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Question about lower astral beings and demons.

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Astral-Trea

Hi all,

I posted this hear cause I didn't know where the appropriate place would be to ask about this. I have been pondering some things lately that I wanted to ask the community to give some insight on.

There are those who believe that demons exist and are evil, others believe that demons are just lower astral entities, and others believe there are no good or bad entities, just different levels of vibration.  I really don't know which is the right answer, but I think it is safe to say that lower entities DO exist and that some could be pretty nasty.

There are alot of alleged cases of "demons" who terrorize people in the physical world, causing physical harm to some of them, haunting them.. in these cases, priests or demonologists end up saying that these demons have specific names and perform exorcisms to banish them etc...

I have heard people in the ghost investigation circuits and demon circuits saying that the difference between a ghost and a demon is that a demon has never been human.

So I started pondering a few questions.. are demon's just another form of lower astral entities? And then a bigger question: Why do lower astral entities and/or demons exist??

What I mean is, if we all come from source and we reincarnate over and over living our lives to learn lessons to eventually return to source, then what purpose is there for source to create these lower entities?

I suspect some may say that these cases of demon attacks on physical people are not real or something else all together, if so what?

I realize this may be a very deep and big question.. maybe too big.. but I would like to hear people's opinions on it either way... :D

Bedeekin

I personally have never been harmed regardless of what problems I might have encountered. Nor have I seen what i would consider 'demons'.

This information is the current understanding and what I can ascertain personally....

Non-physical entities that display negative aspects can't really interfere with this one. They aren't allowed nor do they possess the ability to do so. They simply don't have those privileges. They can't possess us any more than we can possess them. You are specific to your body.

"Why do lower astral entities and/or demons exist??"

Why do nasty people exist in this reality? The nonphysical isn't perfect... very much like this one. It contains extreme variations of beauty and horror.

"if we all come from source and we reincarnate over and over living our lives to learn lessons to eventually return to source, then what purpose is there for source to create these lower entities? "

reality doesn't create predisposed murderers... they become murderers through their environment and upbringing... also there are other factors obviously... this goes for nonphysical residents also. They are doing the same thing as us.

This reality is just a constrained pattern of the wider reality with much stricter rulesets.

Most perceived possessions and encounters with demons take place during Sleep Paralysis. This state offers your fear and imagination to go wild together.



majour ka

#2
Hey Tea,

The only demons that exist are peoples inner demons lol. There really is no such thing, or evil spirits. Its all fiction.

The spirit world told me recently that as we develop our good, kind, spiritual side so our light grows. The more intense our light the higher the frequency we can exist at in the next life. So in short if when a person leaving this life their light is less bright and more dim then they wont be able to reach or experience areas of higher frequency. Until they progress.

The astral plane is an emotional plane that is a reflection of our subconscious and is not the level of existence of the spirit world. At least as spiritualist medium that is how I have come to understand and believe it works. In the astral we will experience reflections of our own subconscious belief and possible fears.

Hope that helps  :-)

Astral-Trea

Quote from: majour ka on November 13, 2012, 18:25:43
Hey Tea,

The only demons that exist are peoples inner demons lol. There really is no such thing, or evil spirits. Its all fiction.

The spirit world told me recently that as we develop our good, kind, spiritual side so our light grows. The more intense our light the higher the frequency we can exist at in the next life. So in short a person leaving this life and their light is less bright and more dim then they wont be able to reach or experience areas of higher frequency. Until they progress.

The astral plane is an emotional plane that is a reflection of our subconscious and is not the level of existence of the spirit world. At least a spiritualist medium that is how I have come to understand and believe it works. In the astral we will experience reflections of our own subconscious belief and possible fears.

Hope that helps  :-)

Very interesting.. so would that mean that everyone starts out as a low astral entity, then somehow eventually begins to encarnate and reincarnate when they reach a certain level on the spirit plane? And I guess also if in a life, you develop inner demons, maybe you murder and rape women, etc etc.. then when you die you will go down in vibration and have to work your way back up?

In this example, it almost brings into play the Hell beliefs... some people say hell doesnt exist which I believe is true.. but we create our on hell maybe? If that is true, then there would be punishment in this way for doing bad things in life, and rewards for being good.

Or maybe I am looking at it too 3-dimensionally..

Astral-Trea

Quote from: Bedeekin on November 13, 2012, 17:46:48
I personally have never been harmed regardless of what problems I might have encountered. Nor have I seen what i would consider 'demons'.

This information is the current understanding and what I can ascertain personally....

Non-physical entities that display negative aspects can't really interfere with this one. They aren't allowed nor do they possess the ability to do so. They simply don't have those privileges. They can't possess us any more than we can possess them. You are specific to your body.

"Why do lower astral entities and/or demons exist??"

Why do nasty people exist in this reality? The nonphysical isn't perfect... very much like this one. It contains extreme variations of beauty and horror.

"if we all come from source and we reincarnate over and over living our lives to learn lessons to eventually return to source, then what purpose is there for source to create these lower entities? "

reality doesn't create predisposed murderers... they become murderers through their environment and upbringing... also there are other factors obviously... this goes for nonphysical residents also. They are doing the same thing as us.

This reality is just a constrained pattern of the wider reality with much stricter rulesets.

Most perceived possessions and encounters with demons take place during Sleep Paralysis. This state offers your fear and imagination to go wild together.




Thanks for that info. About the so called "demon attacks" being sleep paralysis or fiction.. I have found alot of documented cases where people were having a haunting in their home that turned somehow physical where they felt burning on their back, took photos or had a camera rolling during a paranormal investigation, and found that their back had materialized scratches on them. Other than that type of stuff, I dont know that there are any other attacks I could speak of.. I just wondered how you would explain those type of incidents.. I haven't experienced anything like this so I can't back up these claims.. some of what I have seen has been on TV so I guess you could say it was faked and edited to make it look like something happened.

As for things like "possession" I tend to believe that these were mostly early cases of mental illness that were misunderstood and some now that are still misunderstood. Although, there are alot of claims of "possessed people" being able to speak ancient dead languages that they would have no way of knowing.. again, these could be just hoaxes meant to instill fear in people.

To me, if these things didn't exist, it would make alot more sense to me.. because we all know about lower astral entities but they shouldn't be able to do things like this as you said.

Bedeekin

I just think that we tend to fixate on the nonphysical using dogma created projections.

Skin is very prone to intentional thought... look at stigmata... which appear on both wrists in some... or the centre of the hand in others. This I guess depends how knowledgeable the person afflicted is about the way people were crucified. Look at psoriasis, which can be effectively treated by placebo... 99% of the time. Hypnosis is another.

Using 'outside' influence to describe these things... projecting anthropomorphic dogma related tags like 'demon' 'Djinn' or 'Incubus' only leads to a disempowering of ones OWN mind. It is amazing how your intent can control your physical. It is amazing that we can manifest our own fears... and equally amazing that we can rid them without the need of a religion or faith.

I don't mean to be annoying but how can someone identify a 'dead' language if it's dead? I doubt the priest and family present would be able to identify a long lost archaic language. Thinking more nonphysically there is no reason why a person can't drag up the past memory of a lost language.

It always seems to be religious families who have possessions. This alone makes me dubious.  :-)


Astral-Trea

Quote from: Bedeekin on November 13, 2012, 20:04:19
I just think that we tend to fixate on the nonphysical using dogma created projections.

Skin is very prone to intentional thought... look at stigmata... which appear on both wrists in some... or the centre of the hand in others. This I guess depends how knowledgeable the person afflicted is about the way people were crucified. Look at psoriasis, which can be effectively treated by placebo... 99% of the time. Hypnosis is another.

Using 'outside' influence to describe these things... projecting anthropomorphic dogma related tags like 'demon' 'Djinn' or 'Incubus' only leads to a disempowering of ones OWN mind. It is amazing how your intent can control your physical. It is amazing that we can manifest our own fears... and equally amazing that we can rid them without the need of a religion or faith.

I don't mean to be annoying but how can someone identify a 'dead' language if it's dead? I doubt the priest and family present would be able to identify a long lost archaic language. Thinking more nonphysically there is no reason why a person can't drag up the past memory of a lost language.

It always seems to be religious families who have possessions. This alone makes me dubious.  :-)



I agree alot of it probably is perpetrated by religion. I have heard the idea that maybe these people may be manefesting these things physically using their minds without knowing they are doing it.. I never used to believe that but now that I am going through this awakening process and realize what reality is, I can totally see that being true.

With the languages, I guess they call a language that isn't used anymore (but still exists in texts that are spoken and read by scholars) a dead language. But as you said, what is to say that isnt a form of channeling a past life.. and for that matter, what is to say the whole thing isn't channeling a former life where you were mentally ill, or multiple lives at once? I could say that would easily be looked at as a possession when it couldn't be explained by a current mental illness.

Since I mentioned mental illness here so much, I should go further and say I also believe some cases of mental illness are misdiagnosed... I think it is possible that people who hear "voices" and see things that "aren't there" could actually just be tapped into their natural abilities, but be so confused by it that it drives them mad.

Interesting take on this stuff.. I tend to agree with you on this I think. :)

Bordmb

#7
First allow me to explain that there are many types of negative entities. Some, such as demons, have been given power and even brought into existence by a collective belief in their presence and workings. Baal (Bael) is always my example as I, as well as my family, have had multiple experiences with "him." If you are ever unfortunate enough to come into contact with this particular entity, I advise you envision a white light and  know that you are protected as long as you believe so. Anyways, if you find yourself in his presence and he has revealed himself, simply ask how he came to be and I guarantee you will receive an answer along the lines of "I am the consciousness of the lambs in the field; I am the force which drives them to the wolf." That's just Baal for ya.

Now, as for another type of negative entity, there can come into existence masses of stored energy created by people themselves (As in a group of 1-3 individuals). This is the typical poltergeist or haunting. Don't get me wrong, it can be nasty, but these are more or less, psuedo-entities. They came into existence through built up negative energy and you can be rid of them simply by willing them away. (Easier said than done.)

For the last entity that I will discuss, I'll refer to the astral. Astral entities range from cute fairy like beings of good that simply help guide people in their travels, to beings that look like faceless vikings that wander aimlessly and pray on stray energy. They are dangerous and can definitely interfere with your travels, sometimes for months at a time.

In conclusion, I think it's about time I make a post on negative entities since it seems to have become a common topic.

AstralCody

I have seen a few entities outside of my body that looked rather... I don't know how to explain it. Lots of shadow figures, and they mean no harm at all. I was in sleep paralysis once (PS: I highly recommend reading bedeekins sleep paralysis topic you can find in the "out of body experiences" section in this forum. It's a sticky. Anyway I was in paralysis once and had a figure of a man sitting on my bed looking at me. Very shadow like, couldn't get a facial view. Then I also saw a skinny shadow E.T looking figure walk across my hall. Has anyone seen the movie signs? The birthday party scene where the alien walked across the alleyway? That's exactly what it looked like. I have had mediums say that I have nasty things around me at times, and I have also had mediums say that I have people who are helping me around me. She is a very good person, and medium. She described my grandpa to a T and never even saw him in this physical world when he passed away.

I strongly believe what Majour said though! Yeah I have had experiences where I ran into a few things that were... not so human like. But nothing ever hurt me.  8-)

Lionheart

#9
 The only time I encountered negative Astral Beings was during what I figured to be one of the many tests I have experienced in the NPR. This test had to do with recognizing and handling them in a nonviolent way. I must have passed, for they never returned!  :-)
Once in awhile in this Physical Reality I sense a negative energy, but just tell it to go on it's way and it does.
But, I definitely was not always like this. I knew a woman years ago that was convinced and convinced me that there was a Evil presence inhabiting her. I wish I knew what i do now though.

Astral-Trea

Quote from: Bordmb on November 13, 2012, 20:28:43
First allow me to explain that there are many types of negative entities. Some, such as demons, have been given power and even brought into existence by a collective belief in their presence and workings. Baal (Bael) is always my example as I, as well as my family, have had multiple experiences with "him." If you are ever unfortunate enough to come into contact with this particular entity, I advise you envision a white light and  know that you are protected as long as you believe so. Anyways, if you find yourself in his presence and he has revealed himself, simply ask how he came to be and I guarantee you will receive an answer along the lines of "I am the consciousness of the lambs in the field; I am the force which drives them to the wolf." That's just Baal for ya.

Now, as for another type of negative entity, there can come into existence masses of stored energy created by people themselves (As in a group of 1-3 individuals). This is the typical poltergeist or haunting. Don't get me wrong, it can be nasty, but these are more or less, psuedo-entities. They came into existence through built up negative energy and you can be rid of them simply by willing them away. (Easier said than done.)

For the last entity that I will discuss, I'll refer to the astral. Astral entities range from cute fairy like beings of good that simply help guide people in their travels, to beings that look like faceless vikings that wander aimlessly and pray on stray energy. They are dangerous and can definitely interfere with your travels, sometimes for months at a time.

In conclusion, I think it's about time I make a post on negative entities since it seems to have become a common topic.

And here I was thinking Bedeekin had given me all the answers lol. You approach this from a demonologist point of view which is great since I used that in some of examples.. What Bedeekin and Majour said makes sense when I think about it.. But if you are correct and demons are a type of negative entity.. Then i wnder if they will ever be anything other than that... Were they created for a purpose and will they always be the way they are or could they ever raise there vibration and evolve? I think nobody really knows..

I also wonder though.. It seems there must be a limited number of these demons since you mentioned one by name and it seems that is a recurring thing.. As there are records going way back with accounts of the same names over and over. These things either came from source for some purpose we dont understand, dont exist as we describe them, or have come into existance from a process of a spirit devolving for some reason.

Astral-Trea

Quote from: AstralCody on November 13, 2012, 20:38:23
I have seen a few entities outside of my body that looked rather... I don't know how to explain it. Lots of shadow figures, and they mean no harm at all. I was in sleep paralysis once (PS: I highly recommend reading bedeekins sleep paralysis topic you can find in the "out of body experiences" section in this forum. It's a sticky. Anyway I was in paralysis once and had a figure of a man sitting on my bed looking at me. Very shadow like, couldn't get a facial view. Then I also saw a skinny shadow E.T looking figure walk across my hall. Has anyone seen the movie signs? The birthday party scene where the alien walked across the alleyway? That's exactly what it looked like. I have had mediums say that I have nasty things around me at times, and I have also had mediums say that I have people who are helping me around me. She is a very good person, and medium. She described my grandpa to a T and never even saw him in this physical world when he passed away.

I strongly believe what Majour said though! Yeah I have had experiences where I ran into a few things that were... not so human like. But nothing ever hurt me.  8-)

I feel like if you were in sleep paralysis when you saw these entities, its very possible your mind created them.. Especially since you watched signs before that lol. But yeah, that sounds a little disturbing.. I personally thusfar have never experienced sleep paralysis, not sure why... I just always am able to break out of it.

AstralCody

Absolutely! I forgot to mention that in my above post. I'm sure my subconscious was hard at work like it always is.  :lol: You will find that you tend to create a lot... It's actually kind of neat. Things manifest very fast in the astral just by you thinking of them instantly. That's why I think if someone does believe in demons... they WILL see demons because they are creating it most likely.

Contenteo

'Demons' is giving 'them' too much credit.

Most incidents are a manifestation of your emotions and intentions.

In F23 there are a lot of pretty lonely entities that can exude a whole myriad of attitudes.
From what I have experienced and read many times on this forum is things can get pretty crazy/weird if you find yourself landed in one of these areas of F23.

I mean, if you were stuck in your own reality for what seems like an eternity, you could end up being pretty weird yourself. In some cases frightening as well.

I wouldn't worry too much, time has proven itself to be a pretty reliable vector. I think its safe to assume it's a pretty one-way street.


Cheers,
Contenteo

Lionheart

#14
Quote from: Astral-Trea on November 13, 2012, 19:42:57
I have found alot of documented cases where people were having a haunting in their home that turned somehow physical where they felt burning on their back, took photos or had a camera rolling during a paranormal investigation, and found that their back had materialized scratches on them.
Wow, those are some scary Demons. They can come here and create burning sensations, scratches and show themselves on camera and yet I constantly read posts here about people going to the Astral to literally kick axx or people that go to the Astral just to to control others. So why are they any worse than some of us? There are some people here that kill and dismember people, I haven't heard of any Demons doing that here in the Physical yet.

AstralCody

Quote from: Lionheart on November 14, 2012, 03:25:25
Wow, those are some scary Demons. They can come here and create burning sensations, scratches and show themselves on camera and yet I constantly read posts here about people going to the Astral to literally kick axx or people that go to the Astral just to to control others. So why are they any worse than some of us? There are some people here that kill and dismember people, I haven't heard of any Demons doing that here in the Physical yet.

Hey Lionheart. I have actually experienced these scratches before. Many times. I will never forget I was watching ghost hunters and I felt a raging burn on my middle back. It was an annoying feeling. Kind of hurt... not really. So I got home, and looked in mirror and saw 3 deep scratch marks. They were extremely deep. I couldn't make sense of it... I felt no harm or anything. It happened a lot after that. I have no explanation for them but I remember I got super sick of it and it would stress me out to the point where I would feel it and I would get mad. I used to be scratched all the time. I don't know why... I have no explanation for it.  :| I don't anymore though. It seemed to only happen when I was living at a particular house but who knows. An interesting point though, is that I had no animals at the time. I also read that if you eat crackers in bed and the crumbs get on your sheets and then you lay down it can happen too. Which is interesting because I did that a lot. Except for a few times when I was sitting down watching TV or what not. I always got 3 deep scratch marks. It wasn't scary to me... it was actually interesting. It happened a lot when I used to do EVP work. Who knows what caused this though.

Astral-Trea

Quote from: Lionheart on November 14, 2012, 03:25:25
Wow, those are some scary Demons. They can come here and create burning sensations, scratches and show themselves on camera and yet I constantly read posts here about people going to the Astral to literally kick axx or people that go to the Astral just to to control others. So why are they any worse than some of us? There are some people here that kill and dismember people, I haven't heard of any Demons doing that here in the Physical yet.

I am not quite sure what point you were trying to make with this Lionheart, but I doubt any demon has the power to be able to dismember people as you mentioned. Yes, humans are much more able to do these things as they are in the physical and we are talking about physical injuries, and there are alot of horrible people in the world just like there are negative entities or lower entities in the astral.

I just wonder if these demons or lower astral entities came from a human who led a horrible life murdering people etc, Charles Manson, for example and then died and became a lower entity not able to reincarnate cause of the bad actions they took in life... Or if the demon/lower entity encarnated into human form and became that person like Manson. Kind of a chicken or egg type of thing I suppose.

Astral-Trea

Quote from: AstralCody on November 14, 2012, 23:49:11
Hey Lionheart. I have actually experienced these scratches before. Many times. I will never forget I was watching ghost hunters and I felt a raging burn on my middle back. It was an annoying feeling. Kind of hurt... not really. So I got home, and looked in mirror and saw 3 deep scratch marks. They were extremely deep. I couldn't make sense of it... I felt no harm or anything. It happened a lot after that. I have no explanation for them but I remember I got super sick of it and it would stress me out to the point where I would feel it and I would get mad. I used to be scratched all the time. I don't know why... I have no explanation for it.  :| I don't anymore though. It seemed to only happen when I was living at a particular house but who knows. An interesting point though, is that I had no animals at the time. I also read that if you eat crackers in bed and the crumbs get on your sheets and then you lay down it can happen too. Which is interesting because I did that a lot. Except for a few times when I was sitting down watching TV or what not. I always got 3 deep scratch marks. It wasn't scary to me... it was actually interesting. It happened a lot when I used to do EVP work. Who knows what caused this though.

Cody, I thought you were joking for most of this post but I think you are serious now. I just read "Ghost Hunters" and kind of laughed cause I feel like that is one of the shows that is faked alot more than others. And then the crackers in bed thing I don't quite understand.. other than dropping crumbs in the bed then rolling around in your sleep and the crumbs causing abrasions on your skin, why would it cause scratches? I think that is what you meant unless there is a more paranormal cause for it. But I am glad to hear from someone who has actually experienced it.. very strange. Sometimes I find scratches on myself that I can't explain but I always just chalk it up to something I did in my sleep.

Bedeekin

Skin is firmly attached to your intent... like I said.. most skin complaints can be treated with placebos... like I said... look at stigmatas... how they can manifest as either on the wrist or on the palms (depending on your knowledge of how they crucified people versus how they depicted it in biblical paintings).

Scratches.. blemishes.. rashes... bruises and most derma based 'things' can be manifested by the power of intent and/or belief.

I am so sorry if this is a rational explanation.  :-(

Bedeekin

Actually... I'll rephrase that... It's not a rational explanation in the normal rational science sense. It's something science doesn't know as to why it happens.

It's actually wonderful. Because it means you can positively influence your skin or entire body with intent.

I meant I was sorry it wasn't demons or astral monsters of some sort.  :-)

Astral-Trea

Quote from: Bedeekin on November 15, 2012, 17:11:06
Actually... I'll rephrase that... It's not a rational explanation in the normal rational science sense. It's something science doesn't know as to why it happens.

It's actually wonderful. Because it means you can positively influence your skin or entire body with intent.

I meant I was sorry it wasn't demons or astral monsters of some sort.  :-)

It helps to know who you are directing it towards.. I maintain a stance that I do not know the cause of these things... I'm not saying it is demons or it isn't so you don't have to be sorry cause you going against anything I said or believe. I think that explaination makes alot of sense and I am very familiar with experiments in hypnosis and how they have proven that the mind can affect the skin and other parts of the body. I just wonder how AstralCody could be getting all the scratches and burns if he wasn't willing himself to receive them. Atleast consciously, of course it could of been subconscious but that's hard to prove I suppose unless he REEALLY loves Ghost Hunters and gets super into it when he is watching it to the point where his mind begins to manefest those things. (Sorry Cody :)

But what I like is that there are two schools of thought and experience on this subject in this thread.. some saying Demons are very real, others saying that it is the mind.

Bedeekin

I'm directing it towards those who think that skin blemishes and scratches are a direct influence of an 'astral entity' other than 'self'... not you specifically.  :-)

"But what I like is that there are two schools of thought and experience on this subject in this thread.. some saying Demons are very real, others saying that it is the mind."

I don't particularly like it but I find it interesting.

That there are those that believe in Demons and get actively pursued/attacked... and those that don't and neither get pursued or attacked.

It's like... A really hypothetical thought experiment... 

imagine that two people meet in the nonphysical.... one is a demon 'believer' the other isn't... They are floating along maybe heading to a specific target point.. and suddenly believer gets attacked by a 4th dimensional howler from the plane of Id!

Does the nonbeliever see believer acting mental.. swiping an unseen force?

Contenteo

QuoteBut what I like is that there are two schools of thought and experience on this subject in this thread.. some saying Demons are very real, others saying that it is the mind.

I think that there is a deeper truth in play here.

The opposite of a fact is usually a falsehood.
However, the opposite of a profound thought is often another profound thought.

Cheers,
Contenteo

Bedeekin

Maybe it's a simple thing... like... my grandma has never been to a nasty underground bar ran by the Russian mafia in Prague and seen the nasty, dingy  underworld of the european drug cartel scene... yet I have. (when working on Wanted in Prague by the way... not because I was an international drug dealer! :-D )

So our experiences differ in that I did because I was hanging around in places like that and she didn't because she was a lovely innocent old lady who lived in a little home tucked away in rural england.

Although all said and done.. It is projected belief and fear I am sure. I'm a non-demonite.

Astral-Trea

Quote from: Bedeekin on November 15, 2012, 17:37:18


I don't particularly like it but I find it interesting.



Yes I should rephrase that as well.. I don't "like" it necessarily I just find it interesting. It would be easier if everyone believed one thing but less interesting I think. :)