Did anyone NOT enjoy Astral Dynamics?

[Embodied Words]

Most people here seem to look at it as their bible. I guess I'm just not patient enough to really get into the whole NEW thingy. But yeah, I was just wondering if anyone here didn't like it.

[CFTraveler]

I liked it.  But I liked MAP better for my purposes.

[Novice]

I thought it was OK. I don't use it though. I played with it just to see what would happen. Didn't have a problem doing any of the exercises. I was turned off by RB's explainations/interpretations of his experiences as fact. That's probably why it sits in the back of my bookshelf collecting dust. I think the parts on energy and sensing energy are very good though. Just not for me, that's all. And I've never had an issue with needing to do energy work in order to OBE, but others may have different experiences.

[Embodied Words]

Ah, that's a relief. If energy body work was really required to OBE, I was gonna have a hard time.

[Stookie]

I like having a different interpretation of astral stuff, and it definitely provides that, but it's not really "fun" reading - it's almost like a textbook on Robert Bruce's interpretation of the astral.

[Mustardseed]

I found it very helpful. It was a catalyst for me. I find that the problem seems to be, that as soon as anyone ventures out, and gives a "no nonsense" sort of explanation, he or she is almost immediately barraged with criticism by others who wants their explanation to be heard instead, who wants to water his viewpoint out with Relativism etc.

I realise that some will say that their explanation is far more open ended and Robert in more traditional, and therefore theirs is more valid, but I disagree, it is still just an explanation. Why can something not be absolute.? To me there is way too much New Age individualism involved, like the guy why was making up his own religion, with different Gods and Goddesses, just making it up, with no fact attached. He was applauded here by some of the same guys that dis Roberts book. Go figure!!

I personally believe Robert has gotten close, in his experiences and I trust him.

There is a tendency, especially here on the AP, to ditch all so called Mystics, in favour of the more scientific fazing approach. This is a leftover from "the days of Frank"

Just an opinion

Regards Mustardseed

[Stookie]

I found it very helpful. It was a catalyst for me. I find that the problem seems to be, that as soon as anyone ventures out, and gives a "no nonsense" sort of explanation, he or she is almost immediately barraged with criticism by others who wants their explanation to be heard instead, who wants to water his viewpoint out with Relativism etc.

I realise that some will say that their explanation is far more open ended and Robert in more traditional, and therefore theirs is more valid, but I disagree, it is still just an explanation. Why can something not be absolute.? To me there is way too much New Age individualism involved, like the guy why was making up his own religion, with different Gods and Goddesses, just making it up, with no fact attached. He was applauded here by some of the same guys that dis Roberts book. Go figure!!

I personally believe Robert has gotten close, in his experiences and I trust him.

There is a tendency, especially here on the AP, to ditch all so called Mystics, in favour of the more scientific fazing approach. This is a leftover from "the days of Frank"

Just an opinion

Regards Mustardseed

Hi Mustardseed,

Nobody dissed Robert's book or methods. NEW and "Rope" are probably 2 of the most popular methods, both of which Robert Bruce invented. Every OBE author has their own distinct descriptions and methods, and everyone will have a favorite.

Phasing is a method that has helped several of us here, so it's sometimes recommended to members looking for a new method. It's a shame that the forum has turned away from some of the more discussed methods that were here before Robert Bruce left, but he started his own forum where his methods are discussed in full, and you can even ask him questions, so no one lost.

If the forums seems one-sided, it's not purposely done, and no one is conspiring to a single viewpoint. A lot of us share the same ideas, probably because we discuss them with each other nearly every day. I don't think anyone should adopt a single method or philosophical view. It's good to be well read on the subject from multiple points of view and then put what you learn into EXPERIENCE. That's the real teacher right there. Not books or forums. They're just tools to get you to experience.

[CFTraveler]

As an Admin at AD, I can say that I don't find this forum to be onesided, it's just that some people prefer one method over another, and some methods work for some better than others, but that is to be expected- after all if we all had the same beliefs and the same minds, wouldn't life be boring?
Anyway, just from my point of view, I don't really feel Robert's views are more 'mystical' than the technical treatment that phasing seems to get, and to be fair, his views also have changed with the times and with his experiences, and, terminology aside, experiences are experiences, and labeling them with 'traditional' terminology is IMO easier to understand.  But of course, that's not true for everyone.
So peace, brothers and sisters, we're all in this together, even if we call it different things.

[Mustardseed]

I think one major point is that Robert believes in Demons being real. Astral Wildlife. Whatta ya think

[CFTraveler]

I think you'll find that 'belief in something' or other, be it demons, the objective reality of this or that is not a requirement in either forum, and people of differing points of view will come to both forums for different ways of looking at their experiences.
I think you should consider them complementary, not adversarial- I don't see the point.

[Awakened_Mind]

The book was definately a well presented perspective on the nature and experience of OBE's. I wouldn't go so far as to place it as the best, simply because the 'best' is abritray, but I would in no way say that the book is useless.

I think Roberts belief in demons needs to be understood that is only Roberts beliefs. These juggernauts of the astral world have done a very good job through personal experience in exploring the astral realms but at the moment I think reaching conclusions is premature. The very term demon is evolving, we are no longer looking at 'good' and 'bad', now we're looking at two different sides of one whole. This way the fear is replaced with understanding.

Personally I trust Robert.

-AM

[zorgblar]

I thought the book was OK and had alot of good information in it but the reading is kinda to textbook and the none of his obe methods worked for me.

[Mustardseed]

I think you'll find that 'belief in something' or other, be it demons, the objective reality of this or that is not a requirement in either forum, and people of differing points of view will come to both forums for different ways of looking at their experiences.
I think you should consider them complementary, not adversarial- I don't see the point.

well let me explain you the point then. If Demons and various astral wild life is real, they are real for everyone, you and me as well. If they are real they cannot be treated as a fiction of someones mind. They have an agenda, i.e. to feed. They feed on US. I do not think that is complementary.

I know that this is what everyone says, you are all welcome, and it appears that the AP is more open than it used to. However that was not always the case. As I said during the days of Frank people were abused verbally and put down severely if they expressed beliefs that was not "the party line"

The AP took a shift and has chosen the typical New Age approach of, "it is real if it is real to you" relativism, and no absolutes. This brings more people to the table. Remember this is also a bookselling outfit.

Regards Mustardseed

[Stookie]

My view on "Demons":

It make sense that there are other intelligences beyond the physical world. It makes sense that some may not have our best interests in mind. I would say the chances of "Demons" existing are possible. I have no personal proof though.

I also believe that certain states of consciousness reflect your subconscious thoughts and fears back to you. For an astral newbie, it's easy to mistake your own projected fears for real "demons". And when discussing in a forum, you don't know what another person REALLY experienced, so all you can do is let them know it might not be real.

There might be times when it is really is a negative entity. At the same time, constantly being afraid of nothing is a waste of time.

I think Robert Bruce says it best. He says going into the astral is like going for a walk downtown. You have things to accomplish, and even though there is a chance you might get attacked or mugged, you don't worry about those things when you leave the house. I even think it's from "Astral Dynamics".

astralpulse.com is a place where Adrian sells his products, but the forum is open for all discussion. Adrian is very open minded to others beliefs and points of view and is more than willing to let us discuss them here. I've never even read one of his books, yet he lets me moderate. I believe there is more to Adrian than selling books, as I'm sure is the same with Robert Bruce.

[Mez]

RB's Treatise was the catalyst into the OBE world for me so it holds a special place in my heart. I havent fully read astral dynamics but I recommend it as a starting point to friends who take interest in the subject because I feel it tells you what to expect. Frank and RB have different models and personally I always refer to and use franks but I also think the models are complimentary... That is the mystic model of "planes and realms" fits within Franks Focus models. As far as demons go... i've had some experiences with them (in WAKING life) so I definately know they're out there. I think in terms of the astral if you're out there and your thoughts are attracting them then they'll come to you and i dont necessarily think you're CREATING them.. but at the same time if you change you're thoughts you can make them go away... so yeah.

[Nostic]

Astral Dynamics changed my life. It was a revelation for me when I discovered NEW. But truth be told, I've never read the whole book- it's just too big. But I got what I needed from it, and I guess that's all that matters.