What is god!

[Legend]

I'm posting this more as an informational piece than a question or anything else of the sort.  Last year, I was coming back home, my first plane took forever to leave (waiting for someone) and of course, I missed my flight.  To make a long story short, it was early, but still, no planes were flying home before the next day, so as ticked off as I was, I took my luggage and went to get a room to sleep at.  The next day, I was given a copy of the "Bhagdava Gita" by a priest in the airport.  It only clicked after, why exactly my plane was late on that specific day (and the fact that no other plane flew to the bay area on that day).

Anyhow, the part that hit me the most was at the end of the book where it states something along the lines of "We're parcels of God".

If you think about that for a second, it seems to explain a lot of things (mind split).  Why some religions calls us gods (although that's not quite correct).  It explains what type of control we have over any situation.  etc etc....  The more you think about it, the more you'll see how this connects ideas and makes the hardest things to believe, believable.

I just thought it may interest a few people to know that =)
I'm all ears for what you guys think about it!

[Telos]

I think you'll find that to be the prevailing interpretation of God in this forum.

Nice show, though.

[Nostic]

Well yeah, God is the whole... The One. And everyone, and everything is a part of the whole. We, in particular, are said to be made in His image because we have the potential to commune with Him... to ascend to His level... or at least to ascend to a comparable level.

[Tayesin]

There's an old quote that says, "We are energetic probes created by the Universe, and it is because we are possessors of awareness that has energy, that we are the means by which the Universe comes to know Itself."

Parcels of God is the same thing.

If we decided to call God..  the Creative Awareness of this Universe, and we could see how it had Diversified Itself down to smaller and smaller portions of Itself..  you would eventually get to the massive being that we are.. The Soul we really are.

So we are parcels of God according to that view also.

Really, it doesn't matter what words we add to describe It, what characteristics we give It...  It is exactly what It is...  a whole Universe that is creatively aware, and can manifest all and anything we could possibly think of...  in fact, if we can think of it then it is already in existence.

I'm rambling on now... somebody stop me......

[beavis]

in fact, if we can think of it then it is already in existence.

Theres a big difference between a spirit thinking and a brain thinking. Brains dont do anything paranormal, like thinking something to make it real. They communicate with their spirit which has weird abilities and SOMETIMES makes similar things real.

[Nostic]

[edit]

[Berserk]

The claims that "we are all parcels of God" or its Gnostic/ New Age variations (e.g. "We are all sparks of divinity" or "we are all God") are in a sense trivial variations of orthodox Judaeo-Christian notions.   The Bible goes much further than claiming that humanity is created in God's image.  Peter insists that we are all destined to "participate in the divine nature (2 Peter 1:4)."   At one level, since God creates all that is, everything derives from God and is in that sense  part of God.  Since God is omnipresent, nothing exists that lacks God's presence.   Such claims are only controversial because of the dangers of misapplication.

These dangers arise from conflicting perspectives on the grand purpose of creation.   Most spiritualities stress the supreme importance of pure unconditional love.  Evidence from NDEs overwhelmingly confirms that mastery of this love is central to our creaturely mission.  NDEs also confirm the importance of attaining knowledge, though the nature of the most vital types of knowledge ultimately seems vague.  

What is most controversial is the question of whether the Creator can be pleased with His [Her/ Its] creation and whether "He" desires our gratitude, adoration, love, and service.  I believe He does, but I recognize the potential pitfalls of anthropomorphic conceptions. God certainly experiences no loneliness, needs, or insecurities in the sense of our human vulnerabilities.   In Christianity, love is the "gravity" that ultimately enables our spiritual evolution to culminate in a fully realized reunion with our Maker.  The heavens are just tools or way stations en route to this goal.    

Many would ask, "If we are all part of God, then wouldn't our efforts to love and adore God just be a form of unsatisfying Self-love?"   Not if the creatures are both free and prevented from experiencing their God-consciousness.  My chief objection to conventional New Age theology is its failure to recognize just this point.   A few astral adepts like Swedenborg, "the Father of Astral Exploration,"  have repeatedly confirmed the need for loving worship--our need, not God's--as the best form of ego detachment and the key to maximal spiritual progress in  the Hereafter.

Berserk

[Telos]

Many would ask, "If we are all part of God, then wouldn't our efforts to love and adore God just be a form of unsatisfying Self-love?" Not if the creatures are both free and prevented from experiencing their God-consciousness.

I'm not sure that I'm internalizing that statement correctly. Freedom and prevention are conflicting concepts. How can one be free to love with divine love without being free to experience the consciousness of that love?

It reminds me of Erich Fromm's book, "The Art of Loving." In it he states that selfish people actually despise themselves, even though they appear to only love themselves. They feel that they are grossly incomplete and therefore focus all of their energy on filling that incompleteness, whether it's with objects or attention from others. On the other hand, people who love themselves feel that they are mostly complete and require little or nothing from outside to sustain their self-image. This gives them the ability to love others and eventually love all existence.

[Tayesin]

Beavis,
I agree with what you said.  When speaking about we and thinking, I am always referring to Us, the Soul/Being we are and not the physical brain.  And I see no reason why this connection we all share with the Creative force/source cannot provide physical manifestations.  For instance, when I need something I have no problems with having it manifest in the physical, except I don't seem to think big enough, LOL, so I only get exactly what I need and not more than.  Seems ordering what we desire is more about being extremely precise in the wording and intentions.

Berserk,
In all honesty Berserk, I really do think that god/creative source/whatever doesn't give a hoot about us, nor does it require adoration or veneration from us.

The reason for this is quite simple, I think.  We are the one's who make all the choices about Experience and Incarnations without the need to refer to the Source, we are free to choose anything we wish, to experience anything that is available in the Earth world.  We in turn do so and provide the Source with Experience of Itself, this is all that is required from us.

All the religionists views of needing to worship the creator is ancient belief system stuff, and certainly will not apply where we are all heading.

Although I do understand the probable need for us to be aware of the provisions of the source and to be accepting/thankful for that...  otherwise we in effect are removing ourselves from the benefits of manifestation and creation.  But this is not worship.

[beavis]

I see no reason why this connection we all share with the Creative force/source cannot provide physical manifestations. For instance, when I need something I have no problems with having it manifest in the physical, except I don't seem to think big enough, LOL, so I only get exactly what I need and not more than

It does physical things. Telekinesis is one of the most noticable.

You can try to think big, but you dont have unlimited power. Your amount of psi at the moment limits what your spirit can think.

[Gandalf]

the need to worship

oriental despotism.... you find that religions reflect the socities that formulated them.
Religons and faiths change and develop... either that or new ones come to replace them...
Trying to write a 'set in stone' set of divinely guided ethics and law is ridiculous as they end up being hopelessly outmoded resulting in ridiculous mechanisms for fitting them in with developing modern conceptions, just as you get from people like 'Beserk' and others.

It is no suprise that the greatest advances in justice, morality and ethics have been secular ones, and the greatest advances in these have been in the last few hundred years of the enlightenment.
One of the greatest advances of the enlightenment was the abolition of slavery  and its rejection as an ethically acceptably idea.
This is something christianity failed to do.. in fact it actually reinforced slavery as an insititution... using the slave/master conception in their attitude to god and his creations... in the original greek version of Paul's letters for example, he does NOT describe himself and his fellow believers as 'servants' of the 'lord' but as 'slaves' of the 'master' (Dominus), somthing that came across as too extreme for later translators.

The idea of democracy, another secular idea, goes against the very idea of the oriental despot god... who is the opposite of democratic... he views himself as above it.. all the last judgement ideas talk of him coming and disolving all governments and establishing his despotic rule on earth.. again this goes against the grain with many people today... and indeed islam takes this idea to its logical and insane conclusion... that democracy. the 'rule of man' conflicts with the 'rule of god' and therefore has no place...
Many christians too would prefer the idea of a christian theocracy if they could have got away with it... luckily secular philosophy and ethics have tempered christianity over the years and have prevented this from becoming dominant in today's world.

Will people be allowed to vote in god's new kingdom?


Douglas

[daidaluz]

This is what's God is to me

Have you ever gone to some natural landscape , away from people?.
What have you felt?
I always feel harmony, order, energy, perfection, etc.  I think this qualities are present not just in nature, but all over the whole Universe.  Is the spirit of creation.

     I think this is the spirit of God, and our consciousness is the receiver of this Spirit.

[greatoutdoors]

Daidaluz, oh very well put!    I agree -- where people are not, perfection is! I don't pretend to understand it, but I have certainly experienced it -- if my Muir Woods posts are still around, they tell one story.

Gandalf, I'm sorry. I promised myself I would stay positive, but sheesh! First, slavery has not been abolished. It is alive and well in our world this very minute. Second, it was not "enlightenment" that led to the abolition of slavery in the US in the Civil War era (I'm assuming that's what you were referring to), it was economics and politics, a/k/a money and power. The names have changed, the motivations have not.  

This is something christianity failed to do.. in fact it actually reinforced slavery as an insititution.

If you must pick on individual religions, then let's share the wealth. Muslims have a large hand in the slave trade, historically and geographically, right up to the present day. Hindus aren't blameless either -- their "untouchables" live in virtual slavery, they just don't wear the name.

Okay, I apologize, I am really not picking on you!  It's just one of my "hot" buttons. Information on modern slavery is scattered all over National Geographic, Smithsonian Magazine, etc. You just won't find it on the evening news.

As to the nature of God, I am content with that perfection of nature Daidaluz mentioned. Was it John Campbell that wrote about the mythology of religion? Almost everything I see and hear is simply a manifestation of humankind's desire to have a parent to run to for protection and solace -- someone to "kiss it and make it well". And that's okay, if we could just get past fighting about whose mythology is "right".  

[Gandalf]

greatoutdoors

Hey, i agree with your points as well!

Douglas

[Telos]

God is an atheist.

Think about it. He didn't believe in himself, that's why he needed to create people - so that they would believe in him and justify his existence.

Is there a name for this kind of theology? Theathiology?

[greatoutdoors]

Telos, have you ever read any Xanth books by Piers Anthony? If not, you might want to find the one that explains who/what "Xanth" is (I think it might be called "The Source of Magic" or some such, but it's one of the earlier ones). Interesting premise and sort of counterpoint to your thought. Anthony writes metaphorically, but the logic leap is not hard. Your point about God being an atheist because of some personal need hinges on "God" being similar to you and me. Maybeso, but I'm not puttn' money on it. I've had a couple of experiences with what I thnk might be "God" and, if it was, it's as much like us as a tornado is like a spring breeze.

Gandalf, thanks! I really don't like to risk hurting feelings, but I do believe in sharing knowledge. There's a lady at my work I discuss world affairs with periodically. When we began our dialogs she had me branded a "card-carrying conservative". It wasn't long when she told me one day "You're just full of contradictions!", and acknowledge she couldn't put a label on me. I took that as a compliment. All that by way of saying, there may be times you think I'm jumping on you over a matter, but be assured that's not the case. If I ask introspective questions, I am just trying to learn a bit about where the logic-chain originates.

[Telos]

greatoutdoors, thank you for that engaging response. I tried reading Xanth a couple years ago but I found it too "out there" and couldn't find a way to connect it to my life. If it's all supposed to be metaphor, then I read it incorrectly and will give it a second look.

Your point about God being an atheist because of some personal need hinges on "God" being similar to you and me. Maybeso, but I'm not puttn' money on it. I've had a couple of experiences with what I thnk might be "God" and, if it was, it's as much like us as a tornado is like a spring breeze.

Does that mean you'd say that the difference between us and God is a matter of degree and not quality?

[greatoutdoors]

Telos,

First, I hope your holidays were happy! I thoroughly enjoyed the days off, but am now faced with the first full week of work in awhile -- yuck! Oh well, salt mines and grist mills, and all that stuff...

Yes, the first few Xanth books were metaphorical. Since then he's gotten so much into the puns that I think he's writing primarily for that. Even the plots suffer in order to maximize the opportunity for puns. But that one on the source of magic is, at least to me, deeper than it may first appear.

As to God, from my experience, it is not just degree, although that's a part of it. So I guess you could say it's quality. There is something that is just outside of our normal perception that, when experienced, will absolutly knock your socks off! But I cannot tell you with certainty it's "God" -- I don't have a clue what it is. I'll give you two examples of what's happened to me. I'm sort of a semi-geek and was taking an exam for a computer certification once. I knew the material, but do have strong test anxiety. I'm staring at the screen, with no answers coming to my head -- call it full panic mode. All of a sudden,  I had this flash, and saw myself walking down a hallway with bunches of doors on either side. I "knew" each door was a question and it was easy to just turn the door handle and there was the answer. It was the strangest, almost "buzzy" feeling I've had lately, but I sailed through the rest of the test, no problem. Adrenalin overdrive? Higher self? God helping me out? I haven't a clue. But whatever it was "lifted" me from my normal "muddy" mindset into, pardon the pun, "crystal clarity." It didn't last but for a few minutes, just long enough to get me in back in the groove. And try as I might, I can't call it up again. Another instance was my visit to Muir Woods. I can't even begin to describe the feeling that place gave me. If you're interested, and I can find it, I can block and copy my earlier post on that experience. But again, it was just waaaay different, and that one was so incredibly blissful! I wondered then, and now, if I wasn't tapping into something the Druids might have experienced. I know I just barely touched -- "something."

And in case of question, I do not do drugs, alcohol, or anything else that will mess with my brain. I could discuss that subject for an hour or two, but will leave it at that.

[You]

Can I assume you only want to hear from those who believes in a god's existence?

[Potential]

I believe multiple gods exist, I just don't see the need for worshipping them.
If you look in the bible, it makes reference several times that if you want god to help you, you got to do it yourself first. If that's the case what do we really need him for?

[Potential]

Telos,
And in case of question, I do not do drugs, alcohol, or anything else that will mess with my brain. I could discuss that subject for an hour or two, but will leave it at that.

On contrary, everything you put (absorb) into your body, food or drink, even TV and Movies, and dirty looks given by others, and the way people speak to you have a direct effect on your brain, which alters the neurochemistry constantly.