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Belief Systems

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MJ-12


Donni_Joy

Hi kbear

Robert has written an article on belief system cleansing that can have a great impact on many areas of your life. Here it is:

Belief Systems:
Your experiences in life are filtered by what you believe. What do you believe about energy? And yourself? Do you have it set in your mind that you cannot feel anything for some reason? Or if you can't feel it now, it will be hard to, even after trying the exercises several times? Sometimes our beliefs can put us in 'little boxes' that limit what we allow into our realm of experience.

All knowledge is available to everyone. But most people refuse to see, to hear, to realize, because this conflicts with their paradigms, with their innate conceptions of reality. And there are none so blind as those who will not see.  One must get back to basics, and by so doing to broaden ones conceptual horizons.

The method, if it can be called such a thing, is absolute honesty with your own true self.  Know yourself, and to your own self be true. Discard everything not gained via personal experience.  Do not take anything as read.  Question everything and find out for yourself by doing.

But this is a very difficult thing to do.  We are surrounded by opinions and these sink into us, into our belief system filters, and they shape all our beliefs; if we let them. This we must resist profoundly.

Look at everything with the eyes of a child:  be open minded, non judgmental, simple, unfettered by the beliefs and opinions and shackles of others.  

Realize that everything, every sense and perception and intuition and vision and every bit of information  gathered outside the physical body, whether during energy work, OBE or altered state, must pass through the belief system filters in order to be stored as a recognizable memory in the physical brain.

Take for example partisan NewAge beliefs about the nature, structure and  functionings of the spirit world above us.  What if it were not actually like this at all?  How would high level information, contrary to partisan belief, be affected by this contradiction? Could it integrated at all? How would it be changed?  And indeed it will be changed as it passes through the myriad of conceptual belief system filters we all contain.

We strive and plead and beg for the truth, and I assure you it is given to us all at every turn.  But we do not allow ourselves to see it. You see the majority of us are happy and content with our spiritual blindness. Even though much of it does not work, its comfortable, so we stick with it. This is called Maya, the illusion of the physical reality we all share.  

Make a list of everything you believe in.  Apply total honesty to this list.  Keep everything you have personal experience with.  Discard the rest, but remain open minded.  If, for example, you have not experienced OBE, be open to experiencing it. Put all the stuff you have not proven personally into a basket of 'possibilities'. And transfer these possibilities carefully into the 'real stuff' basket as experience is gained.  You will be surprised at how much stuff will never be moved, and will eventually end up in the trash at life's end.

After one has done ones best to purge his or her belief system filters (or self-imposed limitations), real knowledge comes through the realization process.  A progressive number of small realizations (like pieces of jigsaw) flow into the mind.  This is punctuated by progressively larger and larger realizations.  This is the well-known road to enlightenment; which is described in many different ways in the world today.

Just because one has a strict belief system does not mean that one cannot try out new ideas, even crazy ones.  Ideas, crazy or otherwise, are not heartfelt beliefs. But the gems one uncovers and proves have the potential
to become true beliefs; even if everyone else disagrees.



Cheers
Donni

"A balance of perspective must be maintained in order to preserve reasonable logic and truth." Robert the Brute, 2002

"A balance of perspective must be maintained in order to preserve reasonable logic and truth." Robert the Brute, 2002

kbear

Thanks Donni & MJ-12

I think that i am on the road of reviewing and changing self limiting belief's. Bruce Moen has a way that he say's we can change belief's. After relaxing say that you want to talk to the aspect of self that controls a certain belief. Ask a lot of questions on how this aspect of self control's and maintains the belief and it's influence on yourself. Then tell the aspect of self that you want to change the belief and its influence.

I tried this but did not see any real results. But then maybe i just did not keep doing it long enough also.

I am reading a book by Anthony Robbins, if i remember right The Giant Within. He has a lot of ideas on belief systems and how to change them. As i understand some of what he say's. He talks about reviewing the belief to see if it really is bring yourself happiness and fulfilment or pain and dispair. These are my word, he explains it much better. He says one of the ways to change a belief is to start to doubt it. Another more powerfull way is to see that the belief is bringing pain and unfulfilment. Then feel that pain intently because of the belief's effect on your self.

Anyway i am going to try his methods and see how they work for me.

Peace be unto you.
kbear


David

I smashed my Christian Belief system into little tiny pieces about a year and a bit ago and haven't looked back since. Now my belief system is based on experience not just taking anyones word for it.


jack rader

David:
I am glad to hear that you also have discarded this so-called Christian belief system.  I thought it was a real crock of crap even when I was ten years old.
Since moving to Florida I had the interesting experience of running across a few persons I know who are into this "born again Christianity."
This evangelical fundamentalist crowd is something else.  I thought that as a mainstream Christian back before puberty that it was a bit too much to swallow, until I saw these people and saw how they behaved and believed.
It is no wonder Europe and much of the rest of the world either shake their heads at American society or just plain dislike us.  So much of today's Christianity breeds hatred and contempt all over the world.
Best to have gotten out.

Best wishes,
Rader


MJ-12


Usiimers

I have yet to try the catch basket technique.  Maybe part of me is scared to tear apart all my beliefs.  I know that this is something I have to do though.  
My list really isn't going to be that long.  Other than OBEs.  
Would belief in God go on a list of old beliefs or not?  I would say that I believe in God but that I can't really prove it in a logical way.  What do others think?


James S

David, Me too!!
Though I do not disbelieve God or Jesus, I just don't "worship" them wholy & soley as the bible commands you to do.

A few months ago I started to reawaken my spiritual growth. I found that too many of the things I was learning did not fit into the box that Chritianity would have me stay in. I also found the Christian teachings were denying me of the real experiences that I have had in my life.

I found Robert Bruce's "catch basket concept" as detailed by Donni_Joy. It was the best thing that could have happened to me spiritually.

Usiimers,
It is scary! but only for a little while. Once you have blown away your old beliefs, hang on to what you know to be true, and use that to build on. I felt somewhat naked & exposed, and quite confused for a short time. Then I received a vision from my guide - a spirit that has been trying to get my attention for a very long time. Now that I have come to accept this spirit and its guidance as real, all sorts of doors are opening up for me. Now I'm really learning and growing, and having fun with it!

James S

- You don't choose the belief, the belief chooses you!

kakkarot

ok, first off i am going to have to defend christianity. Christianity is not supposed to be a religion, it is supposed to be a way of live: of loving people. next, unfortunately most people who claim the title Christian have NO CLUE as to what it really means to be christian; they really do think it is supposed to be a religion. and more unfortunately, most people who have figured out the difference either stay away from churches or stay quiet at the churches, so it is highly unlikely you will ever find one so that you can learn REAL christianity from them. HOWEVER, real christianity can be learned right from the bible. screw listening to people to hear how they are biased in the ways of "interpreting" the bible. read it yourself, discarding bias and what you have "learned" from people, and then you will see what christianity really is.
DONE DEFENDING CHRISTIANITY.

i tore apart anything even resembling a belief system, starting when i was fourteen and ending when i was almost sixteen. cleaned out everything. i even went so far as to ask myself whether reality really was real, or if it wasn't and then ANSWER it COMPLETELY (however, it was not just a yes or no answer) rather than just defaulting to something like "well, if it isn't then... whatever". i had to in order to make sure i was believing in things that i could trust myself to believe in.

the hardest part about tearing apart your beliefs and building new ones is that you have to fully answer every question you pose yourself and you almost have to ask yourself everything just to make sure you aren't pulling in beliefs from what you used to believe in without testing them first. and the other thing is, not all of your answers will be yes or no answers, and not all of your answers will be answerable. "Does God exist?" not a simple yes or no answer if you want to make that decision in all truth, is it? after all, no one will prove God to exist to you except God. Even if God has proven his existance to another, that person cannot share that experience with you: the best you could do would be to believe or disbelieve in their ability to distinguish truth from fiction. and if you would believe them without fact, then why not believe someone else without fact? and that means that to know something, you have to experience it fully for yourself.

____________
eg) "Do angels exist?" i believe in them due to the experiences i have had in my life time, but i cannot yet declare them, in my own mind, to be factually existant. never have i had an experiece that has forced me to know that angels exist, but i have had so many experiences that have a 'most probable answer' being that they do exist, that i have to, in an unbiased and fair judgement call, believe that it is possible they exist and that they do things.

eg) "Does the ground underneath my feet exist?" Well, for every test and experience i have had with the ground being there, when it has come into question as to whether it is there or not, has proven it to have been there. Therefore, in an unbiased and fair judgement call, i can do nothing but believe that, even if the world is imaginary, that i can continue to put faith into the idea that everytime that i wish to interact with the thought known as the ground, with all of the properties of "ground", i will be able to interact with the "ground" in the manners that i have proven to myself to be able to interact with it in.
____________

~kakkarot

Secret of Secrets

Ides315

Hey, all

Well put kakkarot.

As for a beliief system? mine had only just begun at 5-6. It is still growing today. A lot of extenuating circumstances, but continuing. I don't think any mortal should be so silly as to have a completely set belief system. I you really had it all figured out, you would not need to be a mortal.

The only thing that makes me shudder about someone "starting over" with their belief system is losing the rights and wrongs of life.

Take care, all


James S

Kakkarot,

Nice defence of christianity! Clear, objective & to the point.
My beliefs got pretty badly messed up during my times attending church. Thing is it was the doctorines, dogmas and personal opinions of the ministers that were confusing me. I do have some strong objections to some points in the bible, but that's pretty much on a personal level, and I find I am much happier now just being able to take it or leave it as my heart tells me, and not have some minister telling me what to believe. I could never understand how God made us all individuals, yet so many church leaders seem to believe we must all think & act the same way.

I will always maintian that the words of Jesus himself, not the interpretations that followed, but HIS words, are amongst the wisest, most sensible and most practical that mankind has ever heard. HIS words I believe is what christianity is all about, not the dogmas & demands of the institution that has been made of christianity. Jesus has reached out and touched some people personally. Theirs is a life of full loving devotion to him - a wonderfull thing.

I chose a different path after 18 or so years as a "born again christian". I had never been personaly touched by God in any way, whereas my spirit guide, who is the spirit of earth, of nature - Gaia if you like, has most definitley come to me and personally contacted me in a very real and unquestionable way. I now love her as I was told I should love the Lord, but just never felt it. Interesting thing is that even though christian teachings would deny her existance, she has very clearly confirmed that God (in the all encompasing universal sense of an entity who created all things), and Jesus are both quite real.

Angels? - I have personally witnessed their presance. REALLY AWESOME!!!This is a fundamental part of my belief.

Ides315 - I agree with your last point. I would have to seriously question someones beliefs if they lost all concept of right and wrong. I feel these things are a basic part of the "universal law" that Jesus and most other prophets, icons & spiritual teachers have explained to us.




James S

- You don't choose the belief, the belief chooses you!

Gandalf

James -
I agree,
Christianity is meant to be a way of life, not a religion.
Its easy to get hold of Christ's original teachings, they have all been translated now as they were found in the dead sea scrolls and in the original aramaic manuscripts translated into english by Dr Edmond Szekely.

You will be suprised at how much has been left out of the later 'New testement' including the whole feminine aspect.
As well as the heavenly father who resides in heaven, there is the earthly mother who resides on earth.
I would recomend  the translated manuscript (dating from 1st century AD) now published as 'The Gospel of the Essenes'
The Essenes were the group that jesus founded or belonged to.
Be warned though, although many of jesus original teachings contain many good ideas, some of them IMO are a bit extreme like his strict veggie diet (only as the earthly mother indended it - only raw fruit and veg, NO COOKING) and no kill policy, (ie you must NOT eat or use the hides of animals as this is an affront to the earthly mother - so get rid of your leather shoes!).

Highly recomended, whether you agree with Christ's theories or not.
They're good to read even just to see how much has been left out by later 'revised' christianity!

Regards,
Douglas


"It is to Scotland that we look for our idea of civilisation." -- Voltaire.

Gandalf

PS James, I think you would appreciate some of Christ's original ideas about the Earthly Mother, esp. due to your experiences with Gaia.
Christ beleived that the Earthly Mother was everywhere, was nature itself.
She even has her own angels, angels of the water, the air, the woods etc
Quite similar to many pagan beliefs actually.
The Earthly Mother is JUST as important as the Heavenly Father, but the whole feminine aspect has been droped by the church.

Jeseus says himself also, that you should not simply beleive what you read in the scriptures as 'they are dead as the people who wrote them are dead' but that you must see the Earthly mother in everything around you, in the air, the trees etc.

I agree that some of his original teachings have survived in the new testement and can be found if you're careful enough but there has been to much re-translation and chopping/revising of material plus an infusion of dogma.
That is why I would recomend his original teachings only.
However, I have found that although he does indeed have many great ideas Jesus himself can be quite dogmatic at times and some of his ideas tend to be a bit extreme. Highly recomended though!

Regards,
Douglas




"It is to Scotland that we look for our idea of civilisation." -- Voltaire.

James S

Douglas, that is VERY interesting. Thank you for passing that on.
My mother has a very old book that has been passed down through the generations called The Life of Jesus. It, as well as a few other very old documents around suggest that he had a lot more insight into things other than what has been documented inthe Bible.

It would seem to me that the early churches (esp from around 600 AD onwards) might have viewed some of these documents as heresey. It is believed there are a few books that were originally part of the bible that were removed because of the opinions of church leaders.

James S

- You don't choose the belief, the belief chooses you!

Gandalf

Yes,
The book of Enoch is one such part of the bible that has been dropped!

Douglas

"It is to Scotland that we look for our idea of civilisation." -- Voltaire.

kbear

Recently in my reading i again came across the idea that by age 6 every person has developed their core belief systems. Their own individual way of viewing and their placing of meaning of everything that happens in life. What is right/wrong, possible/impossible and so these beliefs define the boundry of our perceptions and limits of our mortal life.

I seem to remember Robert saying that he came to a point that he had to change and accept different beliefs in what was possible for him.

If this is true that we all have our own individual belief systems that will be different for other person.

Then is there a way to become aware and remove/change these core beliefs that may be stoping us as individuals to experiance astral projection and any other abilities that could help us to grow beyond the physical limits that our belief systems may confine us too.

thanks