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Author Topic: What's wrong with Psychic Self Defense?  (Read 35665 times)
Dark Knight
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« Reply #175 on: February 14, 2004, 08:35:42 »

Sam, I agree with you, to a point, but I think you only listed as far as the point in you post.

As people, we learn, and because boundaries always start off as "all inclusive" we unfortunately find new boundaries my accidentally crossing over another person's unintentionally. Problem is the responsiblity thing. Yes we may only know certain things until after the fact, but once we know better we have to take responsibility and try to do better.

The entities that gave me grief (and still try to, even though they don't get in), would use "the gain sympathy to get in" trick that Robert described. It is not the job of the person under attack to change the incoming neg, it is the job of the neg to do it. The person being attacked is in no position to help an incoming neg, they're trying to keep themselves alive. I would place the responsiblity on the guide and individuals who are healers and not under severe attack.

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McArthur
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« Reply #176 on: February 15, 2004, 06:07:25 »

I couldnt read this entire thread because i find it hard to read these so-called "channellings" from negs/unclean spirits/astral shells. *shivers*

Dont you people realize that an unclean spirit will pretend to be ANYTHING so long as you allow it to keep feeding off your attention/energy?

But from what i have read here it seems that some here (or the negs they are host to) are attempting to recruit other gullable persons to allow these spirits (by inviting them in) to come feed. So im going to have some questions for your "spirit guides" if they are prepared to answer. After all, the Bible says to "test your spirits" so i feel that any positive spirit surely wont mind being tested right?

Here is test No.1: Tell the spirit that you have decided you want it to leave for exactly 1 month and make no contact with you WHATSOEVER during this time. If it refuses or comes up with an excuse such as "I am not able to do that because we have important work to do to fulfil Divine Plans" then you can be sure its a neg. Any positive helpful spirit will understand your wishes and do as asked.


Not all negs will cause negative symptoms. So long as they get to feed on your attention why would they? Some negs feed by giving their victim an orgasm. feels good eh but its still a form of vampirism.

I will have more to say on this soon (and after i have read the whole thread) i'm just so shocked at present how gullable some people really are. You can choose to take my post as being negative if you like, and i'll certainly be interested in what any of your "guides" have to say- so fire away. I do realize that this post may seem slightly antagonistic but thats because i really dont like negs.

Here is a question for anyone with a guide: Ask it what the special meaning of the number 228 is. If it is a guide with contacts Higher up it will know.


Try this link; http://www.clairvision.org/CKB/CKBC/CKBC_000_077/Index.html

Here is a couple from the FAQ;

From: Could some entities be extra terrestrials or related to them?

"All jokes aside, if there is one thing that has emerged from the Clairvision exploration of entities, it is that you can never believe what they tell you. Entities exist on a fluid, changing level. They can easily modify their appearance, and the 'feel' attached to them. They are ready to play all sorts of games. And they are always looking for someone to buy into their game, because it is their best chance of survival."

From: You say that entities are not evil. How do you reconcile this with other people's reports of demonic entities?

"Entities have a chameleon nature.

Once you identify an entity, the entity will try hard to make you believe you can't live without it, or that it is so powerful that there is no chance you will ever get rid of it.

The reason is simple: if you clear it, it loses its life support system. Fragments (by far the most common category of entities) are unable to survive by themselves. In most cases, when a fragment is expelled from its host, its only chance of survival is to find another host in a matter of days or weeks.

So when the client consciously gets in touch with the entity, the entity is ready to play all sorts of games to 'extend its visa', so to speak. Give the entity a lead, and it will follow it. Ask it, "Are you evil?" and it will answer you, "Yes! More evil than you can possibly imagine."

Ask it, "Are you my spirit guide?" and it will answer you as if it were your spirit guide.

Ask it, "Are you an alien?" and it will immediately draw from the client's memory to fabricate extra-terrestrial stories.

This is one of the reasons why entities appear different in different cultural and religious contexts.

In the Clairvision style of work, entities are reduced to their smallest denominator. They are not given much chance to build up stories. Their wantings are analysed with as little 'wrapping' as possible, keeping the story side to the strictest minimum. Then they are cleared."



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The Astral Pulse
« Reply #176 on: February 15, 2004, 06:07:25 »

logoVisit the website of Astral Pulse creator Adrian Cooper.

Home of the best selling book Our Ultimate Reality.

Astral Projection, Metaphysics and many other subjects.

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Dark Knight
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« Reply #177 on: February 15, 2004, 10:03:46 »

MacArthur, I have two problems with the channelings presented here. One is exactly what you have just pointed out in your post. The other is the concept that a guide can and will do anything to you (no boundaries whatsoever) to teach you a lesson, including lying. If that's the case then how do you tell the difference between good and evil. Lessons and learning are not more valuable than people, might as well say experimenting on the Jews in the camps was OK because valuable info was obtained...it's the same thing. Personal value, value of other, and value of creation are the dilineations we use to learn lessons and tell good from evil. Without them there is no way to tell the difference among them, nothing to feel out, they all become the same sensation...one meaningless, all inclusive boundary with no value.  

A direct quote from Robert Bruce's book, Practical Psychic Self Defense:
Avoid the Love and Light Approach:

Contrary to the advice of many modern spiritual teachers, turning the other cheek, refusing to fight back, and sending loving thoughts to an attacking or possessing neg is not productive and borders on the ridiculous. It is an ineffective approach when dealing with attacking or possessing negs.

A channeled spirit once told me that I come under so many intense psychic attacks because I resist. It said my resistance was an open challenge and this, in itself, attracts and causes psychic attacks. I was told to stop resisting and love my enemy, and that the attacks would stop if I ceased my fiery resistance. I tried this once (I'll try just about anything once) and it almost got me killed. I suffered a lot more damage than I would have, had I countered the attack in my usual way. Submitting to an attack and sending loving thoughts, if anything, empowers attacking Negs.

...Negs thrive on love and light approach and use it to further their ends. They use these gentle spiritual beliefs against people. Negs play on these and often pretend to be misguided lost spirits, projecting seemingly harmless illusory forms to the perceptions of sensitives. But in truth they are just furthering their controls. Negs are masters of lies, trickery, and deception. A troublesome spirit, no matter what it pretends to be, should never be trusted further than one can throw it. Negs should never be given the benefit of the doubt.

pages 291-292 of Practical Psychic Self Defense.

And I don't recall Robert Bruce using Fluffy Bunny approach when he was demonically possessed and almost died out in the Australian Bush (pages 135 -142)


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McArthur
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« Reply #178 on: February 15, 2004, 12:29:24 »

quote:
Originally posted by Dark Knight

The other is the concept that a guide can and will do anything to you (no boundaries whatsoever) to teach you a lesson, including lying.


If that is a concept that has been put to you then you are right not to trust those who have done so. YOU are the Master of your own body and Mind, NOT some other entity claiming to be your "spirit guide". Anyone who tells you otherwise is being used as a tool to recruit more food by negs.

Why would we need a spirit guide to help us to experience existence? Are we not each capable of living our own lives and learning our own lessons without interference from "spirits"? Life is short, live it and enjoy it if you can, we will all be dead ourselves sooner or later and able to see what knowledge the spiritual realms have to offer at that point in our Journey.

I made a big mistake when i trusted a spirit that claimed to be my spirit guide quite some time ago. Oh it was polite at first and claimed to offer Ancient Knowledge etc etc (the usual ploy) but when i asked it to be quiet (it would constantly TALK keeping me up late at nights making me listen to what it had to say - all the while feeding off my attention (where the attention goes the enegy flows)) it soon got nasty because it knew i was wising up to its game. Long story but ever since then, after learning MYSELF from that mistake, i have been suspicious about these so-called "spirit-guides" because it is far too easy to fall into the trap of a neg pretending to be one.

And you will find, if you watch those with "spirit guides" closely that there is a general pattern to them. One is that their guides claim to be giving them information no-one else has which plays on ones ego's need to feel self-important. Its a "Oh i have a guide so i must be spiritually mature, i have been chosen! Oh wow how amazing!" Having a "spirit guide" amongst the New Age gurus (and they are ten a penny) is looked on as some kind of status symbol. And negs know that and play into the gullable using all this.

And anyone who suggest you use a pendulum to call spirits is giving very dangerous teachings indeed! Do NOT call these spirits unless you absolutely KNOW what you are doing. People tend to think (as i did before i learned my hard lesson) that if something is a "spirit" non-physical it must be more knowledgable than us and also people associate spirits to "spiritual realms" i.e. Heaven. Well these same folks need to learn that just because your'e "dead" don't mean you are nice!

I'm betting that there will be no comments to my posts by any "spirit guides" because they know i will be able to spot a faker straight away. Lets wait and see. Any takers?
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SpectralDragon
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« Reply #179 on: February 15, 2004, 13:02:00 »

quote:
Originally posted by McArthur

I couldnt read this entire thread because i find it hard to read these so-called "channellings" from negs/unclean spirits/astral shells. *shivers*

Dont you people realize that an unclean spirit will pretend to be ANYTHING so long as you allow it to keep feeding off your attention/energy?

But from what i have read here it seems that some here (or the negs they are host to) are attempting to recruit other gullable persons to allow these spirits (by inviting them in) to come feed. So im going to have some questions for your "spirit guides" if they are prepared to answer. After all, the Bible says to "test your spirits" so i feel that any positive spirit surely wont mind being tested right?

Here is test No.1: Tell the spirit that you have decided you want it to leave for exactly 1 month and make no contact with you WHATSOEVER during this time. If it refuses or comes up with an excuse such as "I am not able to do that because we have important work to do to fulfil Divine Plans" then you can be sure its a neg. Any positive helpful spirit will understand your wishes and do as asked.


Not all negs will cause negative symptoms. So long as they get to feed on your attention why would they? Some negs feed by giving their victim an orgasm. feels good eh but its still a form of vampirism.

I will have more to say on this soon (and after i have read the whole thread) i'm just so shocked at present how gullable some people really are. You can choose to take my post as being negative if you like, and i'll certainly be interested in what any of your "guides" have to say- so fire away. I do realize that this post may seem slightly antagonistic but thats because i really dont like negs.

Here is a question for anyone with a guide: Ask it what the special meaning of the number 228 is. If it is a guide with contacts Higher up it will know.


Try this link; http://www.clairvision.org/CKB/CKBC/CKBC_000_077/Index.html

Here is a couple from the FAQ;

From: Could some entities be extra terrestrials or related to them?

"All jokes aside, if there is one thing that has emerged from the Clairvision exploration of entities, it is that you can never believe what they tell you. Entities exist on a fluid, changing level. They can easily modify their appearance, and the 'feel' attached to them. They are ready to play all sorts of games. And they are always looking for someone to buy into their game, because it is their best chance of survival."

From: You say that entities are not evil. How do you reconcile this with other people's reports of demonic entities?

"Entities have a chameleon nature.

Once you identify an entity, the entity will try hard to make you believe you can't live without it, or that it is so powerful that there is no chance you will ever get rid of it.

The reason is simple: if you clear it, it loses its life support system. Fragments (by far the most common category of entities) are unable to survive by themselves. In most cases, when a fragment is expelled from its host, its only chance of survival is to find another host in a matter of days or weeks.

So when the client consciously gets in touch with the entity, the entity is ready to play all sorts of games to 'extend its visa', so to speak. Give the entity a lead, and it will follow it. Ask it, "Are you evil?" and it will answer you, "Yes! More evil than you can possibly imagine."

Ask it, "Are you my spirit guide?" and it will answer you as if it were your spirit guide.

Ask it, "Are you an alien?" and it will immediately draw from the client's memory to fabricate extra-terrestrial stories.

This is one of the reasons why entities appear different in different cultural and religious contexts.

In the Clairvision style of work, entities are reduced to their smallest denominator. They are not given much chance to build up stories. Their wantings are analysed with as little 'wrapping' as possible, keeping the story side to the strictest minimum. Then they are cleared."




This IS only fair [Wink] Very well, I already did the month thing with Kereen. She did not like the idea (for reasons I will not explain, but it was not the "we have divine" stuff that you were talking about) but she agreed because at the time I had to sort myself out (long story) So that's a plus there.

228...hmmm let's see what she says... she's luaghing. Don't know why. Sorry seems like she thinks this is misguided a bit or something. Has to do with Chaos Math I know (and am getting) that much.

Also, she said "you need to come up with better tests, negs do so like to act like the real thing."
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« Reply #179 on: February 15, 2004, 13:02:00 »



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McArthur
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« Reply #180 on: February 15, 2004, 13:47:28 »

quote:
Originally posted by SpectralDragon
This IS only fair [Wink] Very well, I already did the month thing with Kereen. She did not like the idea (for reasons I will not explain, but it was not the "we have divine" stuff that you were talking about) but she agreed because at the time I had to sort myself out (long story) So that's a plus there.

OK i have a few questions if you or Kereen don't mind. Can you describe to me what Kereen actually is and what purpose she holds as your spirit guide?

Also i am interested in why you "already did the month thing" and why she "did not like the idea". It seems you are reluctant to share this which in itself, in the interest of seeking Truth, does not bode well for our tests. Could you ask her if she would be prepared to do a 3 month test without you? And if not, why not. What reason? Also ask her why you need her, what is the answer?
quote:

228...hmmm let's see what she says... she's luaghing. Don't know why.


Could you ask her why she laughed please. Why would she laugh and not tell you why?
quote:

 Sorry seems like she thinks this is misguided a bit or something.


Oh really? Thats interesting. Ask her if she knows what the sacred number of Jesus is for me please. Its not 228 but i want to know if she knows the connection.
quote:

 Has to do with Chaos Math I know (and am getting) that much.


Can she be more specific please. Vagueness is a trait of a neg that knows very little but knows how to confuse.
quote:

Also, she said "you need to come up with better tests, negs do so like to act like the real thing."


Of course she would say that, isnt that what i said in my post?

Is there somewhere where you describe your spirit guide experience in detail on these forums so i can get a better idea of who/what Kereen is please? (ive not read this whole thread yet-- its so long!)

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McArthur
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« Reply #181 on: February 15, 2004, 13:51:43 »

p.s. also i am interested in what psychic abilities she has. If i was to give you a picture of myself would she be able to give me any information about myself from the picture? Thanks.
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Dark Knight
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« Reply #182 on: February 15, 2004, 14:52:59 »

Whoa, Whoa, whoa, Spectral and MacArthur, take it easy. I know your story MacArthur, you sent it to me before you disappeared, and I have spoken to Spectral "a few times". You guys might end up being friends and don't know it.

MacArthur, Spectral's guide Kereen is "unusual" and so is Spectral. Do I agree with Kereen all the time, no, and Spectral will tell you that. But my trust issue isn't as severe with her as with certain others. And vagueness is a problem I have with Mayatnik.

Read the WHOLE thread MacArthur...and Spectral don't use Chaos Math on MacArthur (he isn't being vague MacArthur, he's doing CM, trying to figure you out too), just be straight forward for goodness sake [Wink] You may really like him a lot and I think you two will discover you have a lot in common.

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SpectralDragon
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« Reply #183 on: February 15, 2004, 15:01:03 »

quote:
Originally posted by Dark Knight

Whoa, Whoa, whoa, Spectral and MacArthur, take it easy. I know your story MacArthur, you sent it to me before you disappeared, and I have spoken to Spectral "a few times". You guys might end up being friends and don't know it.

MacArthur, Spectral's guide Kereen is "unusual" and so is Spectral. Do I agree with Kereen all the time, no, and Spectral will tell you that. But my trust issue isn't as severe with her as with certain others. And vagueness is a problem I have with Mayatnik.

Read the WHOLE thread MacArthur...and Spectral don't use Chaos Math on MacArthur (he isn't being vague MacArthur, he's doing CM, trying to figure you out too), just be straight forward for goodness sake [Wink] You may really like him a lot and I think you two will discover you have a lot in common.



DK we are both being fair, don't worry
McArthur if you want details I will have to go to the PM channels. There is such a thing as something being personal after all [Wink] I will go into more later have to get some sleep.

Also, carefull how you mention XM DK.......
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Dark Knight
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« Reply #184 on: February 15, 2004, 15:06:58 »

You just mentioned XM, I can't believe you just did that [:O]

MacArthur, he really si a nice guy and won't force anything on you.


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McArthur
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« Reply #185 on: February 15, 2004, 17:11:47 »

Heh well it would be hard for anyone to force anything onto me to be honest. And it seems SD is taking my posts ok so far. Nothing from anyone else yet though. The forums have changed a LOT and ive not been on for a while. Seems i have some catching up to do with the new forums such as the channeling one....  ive read Mustardseeds one about halfway and am really enjoying it!

So SD pm me if you like. Like you said Dk i need to read the whole thread but its 12 pages looooong!
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Dark Knight
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« Reply #186 on: February 15, 2004, 17:31:39 »

quote:
Like you said Dk i need to read the whole thread but its 12 pages looooong!


I know, I know, but lessons had to be learned, and learning, sadly, is very linear, regardless of how, where, and when the self floats.

Read all of it, might get a chuckle or two or twelve. Oh Sorry Thirteen, now.

Really, SD is cuddly and lovable, I plan on adopting him as my son someday [Tongue]

Take care MacArthur, and good to see you here again.
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SpectralDragon
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« Reply #187 on: August 04, 2004, 07:50:58 »

Now this brings back memories of the angry bee doesn't it?
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Edi
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« Reply #188 on: January 29, 2004, 11:40:44 »

Hello fellow Astral Pulsars,

although I am a member of this forum since a few months, I have stayed out of the psychic self defense section until now because I neither needed help with psychic 'attacks', nor did I feel the necessity to contribute anything from my side. However, I've been following many threads here, and my guide Perena wishes me to express her viewpoint about 'psychic self defense' here by channeling her words at this present time. I've got to know my guide more than half a year ago and have been in constant telepathic communication with her since. I put absolutely trust and confidence into her, not only because others confirmed her 'validity' to me, but because of the experiences I had with her over the course of the last months; she always did what turned out to be best for me, always respecting my personal needs, and I've seen again and again how I could help others by what was given to me to pass on. In that sense, I ask you to consider what follows with an open mind. This channeling is done by writing down the words I hear telepathically from my guide exactly as they come to my mind.



"Greetings to everyone reading this. As Edi said, it was my wish to express myself here, because I am concerned about the way things are going, along with the other guides who are working at my side. We have seen the attitude that was present in this forum and how it evolved over time. It was decided to put this channeling here and not in the communications section of this forum in order to reach the people who are effected by this topic.

So first I will begin to explain the situation of someone who is new to spiritual matters, wants to explore and find out things, and seeks advice and guidance along his path after a short while. Imagine the common man from the street who follows his urges to listen to what is happening inside of him, to explore who he is. He might buy some books from a New Age store, have some recommendations from friends, and begins to work seriously on his development. Meditation, astral projection, dream recall, magic, or whatever he chooses to pursue, keeps him interested because he reaches his personal boundaries there. He wishes to see and know what he has never seen before in his life, although that slight little "something" has been there all his life. So he starts with introspection, with trying to see where he is limiting himself and to overcome this, which is necessary for personal growth. Feelings get uncovered, painful memories, and so on, but in general the beginning will be hard because the first thing that appears is what has been repressed for so long. Everyone carries around beliefs and convictions that serve a certain purpose in life, but that also are limiting. So far this man I illustrated here has no big problems: he works through whatever comes up with a positive mind, knowing that it's just a matter of time until he lets go of old fear and beliefs he doesn't need any longer.

Now let's see how this man would be affected by practicing "psychic self defense" as some people advocate it.

Situation one: in his meditations, he has strange feelings and uncomfortable images in his mind. The solution would be: experience those feelings, learn what they have to tell, and see how they diminish on their own then. The PSD approach would be: "this could be a psychic attack, a 'neg' feeding off you. surround yourself with a protective shield and learn how to fend off attackers"
Situation two: during an astral projection, the person encounters something that appears as a scary being to him. The solution would be: "boo, what's that? so this is what my mind likes to project and to perceive, interesting... let's sort that out with myself". The PSD approach would be: "that's a daemon who want's to steal your energy, or worse. try to kill him as long as you can!"

You can imagine other situations on your own, but you see where this is going. Where a natural approach to explore those things in a calm and positive way would do the job, the fear and negativity instilled by people who like to 'fight' and 'attack' for whatever reason does nothing to alleviate the problem - in fact it makes it worse! Where's the sense in projecting your fear outwards and then attacking them? People who suffer need help and guidance to overcome those things and grow by doing that. They do NOT profit in any way from only hearing about daemons, attacks, vampires and so on, because the latter are all natural phenomena (although different from what they seem to be). They are no problem except if you make it one for you. So the statement by which I end this preliminary channeling (a teaser, so to speak) is:

Nothing can harm you except yourself.
"Psychic Self Defense" as it is preached here does more harm than good.

Whoever thinks otherwise is encouraged to give his contribution here and to discuss those issues with the guides who are channeled by Edi and Fuzziwig at this present time."




I'd like to clarify that Fuzziwig is in the same position as I am, meaning that he has a personal guide he knows and trusts. He too was trained to be an accurate channeler, and I am happy to have him at my side here; we will be glad to relay the guides' perspective and comments on everything you bring forward in response to what has been said above.

With love and light,
  Edi
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