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John Edward! Fraud or Not? Post opinion!

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timeless

Dear goingslow,

In reference to your comments to Adrian.  In our quest to attain enlightenment, it is almost irresistable to try to see trends, make assumptions, make judgements.  These are then used to create guidelines and rules (known as spiritual materialism).  Unfortunately rules and guidelines do not get us where we need to go.  If this were true then religion (the ten commandments etc.), new age rules would have enlightened most of us by now.  

So the question becomes what does help us acheive enlightenment?  My guess is conquering ego, shadow, and attaining full understanding of self.  Using judgement on self.  The mess most of us never want to dive into and fix.  BUT my guess is as good as yours...right?[;)]  

You do make a person think.  Maybe I will ask you to be my guide in the next lifetime.  You will not allow me to get away with anything.[;)]  If I do listen to you I might reach escape velocity.  You know how much I respect and like you.  So, I hope you know that while I am half joking...I am half not joking.  You would make a good guide.  Spiritual materialism is a big trap that is hard to avoid. A good guide constantly jabs us when we step too close to the covered pit.

Much Love,
timeless[:)]

Nay

I have to agree with Goingslow on this one..  I believe JE is helping thousands of ppl.. and geez you have to make a living doing something..why not doing what you enjoy and are good at?  I go to another forum that is full of ppl that have had readings by JE and it has helped them in many, many ways.  Alot of the ppl that have been featured on the show are on the forums as well.  And they swear there are things that he could have not known...And if they can live another day without the pain of the loss of a loved one..well, that is all that matters..
I personally did not get read at the seminar but found the experience quite enjoyable!  I hope to go to another and another and another..now if I could just somehow get him to come to Ga again..lol

Nay. [;)]

Nay

Forgot to say..Thank-you curiousgirl for your input.!

And Timeless, you know I like you too..but sometimes you say alot and nothing at the same time..lol.. I just couldn't crasp it..perhaps it is my low attainment of enlightenment...[:(]
I feel like the student of a "master" whom was just given a riddle to figure out..

Nay. [;)]

timeless

Dear Nay,

I was referring to Goingslow's comments to Adrian.  I will go back and clarify.  My writing skills need work.  Who says I'm enlightened? I've had some experiences that SEEM to indicate some degree of what some people call enlightenment but frankly that doesn't mean much...not really.

Best Regards,
timeless

Adrian

Greetings Goingslow,

quote:
Originally posted by goingslow
One thing I find fascinating about you adrian is your ability to tell everyone who is and who isn't spiritually aware.  what exactly are the prerequisites not for being spiritually aware yourself but to judge exactly how advanced another person is.

Your posts are filled with judgements on other people's spirituality.  Ever notice that?



I would never make judgements specifically on who is and who isn't Spiritually aware, and if you can produce the links to posts where you think I have done this I would like to see them. It most certainly is not my intention I assure you.

To correct your observation on the context of this post, I was not judging whether John Edward or anyone else is Spiritually aware or not - of course I do not know - I was rather saying, if you read my post again, that genuine psychics who are in contact with people and other beings in the Astral should be spiritually  aware almost by definition.

I also said that I do not know whether John Edward is genuine or not, but I am sure that many so called psychics who perform before audiences for money, preying on bereaved people are not genuine.

And of course John Edward is being paid! How much do you think the TV company is paying him?

With best regards,

Adrian.
https://ourultimatereality.com/
Vincit Omnia Veritas

xgoz

Wow, thanks for all the replies. I did the best I could to count up the votes and it looks like its 5 to 7 in favor of NOT A FRAUD. But if anyone else would like to voice their opinion It could certainly turn to FRAUD. Thanks
xgoz

no_leaf_clover

You know, whether or not we believe he's a fraud or a real psychic doesn't really determine whether or not he actually is..
What is the sound of no leaves cloving?

curiousgirl

perhaps the point of the show is not to prey on the bereaved, but to comfort them (and the rest of us) and to show us that the afterlife does exist, and that our loved ones haven't just disappeared into nothingness.  

and i think he does do private readings, not just ones on tv in front of a full audience (not to mention he did a bunch of private readings for anonymous people in that one book i mentioned).  and some of the information john edward tells the people on the show is so specific, and so amazing because he comes up with stuff that no one in the family even knew about, until after the show and they did some research.  i mean, in some of these situations, john edward or the tv station would have to be paying all these people to lie and go along with whatever john edward says, and they'd have to keep finding people who were good enough actors to pretend they are grieving and amazed and all that.  

so, while i think there is something kinda peculiar about john edward, things seem to point toward his authenticity, unless there's a huge thing going on where all these people are being paid off to lie, even the scientific researcher who wrote that book.  and if it turns out to be all a big "jerry springer" lie, eventually one of those people will decide that it will bring them more money and publicity to uncover his falsehood than it does to lie for him (i mean, if they're willing to lie to the public for money, i doubt they'll have much qualms about backstabbing john edward).  i guess all we can do is wait and find out if there will be even more proof for or against him.

Tayesin


Hi All.

John Edwards does have a gift.  Many thousands of other people also have the same gift.  John has turned it into a hugely profitable deal, most others have kept it low key.

Personally, I do not understand why he charges so much for a reading and I wonderif he uses any of his massive income to do good works in the world. While in Australia he was charging $85 to sit in the audience and $9,500 for a one on one reading !!!!  To me that is way too excessive.

I see no reason why people cannot use their gifts to make a living for themselves if they charge reasonable prices that allow all socio-economic groups to access their abilities.  Unfortunately, John chooses to price at the top end of the market, as so many new age psychics and mediums are doing.

We have to ask also, does the population NEED to have messages passed on to them from the other side ?  Many people have said he provides 'closure'.  But, in the world we live in, Death is closure, and the living must continue on even if they do not understand the circumstances of a loved ones death.  That is the way it has always been.  And that is my fifty cents worth.[:P]

Love always.[:)]

Nay

Sorry to hear that Tayesin!  My tickets were only $45.00..[B)]

Nay. [;)]


xgoz

You would have to be crazy to spend $9,500!

goingslow

quote:
Originally posted by Tayesin


Hi All.

.

Personally, I do not understand why he charges so much for a reading and I wonderif he uses any of his massive income to do good works in the world. While in Australia he was charging $85 to sit in the audience and $9,500 for a one on one reading !!!!  To me that is way too excessive.



Love always.[:)]



either you're lying or misinformed.  His philosophy is he wouldnt charge more than he'd pay for a private reading.  In america he charges about 200 bucks.  I seriously doubt suddenly in australia its about ten grand.

ahh actually I edited this because I know what you're talking about.  If you go to certain sites (his site to be exact warns : DONT BUY TICKETS OFF OF EBAY). they will warn you about people who SCALP tickets to his show.  On ebay tickets have gone for 10 grand profiting off people who are desperate to hear from loved ones.  He doesn't make money off this.  Im not sure you know how this works but a person buys tickets to the show.  Its sold out.. they go on ebay or somewhere else selling his tickets for an outrageous amount.

I think you should be careful before you say he's selling it at that amount when it really isnt true.  You cant be that gullible.  There is a big difference.

goingslow

quote:
Originally posted by Adrian

Greetings Goingslow,

quote:
Originally posted by goingslow
One thing I find fascinating about you adrian is your ability to tell everyone who is and who isn't spiritually aware.  what exactly are the prerequisites not for being spiritually aware yourself but to judge exactly how advanced another person is.

Your posts are filled with judgements on other people's spirituality.  Ever notice that?



I would never make judgements specifically on who is and who isn't Spiritually aware, and if you can produce the links to posts where you think I have done this I would like to see them. It most certainly is not my intention I assure you.

To correct your observation on the context of this post, I was not judging whether John Edward or anyone else is Spiritually aware or not - of course I do not know - I was rather saying, if you read my post again, that genuine psychics who are in contact with people and other beings in the Astral should be spiritually  aware almost by definition.

I also said that I do not know whether John Edward is genuine or not, but I am sure that many so called psychics who perform before audiences for money, preying on bereaved people are not genuine.

And of course John Edward is being paid! How much do you think the TV company is paying him?

With best regards,

Adrian.




 

You may not say much directly but you hint and say a lot by beating around the bush.  I might take you up on the links thing if im bored but a few things come to mind.  You cant eat meat to spiritually advance,  Crowley wasn't a spiritually advanced man.. I mean look at him.  But I prob wont take the time out to link to these things.  If you dont think its something you do then its not a problem right?

Anyway this time your comment was "Genuinely Spiritually aware people do not usually become paid stage performers before large, often TV audiences. "

How did I misinterpret this?  You said spiritually aware people dont become paid stage performers.  ..tv audiences etc.  He does this..therefore he must not be spiritually aware?  I must have read too much into it.

you said he charges the audience.  Do you know how television shows work?  Do you know they make money off the commercials if your show is popular?  big money?  Sooo a spiritually advanced person would say "please no I cant accept.  CBS or NBC you keep my share.  Give me a break.

Im not sure if a lot of this is rooted in jealousy or what but what gives someone the right to say because a person does well in this world they must be a fraud.  What makes psychic gifts so much "higher" than an athletic gift.  If someone was given the gift of mathematical genius no one judges them for making money.  Musical gifts?

Its equating something we dont understand with something divine and judging people for doing well in this world.

I really think unless people here are as gifted.. with the chance to make money doing something than our everyday jobs which Im sure we all love and chose to do.  Then we decline the money because it just isnt spiritual we have no room to talk.

If Robert Bruce suddenly had 3 million fans and made a million bucks would he then have to decline it to be spiritual.  If they offered him a tv show where he talks about OBE would he then have to not accept profits and instead tell the networks who are making money " I cant accept".

Give me a break.  I see a lot of judging based on an opportunity not one person here would pass up.  To do this stuff for a living and a good one.  Is it that much more noble to make money sitting in an office making cash for your boss? Why?

goingslow

One last post then bedtime for me.  Just worked a few very long days.

Timeless,

I understood your post.. I think.  And thank you for the compliment at least I know part of that was one.  [;)].

I like that phrase... "spiritual materialism" and I agree with what you said.

hope things are going well.

curiousgirl


PeacefulWarrior

I just wanted to say that I agree with Adrian.  I do not know whether or not Edwards is genuine, but most of the truly gifted people I have met do not live lives in the spotlight or use their talents to make money.  

Sure Robert is making money off of the sales of his books, but at the same time he offered his advice for free for years before he ever wrote a book and furthermore, his book is not expensive and more than anything else it is truly helpful.

I have studied Edwards and he can be VERY convincing, at the same time, however, there are methods one can master to decieve.  

I would like to talk to someone who has known him as a life long friend or something like that.
Dan
We shall not cease from our exploration, and at the end of all our exploring, we shall arrive where we started and know the place for the first time.
T.S. Elliot
---------------
fides quaerens intellectum

PeacefulWarrior

I found this and thought I would post it for those interested in what people who don't believe in Edwards have to say:

John Edward is a psychic who is making headlines on television.  He has been on the Oprah Winfrey show, Larry King Live and a host of other well know TV programs.  Unlike the spiritualists of yore, who typically plied their trade in dark-room séances, Edward and his ilk often perform before live audiences and on television. Indeed, Edward (a pseudonym: he was born John MaGee, Jr) has his own popular show on the SciFi channel and CBS2 called Crossing Over, which has gone into national syndication.  Yes, he does claim to speak to the dead, and for that he charges $750 for a 30 minute private session and upwards to $100 for his convention style group sessions. My guess is that this multi-millionaire also speaks more frequently to his investment banker!

Spirit contact is growing today. People who have lost loved ones want to know that their deceased relatives are okay. People may seek advice from the departed loved one, but in most cases are subconsciously wanting to know what's in store for them one day.

What is spirit contact? It is contacting a disembodied being, whether it is believed to be a dead person, a being in another dimension, a spirit guide, a spiritual being, an advanced soul, a demon, a higher evolved Master, or any spirit. Spirit contact has been and is common in many cultures that contact dead ancestors and contact the spirit world for advice or for information on the future. In the United States, the religion of Spiritualism, which still exists, teaches that one can and should contact departed souls for advice. Those of you who have read my book know that I was once a spiritualist medium and I can attest with all certainty  that there is something on the "other side". I thank God that I was able to realize that this "something" were demons who were impersonating the departed. If you don't get anything else from this piece, please pay attention here: YES, the 'other side' can be contacted...I have personally done so. But the contact is not with your former loved ones, but demons of the Prince of Darkness.

The Messages from the Spirits: John Edward's show, "Crossing Over," was so popular on the Sci-Fi channel, that it 'crossed over' from cable to regular network. Edward approaches a section of the audience and starts giving his 'impressions' of what he is getting, whether it be a name, numbers, or a date, until someone responds with information that matches. He also asks the person questions as he tosses out 'clues' he says he is receiving. Sometimes it seems that he is throwing out very general information and that the person in the audience is filling in the blanks for Edward. Other times, Edward seems to be uncannily accurate.

Interestingly, it seems the dead have a hard time being very clear. For example, they may show Edward pink roses to say that everything is alright, according to Edward, or they may show Edward a flag to indicate their past patriotism in this life. It is sort of like a game of spiritual charades. One wonders about this. Why can't the dead just speak words to Edward, or write them out on a "spirit chalkboard" so to speak? James Van Praagh (another popular medium in the U.S.), in explaining the difficulty he has in interpreting the symbols shown to him by spirits, said that the recently deceased spirits were just learning to communicate, and so one could not expect all messages to be clear. This raises other questions: Why do recently dead people have trouble communicating? Where do they get these objects that they show Edward and Van Praagh? Why can't they just project their thoughts into Edward's mind? Why are their messages so prosaic and, well, boring? The picture one gets of these creatures certainly does not present a very interesting company of people to pass the time with. Why would these spirits have any special wisdom just because they are dead?

Though the spirits always claim to be happy and to be doing well (is Hitler also there with them, doing okay?), we do not know why they are happy and doing well. What do they do, exactly? And if they told us, how do we know it's true? How can we test these spirits to see if they are lying about anything or everything they tell the mediums? The answer is that we can't test them based on our own experiences since we haven't been to the other side. Only God really knows who these spirits are, and He has told us through the scriptures that they are really demons.

Note that the messages from the "dead," from the spirits, and from channeled entities never encourage people to believe the Bible, never urge people to trust Christ for salvation, and often openly contradict God's word or even speak derisively of Christ as Savior.
We shall not cease from our exploration, and at the end of all our exploring, we shall arrive where we started and know the place for the first time.
T.S. Elliot
---------------
fides quaerens intellectum

Tayesin


Hi All.

Nay, at the time the Australian dollar was at around 50 cents U.S., so that may account for the variation in audience ticket prices.  

Going Slow, misinformed..yes sometimes, Lying..never.  I was told the prices by people who attended his shows in Australia, and they payed $85 to sit in the audience.  It was the same people who asked how much for a one hour private session and were told $9,500.  Naturally they declined.  

Spiritual gifts are there to serve others, why else would we have them?  To serve ourselves?  If service to self and self-agrandisement were the primary goals to our incarnating here then I would have no problem with John becoming a Multi-Millionaire from what he does.  But, that is not the driving force behind incarnation is it??  

Someone recently said to me that John Edwards would have an experience that will change his motivation and he will free himself from the need to increase his personal wealth.  I look forward to it.

Love always.[:)]

Adrian

Greetings everyone,

I believe there is a big difference between making a full blown, highly lucrative business using spiritual abilities, irrespective of whether they are genuine, and selling books.

There are many reasons to charge a modest price for a book. First of all, in the case of Spiritual books such as those of Robert, the primary objective is to achieve as wide distribution as possible in order to help as many people as possible. The only way this can happen in this commercial world is for everyone in the chain from the publisher to the distributors, the books stores of all sizes and the major online retailers to be fully motivated to sell the book, and this is turn means everyone making a profit. The person who makes the least profit in fact is the author, who generally receives perhaps $1 per book sold. Contrast a book with a wealth of information which is owned and can be referred to forever with a ticket for a 60 minute TV show costing $85 or even a personal reading for much more. It should also be noted that authors actually need to live, feed and cloth their children, and generally continue to survive to write more books for the benefit of humanity.

It is fundamentally inappropriate to compare an author with genuine abilities and knowledge such as Robert with a highly paid stage psychic.

With best regards,

Adrian.
https://ourultimatereality.com/
Vincit Omnia Veritas

goingslow

LOL Adrian you really do crack me up.

So the break down is how much they make off their  books.  Here's a news flash JE makes most of his money off his books.  But he might get a better deal than RB.. you're right.. when you break down the percentages.

So John edward doesn't benefit humanity and he's not struggling just to feed his kids.  Apparently you didnt read the part where the tickets to see his television show are free and the money he receives from that are from the network.

Tell me Adrian, how many lives to I have left?  

almost every post you make has a "who is higher" feel to it.  It amazes me you dont see this.  

Again the Seminar.. free?  When does the importance of the books stop and the spirituality end.

In a way I envy you.  It would be kinda nice to sit around with these set formulas.  A book that benefits humanity. ahh spiritually aware and advanced.  You get offered a TV show .. obviously not spiritually aware.  That you broke it down to exactly how much profit they make off of a book and equate that to spiritual awareness really went above the call of duty.

Good job!

goingslow

quote:
Originally posted by Tayesin


Spiritual gifts are there to serve others, why else would we have them?  To serve ourselves?  If service to self and self-agrandisement were the primary goals to our incarnating here then I would have no problem with John becoming a Multi-Millionaire from what he does.  But, that is not the driving force behind incarnation is it??  





What do you care what someone else uses their gifts for?  Your path should be everyone elses?  Its a value judgement based on nothing but new age books which state its wrong to make money in this world.  That is unless you do psychic stuff as a hobby and are a CEO or engineer on the side.

Im staying off this topic now.  This degree of judgement on a person's spirituality kinda disgusts me and is an old topic not specific to John Edward.

Its based on new age BS which says everyone has to be the same.  A person struggling 9-5 making housecalls doing psychic work.  Cracks me up how a group of people who claim to "think outside the box" are so tied into New age philosophies on what a person should or shouldnt do to show their spiritual awareness.


Nay

Well, I still can figure out why it isn't ok to make money for your family but eh, whatever.

Peaceful, I did a google search and most of the links were negative!
So, I assuming that is where you got your info, which most of it was just not true..

Adrian, I wonder if Mr. Bruce would, if given the opportunity to be a highly paid stage OOB teacher, would jump at the chance?  Think of how many ppl he could reach and teach?  But alas he is just not that well known for that.  Oh, and John Edward wrote books before he became a "high paid stage psychic" That is how I found out about him and this was back when the section in the bookstores was still called "occult"..hehehe..

I have read all of JE's books and in "crossing over" he explains alot of reasons why things have happened the way they have happened..but I am going to take the time to re-read it and come back with more info.

In the mean time please go to this link I have provided.
http://www.johnedwardfriends.org/testimonials.shtml

Nay. [;)]





clandestino

Having never seen John Edwards before, I can only say with 99.9% certainty that he is a fraud.

All he is doing is repeating the famous old card trick where you "read someone's mind" by skillful use of language and narrowing down possibilities. It looks impressive done one-on-one, but looks like a sham in front of an audience, where the "magician" cannot fail !

Its the equivalent of asking everyone in an audience to think of a card...you know that at least one person will have picked it.

Unfortunately, the audience is normally biased in that it is made up of people who already "want to believe", and have paid money to participate, and are also too embarrassed to complain / deny / argue with the person on stage (a common factor with the roving sales you find in most towns...a man stands outside a shop with a loudspeaker promising bargains and whipping the crowd into a frenzy. When they receive bog standard goods, they are too embarrassed to complain.)

Personally, I think these kind of "entertainers" should be outlawed...however...

Hi Nay  !
quote:
I have to agree with Goingslow on this one.. I believe JE is helping thousands of ppl..

I agree, he is doing "good" in a roundabout kind of way - but is he merely telling people what they want to hear ? Is that morally wrong or right ?

Adrian, you beat me to it :
quote:
It is fundamentally inappropriate to compare an author with genuine abilities and knowledge such as Robert with a highly paid stage psychic.



Goingslow, I can see where you are coming from :
quote:
If Robert Bruce suddenly had 3 million fans and made a million bucks would he then have to decline it to be spiritual.

Obviously, the answer is no....why should he have to decline money to be spiritual ? I don't think you can draw this conclusion from the original post anyway; it doesn't follow on.
But there is a reason why he doesn't have such a massive fan base...he doesn't tell people that he can converse with their dead relatives.

Anyway, I'm off to get my palm read !!
Mark
I'll Name You The Flame That Cries

clandestino

hi Nay ! I'll take some time to look at your link later.

ps - to all those in favour of JE, I'm just putting across my opinion in my last post....I'm not out to make enemies of you guys !

kind regards
Mark
I'll Name You The Flame That Cries

goingslow

quote:
Originally posted by clandestino

Having never seen John Edwards before, I can only say with 99.9% certainty that he is a fraud.



Sorry thats all your post I read.

Some of this stuff is too funny.
Having never seen his show I can say how he does it.  He sits at the front of the stage yelling.  I have someone here who's name starts with an A.  An A and they gave a watch to someone in the audience.

One more thing what I was arguing here wasn't against anyone who has WATCHED him and even knows his name is Edward not Edwards and thinks he's a fraud.  Thats your perogative.  Its the ones whove never watched and who just know because.. well they just know.

Or the assumption which always comes up that if you're doing what he's doing you cant be real because.

1. Psychics who can do this thing are spiritually aware.

2.  Spiritually aware people dont profit off their talents even if they're getting the message across to a million more people.  They stay low key with small followings.  Its like when youre favorite band gets famous.  Sell out!

3.  You are not spiritually aware thus cant be psychic and real BECAUSE of the fact you're not a struggling psychic.  

The keys to figuring out another's spirituality.  Hmmm I dont think a book like that would sell millions.  You might be safe (to no one in particular [8)]