their own nonsense.
I mean it is good to keep your ears open and see what is out there for yourself, but you need your BS-detector by your side at all times when you are on the internet.
This scenario seems about as likely to me as the Trix Rabbit being real.
I have been at this for half my life, and others for decades more than I. Never once have I even encountered one thing that suggested this scenario. Never once has anyone else suggested this to me.
When you hear the term "MK-ultra" your BS-detector's needle should turn so far to the right that it comes back to the left. If you are unfamiliar, it is a conspiracy theorist's staple about the CIA engineering sleeper soldiers. Being a conspiracy theory does not make something wrong, but it does make it highly suspect. :wink:
To even entertain this... how would the "CIA" dial in to people projecting? How would they even know?
There may be a lab hear on earth making clones that would need souls to inhabit them , but what would be the point to making a clone then get a conciousness that may not do what you want . This was probly made by some kid that had no idea of what they spoke .
p.s. You might want to watch this you tube video , the dangers of a.p. , its b.s. , but fun to watch .
p.p.s Not ever thing on you tube or the inter net is true .
QuoteLeave it be Sam. Everything is a lesson. We are bombarded with so much these days that it's only fair to question something you are unsure of.
Wise words indeed
http://i.imgur.com/XNxja.gif
I thought I'd heard it all.
I think and forgive me for saying this, there are many people who believe everything they hear in the nonphysical (or other-physical) and think they have made a great discovery.
I'd heard of the planes being destroyed, this being impossible, this being against one or another religion, this being a way for 'insert scary boogieman here' to get your soul/energy body/whatever, and now this.
At least it's better that 'you're all crazy' and 'it's all in your head'. In a way, it's refreshing.
Whats with all these mixed worded posts. The dimensions or densities, a group name for something that is what exactly?
It read initially as clone changes to spirit body, then 5th dimension read as astral proper, the 3rd dimension is this physical.
Drugged up is partially phased with the environment and limited self awareness is part of it anyway.
So changing all of that makes it readable but what's the message?
I didn't read it all, couldn't see the point, its all in your head anyway.
Lol
Does the next comment give all the info on what a dream is then? :roll:
Lets all read a book on something and make a post. Yeah...
Quote from: Stillwater on August 05, 2013, 21:49:19When you hear the term "MK-ultra" your BS-detector's needle should turn so far to the right that it comes back to the left. If you are unfamiliar, it is a conspiracy theorist's staple about the CIA engineering sleeper soldiers. Being a conspiracy theory does not make something wrong, but it does make it highly suspect. :wink:
This is a little misleading. MK-Ultra was (is?) , according to declassified documents, a reality and not just a conspiracy theory. Even the skeptic societies' main outlet - Wikipedia ! - admits it:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_MKUltra
Of course, that does not say sth about AP and such, which I do not believe either. However, one goal was to influence and mind-control people. Still it's most likely that it was primarily used only for torture and forced interrogations (today's water-boarding, so to speak...) but one should not discount entirely and easily the possibilty that they also wanted to wipe people's minds clean and re-program them (for whatever) as well.
QuoteThis is a little misleading. MK-Ultra was (is?) , according to declassified documents, a reality and not just a conspiracy theory. Even the skeptic societies' main outlet - Wikipedia ! - admits it:
Oh yeah, that what was real and was a nasty one indeed. They messed up some people's mind, no doubt.
I think SW was referring in specifics to MK-Ultra's interest's in the sleeper soldier program in regards to astral projection.
But if not, then I'm a bit confused too. MK-U was a real program.
I think connecting the governments with any AP or RV programme is bound to mix up all other programmes or fantasy ideas in people's minds. Especially the young mind with fertile imagination.
It's well known the US and USSR looked into using RV and other 'stuff' for espionage.. but it's evident they didn't get anywhere with it. I think that anyone here who is seasoned and experienced can see that it just wouldn't be compatible with the 'needs' of the military. Most of the RV specialists were exceedingly sensitive 'empaths'; Look at Ingo Swan.
Anyway... looking at that message on Youtube.. it seems its content is similar to 90% of the type of thing people write about AP.
It's evident that most people who write this sort of stuff are amongst a group of people who have gave it a go and not quite got there but have built their own little theory about it... and... because they have thought it's actually unattainable they assume that it's all fake and assume a 'role play' stance on the situation. Like Vampires... they start to intertwine a science fiction/fantasy plot line of sorts into it. Because they are sure it's probably fake.. they can say whatever they like because at the end of the day... who's to say they're wrong? This extends to many many plots for conspiracy theorists. Who are probably socially inept, disappointed with the world and don't see themselves as having any future... so they fabricate a fantasy that basically makes them popular with like minded people... and before you know it.. everyone who isn't wrapped up in their fantasy.. are SHEEP. A perfect positive reinforcement method.
To Sazaxx , as the story goes the o.p. stated it was a comment on a you tube video . A confusing mix of items , 3 th. dim. 5 th dim. ,clones , mk ultra , ect.
Not a clone , but I do remember reading of Robert Monroe http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Monroe accdently getting stuck in other bodies , then finding a way out .
To the o.p. of this thread do some reading , there are a whole bunch of free downloadable files on this site , other web sites , books ect.
QuoteBut if not, then I'm a bit confused too. MK-U was a real program.
Mk-Ultra was indeed a real program, and I feel it was probably carried out much longer than its claimed termination time, and perhaps even into the present day. It is also a staple of the conspiracy genre; for instance, the Kennedy assination is real, but it is also a conspiracy staple, because the details could have been anything. I guess you have to have read a few dozen of these posts... they start out big tragedy, they go Mk-Ultra, they make a pitstop at Illuminati, then they end up in Chinese bases on Mars, or reverse-engineered UFO tech.
Ironicly, all of those things just might be possible on their own, but I have seen the idea of Mk-Ultra used as seasoning for literally every story that involved one person taking sharp unexpected actions over the last 3 years. Sometimes people do things for reasons other than CIA mind-control, even if it is just occasionally.
yes, there is indeed a way for many of them by "over"-connecting the dots and making connections where none are, or at least none that are provable. it just sounded to me you meant MKUltra wasn't real at all in your post above.
Yeah, I apologize because I can see why that would seem to be so after rereading the post. The problem is that I described the mythical and the real side of Mk-Ultra in the same sentence, which left an ambiguity.
Quote from: SpiritualSamwell on August 05, 2013, 20:58:53
The Comment
"The Astral Plane, Astral Travel/Projection, OBE, 5th Dimension etc. is actually what is called Cloning Centers. When someone projects or travels, their consciousness is transferred into a clone (most likely a REM-driven Mark 2 clone) at a Cloning Center (in the 3rd Dimension) while experiencing MK Ultra visual and audio effects. Also, your clone may be pre-drugged to make it feel like a dream. These Cloning Centers are above and below ground (in DUMBs).
Look up: Donald Marshall, Cloning & Vril"
BS meter overload. This is just drivel. The author clearly has no experience or knowledge of AP whatsoever, or is a 6 year old. Don't feel bad Sam, btw, this is not directed at you, you are 100% correct with the observation "doesn't add up".
People on "Yahoo! Answers" do the same. Disinformation, and it's not just clueless morons who do it, if you look at a simple list of horror movies from the modern day, you will realise that most of them have little imagination but associate themselves with elements of real parasychology, and then expect people to sum it all up as the real deal. Insidious tries to use astral projection to go "Oh look everyone, daemons attack you all the time in the astral, don't do it!"
A lot of people here know when to say "Dude, that's bovine excrement, don't listen to it". :)
Its definitely a weird concept no doubt. In regards to AP though I highly see this as being likely.
Jeadevil - Yeah I think that's a new tactic they're trying, to produce fear by inputting AP aspects into a film.
Catmeow - I dont feel bad dont worry :-) thanks for understanding. Yeah your right, people will do anything to try and deter us.
I've just came up with something just this minute that is fairly spooky... :-P
What IF for example, I went (not that I would go) to, lets say. The White House in America (im english) or somewhere with an insanely high security lockdown to human 3D contact. because it so secretive, would they have government Astral Projectors just guarding it?
Whats your views on high authority people on the 3D doing AP also? They surely know about it?
Something a bit off topic but just wanted to say this because its also interesting, to me anyway :lol:
On astral guards , in the early 60s Robert Monroe bumped in to some for Kenedy . Astral guards at area 51 in the US state of NV have been discussed hear also . This is a fear based you tube video . I like the way the computer voice says evil . http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MTxheZlvZNU
Quote from: SpiritualSamwell on August 06, 2013, 19:46:34
Whats your views on high authority people on the 3D doing AP also? They surely know about it?
I'd be willing to say some already do, but only the ones that truly are behind the scenes.
Quote from: SpiritualSamwell on August 06, 2013, 19:46:34
Its definitely a weird concept no doubt. In regards to AP though I highly see this as being likely.
Jeadevil - Yeah I think that's a new tactic they're trying, to produce fear by inputting AP aspects into a film.
Catmeow - I dont feel bad dont worry :-) thanks for understanding. Yeah your right, people will do anything to try and deter us.
I've just came up with something just this minute that is fairly spooky... :-P
What IF for example, I went (not that I would go) to, lets say. The White House in America (im english) or somewhere with an insanely high security lockdown to human 3D contact. because it so secretive, would they have government Astral Projectors just guarding it?
Whats your views on high authority people on the 3D doing AP also? They surely know about it?
Something a bit off topic but just wanted to say this because its also interesting, to me anyway :lol:
LOL Astral guards! This made me laugh, But it is an interesting question, The funny part is, Even if you did project into the white house, What could the "Astral Guards' Do to you? Hand cuff you? :lol: Interrogate you?
I mean its non Physical, Just because its the government it doesn't mean they can turn the NP suddenly Physical and chuck you in the grey bar hotel! Or can they.....? :-o (insert eery music) Maybe you will go on the Non Physical Wanted list! :-D heh
I guess they could try and get your name and hunt you down in the physical, But you would be pretty stupid to tell them your name, Hello my names Peanut butter jelly nice to meet you :) Now wheres the secret documents !
They aren't trying to fear anyone into Aping. For a start it's not a very touched upon subject in horror films... but saying that, The Cell was pretty messed up. A nightmare on Elm Street came a long time before Insidious. Didn't stop me.
What's the 3D?
Quote from: Bedeekin on August 07, 2013, 01:42:47
What's the 3D?
I think he's referring to the physical, So Real Time Zone AP into governmental controlled areas.
Quote from: Bedeekin on August 07, 2013, 01:42:47
They aren't trying to fear anyone into Aping. For a start it's not a very touched upon subject in horror films... but saying that, The Cell was pretty messed up. A nightmare on Elm Street came a long time before Insidious. Didn't stop me.
What's the 3D?
Yeah, wouldn't stop me either because I know the lack of knowledge the game/movie industry goes off.
On astral projection horror films , the one I remember was badly made , a lot of the facts were wrong. I watched it in the mid 70s . This guy used a.p. to kill people . A cop creamated his body while he was out of body . It may of been named psychic killer .
p.s. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0073586/?ref_=fn_al_tt_1
It's BS because OBEs have been written about since way before any MK Ultra or any bs like that.. There are accounts of OBEs in the Bible and other texts and literature from before the 1900's.. This is why I overemphasize that people read
Not to mention that the astral plane is not the 5th dimension so obviously this person has a lack of information and doesn't know what they're talking about
My sentiments too. A quick read of something, change a few words and stirr in some magic potion.
On the odd occasion an unsuspecting person uses these words and making sense can be done. The context allowing.
Disinfo BS'ers are everywhere, finding some innocent person who thinks it legitimate is easy to spot. They have real questions and talk sense.
Always seperate the wheat from the chaff.
By 3D i mean Third Dimension, sorry for the confusion.
Enlightnd - hahaha i smiled and laughed a lot at this. Yeah thats what I was thinking. Also, another question. Does your pshyical features apply in the realms? I'm yet to do it. Or is it just a spiritual blur, or an immense aura with no 3D features at all?
Desert-rat - Very interesting! Wow, watching that now. I thought I was being borderline over imaginative and silly.
Just like to say, thanks for your views guys/ladies im liking this topic quite a lot now. Appreciate everything :-)
On what one looks like in the astral , it is my understanding that one can will any form they want . After many years of trying I have yet to have a conscious o.b.e. my self . We all go out at night during deep sleep , I have had dreams that I am sure were from being out of body .
Quote from: SpiritualSamwell on August 07, 2013, 18:41:07
Enlightnd - hahaha i smiled and laughed a lot at this. Yeah thats what I was thinking. Also, another question. Does your pshyical features apply in the realms? I'm yet to do it. Or is it just a spiritual blur, or an immense aura with no 3D features at all?
Hey mate,
Haha :-) I would still like for some info or peoples views on that question..
As for your above question, Yes. No blurs, No Auras, Just the normal you as it looks now. Its personally not something i look out for. As desert-rat said you can/could perceive yourself as anything you desire. Theres a lovely lady on here that often takes the form of a fox, She runs on all fours, Barks and all. :-P
Anything is possible, Thoughts manifest in these realms. In saying that i haven't personally tried to change my physical form as of yet. Theres so much else to do, I guess its something you try when your interested in it .. I have changed objects though. Going through walls and other objects is a daily routine when out of body. This same thought/action would apply in changing form or viewing your physical features, All you do is believe you can or believe it will be, Its just that easy.
For me, I usually feel as though I'm in my physical body looking with my normal physical eyes. The lower region of my body doesn't seem to come into my peripheral view as much as it may in the physical, But then again I'm never really looking for it as theres so much more to see.
I often look down and view my arms and the palms of my hands, This helps to ground myself in the realm so i can continue exploring.
Cutting to the chase, I'm dribbling again!
Put it this way, If you "think" your hands will be there, You look down and there they are. The same goes for any other body part, And it looks completely as they would in the physical
or how you would like to see them. Anything will be there if you believe it will be. :-)
One OBE i had i came across a mirror which was quite interesting, At first i couldnt see my reflection at-all, Nothing but the room behind me, Then i thought hang on thats not right, And suddenly i appeared :lol:
Good luck in your travels, You will get there :wink:
Cheers.
Quote from: SpiritualSamwell on August 05, 2013, 20:58:53
(If I've posted this in the wrong section please tell me so I can remove and replace it elsewhere, i'm new to forums so I need knowledge :-P)
Somebody on YouTube keeps posting this comment on pretty much every AP video I research. I find it to be very unlikely, I haven't done my research on what he's talking about because I'd rather expand my learning of AP. I need people to shed some light. Mainly because it can deter people away from doing AP.
The Comment
"The Astral Plane, Astral Travel/Projection, OBE, 5th Dimension etc. is actually what is called Cloning Centers. When someone projects or travels, their consciousness is transferred into a clone (most likely a REM-driven Mark 2 clone) at a Cloning Center (in the 3rd Dimension) while experiencing MK Ultra visual and audio effects. Also, your clone may be pre-drugged to make it feel like a dream. These Cloning Centers are above and below ground (in DUMBs).
Look up: Donald Marshall, Cloning & Vril"
I don't know about you but, I'd be pretty freaked out if I just herd about AP and I came across this comment. Purely because it seems like your not "free" to do what you want like the experts say you can do. Its almost as if your details of your whole being is input into these "cloning systems" and "pre drugged" sounds to me that its something I wouldn't want to deal with if I was a beginner.
I have an open mind, but this needs clarification. I just don't see how the 3D can gather infomation about your spirit body? Doesn't add up.
Thanks, Sam :-)
There is so much "propaganda", conspiracy theory, etc...
Fear sells...
And for some people,sure you can AP something like that... why not...
a cloning center would be merely a speck of sand in this thing call INFINITY... choose to go somewhere better... learn to raise your vibration high enough to stay out of low vibration places... live this and others will see your light :)
If you do find yourself in some sketchy area of the plane remember these two words HEART ENERGY.