antagonist characters

[LightBeam]

What do you all think? Are negative characters a result of lack of knowledge OR volunteer work. Afterall, we agree that challenges are essential and beneficial for setting up lessons to help us gain knowledge and wisdom. But in order for challenges and hardship to occur, someone needs to cause them. Are the bad guys doing a favor for those who interact with them, because they have their set up to learn? Granted, both sides learn from their experiences, but they need each other's opposing characteristics. And do you think as another character you have been the antagonist?

[Nameless]

Deep! Negative characters are simply necessary, that's all. This is a pretty tough philosophical question good for a round table discussion.

So here is my take. We are all experts at creating our own negative events and outcomes. We really don't need help in that department. I feel pretty sure that if you took an assortment of human beings and put them in a perfect environment with only the most positive energy they would find a way to let in the dark. We should just face the fact that we humans (all of us) are here to provide that discord to possibly all discarnate and incarnate beings alike.

It is our job as a whole unit and we do it well. We do it well even when we think we are doing the opposite. Even Mother Teresa.

Have I been the antagonist? I'm sure I have but whether that turned out for the good or bad I couldn't say in every case. But I was certainly trying to help as it goes against my nature to harm. That's both here and there.

[Plume]

funny you bring this subject , its been on my mind a lot because i keep saying that I need to do gods work by being even the karma messenger.
theer is no savior ... I personally think we need to be both to understand this place , it is so slow moving it gives you plenty of time to look at the mess you created and then spend more time cleaning it up...lol . on thing is for sure now that I feel I finally matured is don't spend time regretting , what is done is done , fix it by making better choices now .

[PerspectiveShift]

Another perspective to add to this discussion is that everyone is just doing what they do. This "game" or "experience" we are all playing in is setup in a way that it is inevitable to step on someone's toes or do harm to others.

For example: A virus in our body is bad according to humans. But as a virus consciousness it is just trying to survive the only way it knows how and the only way it can. Another example: People say the Earth is dying from pollution. But is it? There are billions of planets that are completely toxic (polluted) to human life and they are doing just fine. We always look from a human perspective at things. Hell, maybe the planet wants us the heck off of it and thinks we are little pests that tickle it constantly.

The best thing is to cooperate with as many consciousnesses as possible, but you won't be able to cooperate with all of them. Now if you look in NP terms, there may be certain beings that are setup to cause different energies like destruction (a type of energy which is not good or bad) because that's a way they are setup. Like a demo contractor, their job is to topple buildings in order to make something new and better. It could also be worked into their survival mechanism. But what is that something that they need to survive? What do they want? It would probably be good to find out. Maybe you are threatening their territory, maybe you are like a spider for them or a snake. Poisonous in their eyes. And maybe we are poison for them. There are a lot of unknowns.

Most humans are all after money which is an odd concept for many consciousnesses I'm sure. So assuming we are an evil species because we are not feeding our own kind can be easily perceived. But there is a system in place that they may not be aware of. The money system that is integrated into our every waking day.

But as humans in this game, we cannot be perfect. It isn't setup that way. We cannot please every consciousness there is. If you let all the mosquitoes suck your blood, the mosquitoes will be happy, but you risk dying of a virus. You kill them for survival, or if you can, you find a solution with mutual benefit. Cancer cells or diseased cells are constantly being attacked or destroyed by your blood cells for the good of the human body, but the cancer consciousness would like to live too.

But in essence, we are all doing each other a favour because when we transition through lives and experiences, it's a natural learning process. We think it's scary because dying is unknown or because pain hurts, but we signed up for experiencing a multiple wide range experiences. Some are harder than others, but they are just unique experiences in themselves.

I dunno, that's my take anyways. What do you guys think?

[PerspectiveShift]

What do you all think? Are negative characters a result of lack of knowledge OR volunteer work. Afterall, we agree that challenges are essential and beneficial for setting up lessons to help us gain knowledge and wisdom. But in order for challenges and hardship to occur, someone needs to cause them. Are the bad guys doing a favor for those who interact with them, because they have their set up to learn? Granted, both sides learn from their experiences, but they need each other's opposing characteristics. And do you think as another character you have been the antagonist?

And yes, this is a great question. Maybe the "bad guys" are actually highly evolved beings that signed up for evolving consciousness through destruction. It is a possibility. And in the end, if you believe in the "we are all one" philosophy, then we are already highly evolved at our core selves and are learning and helping each other grow through contrasting "negative" and "positive" experiences.

I learned an experience from Josephine McCarthy (a modern day magician), that she and her students practiced tarot on one of the older Presidents (She didnt mention which one, but stated it wasn't Trump). The President was signing all sorts of Bills that were detrimental to the country and had no clue why he was doing this. Her and her students asked what type of Spirit was in this person. The results pointed to high evolution, monk-like, and all positive. So that would talk to your point exactly that some highly evolved beings can cause destruction for the benefit of many.

Just had to throw that in there.

[Lumaza]

 I think this is where the terms "Someone has to play the bad guy" and "tough love" come into play.

The one thing I find really difficult is a watching people hurt and even destroy their lives because of some kind of "greater good" that comes during the aftermath of it. There are a number of times I was told point blank in the NPR that I wasn't allowed to do something to help a person because it wasn't my decision to make. This point was driven home again and again throughout my Wife's fight with Cancer. Then at the end of her battle, I had to watch as she lived in complete denial of her Cancer even as it was systematically destroying her physical vessel. I tried to prepare her, but she would hear nothing of that. Four days before she passed, she finally gave in and said, "she has had enough".

[LightBeam]

I really enjoyed reading all of your replies. I also think along the same lines. The setup of the multiverse must be fair to all points of consciousness; therefore, each spirit can't be always good or always bad. It has to experience it all and contribute to the overall learning lesson, sometime playing and angel and sometimes playing the devil. I think that while in character we can't fully comprehend that if now we are good, that in another character we actually caused harm to someone. We now look at only through the very narrow perspective of the nature of THIS character. But in other realities a portion of our larger spirit had accepted to play the villain, and that is absolutely normal. Since I had this realization many years ago, I no longer have negative experiences with people. Everyone that comes into my life no matter how briefly is always loving and positive towards me. I view each person as equal, regardless of what they appear to be in character, even the criminals. I see their higher spirits and I see their part they play in this game.

In addition, as we are right now, we are harming others, sometimes intentionally sometimes unintentionally. If we have eaten a piece of meat but never killed a larger animal, we are still supporting the idea of eating them, thus enabling those who kill them or raise them in awful conditions where they only suffer. For these animals, humans are the devil. But we don't perceive it that way. Every time we kill flies or spiders, or step on any bugs while walking, that is harming living things. They too have souls. and what about plants. Just because we cant communicate with them, it doesn't mean that they don't feel pian when we rip them from their roots. So, it really is a matter of perception, but this is the nature of these slow game like realities and each of us is playing the part of our current chosen avatar with all of its assigned characteristics.

Now here is the big question. Can Adolf Hitler's actions be justified? Is he in enteral hell? I think he may have been for a period of time observing the essence of his destructive thoughts in the immediate NP environment. But each spirit eventually reunites with its larger part and realizes the game they had exited and the purpose of the events they were in.

[floriferous]

Now here is the big question. Can Adolf Hitler's actions be justified? Is he in enteral hell? I think he may have been for a period of time observing the essence of his destructive thoughts in the immediate NP environment. But each spirit eventually reunites with its larger part and realizes the game they had exited and the purpose of the events they were in.

I think from the perspective of, for want of a better phrase, 'the smaller self/soul', what you said makes sense. From a bigger perspective I think it changes. The concept of good & bad, and right & wrong are simply that. They are concepts which exist only in thought and not in direct experience. The moment itself places no expectations on what is arising within it. It does not favour one experience over another. Only thought does that. Every experience is totally accepted by virtue of its arising. We bring negative experiences into reality by how we define them.

So from the smaller self perspective there are tremendous negative experiences in the world but from a different perspective, at the same time right in the heart of those terrible experiences is a simple peace.

So I think the answer is paradoxical. It is both answers.

[LightBeam]

So I think the answer is paradoxical. It is both answers.

That is precisely right. From a character perspective those who agreed with his actions justified them, those who opposed them did not. But when we strip the flesh and look at the bigger picture and the journey of the soul as a whole, things change.
The benefit for actually making this realization WHILE in character brings peace within, knowing that what seems to be a chaos, is actually a very well organized and planned event with a purpose.  
Thinking OUTSIDE of our narrow character frame sets us truly free.

[PerspectiveShift]

In addition, as we are right now, we are harming others, sometimes intentionally sometimes unintentionally. If we have eaten a piece of meat but never killed a larger animal, we are still supporting the idea of eating them, thus enabling those who kill them or raise them in awful conditions where they only suffer. For these animals, humans are the devil. But we don't perceive it that way. Every time we kill flies or spiders, or step on any bugs while walking, that is harming living things. They too have souls. and what about plants. Just because we cant communicate with them, it doesn't mean that they don't feel pian when we rip them from their roots. So, it really is a matter of perception, but this is the nature of these slow game like realities and each of us is playing the part of our current chosen avatar with all of its assigned characteristics.

I'm actually relieved you explained this full description as many people don't see the whole picture. Usually they stop at "dont kill animals" but then don't consider the plants as consciousness and energy. Everything in this existence, whether we relate to it or not, is consciousness. Rocks and minerals too, the air around us, spirits and forces we cannot see, etc. We don't understand them (which is why people don't consider them relevant) and we are placed in the middle of everything intermixed within this structure of laws and limitations (like a game) setup around us. We contribute to the game by acting, reacting, or not acting at all (which is still an active action). This affects absolutely everything around us, whether negatively or positively, depending on all of the individual consciousness' points of views.

Most, if not all of us are ignorant to how much we may impact all of these consciousness' whether positively or negatively, but it's pointless to get caught up in it. In this dualistic experience it's absolutely impossible to keep every single consciousness happy as our individual goals and drives clash completely with each others. But that's okay. It's just good to be the best you can be the best way you know how to at the level of your awareness and understanding. And you have to take care of yourself within all of this balance at the same time, because your body is a consciousness too, as well as your mind, and all the little cells, etc. It's pointless to overthink it in my opinion, but it's good to understand fully.

In my personal beliefs up to this point of my limited experience, all the individual points of consciousness' chose to sign up for this mutual beneficial game that we are playing, so stepping way way back at the full comprehensive picture, you can't really screw it up. It's a crazy experiment we are playing with ourselves.

Related to this, I had this very real experience, believe it or not, when the doctors knocked me out on ketomine popping my shoulder back in. I very strongly felt like this experience we are living is extremely small and insignificant compared to who I truly was. It was like a piece of dust compared to my existence and compared to infinity. All the pressures and beliefs, the struggles, absolutely everything in this perceived existence, in the end doesn't matter, as we are much much bigger than anything you could possibly imagine. It's almost like a feeling of carelessness, but wasn't negative or destructive. It was a positive and creative carelessness which is extremely hard to explain as I've never experienced this feeling it in this actual physical body.

I felt I was truly me, pure consciousness sitting there within my body's chest. I felt omnipotent (like I could do everything and anything), but at the same time, I felt completely comfortable and peaceful staying exactly where I was, within this limited and constricted body. It was okay and where I wanted to be. It was extremely peaceful and loving. I felt some of the strongest feelings I've ever felt in this experience and doubt I would ever be able to reproduce them while still in this physical experience as they were so powerful. Nothing like I've ever remembered experiencing. This experience has stuck with me and is one of the reasons I'm seeking more spiritual truth.

Obviously drugs aren't the answer lol, but I truly believe they can be gateways or glimpses into the larger reality. The real training and discipline is why we are here and is what is necessary for true spiritual development. But I could see how wanting a repeat experience could be extremely addicting and drugs would be the easy button. (But actually it's the HARD button as you are falling for escapism and being lazy avoiding the real training/discipline that is necessary for this type of learning experience.) There is my disclaimer!!

But getting back to the point, this isn't the only experience I've had where I tapped into this feeling of being much larger than this reality. But again, this is my personal viewpoint and belief up to this point. I thought it was relevant to share at this time. Hope you enjoyed reading it!

[LightBeam]

I'm actually relieved you explained this full description as many people don't see the whole picture. Usually they stop at "dont kill animals" but then don't consider the plants as consciousness and energy. Everything in this existence, whether we relate to it or not, is consciousness. Rocks and minerals too, the air around us, spirits and forces we cannot see, etc. We don't understand them (which is why people don't consider them relevant) and we are placed in the middle of everything intermixed within this structure of laws and limitations (like a game) setup around us. We contribute to the game by acting, reacting, or not acting at all (which is still an active action). This affects absolutely everything around us, whether negatively or positively, depending on all of the individual consciousness' points of views.

Most, if not all of us are ignorant to how much we may impact all of these consciousness' whether positively or negatively, but it's pointless to get caught up in it. In this dualistic experience it's absolutely impossible to keep every single consciousness happy as our individual goals and drives clash completely with each others. But that's okay. It's just good to be the best you can be the best way you know how to at the level of your awareness and understanding. And you have to take care of yourself within all of this balance at the same time, because your body is a consciousness too, as well as your mind, and all the little cells, etc. It's pointless to overthink it in my opinion, but it's good to understand fully.

In my personal beliefs up to this point of my limited experience, all the individual points of consciousness' chose to sign up for this mutual beneficial game that we are playing, so stepping way way back at the full comprehensive picture, you can't really screw it up. It's a crazy experiment we are playing with ourselves.

Related to this, I had this very real experience, believe it or not, when the doctors knocked me out on ketomine popping my shoulder back in. I very strongly felt like this experience we are living is extremely small and insignificant compared to who I truly was. It was like a piece of dust compared to my existence and compared to infinity. All the pressures and beliefs, the struggles, absolutely everything in this perceived existence, in the end doesn't matter, as we are much much bigger than anything you could possibly imagine. It's almost like a feeling of carelessness, but wasn't negative or destructive. It was a positive and creative carelessness which is extremely hard to explain as I've never experienced this feeling it in this actual physical body.

I felt I was truly me, pure consciousness sitting there within my body's chest. I felt omnipotent (like I could do everything and anything), but at the same time, I felt completely comfortable and peaceful staying exactly where I was, within this limited and constricted body. It was okay and where I wanted to be. It was extremely peaceful and loving. I felt some of the strongest feelings I've ever felt in this experience and doubt I would ever be able to reproduce them while still in this physical experience as they were so powerful. Nothing like I've ever remembered experiencing. This experience has stuck with me and is one of the reasons I'm seeking more spiritual truth.

Obviously drugs aren't the answer lol, but I truly believe they can be gateways or glimpses into the larger reality. The real training and discipline is why we are here and is what is necessary for true spiritual development. But I could see how wanting a repeat experience could be extremely addicting and drugs would be the easy button. (But actually it's the HARD button as you are falling for escapism and being lazy avoiding the real training/discipline that is necessary for this type of learning experience.) There is my disclaimer!!

But getting back to the point, this isn't the only experience I've had where I tapped into this feeling of being much larger than this reality. But again, this is my personal viewpoint and belief up to this point. I thought it was relevant to share at this time. Hope you enjoyed reading it!

Thank you, PerspectiveShift! Very enjoyable post! Completely agree with everything. In my opinion drugs are very destructive in a long run, so I always advocate to not even try, because addictions are extremely hard to overcome and it's not worth it. I've been told that being under the influence of propofol makes you feel absolutely extraordinary like what you described, but Michael Jackson got addicted and overdosed it.
We have the natural capability to open the inner doors. All other methods are abuse to our bodies that will bring undesirable consequences and in a long run more hardship and suffering than exhilaration.

[Nameless]

Beautiful post Perspective. I know that kind of bliss doesn't come often but when it does., oh gosh words can't do the reality justice, but you came close. I agree with everything you said. On the drugs, well, common sense and again learning lessons and the bigger picture all come into play.

[tides2dust]

"The total number of minds in the universe is one. In fact, consciousness is a singularity phasing within all beings." ~Dr. Erwin Schrodinger

[PerspectiveShift]

Yes, I agree with you guys about drugs being a dark path. After I came out of that experience, this was the first thing I realized. I could see clearly how people could get addicted. But I know that's not why we are here. We are here to go through the hardships in this physical existence head on and learn from them. Like lifting weights, if half way through the hard part of the workout you skip it, do half reps with bad form, or cheat, you won't get the results you signed up for.

I'm sure with AP it could become a bit of an escapism too if you let it. Balance and doing things that benefit your physical life here, the primary existence that we chose at this time, is important imo. I always have to remind myself this as sometimes I get a bit overly obsessed with some things.

[LightBeam]

I'm sure with AP it could become a bit of an escapism too if you let it. Balance and doing things that benefit your physical life here, the primary existence that we chose at this time, is important imo. I always have to remind myself this as sometimes I get a bit overly obsessed with some things.

Yes, balance is essential to establish happiness. If anything, AP has enhanced my physical life in all areas. I have realized that I feel at HOME anywhere I am focused in the present and that there is no specific place that we have to belong and call home. If we fixate on the idea that where we are is not our home and we belong someplace else, then we will miss out a lot on being submerged in every present moment and enjoying the adventures fully. Our home is the entire multiverse. It is truly ours. But the actual knowledge of this fact gives us the true freedom and joy.

[Plume]

About Hitler,,,
I certainly would not raise my hand in the back of that waiting class room in the in between life scenes to come and be that evil character , can you just imagine the hell he lived before , during and after or was he way more whole then we know. that's why I would ask who on earth would come and be that negative and why... . if we choose to do so before we enter the Garden of Eden for collective purpose or even individually then it most take some form of courage to be that evil or maybe its a speedy way to get somewhere ...nope not me . I like it easy...jeez, I might have to review my thought when its time to review it all , then again where are we supposed to go ....

[LightBeam]

...nope not me . I like it easy...jeez, I might have to review my thought when its time to review it all , then again where are we supposed to go ....

You are a lot braver than you think  . This is just your current character talking. When we merge with our higher selves, our perspectives change drastically. These lifetimes are like a blink of an eye in the grand scale of infinity.

[PerspectiveShift]

Yes, balance is essential to establish happiness. If anything, AP has enhanced my physical life in all areas. I have realized that I feel at HOME anywhere I am focused in the present and that there is no specific place that we have to belong and call home. If we fixate on the idea that where we are is not our home and we belong someplace else, then we will miss out a lot on being submerged in every present moment and enjoying the adventures fully. Our home is the entire multiverse. It is truly ours. But the actual knowledge of this fact gives us the true freedom and joy.

Yes, I completely agree with everything you just said. Couldn't have said it better myself!