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Author Topic: I know someone believes that OBE is against the will of god  (Read 15268 times)
jason
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« on: February 19, 2005, 21:13:41 »

Am I the only one here that finds religious fundamentalism to be incredibly stupid?

He didn't tell me directly,but he told my uncle,who then told me.I would like to use his computer to down load some bwgen stuff,but I guess I can't now  cheesy
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CaCoDeMoN
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« Reply #1 on: February 19, 2005, 21:27:35 »

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I know someone believes that OBE is against the will of god
Am I the only one here that finds religious fundamentalism to be incredibly stupid?

He didn't tell me directly,but he told my uncle,who then told me.I would like to use his computer to down load some bwgen stuff,but I guess I can't now

I believe that it's against God's will too. But only conscious OOBEs, not spontaneous. Somewhere in Old Testament it's written that people should not engage in any kind of witchcraft, and should not tolerate it. OOBE is certainly a witchcraft practice...
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« Reply #1 on: February 19, 2005, 21:27:35 »

logoVisit the website of Astral Pulse creator Adrian Cooper.

Home of the best selling book Our Ultimate Reality.

Astral Projection, Metaphysics and many other subjects.

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karnautrahl
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« Reply #2 on: February 19, 2005, 21:27:37 »

Yes, but try to love them anyway-because you surely can't fix them smiley.

Honestly, I do try, and try..but the intense irritation they cause me is hard to contain sometimes smiley
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karnautrahl
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« Reply #3 on: February 19, 2005, 22:04:14 »

I don't believe this idea of "God's" will. If the "Creator" was that bothered he/she would have stepped in long ago to make sure we understood. Since we have total free will-to me that implies what I felt the other day (detailed elsewhere) that ALL judgement lies within us...not in the hands of another.
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CaCoDeMoN
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« Reply #4 on: February 19, 2005, 22:16:22 »

Quote

I don't believe this idea of "God's" will. If the "Creator" was that bothered he/she would have stepped in long ago to make sure we understood. Since we have total free will-to me that implies what I felt the other day (detailed elsewhere) that ALL judgement lies within us...not in the hands of another.

All judgement lies in the hands of a government  Smiley
Seriously, I have interesting theory:
(This is not intended to offend anyone)
Many gods claim that they created universe. What if Christian/Jewish God(YHWH) is only one of them and not a creator? This would explain many things found in Bible...
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« Reply #4 on: February 19, 2005, 22:16:22 »



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intergalactic
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« Reply #5 on: February 20, 2005, 03:42:17 »

My good friend Satan said it is perfectly alright. wink If God exists I think he understands.
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CaCoDeMoN
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« Reply #6 on: February 20, 2005, 07:59:37 »

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My good friend Satan said it is perfectly alright.

Friend?  shocked
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jason
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« Reply #7 on: February 21, 2005, 23:22:45 »

What I don't understand at this point is how anything can be against the will of god (assuming such an entity exists).

If I were able to challenge the will of god ,I Would have to be a god myself,instead of an infinitely tiny portion of the universe.
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« Reply #8 on: February 21, 2005, 23:47:26 »

I think of it this way, if  conscience OOBE was against the Christian God's will, then he wouldn't have allowed humans to have the ability.

This is only my opinion. Not trying to anger anyone...  Smiley
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beavis
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« Reply #9 on: February 22, 2005, 00:02:11 »

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Am I the only one here that finds religious fundamentalism to be incredibly stupid?


no
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Ivanda
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« Reply #10 on: February 22, 2005, 02:08:44 »

I wonder why these things are hidden from us?

Maybe we are supposed to learn our lessons here-- in the physical world, maybe too much knowledge takes the sense out of our physical existence?

But then on the other hand how about NDE? Ppl die,  meet God and are sent back changed. I am a little confused, I admit...  At least meditation should not be against God`s will, because for many ppl it a way to know God better, just like the  prayer.
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intergalactic
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« Reply #11 on: February 22, 2005, 03:33:09 »

Love is the law love under will.

Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law.




 Cool
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Quantitativefool
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« Reply #12 on: February 22, 2005, 03:41:45 »

I believe this is a higher way to experience God not against it, Just my thoughts.

-Stu
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karnautrahl
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« Reply #13 on: February 22, 2005, 07:31:43 »

There is no judgement, only the one we create in our minds. Nothing wrong with attempting work that involveds apparent "rules" of reality that get further out there than convention normally acknowledges.

Any creator would be interested in the experience as the this creator is everything that exists anyway. That's the nearest I will come to pinning my beliefs to one place LOL. Because I won't say I'm dead sure, thats just the nearest feeling and intuition I have smiley
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beavis
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« Reply #14 on: February 22, 2005, 08:17:20 »

not that lessons junk again...

just cause its hard doesnt mean somebody designed it that way
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Mustardseed
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« Reply #15 on: February 22, 2005, 09:49:37 »

I am not sure why I write this, but somehow I feel like .....somebodody gotta say something. All the one liners all the jokes and the down putting and cocky "smartness", just rubs me the wrong way. I may not agree with Fundamentalism, but to throw out every single one of their points and not take them serious at all, seems very foolhardy to me.

They believe that God exists, and since we can not know for sure, it is indeed a possibility. If so, then there also might be a Devil, and if there is a Devil then ..................

It just seems too stupid to dismiss the idea of God existing, just because one does not want to acknowledge a God in ones own life, and stands to reason that God most likely exists whether one believes in Him or not.

How he views OBE APs etc how one keeps up contact with "Him/Her/It" and learns and grows that is quite another thing and a different discussion.

Thats all.

Regards Mustardseed
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karnautrahl
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« Reply #16 on: February 22, 2005, 12:17:18 »

I have little trouble with an "entity" that created all, God/Deity/Source whatever label fits I guess.

I find it very hard to really listen to someone when they are extremely fundementalist in nature because I know that they certainly are unlikely to listen to anything outside of their box.

I gave up on all systematic religions years ago, now I only delve into their cultures a little to pick up specific techniques-such as kundalini yoga, tantra, taoist energy practice etc. Yes that makes me sound non spiritual pretty much-which is true. I do energy work and healing for several reasons-health, I like the feeling and I enjoy the feedback if a healing goes well.  So really I'm a technician I guess and I'm not paying an awful lot of attention to the rest of the stuff smiley.  

That said I've had a few experiences involving tears of joy and crown strobing etc that convince that yes there is something greater. I don't believe I need anyone's belief system to get in touch with that being..well it's the other way around really isn't it. Allow myself to be touched by that Being, whenever it sees fit maybe? I guess that sounds less arrogant and fits my experience far better...

If the fundementalists God does exist-I'm positive something Creator like does though it might be everything-it does NOT logically follow that the Devil exists too. Sorry but that's not even an arguement on their part. It's just a statement.  I get annoyed with various fundementalist viewpoints that insist I must have "their" faith in order to touch what they would call God. In the politest way possible that's ****. smiley.

That comes from the heart, I don't need other groups constructs to allow this to touch me. I just need to feel from the heart and soul. The other nonsense has become meaningless...sorry if this is quite strong and opinionated also but this is a personal truth for me and I'm not trying to convince anyone else that it must be true for them.  That would be wrong.
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Ivanda
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« Reply #17 on: February 22, 2005, 13:46:06 »

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not that lessons junk again...


They are real for me...  I'm not saying they are real for everyone.  I believe in God, so for me nothing is coincidence.
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jason
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« Reply #18 on: February 22, 2005, 22:00:51 »

Quote from: karnautrahl
I have little trouble with an "entity" that created all, God/Deity/Source whatever label fits I guess.

I find it very hard to really listen to someone when they are extremely fundementalist in nature because I know that they certainly are unlikely to listen to anything outside of their box.

I gave up on all systematic religions years ago, now I only delve into their cultures a little to pick up specific techniques-such as kundalini yoga, tantra, taoist energy practice etc. Yes that makes me sound non spiritual pretty much-which is true. I do energy work and healing for several reasons-health, I like the feeling and I enjoy the feedback if a healing goes well.  So really I'm a technician I guess and I'm not paying an awful lot of attention to the rest of the stuff smiley.  

That said I've had a few experiences involving tears of joy and crown strobing etc that convince that yes there is something greater. I don't believe I need anyone's belief system to get in touch with that being..well it's the other way around really isn't it. Allow myself to be touched by that Being, whenever it sees fit maybe? I guess that sounds less arrogant and fits my experience far better...

If the fundementalists God does exist-I'm positive something Creator like does though it might be everything-it does NOT logically follow that the Devil exists too. Sorry but that's not even an arguement on their part. It's just a statement.  I get annoyed with various fundementalist viewpoints that insist I must have "their" faith in order to touch what they would call God. In the politest way possible that's ****. smiley.

That comes from the heart, I don't need other groups constructs to allow this to touch me. I just need to feel from the heart and soul. The other nonsense has become meaningless...sorry if this is quite strong and opinionated also but this is a personal truth for me and I'm not trying to convince anyone else that it must be true for them.  That would be wrong.


good post. Smiley  I also find that I don't need any "group constructs" of religion in order to feel and develop a spiritual connection.What I find to be lacking in every religion is the narrow-minded viewpoint of what a higher power could be.The typical god image in religions everywhere is,to me, pathetically simplistic.

What you said earlier about the only judgement coming from within-that really rings a bell-Someone who feels that OBE is against gods will isn't (cannot) speak from experience,but simply from a projected fear of the unknown.A person who subscibes to a neatly packaged religion belief system might feel safe within that construct,and anything falling outside could immediately be labeled "evil" due to the narrow and fragile world view that religious dogma can create.

When the true unknown and the infinite come knocking on their door,their religious construct can collapse like a house of cards.
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« Reply #19 on: February 22, 2005, 22:17:27 »

karnautrahl and jason, these are two very good posts. Cheesy
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« Reply #20 on: February 22, 2005, 22:26:55 »

I beleive god wants us to OBE. Because the side-effects make us more spiritually aware so we can be closer to him.

Also, why would god give us the gift to be able to OBE, if he never intended us to do so?
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« Reply #21 on: February 22, 2005, 23:46:59 »

Quote from: beavis
Quote
Am I the only one here that finds religious fundamentalism to be incredibly stupid?


no
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karnautrahl
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« Reply #22 on: February 23, 2005, 00:02:06 »

Thank you GuardianMasterAngel smiley. Your appreciation is appreciated.
Now I just hope to get the oppurtunity to connect again to whatever it was smiley.
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« Reply #23 on: February 23, 2005, 02:15:49 »

Quote
I believe god wants us to OBE. Because the side-effects make us more spiritually aware so we can be closer to him.


Well said!

Well, after starting to practice meditation and OBE I feel so much more energized and peaceful..I do feel closer to God, indeed.

Also I do not understand people who claim that we try to escape reality by doing all these things. I find that I am able to cope with my work and everyday activities much better now instead of trying to run away.
 Smiley
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beavis
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« Reply #24 on: February 23, 2005, 06:15:02 »

Quote
Ivanda: Maybe we are supposed to learn our lessons here-- in the physical world.
Me: not that lessons junk again...  
Ivanda: They are real for me... I'm not saying they are real for everyone. I believe in God, so for me nothing is coincidence.


I've got a problem with the idea that we're puppets sent here to do one thing or an other. I'm not a puppet. I choose what I want to do. If you think somebody can make me learn a lesson, what would they do if I randomly decided to die and never come back to earth? Or what if I make it my business to make sure nobody else learns these "lessons", or even get them to learn the opposite? Just call me Satan!

Quote
RTCovenant: Also, why would god give us the gift to be able to OBE, if he never intended us to do so?


Why would god give us the intelligence to build nuclear bombs if he didnt want us to kill everybody? I dont see your logic.




I dont ignore everything religous fundamentalists say, just the things relating to or derived from fundamentalism, which for some, is everything they say. PRAIIIIISE the LOOOOOOOOOORD or DIE!!!! I dont want those things poisoning my mind. I've spent too much time ridding it of lies.
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