AP Adventures outside the norm

[Andali27]

I was talking to a friend the other day and we were recounting our favourite television shows when we wondered, why not project to some place other than the RTZ or Astral Realm?  Why not to the world a book you've read was set in?  Or why not invade the SCG from Stargate SG-1 just so you can take a trip through the wormhole?

What about a story you wrote or read?  You have it all in your imagination, the world, everything!

A movie?  Even if it was animated, or life action, like Lord of the Rings, APing there would be just    .

Has anyone tried it?  I knew there used to be a thread here once about AP to fictional places, but who else would want to go anywhere in their imagination/into a TV series/movie/book  etc?  I can't be the only one.  Where would you want to go?

[Telos]

I've definitely visited the environments of a few video games, especially of the martial arts variety. There's not much I'm able to put into words, except that it was incredible and inspiring - giving me the urge to someday fund an animation project about various people astral projecting and doing that kind of unbelievable stuff.

Then the Matrix came out. And I no longer felt like I had an original idea. lol

As far as TV shows or movies, I've definitely visited the Star Trek universe (and flirted with Jadzia Dax), met a vorlon from Babylon 5 (they're always into people's dreams), and a whole bunch of really awesome anime. Wow, does anime look beautiful in dreams... I just can't describe it or replicate it. :/

[Andali27]

I've definitely visited the Star Trek universe and flirted with Jadzia Dax

I'd bop on down to the stargate universe and take a trip through the gate and kick some Go'uld a*s*s!

Anime huh?  How about the world of Disney animation?  Now I so wanna go solar surfing!  Treasure Planet!!!

Andali

[Noxangelus]

Do these places exist when your not visting them or are they created by your own imagination at the time. Do these worlds have the same laws in reality, could you pick up a pencil and snap it in half and then grind it against a wall?

Its very fascinating

[Leannain]

haha i use to dream about that...
to visit final fantasy 7 world
stargate worlds etc etc

[Telos]

Oh wait! I forgot how useful this could be.

In Star Trek, the holodeck is very similar to a controlled lucid dream. Often times, when I realized I was dreaming, I would say, "Computer," and it would beep in acknowledgment. Then I would say something, like, "raise the light level," and it would do so. "Delete this character," "create a river scene," "more rocks," "less water," etc., all worked as well.

And ReBoot! What I great show. For those who haven't seen the show, the characters often go inside a "game cube" (Nintendo stole the name from them, I think) and inside the game they would "reboot," double-clicking an icon on their bodies, and a wave of transformation would pass through them, changing their bodies into one appropriate for the game. I've used that a few times too, and got some pretty interesting results. ;)

Wow, I'm such a nerd lol.

[astralspinner]

Heh. The number of times I've wound up in a level of the Doom computer game in dreams or meditations is unreal.

It's gotten even worse since I got hold of Doom3. Just this lunchtime I got a demon jumping out on me as I went up a staircase

[Nostic]

I don't think it's too uncommon to have vivid dreams or projections into video game or similar worlds. It just sucks when you can't control it. I mean, when you can't make it happen when you want, and you can't determine the length of the experience, or even the exact location you want to visit. Traveling to such worlds is definitely an interest of mine, but certainly not my main objective when it comes to going beyond the physical. I think the fantasy/video game world I'd most want to experience [while fully in control] would be Metroid. Zelda would be cool also, as well as a number of others.  

[ASunnieSpirit]

Dont worry, im just as dorky as all you guys (I think im gonna try that reboot idea ~ I luv that show, hehehe)

Ive been wanting to visit hogwarts and not to mention a few other fantasy lands, Zelda is one i will add to my list =D

As far as imagination, i have summoned characters from my own fantasys (mostly because i know they are all friendly) but i havent been able to talk with them yet for whatever reason..

Im curious to know if these "universes" exist when we are not there as well. I think they do. I remember someone talking about how the Harry Potter universe is quite elaborate and vivid (probably because millions of children have read and dreamed of the place) I would think it to be like a belife system- sort of hovering up there =)

[Frank]

Hi:

Every idea, concept, invention, construct, etc., etc. that has been or ever will be invented or otherwise introduced within our physical reality is already lodged within Focus 2 of consciousness. So any story or animation, music, or whatever, can be experienced within this area.

Yours,
Frank

[-lines-]

This form of astral projecting you guys are talking about looks like you've decided to slap the name on any kind of vivid dreams that you have. I mean, really, if you can't seperate the APing and some dreams from each other(or simply decide that they -must- be the same things), then you're going to be confusing the two more often, confusing any people who read this about them, and making people who just stumble across these forums jump to conclusions of how you think. The dreams that appear to be their own world, to be vividly detailed, and seem to be real, are either lucid dreams or ones that you have remembered particularily well for one reason or another.

--

I just checked the definition of astral projection to make sure that I hadn't gotten it wrong, but it seems that the definition of it has changed from what it once meant. That's too bad, because it also means that astral projecting can refer to fictional places, worlds from books, television shows, and other dream, which only continues to  blurs the line between dreaming and APing, which are two different things, but the term has been used by those who dream because of the intensity, messing up the definition of the word.

[Andali27]

There is no blurring of the line.  If you can't tell the difference then you need to practice more.  APing and dreaming may be looked at the same (because it's thought you AP when you dream) but there's a difference to it.

We're not 'slapping names on' anything.  You can't choose what dreams you have but you can choose where you project to (if you're advanced enough).  That's the difference.

Smart people don't leap to conclusions.  They read up on what they're doing and develop their own ideas.

No one is confusing AP with dreams.  Most dreams play out an abviously preset scenario where your subconscious mind draws what it's going to do from your memories, personality etc.

AP is done consiously and with an intent.  Dreams take off on their own accord and only become lucid if you become aware that you acutally are dreaming.  Even then you can hardly change the scenario and are limited to waht you can do because you're grounded by belief systems.

AP has a whole other set of rules.

Quoting Frank
Every idea, concept, invention, construct, etc., etc. that has been or ever will be invented or otherwise introduced within our physical reality is already lodged within Focus 2 of consciousness. So any story or animation, music, or whatever, can be experienced within this area. ,

is done consiously.

If you're confusing the two, or believing that you can, there are some good threads on the topic of Dreaming vs AP.

Though some AP experiences turn Lucid after a while, they can be forgotten if you go back to sleep because even though you are consious, your body is in sleep mode while you're away and won't retain the journey, like it doesn't retain the dreams you have at 2am depending on where you are in the sleep cycle.

No one is trying to blur the line or smush the two together.  In retrospect, we're saying if you set the place you want to go, and go there with intent and full consiousness, how can you possibly be dreaming?

Andali

[-lines-]

For me, I drop into dreams from thinking before I fall asleep. The thinking, visualizations, and the such just form into the dream I have. This happens with the first dream only, I assume. The rest of the dreams I have are stuff that is normal dream material; things thought about, or done during the day.  I've never APed or had an OBE (never tried), all I know about them is what I've read about them before and the conclusions that I've drawn from that.

Are you saying that APing and dreaming are different only because one has the intent to dream about certain surroundings or events?

Sorry for sounding rude, I've always thought of APing and OBE as one and the same. I figured that APing was projecting your mind to the real world. When I found out that APing also had a different definition, I decided to leave in the first part I wrote. Maybe I should've lurked a bit more, but I find that this lends to learning faster, basing stuff less off of assumptions and possibly wrong information.

[Telos]

Frank, that makes sense, given how art already resembles Focus 2oC.

[ASunnieSpirit]

Lines~ i think you need to do more research on AP and OBE (they are the same thing). you can project into into the RTZ (Real Time Zone, your bedroom, ect) or into the astral where thoughts and dreams rule. Just because the setting doesnt exist here on earth doesnt mean you cant project to an imaginary/fantasy place and not be "dreaming" or unlucid as you put it. I suggest you read up of the other great posts on the subject, the possibilities are literally endless when your out of body =)

[-lines-]

So you are saying that OBEs are exactly the same as APing, even to the extent that you can have an OBE to a place other than the real time zone the same as you can AP to a visualized setting? Yeah, I'll read up on them some more, but it seems that the definition keeps on changing. I may have not properly understood OBEs and APing to begin with.

[mactombs]

So you are saying that OBEs are exactly the same as APing, even to the extent that you can have an OBE to a place other than the real time zone the same as you can AP to a visualized setting? Yeah, I'll read up on them some more, but it seems that the definition keeps on changing. I may have not properly understood OBEs and APing to begin with.

I can understand the confusion. OBE (Out-of-Body-Experience) and AP (Astral Projection) are basically the same thing. AP is archaic, OBE more recent. AP, however, does imply the experience was consciously initiated, whereas an OBE might happen spontaneously.

The difference between dreams and an OBE is something that you have to experience an OBE to appreciate. There is a huge difference. I've heard that dreams are just a form of projecting, but I disagree completely. They might be distantly related, if anything.

Your sig makes me laugh, by the way. You're skeptical until someone proves you're not skeptical?  

But, yes, I agree ... when people talk about this subject it does sound a whole lot more like dreams than anything. Who knows, though. I don't think you or me are going to find out unless we experience it.

Until then, I'll use my grain of salt.

[-lines-]

Dreams are different from OBE's I know, but with APing it seems that two different definitions are used, one refering to an OBE that is purposefully initiated and occurs in the RTZ. The other AP can be to a different time, or to a fictional place, where the second seems to conflict with the definition of OBE's as I know it. I thought that OBE's happened in the RTZ, with the person able to view their body from their astral form. With APing to non-existent places seems to be much different from the AP that is similar to an OBE.

<edit>
Yeah, noticed that my signature didn't sounds like I was meaning it to. That'll teach me to use a sig that pops into my head at 5am without thinking it over longer. I'll end up changing it to what it was meant to mean soon.
</edit>

[Gandalf]

wow! If every idea and story exists already in the astral...then does that mean there is a fully functioning fully populated Tolkien's 'middle-earth' in existence where i can go and hang out?

apart from some temporary mental construct that i just created for myself i mean.. is there also a middle-earth world there that exists independantly of me, whether I go there or not?

Doug

[-lines-]

-That's - the kind of thinking that makes me skeptical of this new definition of APing... not skeptical exactly, it makes the whole thing sound downright absured.

[Frank]

Hi:

There are no new definitions, just a wider awareness of subjective reality.

Yours,
Frank

[Noxangelus]

wow! If every idea and story exists already in the astral...then does that mean there is a fully functioning fully populated Tolkien's 'middle-earth' in existence where i can go and hang out?

apart from some temporary mental construct that i just created for myself i mean.. is there also a middle-earth world there that exists independantly of me, whether I go there or not?

Doug

I know its crazy to comprehend! Do the people like Bilbo Bagins actually exist do they have a mind set of their own character, what would happen if you told him that the world he lives in was created by people from another world and actually in fact this world only exists in an illusion. Do the people their have free will. What does that say about our world?  The questions and possibilities

[Frank]

-lines-:

I rather think you are mistaken in your accusations of us slapping names on any old experiences we might have. There are a number of us here who are serious-minded practitioners of this art, who look very carefully and closely at the experiences we have and who take great care in our understanding of them.

I think confusion is arising these days because some people are becoming more aware of the fact that everything non-physical is not "astral". The term "astral projection" relates to a particular kind of olden-day belief construct that is usually enacted within an area known as Focus 2 of consciousness.

In the olden days, you had the astral that was said to be set out as 7 planes divided by 7 sub planes, blah, blah, blah, all with ubiquitous funny-sounding names that no one really knows the meaning of. This was their model of consciousness as existed in those days. A model that was filed alongside the one about the world being flat, and the sun revolving around the earth.

Now, our technology has brought to us the knowledge that the world is in fact a sphere, and we actually revolve around the sun. However, only a tiny number of people (myself being one of them) have discovered various facts about the traditional astral-planes model of consciousness, and the severe limitations of this model in relation to what actually takes place.

There are no "planes" there are no "levels", there are no "higher" or "lower" places, etc. All of consciousness is all the same. But when you view it objectively, it doesn't actually look like all of consciousness is all the same. And this is the big pitfall that all the olden day explorers fell into. You see, in those days, people looked up at the sky, they saw the sunrise and they saw the sunset, and it was SO obvious (to them) that the sun revolved around the earth. After all, anyone could objectively view this phenomenon for themselves simply by tracking the sun's movements throughout the course of a day.

In turn, other people went within themselves and saw many different "levels" of consciousness with all their attendant characteristics, like planes and sub-planes, etc. But there are no levels and there are no planes. Consciousness just is. It is all the same. There are differences, of course, but these differences are not to do with the nature of consciousness.

Differences come about because there are different focuses of attention, and in this there are created what we term areas of consciousness. Now, if you study the work of Robert Monroe, he was the pioneer in this. It is on his multi-focus model that my more modern-day Phasing model was based. Even though the Monroe model was a brilliant development on the traditional astral-planes models, it is not without its limitations. As in all things, knowledge widens and events move on. This topic is no different.  

In my Phasing model, there are 4 primary focuses of attention within our system, which I have labelled Focus X of consciousness. Where X is the Focus number in question, i.e. 1 to 4 inclusive. I also add the suffix "of consciousness" (which I often abbreviate "oC") to separate it from the Monroe model.

An area of consciousness is not a designation of a level. It is an area that is associated with particular actions, explorations, and/or movements in consciousness. Within these designated areas, an individual may choose to focus their attention and move in directions associated with their choice of exploration.

Focus 1 of consciousness is the area of consciousness known as our physical world, which we are all familiar with so no explanation is needed.

Focus 2 of consciousness is the next area inwards, so to speak. Now, anything that ever has, or ever will come about within Focus 1 originates within Focus 2 of consciousness. This is the area of a person's imagination; it is where all ideas come about, all impressions, gut feelings, etc. Each and every manifestation that is brought into being within Focus 1 oC, absolutely all of it, every invention, every design, every piece of art of any description, etc. without exception originates within Focus 2 of consciousness.  

Focus 2 oC is the place the olden day explorers termed the astral. It is perfectly possible to enter this area and engage in whatever belief construct you like. It's the place where most of us do our dreaming. Such that if a person develops a degree of lucidity while they are dreaming, then this is where they will have a lucid dream. Or if they purposely enact some kind of "projection technique" then they will enter this region with certain expectations, which will pan out as an "astral projection" experience as opposed to a dream or lucid dream. But these actions are all essentially the same. All that changes is your level of awareness and your expectations.

This is about as far as those olden-day inner explorers went. Some of them tried to venture "beyond" but by and large they were captured by their superstitions about The Void. Getting lost or getting mutilated by some monster hidden in the dark recesses of The Void was a big thing in those days. The tales of which would be filed alongside all manner of other scary "facts", such as, if a person travelled at more than 15mph their physical body would fall apart.

But these days the more forward-thinking practitioners realise the infamous Void of old is just an area of 3D Blackness situated between Focus 2 and Focus 3 of consciousness. In the same way, for example, the real-time zone is a kind of buffer area, if you like, between Focus 1 and Focus 2 of consciousness. To followers of the Monroe School, The Void is simply the 3D-Blackness at Focus 21. Simple as that. No superstitious nonsense getting in the way. Just place your Intent and away you go.

So when you "take off" into the 3D Blackness, you generally emerge within Focus 3 of consciousness. Or what is becoming commonly known as the Transition Area.

In the olden days people used to "die" and either go to heaven or to hell depending on how they were "judged" at the pearly gates. Within the Transition Area is where all those heavens and hells are situated, and a whole lot more besides.

Nowadays, more and more of us (albeit still a tiny minority) are realising that there is no death. What we call death is actually a belief construct we initiate within Focus 1 of consciousness, to be permanently disengaging ourselves from physical focus and to be entering Transition within the area of Focus 3 of consciousness. Transition is where we allow time to shake off all the now redundant belief constructs that we picked up during our physical focus experience.

People who are getting wiser as to the nature of the wider reality are spending progressively less "time" in Transition. However, in the olden days, people would enter Transition with all manner of notions about god, heaven/hells and judgements and such like. Many, many of these people can still be seen today engaged within their heaven and hell constructs. Significant numbers of people have been engaged in Transition for the equivalent of several hundred years. Whereas, someone such as myself would enter Transition with full knowledge of what was happening. So any "time" I spent engaged in this process would largely be under my control.

There are a number of other collective actions associated with Focus 3 of consciousness, but for the purposes of this post, my explanation above will suffice.

Next step inwards is Focus 4 of consciousness. This is where things really start getting interesting. This area is populated by all manner of "energy essences" that are no longer physically focused. This is where everyone's "connections" to all their other focuses are situated, and it is the first step "back" into subjective reality proper a person takes following their physical experience. In fact, I could write a whole book just on Focus 4 alone the area is so involved.

Anyhow, in a nutshell, the above is a brief rundown of the "map" of our system. It is quite a bit more complex than my explanation would suggest and I could have written pages and pages more. But the above should give people some idea.

Essentially, then, going "beyond" the traditional astral-projection construct entails switching your area of consciousness, as opposed to a person merely switching their perception within consciousness. As I said recently in a post to another thread, what many people have yet to realise is it is quite possible to change your perception in consciousness and not actually shift your area of consciousness.

To get outside the traditional astral-projection "box" it is necessary to learn how to shift your area of consciousness. This is what my Phasing approach is geared towards, and is the essential difference between Phasing, and the more traditional methods.

Yours,
Frank

[-lines-]

Frank:

Thanks for taking the time to explain it me. I have a difficult time adapting my thinking to different ways, I guess. It probably didn't help that I didn't have the proper understanding of astral/OBE it in the first place. Going to take a bit before I can understand it more fully of course. That's what reading up is all about.

I'll now be able to think on this more often, muse over it when I get in the mood to switch my ways of thinking of how things work. It's easier for me to think of new ways that conscienceness and universal models, ideas, and the such work. Makes it easier than trying to figure out how they could be working at the same time. Hopefully that makes sense to you.

I also realized that my point to joining the forums was to learn more about these types of things, ideas, and concepts, and not to try to explain why they didn't seem to fit in my idea of how -it- works. I guess the amount of information here kind of overwhelmed me and I have to get adjusted to it a bit still. Don't get me wrong, I will still question things. It's what I do.

Again thanks,
c

[Potatis]

Frank,

Please write a whole book on Focus 4 alone!

Potatis