Math question and a new "No Present" Idea.. Need help!

[Catatonic]

Then we agree. 
I think. 

on what?     i think the opinions are still pro and con ... more con, i guess.... but then again.. if there's no present and all that stuff, will it help someone?  is it that interesting?

[CFTraveler]

It is interesting to me, because of the wide divergence of views regarding reality.  As to how useful it is, I would say that whole belief systems are based on both ideas of what is real and what isn't- and occassionally one of these, for various reasons, are a source of comfort to some.  So yes, I do think there is a reason why we're wondering about such things.  As to how interesting it is- well, we're still here, having this 'conversation', aren't we?

[Catatonic]

but why isn't there a thing that says: " look... there's no time.. no present, no future, no nothing" ?   What are those whole belief systems" you are talking about?  what will change in that system if you prove them " look... no present" ?

[Awakened_Mind]

Well I think it's a matter of relevance. In terms of past, present and future; what's happened and what may happen are small matters to what is happening. We don't live in tomorrow or yesterday, we live in the now.

-AM

[Catatonic]

which it doesn't really exist 

[Awakened_Mind]

Then how do you explain experience?

-AM

[Catatonic]

i dunno... i didn't answered all them questions... i just came up with an idea... and asked for your opinions .  there are still a number of unanswered question regarding this " no present" idea, right?

[Awakened_Mind]

Not in my view. I don't experience tomorrow other than what I concieve it to be in the now. I don't experience yesterday other than in the memory reviewed in the now.

-AM

[Catatonic]

yes, but you experience tiny bits of the future in a very fast pace, in your " now"... and in the same fast way that becomes past.

[Awakened_Mind]

Well if it's so fast it is faster than the speed of light, then we are talking about eternity. A place where no before and after can be established.

-AM

[Catatonic]

i think it can be established... but it's too close one of another.  it's like.. how many times do you divide 1 to reach 0?

[Awakened_Mind]

Eternal is synonymous with 'timeless'. So they can't be established. Unless you have a different definition of eternity?

There is no amount of times the number 1 can be divided to reach zero. It can't be done. Sorry I'm not really understanding the point in that?

-AM

[Catatonic]

well... i think that the present, on the line of time must have and ending and a beginning, right? this being available for the people who don't care about time. they think it's there and it's rolling and rolling... but if we know that there's no time and all that, let's suppose that present's interval is 1 second. in order for time to reach from A to B, it has to reach a middle point, right?  in order to reach that middle point, it must reach another middle point, you see? and i suppose it will never reach 0, the actual present.

[Synergy]

well... i think that the present, on the line of time must have and ending and a beginning, right? this being available for the people who don't care about time. they think it's there and it's rolling and rolling... but if we know that there's no time and all that, let's suppose that present's interval is 1 second. in order for time to reach from A to B, it has to reach a middle point, right?  in order to reach that middle point, it must reach another middle point, you see? and i suppose it will never reach 0, the actual present.

The present can not have an interval at all.  By the time it would reach the 'middle point' the beginning would already be in the past.  Once something has happened, it's done... its not still in the present.  And alot can happen in a second.... just look at the slow motion video of a hummingbird's wings and count how many times they beat in 30 seconds (your middle point)  Are you saying those first wing beats are still in the present, even though they have already occurred and new beats are taking place?

[Catatonic]

well... that wing moves in an interval, right?  interval placed in time... so .. back to what i've said earlier..
no, i'm saying that the first beats are in the past already

[Awakened_Mind]

You're really not understanding the concept of 'present' or 'now'. It TRANSCENDS time, so it is not subject to the same laws or logic as before and after. There is no beginning or end. This is why you cannot quantify the present into a second because that establishes a start and finish.

That's the general idea that is agreed upon when discussing 'the present'. I still don't understand your logic for proposing that it does not exist. Your theory to me is subject to befores and afters so is therefore not in relation to the present at all.

-AM

[Synergy]

well... that wing moves in an interval, right?  interval placed in time... so .. back to what i've said earlier..
no, i'm saying that the first beats are in the past already

The interval is not all the present!  The interval you are talking about actually occurs over a time period... that period can not all fit into the 'present' The first movement is in the past by the time the last movement starts to occur.  There can be no middle point to the present...  The present is ever moving forward like a wave front through time.  Its just the reference point and not a chunk of time at all.

[Awakened_Mind]

Well said.

The present is the movement of the time, not the places within it.

-AM

[CFTraveler]

Well said.

The present is the movement of the time, not the places within it.

-AM

Can I borrow this sometime?

[iNNERvOYAGER]

Their was now, and there's going to be now, but there's no now, right now.

[Awakened_Mind]

Can I borrow this sometime?

Go ahead

-AM