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Adrian

Greetings Darrenbeck!

What sort of topics are you specifically interested in? E.g. Magic, OBE, Metaphysics etc.?

Best regards,

Adrian.


https://ourultimatereality.com/
Vincit Omnia Veritas

darrenbeck


distant bell

What about good old Aleister Crowley and Dion Fortune? Can books get more interesting and essential than that?


Adrian

Greetings!

quote:

What about good old Aleister Crowley and Dion Fortune? Can books get more interesting and essential than that?

Well that rather depends on what you think of "good" old Aleister Crowley as a source.

I never judge people without knowing all the facts (which I certainly don't about Crowley), but we do know that Crowley always openly and vehemently claimed to be the anti-christ, "beast who's number is 666" which governed his life and inspired his practices. There was a very interesting documentary on TV here recently, one of a series called "Masters of Darkness", that filmed, for the first time, some the places associated with Crowley, including his "abbey" of Thelema.

You can read more about it here:

http://www.channel4.com/history/microsites/M/masters_darkness/crowley.html

I would add that this program does demonstrate somewhat of a lack of understanding of occult matters, and in particular what Abramelin and King Solomon's Goetia actually are for example.

As for books to recommend:

Modern Magick by Donald Kraig is an excellent book - particularly for work on important rituals such as the Lesser Banishing Ritual of the Pentagram (LBRP), Banishing Ritual of the Hexagram(BRH) and the Middle Pillar Ritual. It is very ritualistic, Golden Dawn inspired - not that that detracts from the book at all - depends what you are seeking.

Astral Dynamics by our own Robert Bruce is unsurpassed on the Astral/OBE/Energy subjects.

And save enough for Robert's new book "Practical Psychic Self Defence", which should be out in a couple of months I hope. That will be a definitive, trailblazing publication I can't wait for PPSD - I do hope it doesn't get delayed for any reason.

Best regards,

Adrian.
https://ourultimatereality.com/
Vincit Omnia Veritas

Rob

The dual book "Liber Null & Psychonaut" (Peter Carroll) is absolutely brilliant! Chaos magick, truly very modern, not to take the philosophy of to heart (of which there is a minimal amount of), this style is for results only. The only book I own which comes close in content to AD (though very different angle), a seriously worthwhile buy. Also I am currently digesting "Initiation Into Hermetics" by Franz Bardon, which is said to be the very best book on this topic by many master. Looks like good stuff, but with some "mistakes" (eg with respect to OBE, not entirely accurate...although the course is excellent).

With respect to Uncle Al, well it has to be said that he really did know his stuff and was a powerful adept, even magus. The best way of describing his works is to say just get the general idea of it but no dig tooo deep into the details. He purposely put things in his books for neophiles to do which are unwise, but initiates would looks at and say "umm, I think I won't do that". A healthy pinch of salt advised! (this was so people would be forced to find things in their own way, do it themselves, and not just follow the text word by word - an attitude it seemed he frowned on, for good reason).
And just look at the legacy he left behind him....

Edited by - Inguma on 15 March 2002  04:31:32
(!!!Formerly known as Inguma!!!)
You are the Alpha and the Omega. You are vaster than the universe and more powerful than a flaring supernova. You are truly incredible!!

distant bell

Everytime I mention uncle Al I gett this stragnge reaction from people who probably never have read one page of his books and understod even less. I don´t know much about Crowleys life, and what he did with his physicall body really dosn´t interrest me. The fact remains that he has writen WERY GOOD BOOKS! And in my opinion that is what really is important.

That crowly called himselfe The Beast 666 had wery good reasons, he turnd against the perverted kind of christianity that was prevaliing in England in those days. Even the OUTSPOKEN CHRISTIAN Dion Fortune (founder of the society of the inner light) claimd that the situation in victorian England was bad- that people lived in menatl misery selfimposed by self created "christian" ethics. Ethics that damaged many people.

Many people now days that call themselfes Christians have a wery different wiev upon life then what the christianity demanded some hundred years ago. I think it might be hard for modern people in secularised countrys to understand the way life was in Crowleys days.

Crowley was serving God, just like all true occultist. He said this many times- but he was not serving the man made tyran Jahve.

Great books by Crowley:
Eight lectures on yoga
Magick without tears
Moonchild
Diary of a drug fiend
Liber AL -the book of the law (Do I dare adding this title?)

I recomed all people who think that they know something
about Crowley to actually read some of hes work, instead
of reading slander about him.

Dion Fortune Link - www.innerlight.org.uk





BDHugh

quote:

Also I am currently digesting "Initiation Into Hermetics" by Franz Bardon, which is said to be the very best book on this topic by many master. Looks like good stuff, but with some "mistakes" (eg with respect to OBE, not entirely accurate...although the course is excellent).





On another message board they were talking about the same differences with astral projection and what Bardon called astral wandering. From what I gathered astral wandering is a completely different "process" from OBE/astral projection.


Adrian

Greetings Distant Bell!

I don't propose to discuss Aleister Crowley, because as the saying goes  "the truth is out there", and he would have known full well the Karmic consequences of his interpretation of "serving God" which he is fully entitled to. I will say the man had a great intellect, and was a very prolific writer. There is also no doubt that he left a legacy of his Magic(k) that will not be forgotten in a hurry.

And lets face it, you can't fail to notice a man who signs himself:

"Winess my hand

Tau-Omicron Mu-Epsilon-Gamma-Alpha Theta-Eta-Rho-Iota-Omicron-Nu (Taw-Resh-Yod-Vau-Nunfinal): The Beast 666; Magus 9 Degree = 2Square A.' A.' who is the Word of the Aeon THELEMA; whos name is called V.V.V.V.V. 8 Degree = 3Square A.' A.' in the City of the Pyramids; OU MH 7 Degree = 4Square A.' A.'; Ol SUNOF VAORESAGI 6 Degree = 5Square, and ... ... 5 Degree = 6Square A.' A.' in the Mountain of Abiegnus: but FRATER PERDURABO in the Outer Order or the A.' A.' and in the World of men upon the Earth, Aleister Crowley of Trinity College, Cambridge."

His business cards must have been a fair size

Best regards,

Adrian.


https://ourultimatereality.com/
Vincit Omnia Veritas

distant bell

-Yeah, the guy had humor!


Winged_Wolf

Oh, he had a DEVASTATING sense of humor, really--he used to write truly lovely hymns, and send them anonymously to churches.  Sometimes, the church would even use the hymn, for quite a long time, before someone noticed that the first letter of each line, if put together, spelled out an obscenity.....
He loved to play with words, acrostics, and such--mathematical arrangements of letters.  Most likely his extensive signature plots out a mathematical arrangement of letters.

As Sybil Leek said of him....he decided that if others were going to think the worst of him, why should he discourage them?  He actively encouraged people in their assumptions about him, and he sat back and laughed while they called him the devil.  
In reality, he simply wasn't as bad as they thought he was--not as bad as he implied he was.  (Not that he was any sort of a saint, and he did do some gross things, just nothing so terrible as people wanted to believe).

All brilliant folks have flaws that often match the depth of their brilliance.  Crowley could surely be counted one of these.


--Winged Wolf
--Winged Wolf
http://www.lulu.com/wingedwolfpsion
"I will stare at the sun until its light doesn't blind me, and I will walk into the fire, 'til its heat doesn't burn me, and I will feed the fire...."

PeacefulWarrior

I, like Darren, would be interested in finding out which books in specific were formative in Robert's path to "enlightenment".  Maybe someday he will compile a list of his favs and post them as an article or here in the forums.

We shall not cease from our exploration, and at the end of all our exploring, we shall arrive where we started and know the place for the first time.
T.S. Elliot
---------------
fides quaerens intellectum

Mobius

Hi Darrenbeck & all readers,I know you asked for Roberts list of
books & I would love to hear of more as well.
In the meantime I,ll throw in some of mine as I,m a lover of all
books.
OBE books:
Obviously "Astral Dynamics"
"Journeys out of the body" by Robert A.Monroe
"Far Journeys" by Monroe
"Ultimate journey" by Monroe
"Voyagers into the unknown" by Bruce Moen
"Voyage beyond doubt" by Moen
"Voyagers into the afterlife" by Moen
"Voyage to curiosity,s father" by Moen
"Captain of my ship, master of my soul" by Skip Atwater (ex SRI)
"Leaving the body,8 systems of OBE travel" by D.Scott Rogo

Psychic self defence:
"Psychic self defence" by Dion Fortune........P.s distant bell,I
think its a good book & I like one of her methods she mentions
towards the end of the book where she says a potential psychic
attacker will find their power useless if their victim happens to
be at a cinema roaring in laughter at the antics of Charlie Chaplin.
But at the same time the book should be taken lightly as her
Christian beliefs/upbringing could have heavily biased her work.
"Positive Magic" by Marion Weienstein

With respect to Uncle Al,I,m not sure how much of his stuff to
believe or not,I believe he wrote in code a bit & that the majority
of his stuff can be easily misenterpreted.
Distant Bell,I noticed you put in the book of Law & even though I
own it & cost me $150 too! I,m dubious as to its validity.
At first he believed it was his channelled contact with Aiwass,one
of the secret cheifs who directed the Hermetic Order of the
Golden Dawn.Then later he turned around & said Aiwass was merely a
manifestation arising from the depths of his own subconcious mind.
Much of the book of Law was based on the info that Aiwass was
supposed to have comunicated to him.
I like a lot of his stuff but like many others was turned off a bit
on hearing of his involvements with the Ordo Templi Orientis (OTO)
& the Argenteum Astrum/A'A'/Silver star, the 3rd order of the
Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn.
The OTO were notorious for their sexual rituals.

I like one of Aleister Crowleys quotes which goes:
"Always tell the truth,but lead a life so improbable that no-one will
believe you"

Adrian, can you verify a rumour I heard a few years back,that
Jimmy Page from Led Zep,purchased the Abbey of Thelema & much of
Crowleys original works,do you know if that was true?

Good reading everyone,& can we see some other interesting titles
from whoever reads this,thanks.

All the best on your journeys

Mobius


distant bell

O.T.O. – wild ecstatic sexuall orgies and rituals!

I have heard the slander about O.T.O. too. Hm.. what can I say...
I know people who are memebrs of the O.T.O., I have even thought about joining them myselfe. And well- somewhere hig up in the grades where no regular mebers ever get,  ther might be some sexual rituals involved
- But I have never heard of it.
The pople I have talked to who are mebers of the O.T.O. have some pretty hige grades. I know one guy who humorous said that he had gotten into O.T.O. in the first place because of al the talk about sex magic- just to find out that there actually isn´t anything like that  going on in the orden. Note- this was said as a half joke- but the fact about O.T.O. and sexual rituals remain- it is not true that this is a common practise in O.T.O., at least not in the
branch we have here in sweden. The members of O.T.O. are inteligent free thinking people with an intereset for the occult. No more and no less. And yes, a certain interest in the writings of Crowley, and an apreciation for Liber Al and Thelema of course.

I have read Liber AL- the book of the law- with great pleasure. It is interesting and valuable reading- it may have been written by an entity called Aiwass or perhaps even by one called Crowley J
To me it dosn´t really matter. Either it makes sense and helps me with my life and understanding of the univers, or it dosn´t. I don´t feel that I would have more trust in a entity called Aiwass then I would in Crowley. So I look at the text and make my own judegement. I would never trust any book or information because it suposedly had divine origin. I have read the bible to, and personally come to the
conclusion that I choose not to belive in it- because it wasn´t really making any great impression on me. I think all books should be carefully studied and exmined with intuition and logic, before one choosed to belive in what they say.

I am a Thelemit and thus see great truths in the Book Of The Law. Of course this is a book that takes a lot of time to understand, and things ar not always as they seem on the first wiev. If anybody whants to read it I have some advice for you:
read, digest and think, then read again, digest again and think it over wery properly and with a free mind befor you judeg it! An open mind and a willing to see beyond the first impression
will be needed. Remember that the book has MANY dimensions, and shows the different aspects of the univers.

Well, Dion Fortune is a great author. I guess her atempt to be both christian and pagan at the same time might have been a bit tricky at moments. I think that this might have the effect that she will be seen with scepticism by both "real christians" and "real pagans"

There is a great site on the web that has most books and text availabel free on line. They have almost everythig regarding religion, The bible, koran, crowly, buddhism, Etc.etc. This one is a must! Check it out!!

http://www.sacred-texts.com/index.htm

Extract from Dion Fortunes- Psychic Self Defense:


The exorcist has to achieve three things; he must repair the patient's aura, clear the atmosphere of his environment, and break his contact with the forces that are causing the the trouble. These three things are interdependant and not one of them is first or last. The first thing to do when dealing with an occult attack is to make a temporary clearence of the atmosphere and so gain a breathing-space in which to reform the shattered ranks. this is more readily performed by a
ritual than by unaided willpower. Any act performed with intention becomes a rite. . . . [If] we...take a bath with a view to ritual cleanliness. . . its efficacy will extend beyond the physical plane. Water is a means of purification. It is used in the rite of baptism by the Church and in the preparation of the lace by the occultist about to perform a ceremony. [notes salt that has also been consecrated should be added to the "holy" water] alt is the emblem of the element earth. it is also a crystaline substance,. . . and
holds etheric magnetism better than anything else. Water on the other hand, is the emblem of the psychic sphere. It is an excellent plan, when trying to break an undesirable psychic contact, to emmerse oneself in a bath of water that has been especially consecrated for the purpose; re-dressing in new or at least clean clothing afterwards.
The following prayers may be used for the blessing of the salt and water:
(Pointing the first and second figures at the salt) I exorcise thee creature of salt by the living God (+) by the holy God (+) by the omnipotent God (+) that thou mayst be purified of all evil influences in the Name of Adonai, Who is Lord of Angels and of men.
(Extending the hand over the salt) Creature of earth, adore thy Creator. In the Name of God the Father almighty, maker of heaven and earth and of Jesus Christ his son, our Saviour, I consecrate thee (+) to the
service of God, in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost. Amen
(Pointing the first and second fingers over the water) I exorcise thee creature of water by the living God (+) by the holy God (+) by the omnipotent God (+) that thou mayst be purified of all evil influences in the Name of Elohim Saboath, Who is Lord of Angels and of men.
(Extending the hand over the water) Creature of water, adore thy Creator. In the Name of God the Father almighty, maker of heaven and earth and of Jesus Christ his son, our Saviour, I consecrate thee (+) to the service of God, in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost. Amen
(Casting the salt into the water) We pray Thee, O god, Lord of the Heaven and Earth, and all that in them is both visible and inviisble, that thou mayest stretch forth the right hand of the Power upon those creatures of the elements and hallow them in thy Holy Name. Grant that this salt may make for health of body and this water for health of the soul, and that there may be banished from this palce where trhey are used every power of adversity and every illusion and artifice of evil, for the sake of Jesus Christ, our Saviour. Amen The water thus conscecrated may be used as a bath, or for the making the sign of the cross upon the
forehead, or for sprinkling about the place. When using it, the following prayer may be employed: In the Name which is above every other name and in thepower of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, I exorcise all influences and seeds of evil; I lay upon them the spell chains and cast into the outer darkness that they may not troulbe the servants of God

This text is taken from The society of the inner light webb page.


Be Blessed!



Mobius

Hi Distant Bell,WOW someone I now sort of know is fairly close to
the O.T.O,thats great!I,m sure if the O.T.O sect you are talking
about are primarily occult based & not the public perception that
the occult is Satanism which it is not,it would be interesting.
Most of the readers in here would know that Occult literally means
"hidden" "mysterious" "not revealed" & has been posted in other forums
as well,so for anyone who is just reading this & is not familiar
with the Occult,you will find that the majority of people who are
into the occult are peaceful nature loving people.
The bad press has been from Satanism & some how the two got put together & in reality are poles apart.
I too like the book of Law,I love big books & nicely bound hardcovers.
Its absolutely jam packed with information & goodies & just looks
good.
That site you posted has been on my favourites list for a while &
I notice a couple of others have referenced it like Daniel,brilliant
site.
My eyes are closing up I,ve got to go to bed,cya,s

Good luck on your journeys

Mobius



Edited by - Mobius on 28 March 2002  11:09:15

darrenbeck