AN ATTACK OR A MESSAGE??

[LadyLea]

For furthur background refer to thr thread Astral Meeting in the OBE Discussion Forum and read my post(Ladylea).  I will include as much info as poosible.  If anyone has a question, please ask.  This has remained unanswered for a long time.  Any help is appreciated!

When I was 15 years old I met J, 16.  We decided to go steady on Valentine's Day.  He told me one afternoon that he could enter people's dreams.  He proved it.  

He told me about a group where he used to live could AP, use telepathy, etc.  J stated that I was a part of that group but I did not know it.  Slowly, I began dreaming of a plump, bald-headed man in a brown robe with a tannish colored rope around the waist, pointing at the entrance of a tunnel.  Apparently, I was to enter.  A couple days later J asked me if I had seen anything out-of-the-ordinary.  Infact I had.  I saw the images of two boys around J's age in my mind's eye.  I told him.  I'd never met them in real life.  J asked me to remember any details about their faces and I described them.  He said it was T and M.  Friends of his in the group.  He informed me that if I did not want them there then they wouldn't be.

A week later I was still having dreams like those above.  I was talking to J about fate and us when I glanced at my left wrist.  I saw three bright red spots on the inside of my wrist arranged in an upright triangle (he had told me earlier that they formed in triangles to kill evil beings in the astral--strange to me now but how can I not believe a little bit of this after everything else) each approxiamtely one cm big.  I was taken aback.  I told J.  He stated that it was normal and there was nothing to worry about.  He assurred me not to be scared.  He said it would disappear in a couple minutes ... which it did.

*Before* J and I became a couple on Valentine's Day we would sneak out.  One night I was pushing my mom's car down the drive to crank in the street when I saw a dark figure (which looked like J) watching me.  When I went to investigate it, or he, was gone.

I have another incident that happened in 1992 that was similar.  I was awake, listening to music.  An embarrassing moment later I walked into the hallway and saw J's dark silhouette.  He was trying to speak but I could not understand what he was saying.  He had told me when he was learning to AP, T would AP and meet him in the RTZ and talk.

Has this happened to anyone else?  What does it mean?  Were the red dots an attack or a silent message or a sign?  Can anyone explain what happened between J and I?

Any furthur information to help me find out what this was would be great!

Thanks!  ...I hope nobody thinks I am weird.

If your focus your life on hate, anger, and regret, it is only your fault for what you get.

[Tyciol]

The post you are referring to (since you said you had trouble with linking) would be this: http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=30

As for J, is his name Jordan?

Now... I haven't quite heard about three red triangles, perhaps someone more familiar with symbolism could help you identify the meaning of it. If not, I'll try a Google search for it.

It seems very strange indeed. My suggestion when dealing with such dreams would be rather than telling him what you saw, right it down for yourself in a dream journal. This is often done by people trying to do dream work. By keeping a personal record, you can be sure that he's not making things up. As for the friends you see in your dream, to be sure that they're real people, I'd lock the image into your mind and write down everything you can about what they look like, and then ask to meet them in real life (in a safe location) and compare what you wrote to what you see.

Honestly, while I am occasionally Lucid, my memory of dreams is not enough to really enjoy what may or may not have happened, or to verify it. I'd like to learn where this 'J' learned his techniques, and what exactly these techniques are.

I've been thinking about trying Yogi sleep. It's supposed to relax you faster, and send you into the final stage of sleep where you will rest, and not dream, faster. While on the plus side this would mean I'd only need 4-5 hours of sleep to operate at peak efficiency, it would mean giving up dreaming, and I'm not ready to do this yet, as I love to record my dreams (which I think you will too in time, it's exhilarating to write them down).

So, I will experiment with the Yogi sleep, but I will also try to sleep normally from time to time (perhaps after a full meal!) so that I will have lots of dreams, perhaps nightmares. Even nightmares can be benefited from, as they relay your inner fears or conflicts to you, as a way of showing you what you need to confront.

[Juliet]

Hi, Tyciol!

His name is not Jordan but James.  

I hope you're not confused by my posts.  This post was made in 2002 about when James and I met and starting dreaming together in 1989.  I was 15 years old then.  (I'm 30 now.)  

In the part of the dream back then when I was with the man in a brown robe and going through tunnels, I "met" Tommy and Mike as well as a group of kids around my age at that time.  Somehow, James told I am linked to them--that is what the triangle stood for I think but how it included me I can't be sure.  I never met Tommy and Mike.  However, recently, in another dream (I keep a dream journal and a remote viewing journal) I had this past week, I think I recognized Tommy and Mike and asked them why James appeared as a purple aura(in the post called "Lucid Dream? Or Something Else?) and they didn't know.  James has not revealed himself to me since but I sense him near in my dreams.  I do not understand.

Lucid dreaming is relatively easy for me as long as I'm not tired or stressed out.  Sometimes its fun, flying dreams, sometimes meeting dreams, sometimes sexual dreams, sometimes nightmares (but not in a while), and dreams where I work out problems.  It is helpful.

About Yogi sleep?  Go to Amazon.com and look it up in the search engine under books.  They have books that explain how to do it.  But I wouldn't want to give up my dreams either! LOL

Take care!

~ Juliet

[Tyciol]

Oh actually I'm reading a library book on it, so I don't need to buy it.

[Chimerae]

<Has this happened to anyone else?  What does it mean?  Were the red dots an attack or a silent message or a sign?  Can anyone explain what happened between J and I?

Any furthur information to help me find out what this was would be great!

Thanks!  ...I hope nobody thinks I am weird.<img src=icon_smile_blush.gif border=0 align=middle></font id='Georgia'>

Dear LadyLea,

At Dictionary.com, the first definintion of weird is:  ". . .Of, relating to, or suggestive of the preternatural or supernatural."

You are weird.   Say "hello"  You're in company of kind.

As to your real question about the astrally projected extended community and the three dots. . .

I live in that kind of a zone and I'm part of several different "out of body" communities like that.  Mostly I just try to ignore the whole thing because I have too much that I want to do here in the mundane world to get distracted.  

The out-of-body communities work for me in the mundane, because I can frequently recognize someone I meet as an associate -- or at least a "friend of a friend" out of body.  This allows me to facilitate and sort of "dance around" all kinds of limiting interpersonal bs in business and community work.  

It's my perception that everyone is participatory in that sort of non physical community but different people have different levels of awareness and choice, different levels of presence, and radically different ability to remember when they are wide awake.  

There's more that I can't understand than I can, but one piece that's a real headscratcher is that some of the most powerful and aware astral projectors, can't seem to get any awareness of that space you are describing.  On request, I've tried to teach people as your partner introduced you, but most people just can't do it, unless I take them there as a guide.  I finally decided that was just a waste of time all around and if people are meant to have access to whatever that is, they'll get it.  

All of that is lead in to say that your "three red dots" sounds like a material manifestation of something happeninng "out there"  Even people who have no memory and are unconscious of their "Other Place" antics get those.  I have odd mark and especially scars appear and disappear on my body while I'm getting massages.  It seems to be particularly intense if the massage therapist is someone with a strong presence in that Other Place but has no memory or awareness.  

Maybe we're acting as animated post-it notes in the mundane.

My personal feeling is that anyone in or out of body who causes any changes to me and mine is perpetrating an act of aggression.  It's just that "acts of aggression" are not necessarily attacks -- an offer of a handshake is a friendly act of aggression.  It's not the other person's issue that as an empath a handshake is a bigger deal for me than for your average (less weird) individual.  

My own personal much adored dogs attack me with too enthusiastic affection every time I come in the house.  I wish they wouldn't.  We're working on "NO"  I still appreciate their intent.

I think it's a message, even if it's just a "hello, you were here, this is real and not just your imagination"  My experience is that only you can really translate it, because only you know the context for the message.  

Three dots have lots of possibilities.  If memory serves me correctly, it's the mathematical symbol for "Therefore"  Three balls (2d dots) is both "The Juggler" and (if gold) the symbol for St. Nicholas.  And for pawn brokers.  The color red has it's own meanings -- plus I would have to wonder if it was red because that was one of the colors available on the "post-it-note" of my body and the one I was most likely to notice.

And it FEELS like none of those is it -- I keep seeing it in three lights, like a star combination or alignment.  

It feels wrong to end this without saying that I feel like you are projecting too much authority in this realm onto J.  There's something just not healthy for you there -- not with J but with this aspect of what you are thinking/expecting.  It's like thinking that because someone took you to MacDonald's for your first cheeseburger that you can't ever go to MacDonald's without them.  Take back your power here.  It's not good for J what you're doing.  

But then I'm a cranky, cranky little girl these days.

[Juliet]

Hi, Chimerae! This is LadyLea but I'm using a different username.  It's Juliet.  I hope it doesn't confuse anyone.

You voiced some opinions that I've had for quite some time.  And for a while I did move on and left James in my past.  Everything was going ok until I decided  to take an active part in improving my APing, LDing, and remote viewing skills.  

Three days before I started, I saw four clear, vivid images in my mind's eye.  I didn't know who it was or why they sent the images but I did not like the free access they had to my mind so I shielded myself.  This worked and I sensed the person didn't expect me to do this.  An hour later I was psychically attacked for about an hour.

Three days later, I decided to take control and learn things on my own.  Several days past and I had a ball in my dreams.  I learned to fly by my own will, walk through walls, etc.  Then, a few days later, I had the dream where the purple aura of a person I thought was James touched me sexually.  It was pleasant and nice.  I wanted it to continue but when I tried to see who it was I only saw the aura.  I woke slowly and saw a man in my mind's eye (through RV) lying on a bed with a sheet draped across his body.  It was James.  The next night in my dream I wanted to talk to him but he wouldn't.  I don't recall any conversation.  I turned and recognized Tommy and Mike (I hadn't seen or remembered seeing then since 1992.) I asked them why James wouldn't talk to me.  They said something but I can't remember.

Then a day or so ago I was browsing through the posts on Astral Pulse and came across a post by Robert Bruce and Nita describing incubi attacks.  It described what happened to me at 18 exactly. (I'm 30 now).  When the attack began, it resembled James.  I felt loved and special.  Then as time went on, I realized it couldn't be James because no human could astrally or telepathically touch a person 24/7.  As I became lost with this creature bothering me, I heard James crying from across my room.  i didn't understand it then but I think I do now.  maybe he regretted his actions and realized he messed me up.  Soon I became concerned.  Then the touches started getting punishing.  I'd be riding with my sister, trying to hold a conversation, as it would touch me.  Soon I couldn't take it anymore.  One day I went to the bathroom to end it but I heard a voice like James say, "What in the hell do you think you are doing?"  I felt like it was him and he was sorry.  As I was about to cut my sister came in and got me help.

Once I discovered this and figured it might have been James who placed the incubus on me, I put a shield of white fire up before going to sleep that night.  I didn't dream of James.  I don't recall any dreams although i know I did.  Ever since I do not think James has come into my dreams but I still sense him.

Last night I was listening to Stevie Nicks as I thought about how we met, our bond, our dreaming, our intense feelings for each other, our break up, and the years that followed of off and on dreaming together.  As I thought of him, I pictured his face in my mind's eye.  Suddenly, my third eye began to tingle and pressure grew heavy and strong.  I began seeing images.  I could only make out one.  I saw James punching a bag, the ones that boxers use to train on.  I was puzzled by this image.  Why did he send it to me?  If he didn't send it to me, why did I pick up on it?  Could he be made because I am trying to take control of my learning? Or is he angry that I'm trying to break the bond between us?  It feels like leaving home.  I know I need to but a part of me wants to hang on to him.  I know this isn't healthy.  I don't understand how to deal with this situation and him.  I need to understand what's happening before I move on.

Chimerae, can you offer any ideas on what any of these things I've mentioned means?  

~ Juliet

[Juliet]

As I was about to cut my sister came in and got me help.

Sorry this is supposed to read "As I was about to cut myself, my sister came in and got me help.

Could he be made because I am trying to take control of my learning? Or is he angry that I'm trying to break the bond between us?

The first question should read "Could he be mad because I am trying to take control of my learning?"

Sorry, I hate typos!

~Juliet

[Chimerae]

Hi, Chimerae! This is LadyLea but I'm using a different username.  It's Juliet.  I hope it doesn't confuse anyone.

I don't have a word for the experience you call incubi, but I have had that happen and it's just annoying as hell.  

In that Other Place, people very much have specific energy signatures, like fingerprints, and that it's possible to tell "fakes" like that, as long as I'm not too needy or exhausted.

The desire to cut is a tough space.  Are you taking care of the things that are around that at this point?  Any spots there that need more backup?

Last night I was listening to Stevie Nicks as I thought about how we met, our bond, our dreaming, our intense feelings for each other, our break up, and the years that followed of off and on dreaming together.  As I thought of him, I pictured his face in my mind's eye.  Suddenly, my third eye began to tingle and pressure grew heavy and strong.  I began seeing images.  I could only make out one.  I saw James punching a bag, the ones that boxers use to train on.  I was puzzled by this image.  Why did he send it to me?  If he didn't send it to me, why did I pick up on it?  Could he be made because I am trying to take control of my learning? Or is he angry that I'm trying to break the bond between us?  It feels like leaving home.  I know I need to but a part of me wants to hang on to him.  I know this isn't healthy.  I don't understand how to deal with this situation and him.  I need to understand what's happening before I move on.

Sounds to me like you tuned into HIM listening to Stevie Nicks, thinking and remembering.  Picturing his face in your mind's eye is like dialing up the old phone number.  

The punching bag image sounds great!  I would hear that as James has anger work to do (as do most of it) and he's working it.  A punching bag is a GREAT place to do anger work.  Personally, I like to break glass, but my method is messier and requires tedious cleanup afterwards.  

The part of you that wants to hang onto him . . .do you have a childhood where the real experience of love, connection, and intimacy has some unfortunate pain and strings attached?  If so, you may have somehow linked those to love in your psyche.  Also, you had a pretty powerful experience and awakening with James, many people feel drawn BACK through their desire for the intimacy of breakthrough experiences because we've not yet learned that THERE'S ALWAYS MORE LOOT!!! and that as long as we grow FORWARD there will be MORE breakthroughs, more intimacy . . . but with currently unknown sources.  It takes a while and practice owning your own power before that gets easier.

There are lots of people here far more skilled than I am with helping people get clarity, set some parameters, and practice responsibly owning power.  

Still, sounds like great work to me.

[Juliet]

It feels wrong to end this without saying that I feel like you are projecting too much authority in this realm onto J.  There's something just not healthy for you there -- not with J but with this aspect of what you are thinking/expecting.  It's like thinking that because someone took you to MacDonald's for your first cheeseburger that you can't ever go to MacDonald's without them.  Take back your power here.  It's not good for J what you're doing.

This paragraph stood out to me and made me think.  It was the last sentence in the quoted paragraph above: It's not good for J what you're doing.  I don't understand how I could be bothering him. What's he experiencing from me that is not good for him?  It hurts to think I could be causing him pain.  Can you explain this to me so I can understand his side a little?  I know you are not him and don't know him.  Could you shed some light on this though?  

Even though years have passed and things have happened, I know he cares for me very strongly as I do him.  I don't want to give you the wrong impression.  I don't think of this 24/7.  I do other things.  I'm just trying to understand.

~ Juliet

[Chimerae]

Juliet --

I can be completely wrong, so I would hope everyone would always take anything I say with a grain of salt and just work with what resonates, letting the rest go as just me howling at the moon.

Having said that, I added that last bit with reluctance, only becuase it FELT so important.

In my experience, bonds form in the etheric that can tangle up etherically gifted people like J.  Like you.  Like me.

And now I'll talk out of my intellect and experience to try to translate my intuitive sense.  

If you conceptualize J as the repository for etheric capacites that are really YOURS, then every time you access your gifts that you have him mentally linked to, you pull a part of him in.  

Someone out on AP was talking about Soul Retrieval.  I don't do Soul Retrievals, but I refer people to shamans who do them.  Trapping a teacher in an etheric icon identity -- even if they get off on the power of that identity -- often results in some level of soul loss.  Most individuals who have enough "soul" to be etheric teachers have a way to recall and recapture the lost bits, but  it's a drain.
 
There's lots of other things that happen, but consider that an example, a little mini word story to sketch how you being your most authentic and fully charged self is a benefit to J and others you care about.

[Tyciol]

Are you out of contact with James? Perhaps you could phone him and ask him if he's had similar dreams, or boxed a punching bag, or knows of Incubi.

[Juliet]

I can be completely wrong, so I would hope everyone would always take anything I say with a grain of salt and just work with what resonates, letting the rest go as just me howling at the moon.

Don't worry about me taking others opinions and statements to heart as fact.  I listen to what they say, think about it and how it could relate to my situation, and figure things out on my own.  Still it helps me to get a fresh mind who is removed from the situation that can offer advice and offer information they know through their experiences.

There's lots of other things that happen, but consider that an example, a little mini word story to sketch how you being your most authentic and fully charged self is a benefit to J and others you care about.

I'm sorry to ask another question but I am learning and discovering all on my own.  When you said, "a little mini word story to sketch how you being your most authentic and fully charged self is a benefit to J (James) and others you care about.   What did you mean by most authentic and fully charged self?  I am unsure of what that means.  (I apologize for my incomprehension of some things.)

~ Juliet

[Juliet]

Are you out of contact with James? Perhaps you could phone him and ask him if he's had similar dreams, or boxed a punching bag, or knows of Incubi.

I am not in contact with James.  Two years after I met him, I moved to Texas with my mom, sister, and stepdad/boyfriend.  That was in December of 1991.  I haven't spoken to him on the phone since the latter part of 1989, I think.  I think he moved too.  When I was in my twenties, I tried to locate him.  I made some calls but nothing panned out.  So I can't call him and ask him.  Wish I could.  That was a good idea.  Who knows where he lives now?  He probably doesn't know where I am either.

~ Juliet

[Chimerae]

What did you mean by most authentic and fully charged self?  I am unsure of what that means.  (I apologize for my incomprehension of some things.) ~ Juliet

Juliet --

There's always the interesting question about whether it's your incomprehension or me being incomprehensible.  I see things differently, and then when I try to say what I see it gets even more muddled sometimes.

You know how people talk about the "higher self"?  

With a few rare people, I have have seen them come alive, not just in their higher self, but in a way where every aspect of who they are comes to it's highest level of ability and works at maximum synergy with all their other aspects and with their place in the world and the world in general -- and across planes and in different worlds concurrently.  People who know more and have studied with Mr. Bruce may have a word for it that I just don't know.

By rough example, when that happens, even other people's incorrect models of that person were suddenly the best and highest version they could possibly be.  And the person's higher self would be concurrently engaged.  And the primitive selfish child within would be at it's highest capacity - - and so on and so forth.  And somehow, all those incompatible elements are just in perfect alignment.  It's like tuning a guitar and hitting the enharmonics.

That just fascinated the hell out of me.  So I started paying attention.

I noticed that everybody has those moments -- or more likely for most of us, those tiny fractions of a microsecond.  I noticed that it seemed that the least complex and evolved individuals had more of these moments than the enlightened who tended to lean into their higher self.  

But there are some rare individuals who are complex and highly evolved who are able to manifest this "most authentic and fully charged" congruity  with great frequency and consistency.  

They're often totally confused, because the experience doesn't "fit" the lower reality that their ego had the difficult job of navigating.  So they conceptually displace their own power onto other people, which makes the ego's job much easier but makes it harder to manifest that authentic and fully charged self.

[Anonymous]

I have read much of this post and I find it very interesting. Unfortunately I do not think I can contribute anything helpful or useful at this time, but I will let you know if anything comes to me.

[Chimerae]

REMEMBER: Homeland security is watching you- in bed, on the toilet, and while you shower.

"Price: Value, plus a reasonable sum for the wear and tear of conscience in demanding it." -Ambrose Bierce, the Demon's Dictionary.

I like your signatures.

RE:  "Homeland security is watching" . . . I think it's in consequence my place to make it an interesting and educational program.  Getting someone's attention is the first step in retraining.

Just think!  We've got 'em paying attention!!!!

[daem0n]

by enlightened people you meant people who think that they are spiritual because they talk a lot about "higher things", lean to higher self ?

if someone leans to higher self, you mean that he can chat with it ?, or better, listen to it ?

come alive in higher self? you mean leaning to it? (see above), surrendering to it ?

you meant acting as whole, through physical instrument
thx for reminder, i forgot  

[Chimerae]

by enlightened people you meant people who think that they are spiritual because they talk a lot about "higher things", lean to higher self ?

Were you responding to me?

IF so. . . there are people who just plain "glow."  Sometimes these are people who think they are spiritual and talk a lot about higher things.  There's something about that pattern that increases the odds of the "glow"

Ironically, it's not about good/bad.

There are people who think spirituality is fantasy who don't talk much at all who also "glow" but they seem to lean into one part of themselves -- what I understand as a "higher self"

There are also "enlightened" people who just talk the talk (incessantly) but and some of whom even walk the walk who do not "glow"  They often are the teachers and advertising for others who will "do"

The world is very confusing.

[daem0n]

i was mainly talking to myself
the glow indicates vision/knowledge/potential of more than physical reality
it doesn't have to do anything with action
the glow can be dimmed by integrating "dark" side (this is very different shining, even if balance haven't been reached yet, i would guess it is harder to percieve), those who shine very very bright often cut off from part of themselves ..

[Juliet]

Hi ender!

If anything comes to you, if you don't want to post it here, you can send me a private message.  Any theories, ideas, suggestions, and/or advice is welcome.  If you want, read some of my other posts to get a sense of what I'm dealing with.  

I agree with Chimerae as well.  Your signatures are cool.  The first one reminds me a book I just finished reading by Joseph McMoneagle called Remote Viewing Secrets: A Handbook.  It discusses the Stargate program, its protocols and methodologies for remote viewing tests, etc.  Good read.

Take care!

~ Juliet