One Million Dollar Challenge

[pod_3]

I've left messages on this site before to the effect that I have spoken to him personally, and he is giant, f-cking liar! In spite of his claims that he would pay expenses, he was in my area and free. There would be no expenses. I told him he could bring the object of his choice, and request the PK of his choice. He tried to explain to me why such things were impossible, and he would not watch.

Someone else, who has posted here, claimed that Randi has been propositioned publically in front of cameras, and he would not accept.

Give him your name, and you will learn what the purpose of the trick is.  Anyone capable of a reading, tell us what you see.

[kraz18]

http://www.alternativescience.com/james-randi.htm
That may explain why no ones are trying the challenge.

[karnautrahl]

I'd not bother with Randi at all. If I really really had to bolster my ego by proving something to science, then if an oppurtunity came up to work with a university study on healing and energy work I'd do that.
Actually I want to see what happens if I do my energy work whilst in an fMRI or PET scanner (or both) Now THAT would really really interest me, and probably boost my ability (if I could see what was happening at the time).

That would be fantastic to see and do. So anyone here in UK facility of any kind that has access to this I'd be willing to volunteer for that.

[pod_3]

I want to see what happens if I do my energy work whilst in an fMRI or PET scanner

I have seen it. Basically, they show activity in the right hemisphere (already known for intuition).

Very right! I wandered blindly into Randi, because I was out to boost my ego. A shame that getting creative would not make him think.

[karnautrahl]

I've measured what happens on my EEG machine (it's only a waverider jnr 2 channel using bioexplorer software for those who are interested).
Using sites c3 and c4 on one occasion and sites Fp1 and Fp2 on another. I controlled for muscle movement readings first of all-a real issue on fp1 and fp2 though mainly it affected amplitude readings in the delta frequencies.
The gist of what I found was that in all frequencies I could get much higher amplitudes than a running average.  I'd hit over 50u microvolts from an average of 10.  I set this as a little challenge and found that alpha was the easiest to increase and gamma was the hardest (40-64hz, which is the max on my device). However I did spike gamma to over 50 a number of times in the session.  The spiking happened only when the energy sensations were the most powerful, typically when I was sweating from the heat.

Unusual side effects are a combined chilling and heat effect when I do this-happens in a healing session as well.

[beavis]

I want to try Randi's million dollar paranormal challenge!

My thread about it here:
http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=149433#149433

[Tyciol]

http://www.alternativescience.com/randi-retreats.htm They use THAT to disprove Randi? This is stupid. If Randi locked up a guy and he starved to death, he'd get in a lot of legal trouble. It would also take FOREVER to do, you can survive without food for over a month in some instances. It's also really easy to sneak in food, eat bugs, feces, mucus etc.

Besides, that's barely supernatural, and more attributed to genetics or weirdness than any supernatural powers. The cost in keeping him in a cell for such long periods is just ridiculous, and force Randi to pay money for something that may not even work. A homeless man could propose such a challenge, he wouldn't get anything to eat anyway, at least he gets water and shelter, and when he gets hungry and famous he can stop, and get all the food he wants.

If he wants to levitate 2 feet off the ground for 30 seconds, that'd be better.

[LordoftheBunnies]

Uh, all you'd really need to do is have someone moniter his health or take blood samples during the time.  It wouldn't be that hard.

And, while I agree about how any bum could come in and make such a claim, really, if he can't get together the resources to test all those who apply then maybe he and his fans need to quit shoving this million dollar publicity stunt test in people's faces.

Personally, this short article about sums up my opinion of his test and its scientific "validity".

http://www.skepticalinvestigations.org/controversies/Auerbach_Randi.htm

I might actually title this essay "Why I no longer care about Randi's One Million Dollar Challenge," but honestly "So What!" sums up my feelings these days.

Over the last several years, I've been somewhat outspoken about the specific details of the rules of Randi's challenge. But recently, when being harassed by yet another disbelieving type about the test, some kind of light - an epiphany of sorts - went on in my head. The individual made a statement, with a question, that I often hear in variations from self-described Skeptics (actually disbelievers):
"The Amazing Randi offers one million dollars for anyone who can demonstrate something paranormal. If psychic abilities are real, why has no one won the prize?"

Rather than responding as I have in the past with a discourse as to why I don't believe anyone will win that money, I spontaneously switched gears. [The following is an approximation of the conversation]

"What would that prove?" I asked.

"Huh?" said the Skeptic.

"Why is Randi offering the money?" I asked.

"For anyone who can prove something paranormal," said the Skeptic.

"If someone did win the million, what would that actually prove?" I asked.

"Huh?" said the Skeptic.

"I mean, if a psychic won the million dollars, other than the psychic walking away one million dollars richer, what would that prove to the skeptical community or to Science?" I asked.

"That someone could do something psychic," said the Skeptic with some confusion in his voice.

"Would it? If someone won Randi's million dollars, would YOU accept that psychic abilities are real? Or even just possible?" I asked.

"Huh?" said the Skeptic.

"Would mainstream Science accept the probability of psi, if not the reality, if some psychic won Randi's million?" I asked.

"Uh-uh-huh?" said the Skeptic.

"Would the organized Skeptics accept that psi is real, or would they be more likely to believe that Randi was simply fooled, scammed out of his million? Would you?" I asked.

I received a blank stare from the Skeptic, then saw confusion appearing on his face.
I continued to push at him. "The fact is that people who do not accept the laboratory and other evidence for psi that already exists are unlikely to change their minds or their beliefs simply because someone beats Randi's challenge and wins Randi's money. In the name of Science, many keep raising the issue of parsimony, of Occam's Razor where psi is concerned. In this case, wouldn't the simpler explanation as far as the Skeptics are concerned be that Randi was scammed out of the money? In the name of Science, many raise the issue of repeatability. If someone beat Randi's Challenge once, how does this meet the criteria of repeatability? What does this prove?"

The Skeptic was silent, confusion and frustration (and a little anger) continuing on his face.

I finished with "If you can honestly tell me - I mean look me in the eye and tell me honestly - that you would be open to psi's existence if a psychic won Randi's money, I'll give you 20 dollars right here and now. It's not a million, but to be honest, your opinion isn't worth that much to me."

He walked away (okay, he stormed off).

I've since used this argument on a few others, whenever Randi's Challenge is raised like a weapon against the field of Parapsychology, and against the existence (real or just potential) of psi.

To recap: If someone wins Randi's million, he/she will be one million dollars richer. However, as far as Science and the Skeptics are concerned, the simpler answer to this conundrum is that Randi (or his chosen panel of judges) was fooled.

In other words, So What if someone wins the money. It won't change the prevailing attitudes towards parapsychology, or the prevailing beliefs of most who waiver to the disbelieving side of the center where psi is concerned.

As this is the case (prove me wrong, somebody - please!), we waste our time even giving Randi's Challenge the time of day.

It's not a benchmark for Science, or even the Skeptics. Why should we care?

So What!

Loyd Auerback

Media Skeptics... James Randi
The Randi Prize
Current Controversies page

[karnautrahl]

Arch skeptics of the Randi breed hang onto their "faith" even more fervently than religious fundementalists I think .

I love that above article. So goddammed true. It pisses me off at times some of the crap a skeptic will try to shove in my face to "disprove" my own basic healing ability. I end up telling them where to get off, as they are not me and are not experiencing what I can or cannot feel.
To me those skeptics say one of 3 things.  I'm a liar, I'm badly mistaken or insane. No other choices..though the last two are probably the same.
Next skeptic that implies this is likely to deserve what he gets.
I'm a healer but I'm not a white light fluffy into the bargain .

[beavis]

Do you think if Randi saw somebody levitate themself, he'd believe paranormal things exist?

[Tyciol]

Lord of the Bunnies: It would prove it's not impossible, and at least slightly probable that such a skeptic would give in. Furthermore, whoever won the challenge might be called upon to demonstrate it again, and I think he should be quite glad to.

Major Tom: As difficult as getting through the process for testing is, the point is that for a million dollars, unless this guy is purposely not testing anyone at all, some of the many many many people with psychic abilities should have gotten through and done them.

[Psan]

First of all : If I ever get a psychic ability, I wont go for a million, I can use it to make billions. A tiny supernatural skill can give me a huge advantage over normal guys.

Second of all : I wont go out in street declaring that ability. It will make more enemies and make people careful, when you are around......decreasing your chances of getting a billion, and even surviving.....

[Tyciol]

Psan, a great argument, and one I would follow like you as well. Unfortunately it still does not dispel the argument: not everyone is so smart, and will want to show off. The first guy to prove he has psychic abilities will be rich and famous, they would definitely take it.

[no_leaf_clover]

Do you think if Randi saw somebody levitate themself, he'd believe paranormal things exist?

He might, but he wouldn't have to say admit it, and after reading about how bad some of his TV appearances went for him, I don't think he would.

[Psan]

not everyone is so smart, and will want to show off.

And they do it everytime.
And fail, because skeptics are smarter.

On a more serious side, I feel you cant use the so called 'psychic abilities' too much for practical things, even if they exist. There seems to be some sort of check from beyond....somebody is ensuring that the physical remains strictly physical.

Otherwise, R Bruce or Monroe would be the kings instead of B Gates.
Even if the mentioned masters are too modest to do such thing, there are many who'd have done that.
Common sense.....just think.

[Tyciol]

Right... cosmic check...  nice copout.

I believe, that if Robert Bruce and Munroe are being totally truthful about their psychic abilities, they're probably too involved in their Astral wonderland to put much effort into affecting the real world, not that there's some silly cosmic check stopping them.

[pod_3]

And they do it everytime.
And fail, because skeptics are smarter.  

Just fail to convince, but there is no circuit of spiritual rapport between myself and some.

Psychophobia. - Lit., "Soul-fear," applied to materialists and certain atheists, who become struck with madness at the very mention of Soul or Spirit. (THE  THEOSOPHICAL GLOSSARY BY H. P. BLAVATSKY)

If you are capable, be blatant and see what happens. It won't be fear as you might think of it.

[beavis]

not everyone is so smart, and will want to show off.

First priority, I wanted the $million. Second, I wanted to show the world that the paranormal is a fact. Third, I wanted to show off. Do you see something wrong with that?

[karnautrahl]

I don't care enough about such opinions these days as to consider trying to jump through Randi's hoops. Now if there was a genuine scientific challenge that was clean and clear with only the intention of proof/disproof (is that a word?) the way science SHOULD be-along with a £1million prize then that would take my interest-of course it would.
The fact is anyone well informed about Randi, would totally avoid the man-even if they could walk on water.

[Telos]

First priority, I wanted the $million.

Beavis, you mentioned that you were into computer science, didn't you? Have you considered the P=NP problem?

http://www.claymath.org/millennium/

Or one of the other six $1 million prizes? Considering all the trouble you would have go through with courts and Randi, I would think that it would be about just as difficult.

[beavis]

I knew about those 7 $million problems. I tried to solve P=NP for about 200 hours total. Got an approximate solution that only works some of the time. Worthless. The weirdest thing I tried to solve the "max-clique" version of that problem is to put all the vertexs into a space with as many dimensions as there are vertexes, and let their connections or lack of connections push and pull on each other. I tried asymptotic equations, exponential, and lots of others. I tried never letting any 2 vertexs that werent connected get closer than some set distance, so only a true clique could come together, but the cliques didnt always come together. I think it could be made to work, but would take so much time that its disqualified as P.

[pod_3]

Miracles would not occur if probability could not be altered.

[beavis]

Things we dont know about can be altered, but the ideas describing random things cant, unless they are found not to be random... and then those laws do not apply and are still correct.

[pod_3]

Who said anything is random?

[beavis]

only random things have probability