Most beneficial trance

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Major Tom

...

Patrik

MajorTom,

Thanks for the reply, I guess I just will have to keep experimenting with them both. One thing though, as in the first method you mentioned will have to at some point to "let go". Perhaps it's more noticeable in certain states, but the times I have been out I have never had to "let go", nor been close to sleep. However it has been with wake-ups. So I have basically woken up, feeling "fully" awake, done a practise and gotten out, not feeling that I got closer to sleep, not that I had to "let go", I just willfully got out.

However it is not as easy when doing it without having slept first. Which is the reason I want to know which is easier, enter the edge of sleep, or just deepen the trance. Both which seem to have their benefits and bad sides.

The first method seem like a good choice since I want to master silence of mind. The second one basically included forcing my mind to chatter away, get lost in the chatter, and in that way get to the edge, which is not as beneficial. "Problem" is that I can get myself into the theta or so range of brainwaves, but still feel 100% mentally awake... which also causes problems. I think that if you are on the edge of sleep, you can cause the split with a less ammount of concentration, which is beneficial, however since at the edge, it's a lot harder to stay concentrated. When you feel 100% awake, it seems you need to stay much more concentrated and for a longer period of time... however if you just can master this, it seems like the best choice.

Perhaps I am just mumbling... But it seems I have two choices when entering a trance, and I don't always take the same one. Either I 1) stay just as mentally awake, but deepens the trance, lowering the brainwaves while still being just as awake. or 2) I take the sleep road, I stay concentrated, but all the time get closer and closer to sleep... When starting to get close, I get a lot harder time to concentrate, and eventually just fall asleep, or break the trance. I often find this road harder, I think it all depends on how I focus the brain... kind of which part of the brain I make the most active - which isn't always as easy.


innerpilot

You can try focusing on the light that's emitted through the pineal gland. It works for me a lot of the time. The benefits are many. Besides serving as a focal point, it often brings me the closest I've been to zero point unified field which seems to be the foundation as well as the medium for the parallel universe, astral field, etc. It seems the more one focuses on it, the more it opens and acts as a portal at the same time being a mediuim for itself to travel through. It can also be very healing and truth revealing.

Patrik

MajorTom,

Thanks again, I think you are right, perhaps what I need to experiment with is to enter a trance, silence my mind and go as deep as I can. When I feel I can't get much deeper I should perhaps try and and not focus so much on the trance, but more on the fact of getting out. I have always seen the projection techniques used, to deepen the trance and at the same time squeeze your conciousnes into one tiny thread long enough to cause the projection. But perhaps I should start to see it in two steps:

1) Silence the mind and enter an as deep of a trance I can, while keeping myself fully mentally awake.
2) When deep enough forget about the trance, and try to deepen my conciousnes, or squeeze it into a tiny thread.

A problem with this however might be that I have found once deep enough, the surface mind more or less shuts off. When that happens it more or less stays quiet and it might not be as easy to deepen the conciousnes. There are many techniques to focus your concentration on in order to project, however I find that even if in a deep trance when trying I can't seem get "less awake". Perhaps I need to try new ways, perhaps once in a deep trance I need to "force" the mind to chatter away a bit, while still keeping the level of trance... if at all possible.

Your idea about drifting into a high energy state sounds interesting, but it is very hard to know what you mean by it. I have noticed that when I get to at about as deep as I can get at this point, the cobwem type tickeling transforms into a kind of energetic "vibrations", often over the entire body... While still NOT being the actual projection vibrations, but more of a strong energetic "tickeling". Perhaps this is part of the "high energy state" you describe? However I cannot imagine how I would be able to "ride it", but I guess it's worth experimenting with.


innerpilot,

I have tried many times to use the 3rd eye as a mean of focus, however I have never been able to see a "light" emitt from it, even though I have tried many ways of focusing my mind. What I have tried however is to focus on the pressing feeling I get on the 3rd eye in trance. It does work to an extent, but can be quite hard. I do notice how it gets more intense the more one focuses on it. A few single times I have managed to put such a focus on the pressure feeling in trance that the intense pressure transforms into feeling like a second heart, pulsating in synchronizity with the physical heart, quite intense.

However getting such an ammount of focus on it, is NOT easy, and it is very intense. If you have any suggestions on what I might do wrong in order to see this "light", I'd appreciate feedback.

JAW

Hey Tom,
You describe the rushing up spine sensations and so forth in a similar manner to what I get when Im meditating/trying to project. Ive always had trouble trying to discern between whats supposed to be vibrations and these "rushes". The type of rush I feel is actually identical to what i sometimes feel when Im totally awake, expect sometimes it feels a bit stronger/different, possibly because Im in a semi trance/full trance (god knows!). Would you say these rushes you get feel similar to anything you get when wide awake?
Also sometimes these rushes I get sort of pulse through me, but they never last long, I can only get them to stay around for maybe 10 seconds max, and I can always get them to go away at will, unless I feel like something big is happening, then I try not to focus on it.
Interested to hear what your experience is.

Cheers.
When you ask why some event happened, the only true and complete answer is "The Universe", because if any part of the Universe had been different, things would have happened differently - Eliezer S. Yudkowsky

Patrik

MajorTom,

Thanks, you have really given me a new perspective on the problem. When you mention it, it kind of does feel like a "buzz", kind of like a shiver but more energetic and intense, and you never move the physical body. I have tried to intensify it in many ways, without any real success. Perhaps what I need to do at this point is to somehow learn to deepen my conciousnes. Will probably take a lot of practise, but defenetely worth experimenting with.

I have also noticed how attitude plays a big role in projection. I need to willfully "want" to get out, but at the same time I need to not really care if I do or not. I have noticed that most of the times when I have gotten out it is when I think I won't be able to. If I, without words, think "now I want to get out", it never works. I have also gotten "stuck" half way out. I try and get out, don't really think I will be able to, then I notice I am half way out, I get surprised, start thinking and then cannot get further. If I then quiet down the mind, thinking "okey, so now this projection is ruined" I all of a sudden can move forward again.

innerpilot

Patrik, I have sent you a private message. Hope it is useful to you. Enjoy your journey.

JAW

So Tom would you call that feeling the classic vibrations that many people talk about? Because I thought you could be in the vibration state for many minutes? This is, as you say more like the feeling you get when you watch a scary movie.

Im pretty sure I read in Astral Dynamics that Bruce thinks this rushing feeling isnt vibrations and that its even detrimental to success? Anyone else read this? Ive lent my copy away and cant remember. However if this helps you get out then its only a good thing!!

Did you ask how I get the feeling? Couldnt quite understand that last line. I usually get it as I reach a certain state of trance, or I have a strong hypnogogic image... hard to say actually. When I let it "take over" though, it feels quite different to the normal chill/rush feeling, as my whole body/mind feel like they are almost taken over by it. However nothing ever happens for me from this point. I might have to see what I can do next time just to make sure Im not missing something good here :) I think I had it more when I started too, like it was linked to excitement and stuff like that, so I dont get it quite so much now.

Cheers.
When you ask why some event happened, the only true and complete answer is "The Universe", because if any part of the Universe had been different, things would have happened differently - Eliezer S. Yudkowsky

JAW

Hi Tom,
Thanks for all that. Very interesting indeed. Its good to talk to someone who seems to share some of your own experiences. Better than someone whos always been able to do it easily using a totally different method :)
Im sick at the moment so dont like my chances but Ill have to fill you in regarding whether I get out using this method. Im assuming youd have a hard time trying to explain your falling inwards theory? Doesnt sound like youre trying to feel like youre floating or using any vizualisations... If you can get out within 2 seconds it mustnt take long to do?

Just editing here after reading that keys link you provided. I like this guys viewpoint and the less active/forceful methods of OBE. As I've had trouble using the rope method and stuff like that, I like the ideas he presents. I think I may also have a better understanding of what you might mean when saying you fall inwards, but Im still interested to hear from you what you mean, and how you pull it off within 2 seconds of feeling vibrations. Also if youre using this whole attitude of just, observe, see what happens, dont concentrate on physical body, how can you at the same time feel the vibrations and then react to them using a technique to get out? :)

Cheers.
When you ask why some event happened, the only true and complete answer is "The Universe", because if any part of the Universe had been different, things would have happened differently - Eliezer S. Yudkowsky

Patrik

I usually don't get vibrations when I get out, but I have had them. However the times I get them are rare occasions, it basically happened once in the beginning and once lately when I am pretty sure I was helped. Usually I just get out without sensations at all, except perhaps some resistance by the physical body at times.

I can say this though, the "buzzing" feeling I get is NOT like the vibrations. Perhaps they are just the beginning of them, and hence not as strong, buce I really doubt it. The vibrations feels like "shakings", or that your body is vibrating at high speed, but still having an energetic feel to it.

The feeling I get in trance is more like an intense energetic shiver, or "buzz". It's not like the shiver you get by seeing something horrible, nor do I get a raising feeling in the spine. It's more like the entire body is tickeling energetically very intense. It's like you have energy moving rapidly over your entire body. If I hadn't had intense vibrations before, I would think this was it, but they are very different.

To get this feeling I need to be very relaxed, and in a "deep" trance. I basically need to be more relaxed than I thought possible when I began practising trance. I enter the trance, shut up the surface mind, and relax more and more. While doing this I stay concentrated, either on just the blackness trying to keep the mind totally quiet, the heart, breathing, sound etc. Eventually I will feel a cobweb like ticekling in the face, and/or neck area. I stay concentrated, and deepen it more. Eventually the tickeling energetic feeling in the face will run through the entire body, and it will get more intense, and get more of a "buzzing" feeling as MajorTom explained his. It does not really spread, it just suddenly start running through the entire body.

I could never get this feeling before I managed to get the trance this deep. I do not get it if I think too much, nor if I am emotional. They also do not happen if I "want" them to happen, so it has nothing to do with excitement or expectations.

When I enter this I am usually very mentally awake though. I tried twice yesterday, first time I fell asleep when the energetic feeling began slightly (didn't sleep much during the night). The other time I didn't manage to deepen my conciousnes.

I can keep this feeling for many minutes, or as long as I can keep the relaxation, trance and be relatively concentrated and mentally quiet. Sometimes it gets more intense, and sometimes less... which like the "true" vibrations seem to be based on the level of concentration.


JAW

Hey Tom,
I cant say how clearly your term "tremendous power rush" explains the feelings I get. If I let them, these rushing feelings do "take over" and yeah, feels like a full on power rush throughout my whole body, yet as Ive said, usually this feeling reaches a climax for maybe a few seconds, then slowly fades away, leading me to beleive its just that feeling you get when watching a movie :)
So when you say the feeling is good enough to roll or fly out, do you actually use these as projection techniques or do you "go with the flow"/"fall into it" and you're all of a sudden just out, next to your body?

I also wonder (seeing as though you seem to share similar experiences) if you recognise anything from my earlier post at http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11543&SearchTerms=projection Im actually taking a break from reading Rob Monroes first book right now and was shocked to read his journal entry which described almost to the letter, the same tunnel/person sitting scenario, except he was out of body I think at that point and I wasn't.

Cheers and thanks for your time spent so far.
When you ask why some event happened, the only true and complete answer is "The Universe", because if any part of the Universe had been different, things would have happened differently - Eliezer S. Yudkowsky

Patrik

MajorTom,

No I haven't, didn't think there were much to it until you mentioned you had a similar thing when you project in trance. I am usually too mentally awake when I enter this state, and it is only reccently I have managed to get my trance this deep. In any event, it's worth experimenting with, perhaps succeeding in deepening my conciousnes will give some results.

My mentally awake, I mean that I am most likely in a middle to lower theta range of brainwaves. But that my mind is too clear to succeed in a concious projection. I think I need to apprach the sleep line a bit to actually be able to leave the body. What I assume you mean by "falling into", you kind of deepen your conciousnes, loose yourself into your mind, but still staying awake.


Patrik

MajorTom,

Actually I have projected from that state where I see through my eyelids. However it is rare, and only happened in the morning. However I have also projected when feeling more mentally awake than during these times. So I don't think I need to go much deeper than that, conciouswise, though I DO think I need to go about as deep. However not an easy thing to do.

I might add that I am in a much deeper trance when getting the above sensations, than when having seen through eyelids. I think the only way is trials and error, and I need to find some way to get closer to sleep while in this trance state.

Patrik

I came across some things written by Samael Aun Weor yesterday, and even though he has some really weird ideas, he do have some good ones. He mentions that in order to project using the astral body one needs to be in a "sleepy state". He also goes on saying that meditation is useless if not accompanied by the sleepy state. The sleepy state is needed in order for the chakras to start spinning, and to develop psychic abilities such as Clairvoyance using meditation.

I am not sure if it is true, but it does sound valid. I used to get to a drowsy state, where I easily fell asleep during practise, however then I didn't get very deep into the trance. Now I can a can force a lot deeper trance, but have a hard time causing myself to get tired during it.

Perhaps I have just been sleeping too much lately... But if anyone has any suggestions on how to enter the sleep boarder, that would be appreciated. I think I need to in some way focus my brain in a different way, and focus more inwards. However this is easier said than done, pretending that I am going to sleep doesn't really work.

zjrules

hi, i tried to have a ap last night. almost got it. i had the tingling spider web feeling, saw 3d darkness, and heard my self snoring[:D] i'm having trouble also. i got to that stage within 15 min., and im only 14 am i good or what!!![:D][8D] only problem is i cant get further, can someone reply to my topic??

JAW

Hello again :)
Ok number 1, Im not a biker :) Though you could definitely say Im a bit rough... longish hair, generally unshaven... I was meditating/ trying to project last night, early morning...? hehe. How clear was the image?

Just finished reading Monroes first book (in 1 1/2 days ;) Its definitely not as "nice and safe" as Bruces book. He doesnt seem to pull any punches anywhere thats for sure. Anyway I read something that he said which sounded interesting, that his vibrations started out "rough" and then turned into just warmth. Youll also recall I said mine seem to build up into a big rush and dissapear, but now I wonder if they actually just reach a frequency that I can barely feel. I took special notice of the feeling last night and I think I may actually have been able to feel a very slight vibration after the big rush, but I cant be sure. Had a very good session last night listening to the free binaural abyss track, I was pretty far gone :) Quite possibly the deepest trance level Ive attained yet. But of course still no projection otherwise Id be jumping up and down a bit ;) So yeah Im essentially just sorta wondering if the vibrations are continuing but I cant feel them...
? :)
When you ask why some event happened, the only true and complete answer is "The Universe", because if any part of the Universe had been different, things would have happened differently - Eliezer S. Yudkowsky

Patrik

Neither I am a biker, wear white t-shirt nor am "rough". However I do usually wear a black t-shirt, and a bit of leather (i.e long coat, boots and often pants). I am more thin and tall, and also I have long hair (about 1dm belove shoulders), however often wear it in a tale.

I am defenetely not a biker, and if you necessary want to call it something, I guess a metal/goth look is more in order.


Patrik

I have a question regarding which has been most beneficial for your AP work.

Usually when I enter a trance I can do two things, well most of the time at least. I can either put my body to sleep, keeping a clear surface mind trying to keep thoughts from popping up in my mind. While doing this I relaxa my body more and more. I either just concentrate on not thinking, the blackness, heart or something else to put my full focus on while having a clear surface mind.

When doing this I get my body into a very deep relaxation, and eventually manages to keep a clar mind for extended periods. When doing this I feel I am "deep", and manage to keep my concentration, I never get any hypnogogic images popping up. I often feel a "cobweb" tickeling over my entire body, but especially in face.

OR

I put my body into a deel relaxation mode, and instead of clearing my mind I just pretend I am going to sleep, and try to get as close as I can to the sleep boarder. I do try and keep my mind relatively quiet while doing this, but also try to get closer to sleep. Eventually I am near sleep, my body is quite deep and I can get an occasional hypnogogic image. When doing this I get close to sleep, and often fall asleep, having a very hard time keeping my concentration.

Now is the question, what is most beneficial? Should I just try and keep concentrated but 100% awake, not thinking of entering a near-sleep boarder, and just deepen the trance as much as possible? OR should I try and get as close to sleep as I can, while having put the body into a trance state, and while getting close to sleep try and learn to hold my concentration?