Vibrations? A theory...

[Stookie]

There has to be something that makes you question it. Anything? Because it's not observable? A gut instinct? I can't think of anything myself. It seems pretty verifiable across the board as a real thing that happens to pretty much everyone who projects at some point or another, whether they've heard about them or expect them, or don't. There's not too much difference between everyone's description of them either.

[jub jub]

Being of electrical mind and body, I have a theory about phasing. My theory is that it is similar to paralleling two generators together (I use to work in a power plant so I like to use this analogy). Before paralleling two generators together, you must first synchronize  the oncoming unit to the same phase relationship as the unit that is on line before you close the breaker. What that means is the voltage and frequency have to be identical or "in phase".

So, you can liken the relationship of phasing into the Astral the same as connecting two generators together electrically. As you raise your vibrational frequency by observing (mind awake, body asleep), your consciousness synchronizes with Astral and wallah, you're there!

As far as the strong vibrations felt by some, I believe that is usually the case when making the transition into the Etheric plane or real time zone (RTZ) as it's called. Because the transition is so abrupt, and the vibrational frequency so much lower, it is readily felt as a vibration or tingling sensation. I believe this accounts for why the higher you go into the Astal planes, the more vivid and brilliant they become.

Of course, all this is conjecture on my part and I really have no idea what I'm talking about! lol

[jub jub]

If they aren't "real", what else would they be?

I think what Xanth meant is, they're not real in the sense of being a physical manifestation. More of a psychological phenomena.

[Xanth]

Partially, Jub jub. 

I mean... we all know that there are certain "baseline" experiences that people tend to experience towards everything metaphysical, however, we also know that there are exceptions to every rule.  Not everyone is going to experience the same thing in the same manner each and every time.

Now... assuming that they're only felt during a classic 'etheric' projection (aka: OBE) and not during an 'astral' Projection... then that is actually good evidence within itself that the Etheric truly is a separate entity from the Astral.  I dunno... I guess that's just a side note.  LoL

Jub jub is correct though, in that do not believe for a second that Vibrations are anything physical.  The question is really, what part of the non-physical, if any, are they related to.

Doesn't TMI have any big research towards this?  I'd love to see what they gathered.

In any case, consider this me remaining... open minded.  LoL

[Lexy]

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[Volgerle]

I cannot imagine vibrations to be chemical in its basis. That is, by the way, how reductionist / materialist skeptics surely would argue too - that's why I also don't like it  . Next logical step then would be that we postulate that projection is all a neuro-bio-chemically caused illusion of the brain-mind anyway, huh?

No, it is surely on the border between physical and nonphysical. "Etheric" might be the right expression since the etheric body is supposed to be narrowly entangled with the physical and does itself not leave the body except for standing out a few inches or so (ok, that's just a theory, who knows what's to it..  )

I think it is electromagnetical. It feels this way and to me it is only logical to assume it is.

[Lexy]

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[jub jub]

Maybe you can find the answer here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCeD_6Y3GQc

[Under_the_Midnight_Sun]

I really don't think there's anything different going on chemically. In my opinion it is just the separation process. Our astral body.. usually in perfect vibrational harmony with the physical body.. begins to vibrate at a higher frequency when our physical begins to drift asleep. Now what if there is some sort of interference pattern between two bodies existing upon one another with different vibrations.. My guess would be is that they would interfere, possibly causing the shaking we feel.

[Xanth]

I really don't think there's anything different going on chemically. In my opinion it is just the separation process. Our astral body.. usually in perfect vibrational harmony with the physical body.. begins to vibrate at a higher frequency when our physical begins to drift asleep. Now what if there is some sort of interference pattern between two bodies existing upon one another with different vibrations.. My guess would be is that they would interfere, possibly causing the shaking we feel.

An interference pattern, kinda like the Binaural Frequency in a Binaural Beat?

Interesting. 

[Lexy]

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[Volgerle]

Of course, there are bodily bio-chemical, electrical and psychological actions & reactions taking place in every (voluntary or involuntary) induction method.
It's like turning on switches on a radio to get another frequency in (more or less clear or distorted or interfered with other "channels"). For me it is us driving a bio-computer or bio-machine that can be switched and operated on to get different results. For example, DMT might cause more separation from the body and thus facilitate the experience, especially during so-called near death experiences. (But it's a facilitating contribution, there are possibly other things, that contribute, too).  Similar things apply to other induced states of consciousness with similar or other ways of induction, e.g. by ingesting external drugs (DMT is then an 'internal self-generated drug', so to speak).

The problem is (and it is overlooked quite frequently!) that we should differentiate between the TRIGGER / INDUCTION TOOL on the one hand and the consciousness EXPERIENCE on the other.

The EXPERIENCE is not DMT or any internal/external chemical. The EXPERIENCE is not any drug. The EXPERIENCE is not the induction of a meditative or trance state. All these things help to get it, but the EXPERIENCE is an independent reality we "receive" or "enter" and later "digest" the memories of it by analysing it with / in our brain waking state.

So the thing is: I consider vibrations already being more part of the EXPERIENCE instead of being part of the TRIGGER. Vibrations thus are also already a consequence of my induction activities (affirmations, meditating, visualising, putting myself in trance, etc.). So I think that we do not "induce by vibration" or "induce by releasing vibration-sensation-causing chemicals", but rather indirectly "induce vibrations" when we have them when you actually "induce OBEs".

What makes these vibes so interesting, is that they still "feel" physical because the have a direct interaction with your (physical) body. But does that therefore mean it is chemical? I think they are something really in-between physical and non-physical. It is a border-land - quite literally - when we switch between realities (or bodies). That is why it cannot be (purely) chemical because that would still be too much on the physical side for me. However, they are very real! This is why I cannot agree to Xanth's hypothesis declaring it somehow "unreal". Non-physical things are as real as physical. And those in-between-things as well.  

Of course, as said above, during induction methods, there might also be chemical "switches" be flipped by conscious / psychological action in conjunction with neurological/bio-chemical reactions taking place. So yes! - You might see "vibrations" indirectly caused (also!) by chemical causes, if you like to see it that way. Since we always start out from our physical body when we have and induce these experiences, we naturally use body "chemistry", too.

However, and this is again quite subjectively (but I know I am not the only one that thinks that way), vibes just feel so exlusively "electrically" spreading over the body in waves, that I just cannot imagine it being purely chemical at all. It's just my impression.

[daytona955]

We've all "read about" the vibrations... actually, it's probably one of the very first things that a person learns about regarding astral projection! We're told that to project, you need to initiate the "Vibrational State" and then they go on to tell you *EXACTLY* what it's supposed to feel like. *THIS* is the problem.

Have to say that when I first experienced vibrations (approx 14 years ago) I had no idea what was happening to me. I had never investigated OBE or AP before and I never actually projected either, (because I didn't know that I could, or that it was even possible).
I have experienced SP on and off for approximately 23 years, but when the vibrations hit me again for a second time (just about 3 or 4 months ago) I then investigated through the modern wonders of the internet and found you guys! Since then I have only been reading up about the likes of Monroe etc, and it's typical of me that I have not had a fully conscious SP since!!! 
It is this reason that leads me to believe that I must be an energy of some form, but why it seems to have disappeared in some more experienced people is beyond me.

[Under_the_Midnight_Sun]

Have to say that when I first experienced vibrations (approx 14 years ago) I had no idea what was happening to me. I had never investigated OBE or AP before and I never actually projected either, (because I didn't know that I could, or that it was even possible).

what if.. experienced projectors don't experience the vibrations as frequently, because they know when they are in the right state of consciousness to simply roll out. There would be minimal interaction between the two bodies. The same hypothesis holds through with phasing. When the individual is in the right state, they are instantly transported to their desired location, thus reducing the interaction between two bodies.. just a thought

[Lexy]

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[Xanth]

However, they are very real! This is why I cannot agree to Xanth's hypothesis declaring it somehow "unreal". Non-physical things are as real as physical. And those in-between-things as well.  

You're confusing what I'm saying.

I'm not saying they're "unreal"... I'm saying that they *could possibly* be a subjective experience. 

[Volgerle]

You're confusing what I'm saying.

I'm not saying they're "unreal"... I'm saying that they *could possibly* be a subjective experience. 

Of course they are subjective, since they are experienced subjectively and personally. Everything you experience / feel as a person is subjective. Is there any 'objective' experience at all?

[Xanth]

Of course they are subjective, since they are experienced subjectively and personally. Everything you experience / feel as a person is subjective. Is there any 'objective' experience at all?

LoL I had actually typed that exact response out as well... but then deleted it. 

[djed]

Hi I'm djed ; As has already been mentioned, the yogic teachings are 'the stimulation of the chakras causes the kundalini to flow'. There are special meditational techniques for this. What then happens there is a kind of cleansing and a freeing up of the natural life force.
My first natural oobs occured without vibrations, the vibrations came later through practising meditation and yoga.

cheers, djed 

[Naykid]

Yeah, I think it's safe to say, everyone is different when it comes to the vibes.

[ka0s]

I didn't read through this entire threat but just your initial post. I've had hundreds of documented OBE's and rarely ever had any signs of vibrations. I've mostly had buzzing noises and hypnopompic hallucinations if I don't return to my body properly and just "force" my body awake.

I would agree that generally speaking -- much of the idea behind vibrations came from Robert Monroe and that this "inspiration" led many of us to believe in "Vibrations" or the "Vibrational State". The power of thought alone amazes me and it would not surprise me that these thoughts create our own actualization of the vibrations instead of it being a natural phenomena prior to an OBE.

That's my thoughts.

[CFTraveler]

I didn't read through this entire threat but just your initial post. I've had hundreds of documented OBE's and rarely ever had any signs of vibrations. I've mostly had buzzing noises and hypnopompic hallucinations if I don't return to my body properly and just "force" my body awake.

I would agree that generally speaking -- much of the idea behind vibrations came from Robert Monroe and that this "inspiration" led many of us to believe in "Vibrations" or the "Vibrational State". The power of thought alone amazes me and it would not surprise me that these thoughts create our own actualization of the vibrations instead of it being a natural phenomena prior to an OBE.

That's my thoughts.

http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_out_of_body_experiences/vibrations_a_theory-t32920.0.html;msg271410#msg271410

And,   http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_out_of_body_experiences/vibrations_a_theory-t32920.0.html;msg271608#msg271608

[Pauli2]

I didn't read through this entire threat but just your initial post.

I think you should read through the thread.

[ka0s]

I didn't need to read the entire thread to state my opinion --- because it is all relative to interpretation =). CFTraveler, I read your links and I did not know that! It is interesting how far it goes back. I guess I meant "modern day" adventurers likely get the "Vibration" idea from Monroe.

[jub jub]

I didn't need to read the entire thread to state my opinion --- because it is all relative to interpretation =). CFTraveler, I read your links and I did not know that! It is interesting how far it goes back. I guess I meant "modern day" adventurers likely get the "Vibration" idea from Monroe.

I don't think so. I think the vibrations are part of the phenomena which most people experience. I use to get vibrations long before I ever heard of Monroe or OBEs.

BTW, is your name an amateur radio call sign?