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Author Topic: Land of the free...  (Read 5278 times)
cavernstoy
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« on: November 19, 2007, 22:51:28 »

I need not say anything

http://www.newstarget.com/022267.html

Cavernstoy
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« Reply #1 on: November 19, 2007, 22:59:10 »

...Besides this:

Why the HELL is the US Government so freaken stupid!  I hope your as ticked Off as me.  If not, great, but we really need to do something about this

Any ideas on how to stop this BS before all our rights are stripped from us?
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« Reply #1 on: November 19, 2007, 22:59:10 »

logoVisit the website of Astral Pulse creator Adrian Cooper.

Home of the best selling book Our Ultimate Reality.

Astral Projection, Metaphysics and many other subjects.

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Old Dood
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« Reply #2 on: November 19, 2007, 23:13:23 »

...Besides this:

Why the HELL is the US Government so freaken stupid!  I hope your as ticked Off as me.  If not, great, but we really need to do something about this

Any ideas on how to stop this BS before all our rights are stripped from us?


I agree with you. Personally, I think it is beyond our 'Government' and the true Powers that Be are forcing this.  This is New World Order stuff happening. It is no coinicidence that our personal liberties are being taken away.  Bit by bit.  REMEMBER this: There is No such thing as a coinicidence.  EVER.  Reason for everything.  Cause and Effect!

Simply start doing some Google Searches on New World Order and you will start to see as to WHY! Now bear in mind that there is a lot of disinformation out there and do not believe every website you come across. You have to be smart about figuring out what is what.  Who is really in control.  The answers might shock you.  The answers probably will make you say out loud..."NO WAY".

History is repeating it's self.  Always does....But, it doesn't have to. 
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Awakened_Mind
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« Reply #3 on: November 20, 2007, 16:32:29 »

You have to be smart about figuring out what is what.  Who is really in control.  The answers might shock you.  The answers probably will make you say out loud..."NO WAY".

I think this 'New world Order' business is real. I've watched a lot of documentries and read some books on the topic and intertwined it with some social theory. It's definately a candidate for explanation of world events. However, I think the most terrifying part is the reality that NO ONE is in control, not even the Illuminati/Masons etc. They are [/i]attempting[/i] to control society and have done a pretty good job so far.

When will the threshold of rebellion be breached in the collective consciousness? At the moment most people are very naive about what's going on in the world. People don't care about things unless it affects them in their living room. As horrible as that sounds, and with all the good that is going on in the world I unfortunately believe that last statement to have some merit.

Most people I've spoken to about the issue shrug it off as some political issue. I know longer see it as a matter of politics, it's a matter of ethics. What's the point of a political system that betrays the very moral foundation it was built upon? (Constitution). I'm not an American but I like the constitution. Smiley

-AM
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« Reply #4 on: November 20, 2007, 17:36:45 »

My main problem with the NWO is that theorists have been saying since the early 80's that they're slowly taking away our liberties and we're all going to be controlled in a police state, but in reality, they haven't done a good job at all. According to the original theories, we were supposed to be done-for years ago. Theorists claim that the NWO is in motion, but I don't see any evidence. Inoculations? It's been law FOREVER - it's nothing new. Your child has to get vaccinated to enter school. It's how we got rid of smallpox and measles. Do you want to live through another plague in this day and age?

There are a lot of problems in the world, and I'm not sure about blaming it on an unknown, unseen group of people with no central organization. Maybe we just don't want to blame ourselves for letting the world get to where it at. When there are problems with unclear answers, the EASIEST thing to do is blame it on someone who can't defend themselves, in this case, a group that no one can prove exists.

I stay open minded, but need harder evidence as of now. As an American living in a modern American society, I'm as free as I've ever been. I think the biggest threat out there is the patriot act, and people know that and are fighting it. Parts of it have been thrown out. I think 911 and Iraq have made people more aware of the actions that politicians make and will be more prepared during the next elections.

I followed and somewhat believed the NWO theories for years - the first couple years it was easy to believe, but as I became more educated on political subjects and where theorists get there facts from, I realized there was really little to go on. If you want to make money writing books and lecturing on the subject, no one can disprove you! I really like Alex Jones, but I also think he's so involved in what he does that if he had information that proved his livelihood wrong, his belief system wouldn't let him believe it.
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« Reply #4 on: November 20, 2007, 17:36:45 »



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« Reply #5 on: November 20, 2007, 18:13:44 »

Good point. It's definately a possibilty that the idea of a 'New World Order' is simply something that has arisen in the collective psyche as a step toward awakening ourselves to our destructive cultural trends.

-AM
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« Reply #6 on: November 21, 2007, 23:13:17 »

I agree that the heavy handed tactics were extreme and that the situation could have been handled with more dignity.

Some of the old folks here might remember when it was not uncommon to see a classmate or two with one shiveled up leg in a brace, or using a crutch to limp along.
Since the time of polio vacinations, I think that most of the new generations have been spared this little jewel of nature's wrath.

NOW, one of the biggest problems is kids getting too FAT. Can you believe it? Oh dear! an obesity epidemic. JC/almighty, how fact can be so much stanger than fiction.

http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/cgi/content/full/115/5/1428

"The immunization of children against a multitude of infectious agents has been hailed as one of the most important health interventions of the 20th century.1–3 Immunizations have eliminated smallpox infection worldwide, driven polio from North America, and made formerly common infections like diphtheria, tetanus, measles, and invasive Haemophilus influenzae infections rare occurrences. By one account, pediatric immunizations are responsible for preventing 3 million deaths in children each year worldwide.3 Despite this success, some parents continue to refuse immunizations for their children. The number of pertussis cases has increased steadily in the United States over the past 20 years, and Web sites critical of immunization are prominent on the Internet, a source that many parents rely on for health information.4 It is ironic that the remarkable success of vaccine programs has resulted in a situation in which most parents have no memory of the devastating effects of illnesses such as poliomyelitis, measles, and other vaccine-preventable diseases, making it more difficult for them to appreciate the benefits of immunization."
« Last Edit: November 22, 2007, 00:47:31 by iNNERvOYAGER » Logged
no_leaf_clover
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« Reply #7 on: November 29, 2007, 05:46:27 »

Inoculations? It's been law FOREVER - it's nothing new. Your child has to get vaccinated to enter school. It's how we got rid of smallpox and measles. Do you want to live through another plague in this day and age?

Polio was mostly eradicated when its vaccine was introduced, and immediately after it was introduced, polio rose something like 11%.  We know vaccines can affect children and the elderly (causing symptoms of the injected virus in some cases), and ingredients in vaccines like mercury is protested by a lot of credible medical professionals because of its health effects.  Those are a few issues with vaccinations people have, and there are others.  Why shouldn't people have the right to chose whether or not their children are vaccinated, especially in the face of all these issues?
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Old Dood
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« Reply #8 on: November 29, 2007, 11:09:39 »

My main problem with the NWO is that theorists have been saying since the early 80's that they're slowly taking away our liberties and we're all going to be controlled in a police state, but in reality, they haven't done a good job at all. According to the original theories, we were supposed to be done-for years ago. Theorists claim that the NWO is in motion, but I don't see any evidence. Inoculations? It's been law FOREVER - it's nothing new. Your child has to get vaccinated to enter school. It's how we got rid of smallpox and measles. Do you want to live through another plague in this day and age?

There are a lot of problems in the world, and I'm not sure about blaming it on an unknown, unseen group of people with no central organization. Maybe we just don't want to blame ourselves for letting the world get to where it at. When there are problems with unclear answers, the EASIEST thing to do is blame it on someone who can't defend themselves, in this case, a group that no one can prove exists.

I stay open minded, but need harder evidence as of now. As an American living in a modern American society, I'm as free as I've ever been. I think the biggest threat out there is the patriot act, and people know that and are fighting it. Parts of it have been thrown out. I think 911 and Iraq have made people more aware of the actions that politicians make and will be more prepared during the next elections.

I followed and somewhat believed the NWO theories for years - the first couple years it was easy to believe, but as I became more educated on political subjects and where theorists get there facts from, I realized there was really little to go on. If you want to make money writing books and lecturing on the subject, no one can disprove you! I really like Alex Jones, but I also think he's so involved in what he does that if he had information that proved his livelihood wrong, his belief system wouldn't let him believe it.

First of all...'Follow the Money'.  That is the key right there.  There is NO REASON for the world monitary system to be in trouble.  It is a controled/planned event to take away more liberties.

As for liberties....look at the US Constitution...it is basically ignored!  We have lost liberties.  Mainly in the last 10 years.
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« Reply #9 on: November 29, 2007, 16:18:53 »

What liberties have we lost?
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Old Dood
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« Reply #10 on: November 29, 2007, 18:08:02 »

With out 'Habeas Corpus' we have LOST 9 out of 10 of our Bill of Rights!

Check it out...if you don't believe me.

NSA Wire Taps and having the Telcos monitor our private lives is also a breech and loss of our Civil Liberties. 
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« Reply #11 on: November 29, 2007, 20:01:30 »

I'm as free to do everything I could do 10 years ago. You have to wait in line at the airport longer, but that has to do with the FAA.

I agree that as citizens we need to be aware of these things and make sure they don't infringe on our liberties, and there are many people doing so through the proper channels. Wiretapping & data mining are scary things with the advancement of technology, and that's why it's important to vote for people who will protect your rights as a citizen.

We still have "Habeas Corpus". It was partially suspended for "Enemy Combatants", but the supreme court reaffirmed the right of United States citizens to seek habeas corpus even when declared enemy combatants.

Right now, these problems are more in the terminology than the law itself. In an average person's daily life, habeas corpus is the least of their worries. If I get arrested, I'm going to get a lawyer and have a trial. I'm not going to Guantanamo. And even many in Guantanamo are entitled to Habeas Corpus now.

I don't think "they're out to get us". Maybe they really do just want the bad guys.

I still like Thoreau's quote: "The government that governs least, governs best". Vote Ron Paul - The Bush administration has made everyone paranoid.
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Old Dood
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« Reply #12 on: November 29, 2007, 21:19:39 »

Here is a 47 minute video that explains what is going on...NOW!: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RjALf12PAWc

This is not fake. This is what is happening to law abiding Americans...now.  They get put on a 'list'.  For what?

Disagreeing with the current Administration?

The Telcos HAVE broke the law.  What is being done about it?

The Media is not doing it's job.  Hasn't for years.  So we have no 5th Column there. The MSM (Main Stream Media) has been compromised years ago.
Here is why: http://www.tekproject.com/articles/globalelite.html

Excerpt:
Plans for a world currency and world government have gone one step forward with the signing of a new 'transatlantic economic partnership' between the US and the European Union, with the two powers agreeing on a 'single market'. As reported by the BBC , "the pact is designed to boost trade and investment by harmonising regulatory standards, laying the basis for a US-EU single market."

The European Union - as well as its single currency - itself is a product of the secretive Bilderberg group , which began planning for its creation in the 1950's. An 'American Union' was also discussed by Bilderberg in 1987 in Cernobbio, Italy. Jim Tucker, who has been following the shadowy elite for many years was able to retrieve this information from within Bilderberg through his various contacts. Media coverage of Bilderberg in the United States has been in a blackout, while overseas reporting has been steadily growing in recent years making the Bilderbergers squirm in their seats. David Rockefeller, founder of the Trilateral Commission and one of the top globalist architects expressed his gratitude to the U.S. media for their vow of silence before the Trilateral Commission in 1991.

Rockefeller stated,

"We are grateful to The Washington Post, The New York Times, Time Magazine and other great publications whose directors have attended our meetings and respected their promises of discretion for almost forty years. It would have been impossible for us to develop our plan for the world if we had been subject to the bright lights of publicity during those years. But the work is now much more sophisticated and prepared to march towards a world government. The supranational sovereignty of an intellectual elite and world bankers is surely preferable to the national auto-determination practiced in past centuries."

The North American Union, coming straight from the Council on Foreign Relations, fulfills Bilderberg's dream of an 'American Union'. In the CFR's document, Building a North American Community , mention is given to the Bilderberg group in a recommendation that private bodies be formed to direct policy between Canada, Mexico, and the United States. The document states,

"To ensure a regular injection of creative energy into the various efforts related to North American integration, the three governments should appoint an independent body of advisers. This body should be composed of eminent persons from outside government, appointed to staggered multiyear terms to ensure their independence. Their mandate would be to engage in creative exploration of new ideas from a North American perspective and to provide a public voice for North America. A complementary approach would be to establish private bodies that would meet regularly or annually to buttress North American relationships, along the lines of the Bilderberg ..."



The Internet is our only chance at a 5th Column.

And...'they' want to do away with that now too.  That scares them.  Truth scares them. 

Here is how everyone can help Save our Internet...Now: http://savetheinternet.com/
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cavernstoy
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« Reply #13 on: November 29, 2007, 22:46:44 »

Hello Old Dood,

I just found this article that was posted on Newstarget.com

"The end of Free Speech in America has arrived at our doorstep. It's a new law called the Violent Radicalization and Homegrown Terrorism Prevention Act, and it is worded in a clever way that could allow the U.S. government to arrest and incarcerate any individual who speaks out against the Bush Administration, the war on Iraq, the Department of Homeland Security or any government agency (including the FDA). The law has already passed the House on a traitorous vote of 405 to 6, and it is now being considered in the Senate where a vote is imminent. All over the internet, intelligent people who care about freedom are speaking out against this extremely dangerous law: Philip Giraldi at the Huffington Post, Declan McCullagh at CNET's News.com, Kathryn Smith at OpEdNews.com, and of course Alex Jones at PrisonPlanet.com

This bill is the beginning of the end of Free Speech in America. If it passes, all the information sources you know and trust could be shut down and their authors imprisoned. NewsTarget could be taken offline and I could be arrested as a "terrorist." Jeff Rense at www.Rense.com could be labeled a "terrorist" and arrested. Byron Richards, Len Horowitz, Paul Craig Roberts, Greg Palast, Ron Paul and even Al Gore could all be arrested, silenced and incarcerated. This is not an exaggeration. It is a literal reading of the law, which you can check yourself here: http://thomas.loc.gov/home/gpoxmlc110/h1955_rfs.xml

The bill states:

‘...ideologically based violence’ means the use, planned use, or threatened use of force or violence by a group or individual to promote the group or individual’s political, religious, or social beliefs...

Note that this means the "planned use of force to promote a political or social belief" would be considered an act of terrorism. This all hinges on the definition of "force," of course. Based on the loose use of logic in Washington these days, and the slippery interpretation of the meaning of words, "force" could mean:

• A grassroots campaign to barrage Congress with faxes
• A non-violent street protest
• A letter-writing campaign that deluges the Senate with too much mail
• A sit-in protest that blocks access to a business or organization
• A grassroots e-mail campaign that overloads the e-mail servers of any government department or agency

You get the idea. "Force" could be defined as practically anything. And since the "planned use of force" would be considered a criminal act of terrorism, anyone who simply thinks about a grassroots action campaign would be engaged in terrorist acts.

If you stopped someone on the street and handed them a Bible, for example, this could be considered an act of terrorism ("...use of force to promote the individual's religious beliefs...")

If you sent a barrage of angry letters to Washington about global warming and the destruction of the environment by the U.S. military, this could also be considered an act of terrorism ("...to promote the individual's political beliefs...")

If you believe in same-sex marriage and you wrote a letter threatning a sit-in protest in front of your state's capitol building, this could also be considered an act of terrorism, even if you never carried it out! ("...planned use of force to promote a social belief...")

The United States is on the fast track to fascism, and the Congress is working right alongside this nation's traitorous leaders to criminalize any thoughts, words or speeches that disagree with current government policies regarding war, terrorism, domestic surveillance and civil liberties. Simply speaking out against the war on Iraq could soon be labeled a crime. Merely thinking thoughts against the war on Iraq could be considered a criminal act.


Must-see video: Naomi Wolf's lecture on 10 steps to fascism
There's a video lecture you simply MUST watch. It's by Naomi Wolf, author of The End of America. She covers this topic with great elegance and a deep understanding of history. See her video on YouTube at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RjALf12PAWc

Click here to see her book on Amazon.com.

In her lecture and book, Naomi reveals the ten steps to fascist, then reveals how the United States of America is pursuing all ten! This S.1959 legislation, the Violent Radicalization and Homegrown Terrorism Prevention Act, represents one of the ten steps to achieve a fascist state!

It is designed to squash all opposition to the State's ongoing march towards blatant fascism, where secret police and secret prisons dominate the law enforcement landscape, stripping U.S. citizens of all civil liberties and Constitutional protections.

Thoughtcrimes are about to become a reality in the United States of America, and Congress is pushing this through as quickly as possible so that each individual member of Congress can claim that he or she is "against terrorism." But this bill doesn't merely target terrorism: It targets anyone who speaks or even thinks thoughts against the U.S. federal government.

With this bill, the U.S. government is officially labeling the People of the United States as criminals. It is drawing a line in the sand and stating that from now on, it's the Government vs. the People.

If we don't stop this bill from becoming law, we are lost as a nation.

There is no turning back from tyranny once the government turns its own citizens into criminals, enforcing only the thoughts, ideas, words and speeches that it approves or tolerates. Everything is at stake here!


Take action now, or lose your freedoms forever
If you live in the U.S., it is urgent that you call your senators right now and voice your strong opposition against this extremely dangerous law.

Here are the phone numbers for the U.S. Senate switchboard:

1-877-851-6437
1-800-833-6354
1-888-355-3588
1-866-220-0044
1-866-808-0065
1-877-762-8762
1-866-340-9281
1-800-862-5530

How to do this:

1) Make sure you know the names of your Senators.
2) Call the U.S. Senate switchboard using one of the numbers above.
3) Ask to speak to the offices of your Senators.
4) Tell them you are strongly opposed to S. 1959, the Violent Radicalization and Homegrown Terrorism Prevention Act
5) Ask for their fax number.
6) Follow up your phone call with a written, signed letter that you fax to your Senators.

Stopping this bill from becoming law is the single most important thing all Americans can do right now. If this becomes law, all free speech about health freedom, the crimes of the FDA, the crimes of the Bush Administration, America's role in global warming and any other topics could all be criminalized. YOU could be labeled a terrorist, kidnapped by government thugs, taken from your home, thrown in a secret prison, denied access to legal representation, denied due process and essentially "disappeared" into a system of such corruption and evil that it now begins to blatantly mirror Nazi Germany.

Think it couldn't happen here? It's happening right now! This is exactly how it happened in Nazi Germany. First, burn the Reichstag and blame it on the "enemy." Pass new police state laws. Disarm the people. Spread fear. Erect secret prisons and secret police. Call anyone who disagrees with you a "traitor." Control the mainstream media. Sound familiar? This is all happening right now in the United States of Amerika, and if we don't work to stop it, this nation will rapidly devolve into a fascist police state where no one is truly free.

We are but a few small steps away from it right now. All it would take is one dirty bomb in a major U.S. city. Bush would declare Martial Law and take over the National Guard. Troops on the streets. Anyone who writes a blog against the government would be arrested. Authors of "alternative" books would be kidnapped and have their books burned on the street. It could all happen at the stroke of a pen. The infrastructure for tyranny is in place right now, just waiting to be invoked.


Our best weapons: Non-violent protest and speaking the truth
How can we fight back against this onslaught of tyranny? We must use what remaining free speech freedoms we have right now to alert our fellow citizens to what's happening. We must rise up and tell the truth while urging our representatives in Washington to resist the temptation to vote for more "anti-terrorism" legislation that only works to enslave the American people.

We must use our phones, faxes, emails and blogs to rally our friends, family members and anyone who will listen to oppose these police state laws, and we must organize mass (peaceful) protests against this government that is attempting to marginalize the rights and freedoms of our People.

We must not be lulled into a sense of false security by the purveyors of hatred and fear -- the Sean Hannitys, Rush Limbaughs and Bill O'Reillys of the world. Instead, we must listen to the voices of freedom. In terms of the upcoming election for U.S. President, there is only one candidate that actually believes in freedom: Ron Paul. He needs your support to win: www.RonPaul2008.com

All the other candidates are nothing more than tyrants of different political affiliations. Ron Paul is the only candidate that truly understands the fundamentals of freedom. That's why he's the only real choice for our next President. Can you imagine what Hillary Clinton would do with the police state powers that Bush has now created? That's the danger of all laws that centralize power in Washington: It's not necessarily what today's President will do with them, but what some future President will do with them.

That's why it's never good enough to say, "Well, we intend to only apply these laws to terrorists and not to U.S. citizens at home." That may be the intention right NOW, but virtually all such laws creep into areas of enforcement for which they were never intended. Just look at the application of RICO laws which were originally designed to fight organized crime operations but are now applied to virtually anyone (and yet they are never applied to Big Pharma, which operates almost exactly like organized crime!). All these anti-terrorism laws run the danger of expanding in enforcement to the point where they are applied against the People of this country. At first, it's only illegal for "terrorists" to think thought crimes, but before long, it's illegal for anyone to think those same thoughts. That when the domestic arrests of authors, journalists, bloggers and thought leaders will kick off, and the country will plunge itself into outright tyrannical fascism.

Again, we're on the track right now. This is happening, folks. You're LIVING through an amazing chapter of history right now. You're actually witnessing the downfall of a free nation and the rise of a superpower fascist state. You're actually part of it.

When it's all over, will you look back and realize you did nothing? Or will you now take a stand against tyranny and oppose these dangerous laws and lawmakers who threaten the Constitutional freedoms of you and your children?"


(http://www.newstarget.com/022308.html)

Everyone else on this forum, I don't think this is a joke. 

consider this...

Quote
Think it couldn't happen here? It's happening right now! This is exactly how it happened in Nazi Germany. First, burn the Reichstag and blame it on the "enemy." Pass new police state laws. Disarm the people. Spread fear. Erect secret prisons and secret police. Call anyone who disagrees with you a "traitor." Control the mainstream media. Sound familiar? This is all happening right now in the United States of Amerika, and if we don't work to stop it, this nation will rapidly devolve into a fascist police state where no one is truly free.

Think of what happened in 2001? 

Was 911 a conspiracy?

Please read...

http://www.911truth.org/article.php?story=20041221155307646

Please consider this a warning...

Do you really trust our government?

Who's going to save us from fascism?

http://www.newstarget.com/022041.html

Cavernstoy
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« Reply #14 on: November 30, 2007, 00:33:14 »

Thank you cavernstoy for the heads up.  I didn't 'know' about his one.

<sigh>

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« Reply #15 on: November 30, 2007, 11:09:54 »

I stand corrected.  This is the 'Thought Crime Bill'.

I have called both my Senators about this.  I have them on my Cell Phone Addy....
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« Reply #16 on: November 30, 2007, 16:53:17 »

"Newstarget.com" is an editorial site, not a news site. He implies a lot in that article to strike fear in the reader:

Quote
Based on the loose use of logic in Washington these days, and the slippery interpretation of the meaning of words, "force" could mean:

• A grassroots campaign to barrage Congress with faxes
• A non-violent street protest
• A letter-writing campaign that deluges the Senate with too much mail
• A sit-in protest that blocks access to a business or organization
• A grassroots e-mail campaign that overloads the e-mail servers of any government department or agency

You get the idea. "Force" could be defined as practically anything. And since the "planned use of force" would be considered a criminal act of terrorism, anyone who simply thinks about a grassroots action campaign would be engaged in terrorist acts.

If you stopped someone on the street and handed them a Bible, for example, this could be considered an act of terrorism ("...use of force to promote the individual's religious beliefs...")

If you sent a barrage of angry letters to Washington about global warming and the destruction of the environment by the U.S. military, this could also be considered an act of terrorism ("...to promote the individual's political beliefs...")

If you believe in same-sex marriage and you wrote a letter threatning a sit-in protest in front of your state's capitol building, this could also be considered an act of terrorism, even if you never carried it out! ("...planned use of force to promote a social belief...")

"Force" doesn't mean any of those things and isn't implied in the bill to mean any of those things. The author is trying to scare people who do those things to side with him. It's as dirty, if not dirtier, than FOX news. They are twisting the words of the bill. It probably isn't a good bill to pass, but I think the danger is being greatly exaggerated.

Does it really seem likely that we'll go from being a free country to a 1984 police state in 1 day when a single bill passes? It's impossible - there aren't enough police and officials who would go along with. Policemen and military men care about our freedoms too - they aren't our enemies and aren't going to turn on us with the passing of a single bill.

There may be a lot of sinister things that people in congress want to accomplish, but it's hard to believe that they are conspiring to take away our freedoms without anyone finding out about it ahead of time. Logically, it just doesn't seem possible.

The other person I stay skeptical of is Naomi Wolf because she is promoting the living bejesus out of her book right now "The End of America", and stories like this help lean people towards her beliefs, henceforth buying her book. She was also a member of the Clinton administration - they are supposed to be a part of the NWO too. What if she's on the inside? Which would mean everyone helping promote her is on the inside, including newstarget.com and Alex Jones. The conspiracy gets bigger...

(he he, I said "henceforth")
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