The Purpose of Negs

[Sentential]

Ive had quite a bit of bad contact with negs, so I will share. Negs exist in this world, because they have no purpose. No reason to move on, no reason to care.

They really need people that understand them and can ease their pain. I mean come on..... they are usually people plucked from the prime of their lives, from families that they love. In this world, unfortunatly where spirituality = insanity they really have no other choice. If the departed try to contact their families, they are horribly rejected and feared, even if it is a spouce.

How would you feel if you died today and you try to contact your family to tell them you are ok, only to be called a demon and they run off screaming? Wouldnt that drive you insane after awhile seeing loved ones in pain, because of you, and you are unable to do anything, in fear of making things worse?

You must remember.... negs dont just sprout up out of no where. They are evey bit as human as we are, and deserve the same treatment.... for anyone has the potential to become a neg under the right condition. So on that note, have some sympathy for them.

BTW, I think its safe to say that Ive seen atleast as much, if not *far* worse, and even I have sympathy for them. I used to hate what they stood for, but now I only feel sadness. No one deserves such a fate... no one.

[narfellus]

Thanks Sentinial for your thoughts. I don't know if i agree that ALL negs are/were human. From my limited understanding, there are some that have always existed and always will exist for the purpose of hurting mankind. I see a correlation between certain high ranking angels that have never been human either, and they exist for the purpose of helping mankind. Other negs were easily human once, but through lack of spiritual knowledge, anger, or the influence of other negs, they become harmful to the living. It is all a very complex and fascinating subject that even the experts don't fully understand.

[Nay]

Narfellus, nice thread. [] Couldn't agree with you more!

I also tend to believe that if you are constantly thinking about negs, you are going to encounter them...constantly. [^]  Like attracts like.

Nay []

[narfellus]

Good point Nay. Now, would you say that our discussing negs and their influences and position in the multiverse have a way of attracting them? Hmmm...I think they are often like animals attracted to food.  There are probably whole species of negs that quietly leech life energy with no harm to the host. It's funny when you look back at the immense volume of fantasy and science fiction written over the years and realize how much of it was probably true, or based in truth. But yes, like attracts like, so when we search for like-minded people to discuss life's intracacies we find them!

[Nay]

I wouldn't say that me discussing them right now will make them show up tonight or in the morning, because I have no time for them in my life..[]

I meant more of a obsession, when people do nothing but think or talk about them, in or away from the forums.  You focus on such things, of course you will make it happen in the astral.

Frankly I'm surprised at how many people claim to have been attacked, because such attacks are rare.  I get the feeling that they want the attention either from the neg or the people whom listen to their experience, of course...alllllll my opinion.

Nay

[Michael_E]

after reading psd i get an increased amount of "attacks". I probably unconsciously create the attacks, but it does say in the book that negs have a way of almost punishing behavior that will compromise them. being aware of them and thier games would probably be something a neg would not want having so i could see how conditioning me with more attacks after reading the book would be useful for thier attachments.

I dont know how intelligent they are, they might not be able to think in that way. In which case the attacks would be because of an active imagination.

[narfellus]

Here's my take Nay...in our day and age people are spiritually starved.  Many neglect and mock organized religion and then jump head-on into metaphysics looking for answers. Between the books and the internet and message boards, a huge chunk of the world population is studying esoteric aspects of life long neglected. Many do so with NO idea what they are doing, and the negs find ripe energy sources. I don't know which tastes better to a neg though: a regular person questioning the meaning of life everday, or someone who KNOWS the meaning and how to AP, and sees the negs for what they really are.

And Michael, you say attacks increase after reading PSD. I've read lots and lots of these posts and books on the subject, and in the majority of what i've read, it seems that people who actively seek the astral plane to understand it have greatly increased encounters. So maybe they do want to thwart you; maybe they don't want you to build defenses or learn tricks. Maybe fear of the unknown is the only thing TO fear, and once you know what they are, whether prince or duke or minion, their power over you is lessened. Just a theory.

I've been following Sentinial's recent threads and it sounds like he is a man undergoing a major major spiritual enlightenment, and it is not always pleasant. I think the more he learns, the more we will too.

[Blackstream]

Don't forget Sentential, some negs are also thought forms created by people that go off and do stuff.  Like I guess (assuming you can do this because I can't) people that make psiballs and give them foolish programming like "steal as much energy as you can and become as smart as you can".  I dunno.  Or just people aiming hateful thoughts at other people could possibly make a neg too.

[Sentential]

Its not really like that. From what Ive personally witnesses. Programs are just an extention of the owner. They really arent sentient, like you would imply.

Also my PSI attacks are very similar to DnD type stuff (I played DnD much later in life after my brushes with the dark arts)

[Mystic Cloud]

But then there are always those poor spirits who have refused
to move on and are too afraid to do it by themselves.

For them it is a mere matter of survival.

Though I've also heard some addicts stay here for the pleasure
of getting their addiction boosted.

Most neg attacks are probably your own creation anyway []

[narfellus]

Yes, i think there are actually many many different types of negs: Lost spirits, or intellect, projected anger, astral wildlife that are copies of our terrestrial wildlife (or is it vice-versa?)aggressive negs looking for food, predator negs, and then full fledged intelligent negs that prey on people. What these last beings are i'm not sure exactly. Has anyone ever followed the line of thought that extraterrestrials on a different spiritual level than our own are probably out there too? As well as their lost dead who were spiritually confused.

[narfellus]

Sentinial...i had a conversation the other day with thelou about D&D. He played many years ago 1st edition, but i've played on and off through the years through the current reincarnation of 3.5 edition. I agree, your psiballs do sound akin to psionics, and i wonder what the connection is between your imagination and your etheric/psychic abilities. Do you still play?

[Mathias Jonsson]

The problem with negs is that they can be connected to a variety of causes: emototional/traumatic, karmic, etc. It is no easy task to come to the roots of the problem. But the most important step in severing their links and healing their connecting points is means primarily to know oneself, and try to discipline one's thoughts and desires. This is of course no easy task.

Also advancing spiritually or magically also means more responisbility on the practictioner. I recall the renowned occultist WE Butler once saying that once we advance as occultists we have to take more responsibility for our own use of the magical knowledge we have gained, otherwise we can fall into the hole of being black magicians without intending so, as the saying goes: "the way to hell is paved with good intentions".

[Sentential]

quote:Originally posted by narfellus

Sentinial...i had a conversation the other day with thelou about D&D. He played many years ago 1st edition, but i've played on and off through the years through the current reincarnation of 3.5 edition. I agree, your psiballs do sound akin to psionics, and i wonder what the connection is between your imagination and your etheric/psychic abilities. Do you still play?

Yes it is very strange. But I stress that that psionics revolves around your imagination, since this is how essentially you project yourself into the astral, Both the good and bad come with you.

On that note I wish to add that 99.9% of all negs are human, or were once living. There is a very small number of ancients who would be considered pure evil. There cannot be an Alpha without the Omega.

Ive never seen or heard anyting about the original evils, but I have a looming feeling that they would make any demon or satan for that matter, look like amatures.

However, pplz would say that focusing too much on negs is bad for the soul. This is a yes and no anwser. If you focus on their power, then thats bad. But if you focus on who and what they are, that is good.

People should learn from other's mistakes. Do not follow a similar path.

[jilola]

Anyone ever think that 'negs' are there to provide you what you want?
Perhaps to provide you with the presumably needed opposition to see into yourself via your reactions to them?

Everyone seems to agree that in the astral you get exactly and immediately that which you wish and think is. Why doesn't that same principle work in the case of 'negs'? If your wish is that there is a negative pole and that this pole is represented by personified entities the you will get them. If you further expect that this pole is opposed to you as being one who strives to be good then they will oppose you.

This interpretation doesn't negate the existence of 'negs' as what you personally perceive as reality is provided for. It just suggests that your reality may not be that of another.


2cents & L&L
Jouni

[Sentential]

Negs are very different. They are out to seek *their* own adgenda. They do not have your best interests in mind.

I spent severao=l or so years under sem-training from what you call "negs". They are foul little ********, and are very convincing at that. They are mostly human, but have evolved to re-take what is not theirs. In essence:

Angels = like a football coach or something, they like to watch
Demons = That ******* parent that thinks they know the game best.

Basically they are on in the same, but angels wish to let people live their lives, and make their own decisions. Basically enlightening the masses, and eventually asking you to join them.

Demon's final goal is to live again, *By ANY means neccessary*.

Beliveing what they say is foolish

[jilola]

[8D] Read my post again. Once more with feeling [8D]

Has anyone ever questioned why some people seeem to be under constant barrage and others never even see a flick of a tail?

I'm not belittling the horrible experiences people have and those that have been described on these forums. Not at all.
But why is it so hard to consider the possibility that our deepest essence, soul if you wish, needs these experiences in order to either experience something itself, to learn something of itself or teach others somethign about them?

It seems to me that when the word 'neg' comes up everyone flick off their thinking and accepts them as the absolute truth and at the same time accepting the idea that one can have anything and everything one wishes in the astral? Some even have grasped the idea that physical life and astral are just different perspectives of the same reality.

So whence this need for opposition? and whence the abhorrence of the idea that 'negs' are there to provide a service and thus are actually 'un-negs'?

2cents & L&L
Jouni

[Sentential]

I really dont know what to say. I never knew about negs until they viciously attacked me as a child. I have no religous ties at all. Hell I havent read the bible or any religious text.

Now... I really dont know why the angelic allows demons to exist. It is entirely possible that they are part of the same entity, and choice is what faction we choose.

Almost like the democrat / republican feud.

[jilola]

I had this recurring nightmare as a child where for some reason I was surrounded by something that tried to squash me.  Only whenever that happened thr last perception before waking screaming was a flower that blossomed just as I woke up. Was I attacked by 'negs'? Apparently since I got squashed. What was th emeaning of the flower? That I didn't stop existing, that I was as beautiful as before and not squashed at all. That was how my child mind interpreted things.

So I offer the suggestion that whenever one perceives being under attack one should look beyopnd immediate appearances. As creative entities (to use the word to denote a facet of the all pervading existence from a particular point of view) we interpret things. We create a scenario that fits both our expectation and out surrounding reality.
Given that from the physical point of view things get eerie when perceived in a non-physical perpective (astral, dreams whatnot) we interpret and thus create conditions that mimick the pysical experience;that there is always an immutable  cause.
Thus our intrepretative capability crates the environment as we perceive it, 'negs' if we're uncertain and uncomfortable, 'angels' if we feel secure and comfortable.
Both are the same thing manifested and perceived from a different perpspective.

That's my reality anyways. Yours may vary.

2cents & L&L
jouni

[Michael_E]

quote:Originally posted by narfellus


So maybe they do want to thwart you; maybe they don't want you to build defenses or learn tricks. Maybe fear of the unknown is the only thing TO fear, and once you know what they are, whether prince or duke or minion, their power over you is lessened. Just a theory.

Well whether they are or arnt actual negs or do or dont want to condition me to stay away from the astral(which it seems like they do when they do attack), im going to keep going and in the end any attempt to thwart me will make me stronger and will help me understand more about how i can and do respond to negative pressure. I have good faith in perserverance and an ability and desire to understand.

I would put fear of the unknown up there with other instinctual psychological phenomenon encountered while out of body, like the gravity instinct. while out of body gravity is instinctually felt and can effect one by pulling them down towards the ground while flying keeping one from flying. I can see how the fear of the unknown can manifest as creepy scary things coming to get you since quite often the default mode when approaching something strange and different is with caution leading one to think, what is it thats there to be cautious about? And if its that fear itself that is creating things to be scared of, your caught in a loop in which a change in an instinctual fear of the unknown would be ideal. Changing an approach from what is it there that is to be feared to what is it there that is not to be feared, can radically transend any further expected out of body experiences towards a positive note. One of the things that i have a problem with psd is that it can seem to encourage this idea that there is something there to be afraid of in a way that is unnecessary. It would be nice if Bruce would write a book just on positive experiences.

[Tayesin]

Hi,
Well written narfellus.  I see what people here call negs as just other beings who choose to use their energy for darker purposes.  They do help us by making us face our fears and in the end we learn the most important lesson, that Love really is the answer to dealing with them effectively.

Also, my perspective on the grand plan is this... we eventually come to know or rememeber who We are, then we see we are providing experience of this Universe to the Creative force/awareness.(god)  In so doing we re-connect with this Source and come to know that we are all One, part of this Creative Awareness... and it too grows through these exeperiences.

So negs are a part of the overall scene/plan, once people see them as you do then they can move through their own blocks more effectively.

Love Always.[]

P.S.  Had an old quote that fits well here...

"We are energetic probes created by the Universe,
and it's because we are possessors of energy that
has Awareness, that we are the means by which
the Universe becomes aware of itself".
- Don Juan Matus

[narfellus]

Tayesin, i agree with your post as well. We as humans are simply enough the Universe learning of and exploring itself. I suppose this has happened MANY times in many dimensions, and maybe when that universe has learned all it can learned it implodes and starts anew. Who knows? The important part is that on these forums, between the BS and the confusion and the neg lies (which are here) there are vast universal truths shared by people who have looked for them.

I believe the negs, no matter whether human in origin or shadows of terrestrial life or fully sentient beings feeding off life energy because that's all they know to do, i think they all fulfill a grand and carefully designed purpose. That in itself seals away fear of them.

Sentenial, you mentioned that you grew up without a religious or spiritual background. This is interesting because you are being flung headlong into a mystical path and forced to figure it out without prior tools of faith. This is the path picked by YOU before you were born into this world, so it is completely normal and natural, if not fun. The good news is that you have a mortal lifetime to figure it out, albeit in a way i did not travel myself.

And jiola, yes, i think as children we are often severely affected by negs, mostly because we and our parents and peers don't know any better. Demons and ghosts are just scary stories; little does anyone know they are an intimate part of everyday life. I was emotionally tortured for many many years as a youth, but it was done BY ME. The madness i've endured has been very catalystic, cleansing, and purifying. It has forced me down paths i would never have picked on my own, simply because they were painful, lonely paths.

The more we learn and share with each other the further we climb the ladder to our Higher Selves. The more we learn in this life the further we are evolved in the next. Thank goodness i have likeminded people to talk about at these forums; my girlfriend thinks i'm nutty when i talk about angels and demons, so i just keep my whacky thoughts to myself most the time. []

[Tayesin]

It's refreshing to read others saying this same thing...
"This is the path picked by YOU before you were born into this world, so it is completely normal and natural, if not fun. The good news is that you have a mortal lifetime to figure it out." by narfellus.

Unfortunately, many people think this means pre-determination.  It doesn't have to be if you can see that we decided on all the experiences we wanted to have, all the millions of choices that we could make in life (our free will is expansive)and all the contracts we made with others in all the realms.  This allows us more choices in every moment than we realize.

Narfeluss, you spoke about climbing the ladder to our Higher-Self.  It does not need to be so hard, there are easier ways to experience our true Self.  It's what you do with the knowledge and how you apply it that counts.  And, it doesn't always have to be serious... we need to play some too.

Perhaps you might like to check out my webpages for the simple method I use for myself and others to experience our higher awarenes levels.  They work very well most of the time, so it can't hurt trying.

Love Always. []

[jilola]

quote:Were we all creating the same thing we didn't want?

We create reality both as individuals and as a collective whole. Thus our realities affect each other and allow us to experience an essentially indetical pysical reality to give an example.
We can affect our own reality to the extent of being able to equate our choices and will to effects in our perceptual reality.
To affect a change our influence on reality has to overcome the background inertia other perceptual realities. That's wy it's difficult to walk through walls, 6 billion other people's reality has too much indertia for a single person to overcome.

That's why others may be able to experience what we experience (in your case the hostile/negative entities). In a sense you were all creating the same thing and part of it was caused by the significance and the strength of your personal creation that affected others around into creating the same or very similar reality they perceived.

quote:Are you talking about my thoughts?

Not about your personal thoughts but thoughts in general.

If you watch your thoughts when you experience and perceive things around you, does thinning aout the experience aloud in your mind seem necessary or is it just a conscious commentary on what you're perceiving? You can smell a flower without your internal dialogue reminding you that you're smelling a flower and that it smells good.
Thus most of our thoughts are just a drone that comments and restates things that we perceive.

What about thoughts that one uses say at work to solve a problem? Well, for me the dialogue isn't necessary. Sometimes it's helpful in reviewing the problem but the solution always comes firts and then the internal dialogue rambles on to state the solution in words.

2cents & L&L
jouni

[Nay]

quote:Narfeluss, you spoke about climbing the ladder to our Higher-Self. It does not need to be so hard, there are easier ways to experience our true Self. It's what you do with the knowledge and how you apply it that counts. And, it doesn't always have to be serious... we need to play some too.

Ok..this really popped out at me!  A few months ago, I found myself standing infront of a tower of sorts, it was blocking my way so I just knew it was a hurtle for me to overcome.

I started to climb, climb and climb some more.  I'm still overcoming my fears of heights in the astral and physical plane..[]  but I struggled on.  There were areas of it where there was nothing but a long drop for me, yet I continued through my fear and I'll be darned if I didn't make it to the top!!  I layed there thinking..wow, I did it.[] Then I heard this disembodied voice say...."You could have taken the stairs that are inside the tower, you make things harder than they need to be"

Maaaaaaaaaan..my jaw dropped.[^]  First I was like, "oh, thanks for telling me AFTER the fact"  Then I just couldn't stop laughing at myself.[]  It was such a great lesson, and so simple.

Nay