News:

Welcome to the Astral Pulse 2.0!

If you're looking for your Journal, I've created a central sub forum for them here: https://www.astralpulse.com/forums/dream-and-projection-journals/



Lord of the rings

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

WalkerInTheWoods

Right after I saw the first movie I went out and bought the whole set, Hobbit included. I personally like the Hobbit the best and I do suggest reading it to find out more about Bilbo and the Dwarves. The books are definately better and have a much more indepth story. Aragon and Arwen's (not sure how to spell their name's right now) story is not presented in the story like it is in the movie. You have to read the part after the Ring story in Return of the King to get all of it, as well as information on the Elves and much more. I was disappointed by the ending of the Two Towers because it did not end like the book does, but they say that it will be in Return of the King so that is cool.

The movies are better when it comes to the battles. I find reading about battles boring, but they are exciting to watch.

I am just curious how they are going to end Return of the King.
Alice had got so much into the way of expecting nothing but out-of-the-way things to happen, that it seemed quite dull and stupid for life to go on in the common way.

Kazbadan

Hello! I´m a fan too! I met Tolkien books at a long time go, ten years maybe.

Recently, surged many books pretending to be good as Tolkien books, but the true is, that none of them can be compared to Tolkien.

The books are delicious! The way that tolkien uses to describe the marvelous world that he built it´s fantastic!

Fallenangel, about the battles, i disagree with you. They are really nice in the movie but the book it´s very good too. You just need to concentrate and imagine all the battle happening in your mind.

The Balrog in the book, as i imagined him, it was much more scary and terrible (and not in a "cartoon" style). Even the Moria Mynes were better and scariest in the book. Indeed i think almost everything was best in the book. The only exception to this it was the lothlorien houses, they were very nice in the movie (but other aspects in the book were nice). And about the elven queen, i think that in the movie she was very beautiful. And i mean beatiful in an angelical way, not beautiful with a "pretty" mean, like a very atractive woman as Monica Belluci for example. She (the queen) was divinal, altought she had more a celtic look than an elfic one.

I forgot to mention the Nazguls, they were very scary in the movie, maybe more than in the book. Other good aspect of the movie were the beautiful landscapes from New Zeland.

About the battle with the ents, it´s a disapointment in the movie. In the book, as i saw it, the ents were machines of destruction (with a comic look) even stronger than the movie. And the battle was longer.

But even with all the critics, i enjoyed the movie very much.

Besides Tolkien there some good autors too, like Stephen Lawhead. Anyone like him? For me he is good (not so much as Tolkien), and the trilogy "The song of ALbion" (don´t know the exact translation from portuguese to english) it´s amazing. The history it´s original and very good. You must read it.

If you are a D&D player, it´s a must read the "Dragonlance" series. If you don+t know who the hell is Raistlin, you should buy the books imediatly!

I love you!

shaman

It looks like this one is a fan... Yes! he is a winner!

WalkerInTheWoods

That is a lot of rings! [:O]

quote:
Fallenangel, about the battles, i disagree with you. They are really nice in the movie but the book it´s very good too. You just need to concentrate and imagine all the battle happening in your mind.



You may be right, but personally I just don't find reading about the epic battles that interesting. Just me. I do enjoy the smaller fights like in Moria and I really enjoyed the Ents battle. But for me I am just not that fond of reading it when it comes to large groups fighting large groups. I guess I like reading about the individuals more. But I will try to be more imaginitive next time. [;)]

quote:
The Balrog in the book, as i imagined him, it was much more scary and terrible (and not in a "cartoon" style). Even the Moria Mynes were better and scariest in the book. Indeed i think almost everything was best in the book. The only exception to this it was the lothlorien houses, they were very nice in the movie (but other aspects in the book were nice). And about the elven queen, i think that in the movie she was very beautiful. And i mean beatiful in an angelical way, not beautiful with a "pretty" mean, like a very atractive woman as Monica Belluci for example. She (the queen) was divinal, altought she had more a celtic look than an elfic one.



One thing I kind of dislike is that I saw the movie first. When reading the books places, people, and things can look about anyway you want them too. But after having seen the movie, it influences how I see things while reading the books. That is the magic of books, having everything come alive in your mind. Seeing the movie first kind of takes away from that magic for me.
Alice had got so much into the way of expecting nothing but out-of-the-way things to happen, that it seemed quite dull and stupid for life to go on in the common way.

Tisha

I have a beautiful boxed set of Tolkein's writings from England (I'm an insane book collector; I even have a 1st ed. Gone With the Wind!). Anyway, I am sorry I saw the movie first, because it all looked like just a lot of fighting.  And fighting bores me (isn't all fighting the same battle anyway?).  So, I've always found something else to read (like the 12 books on the floor by my bed).  Someday, someday, I'll real Tolkein and blip over the battles.
Tisha

WalkerInTheWoods

quote:
Originally posted by Tisha

I have a beautiful boxed set of Tolkein's writings from England (I'm an insane book collector; I even have a 1st ed. Gone With the Wind!). Anyway, I am sorry I saw the movie first, because it all looked like just a lot of fighting.  And fighting bores me (isn't all fighting the same battle anyway?).  So, I've always found something else to read (like the 12 books on the floor by my bed).  Someday, someday, I'll real Tolkein and blip over the battles.



Actually fighting and battles are not that common in the books. They contain a lot more story than the movies. Read the Hobbit. I think there is only like one battle in it, but the group is getting into some sticky situations throughout.
Alice had got so much into the way of expecting nothing but out-of-the-way things to happen, that it seemed quite dull and stupid for life to go on in the common way.

Nick

I have to say that I've enjoyed both of the films so far, and am looking forward to the release of the third. While I have never read the books, I know that they have been popular long before the movies. In the late 1960's for example, just about everyone was talking about the books. A lot of people's pets were being named after characters in the books as well.

Maybe I'll give the first book a read. Also, congratulations fallnangell77 on reaching Premier member! [:)]
"What lies before us, and what lies behind us, are tiny matters compared to what lies within us...." - Ralph Waldo Emerson

WalkerInTheWoods

quote:
Originally posted by Nick


Also, congratulations fallnangell77 on reaching Premier member! [:)]



Thank you. [:)]
Alice had got so much into the way of expecting nothing but out-of-the-way things to happen, that it seemed quite dull and stupid for life to go on in the common way.

TheSeeker

The books are good, but I've read many fantasy books I thought to be superior, almost all I've read as a matter of fact.  Check out Robert Jordans' "Wheel of Time' series.

Oh, and I did read a Dragonlance series with Raistlin, cool stuff.

My all time favorite is a forgotten realms series about the dark elf Drizzt Do'Urden, there are about 15 books out now with im in it.. the first trilogy is 'The Dark Elf Trilogy'.

Kazbadan

TheSeeker: i wish i could have your luck, but i live in Portugal and that kind of books, like FOrgottens Realms, don´t exist. Sometimes i find books from Baldur´s Gaqte storys or the like, but they are not in my language, only in english and i don´t like read in english. It´s difficult and the reading won´t be fluid as in portuguese, since that it´s my mother tongue.

To other people: don´t see the movie first! Read the book, then see the movie! Maybe it´s better if you read the HObbit first. It´s a delicious book, with a more funny story, not so heavy as LtRings. And besides that, it´s the story that comes before LotR. THIS IS IMPORTANT READ IT: Do you think that Harry Potter its the best reading for childs ?! No way! Hobbit it´s from superior quality! They will love it! It´s a book from big people and little people. Well, Harry Potter it´s nice too!
I love you!

Gandalf

Well, how could I not post to this topic, esp. with my user name!!!!!


No prizes for guessing my favourite book!

About the movies, I know a lot of Tolkien fans complain about the movies, in that they miss out a lot of stuff and waste valuable time on pointless scenes that are not even in the book; however, most 'reasonable' fans realise that there has to be some kind of sacrifice if you want to see a 1000+ page novel turned into a movie, which we do!

So, I would just like to say that myself and most reasonable Tolkien fans *loved* the movie (the hardcore Tolkienites will never like any film version no matter how good).

However, just because I love the movies doesn't mean that I like everything they've done:

Bad points:

e.g. the utterly stupid 'Indiana Jones' sequence in Moria with the falling staircase, which goes on for about 15 minutes... snore!!
Not in the book, and not even in the script! It was added afterwards as PJ (the director) thought it was 'cool'. No it wasn't, it just made me press FF on my remote.

Gimli the dwarf turned into comic relief character... not in books, utter waste of a character AND a race.

Elves with pointed ears.  Well Tolkien fans are split on this issue, one camp (the majority) say they dont, the other camp think they do... Tolkien never says one way or the other, but in the book the main way to spot an elf is NOT their ears but rather their 'inner light', a kind of metaphorical spiritual thing which doesn't really translate into film very well. Anyway pointed ears just sends out images of D&D (inspired by Tolkien but 'vulgarised to some extent') which is not what is really wanted.

The omission of so many secondary characters but who are firm favourites with book fans; like Prince Imrahil, The Sons of Elrond, Tom Bombadil, Farmer Maggot, Fatty Bolger, Beregond, Haldir, Radagast, no sign of Glorfindal!!!, all the characterisation and interaction that is lost in the movie version, etc

In the same sense, the omission of important scenes in the novel:
The house of Bombadil, the Old Forest & old man willow. The meeting with Haldir and the other elves on the road in the shire, which is the other hobbits first encounter with elves, the fight on Weathertop between Gandalf and the Nazgul, The ommission of the beautiful scenes in the 'fire room' at Rivendell, Aragorn going to the hill of Cerin Amroth in Lorien:'the heart of elvendom on earth', etc

Ok, so I realise that these are due to time constraints so I accept it...

Other gripes: not enough mention of the human allies of Sauron.
People watching the movies would think that Sauron's army consists primarily of orcs... it doesn't...
All the lands of the east and south of Gondor are under the dominion of Sauron; these nomadic tribes including easterlings and southrons, make up a massive part of Sauron's army.

They are seen briefly in the Two Towers movie however, and we might see more of them in the final film.
Talking of the Two Towers, at Helms Deep, Saruman's army also consists of Dunlendings, men form a wild hill tribe to the west, who are enemies of Rohan; did anyone see any men in Saruman's army in the movie? No, because it must screw up the crap version of the movie storyline where Aragorn says that Saruman wants to 'destroy the world of men'

Actually he doesn't, he wants to rule over them (as a tyrant of course), as does Sauron for that matter, otherwise why would men fight on the side of a force that wants to 'destroy the world of men'... doh!

Tisha...Please please please DO NOT be put off by the battle scenes in the movies.... THE BOOKS ARE NOT LIKE THAT!  There are some battle scenes in the book but I can assure you that they are very much in the minority and are NOT what is great about this book... it really IS all about the other stuff!

Because the movies are appealing to blockbuster cinema viewers, all the fight scenes have been blown out of all proportion AT THE EXPENCE of all the good stuff!

The wars/fights are actually the smallest part of the book and are not what book fans remember the novel for... It is a sad fact that most people who have seen the movies now think otherwise!

Anyway, I'll stop now as I have been sounding far too sad for far too long and you all need a rest!

Regards Douglas,

PS I'm looking forward to return of the king, should be awesome!
But everyone... READ THE BOOKS, THEY ARE SO MUCH BETTER!










"It is to Scotland that we look for our idea of civilisation." -- Voltaire.

rodentmouse

ive just got up  to where pippin and merry escape  from the uruk-hai in the two towers, i must say that i prefer the  movie version of the orcs compared to the book.  In the  book  they  dont seem like the barbaric animal savages like they do in the movie,  for example they  are  having long  articulate civilised conversations in the book,  to me  this takes away  the  focus-on-death-and-pain feel they had in the movies.

Hephaestus

I enjoyed the two towers, my favourite bit in the film was when the trees attacked Sowrons base.

Mustardseed

interesting and certainly good intertainment. He was a good friend of CS Lewis from what I understand. Someone told me back in my hippie days that the landscape of Nepal was used as a background in his mind and that the sherpas were models for the Hobbits?
Words.....there was a time when I believed in words!

Gandalf

Mustardseed_
Really? I didnt know about that. I know he was good friends with CS Lewis and other members of the 'Inklings' literary fraternity at Oxford.

btw its interesting that much of the mythology of lord of the Rings is based on Tolkien's Catholic leanings, as well as anglo-saxon stuff...

You certainly notice the Catholic influence when you read the 'Silmarillion', Tolkien's account of the creation and First Age of Middle-earth.

At that time, the First 'Dark Lord' was called Melkor (later named 'Morgoth' which means 'great enemy')..
Melkor was one of the greatest and most powerful of the 'Valar' (the angelic/godlike beings sent to watch over the world on behalf of Eru, the One God; Eru took no part in the world after the creation but remained outside the universe, leaving the running of things to the Valar)

but Melkor rebelled and tried to possess Middle-earth for himself.
In those days Sauron (the enemy in lord of the rings) was but a servant, the leutenant of Morgoth.

Eventially after great wars, Morgoth was defeated and was cast into the Void.. 'but his chief servant was not found, and he later rose up like a shadow of his ancient master and followed him on the same ruiness path'...

Sound familiar?

Later, in the third age, powerful Maiia spirits (servants of the Valar) are sent to Middle-earth to contest the power of Sauron, and to rally support among Elves, dwarves and men against Sauron, although they were forbidden to match Sauron's power with force.
These spirits came therefor in the shape of men, 'old in years but stong in body'.

The chief of these and the one deemed the wisest was called Saruman by men (who later becomes corrupted in lord of the rings), and also others such as Radagast and Gandalf.

The Istari, as the wizards were known, are best described as 'incarnated angels' from a christian viewpoint.

btw Tolkien has explicitly denied on many occasions that his book is any kind of christian analogy or that Gandalf represents Jesus as some have claimed, but there is certainly some similarities.

Tolkien has stated himself that like the great anglo-saxon poem Beowulf, the lord of the rings is absolutly a pagan story, set in a pagan world with pagan characters, *BUT is infused with christian concerns*.

Regards,
Douglas









"It is to Scotland that we look for our idea of civilisation." -- Voltaire.

Mustardseed

Well ok then I will tell you the real story. When I was a hippie back in the 60s I lived in Nepal for a long time I traveled with a young man who was according to himself a very good personal friend of the Tolkien family. He was pretty messed up on drugs but told me of his close relatienship with someone he called Chrissy. Apparently someone close to Tolkien or related. I think he was either a grandkid or maybe it was a grand kid of CS Lewis. I dont know. Anyway he told me he had sat in on some of the first readings of the Lord of the rings, and was told that Mr Tolkien had recieved letters from other english stationed in India , discribing the country of Nepal and the entire region and was obsessed with the Nepalies. He himself had gone there (where I met him) to find the roots of the Hobbit. He sounded quite intense and trustworthy. I left him in Kathmandu and he went trekking up to Annapurna but we never met again. He entertained me for days with stories about the Tolkiens family and stuf and the Hobbit and all about how the whole story was developed by their family all together, with ideas from the kids attending, of whom he was one. If he was a liar he was good. Anyone who has ever traveled in Nepal or seen the Nepalies or Sherpas will certainly recognise them in the Movie. Thats all.
Regards Mustardseed
Words.....there was a time when I believed in words!

Gandalf

Wow!
amazing story Mustardseed!

You mention 'chrissy'... well, Tolkien's son is called Christopher.. he is now the editor of 'the history of middle-earth' series which publishes all of Tolkien's written material.

I wonder if its the same guy?

Douglas
"It is to Scotland that we look for our idea of civilisation." -- Voltaire.

Mustardseed

Aint got a clue it was along time ago. However I never read the Lord of the rings but only saw the movie and was impressed by the Hobbit they look like nepalies. He told me a lot of other things too If interested I would be glad to expound
Regards MS
Words.....there was a time when I believed in words!

WalkerInTheWoods

The books contain a lot more information about Hobbits than the movies, so you might enjoy reading them if you want to learn more about their culture and society. I have no knowledge about nepalies, so I cannot say about any similarities.
Alice had got so much into the way of expecting nothing but out-of-the-way things to happen, that it seemed quite dull and stupid for life to go on in the common way.

WalkerInTheWoods

What day is Return of the King being released? Anyone know?
Alice had got so much into the way of expecting nothing but out-of-the-way things to happen, that it seemed quite dull and stupid for life to go on in the common way.

Gandalf

December the 19th.........oh yeahhhhhhh!

Douglas




'Hinder me? Thou fool! No living man may hinder me!'
The Witch-King    
     -The Return of the King-

"It is to Scotland that we look for our idea of civilisation." -- Voltaire.

Gandalf

Don't know if anyone's heard the news but Rings director Peter Jackson has apparantly cut out Saruman's final scene from Return of the King.

Christopher Lee is probably one of the best talents they've got working on those movies and he's been a lifelong Tolkien fan who has waited years to appear in a movie version of the book.

Then, after persuading him to do so, Jackson proceeds to dump on him from on high.... very nice!

May Tolkien rise from the grave and smite down the heathen Jackson!

The only reason people went along with Jackson is that he claimed to be making a movie version that would be 'a faithful adaption'.
Thw last two films have shown otherwise and this new revelation seems like the final insult....

Douglas


"It is to Scotland that we look for our idea of civilisation." -- Voltaire.

Nagual

I heard that Saruman will be in the extended/director's cut version... $$$ [|)]
If electricity comes from electrons, does morality come from morons?

WalkerInTheWoods

After I saw the second movie I got a bad feeling about the last one. I can't believe they are cutting Saruman. I guess they have to make room for the love story and all the special effects they will be adding.
Alice had got so much into the way of expecting nothing but out-of-the-way things to happen, that it seemed quite dull and stupid for life to go on in the common way.

rodentmouse

any LOTR  fans  here?

i saw  the movies and bought the books, ive just finished  the fellowship and am about to start the two towers,  im loving  gollum too.

It  just suddenly  came to me when i watched the movies  how great  it all is,   i want  to show my appreciation.

return of the king is  out  in december,  im looking forward  to it.