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Author Topic: Thomas Campbells view on reincarnation  (Read 6910 times)
ArmyOfOne1911
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« on: December 19, 2011, 04:47:06 »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VmkPBrHwQWI&feature=related

Pretty interesting...

It disappoints me though... undecided

So everyone I meet in this lifetime... All of my good memories of this lifetime... My family, pets, relationships, etc. Just gone after leaving? You will never meet up with them again, for you will have no clue who your family even was. If this life we are in now fades away "like a dream" Then you are sent back here to relive the physical again.

I know this is another reincarnation topic... But here is my viewpoint on this.

Wouldn't you want to die and see your loved ones? Reunite again, and just move on to greater planes? Knowing your family for eternity... Who you are... what you did in your past life... Instead of being brain washed and thrown back into this reality to learn and grow? For example what if you don't want to come back to the physical? I don't know but I would like to always keep my personality with me wherever I go. Not die... and then think to myself well I better cherish my memories before I get brain washed and sent back to earth as a guy living with a horrible disease because I didn't understand it... therefore I should live the experience to learn and grow more... It just sounds bad to me. :|You build bonds with people... relationships in this life, and from what it sounded like you will forget about them anyway and they wont even cross your mind in your "next life" because they won't even exist to you.

I guess I just get frustrated with reincarnation. I'd rather be in the astral helping others, knowing who I am, and being able to see those I love whenever I wanted to. Not being brain washed and thrown back into this world totally clueless again... and again... and again... until you learn everything to become more "advanced" I guess you would call it.  undecided
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« Reply #1 on: December 19, 2011, 05:24:02 »

I didn't see anything unexpected. Our real existence is in spirit realms and we come here to be challenged without the security of knowing that we are totally safe and always protected. Under this condition of stress we learn through adversity and we progress. We meet our loved ones again back in spirit or our loved ones will write and choose their own lives to be with us again during the incarnation.

It's an eternal journey so never worry about any one individual cycle.

He doesn't suggest that we have no further memory of our life and loved one and, regardless, we can always go and re-experience it as we choose. Our true life is in spirit. We are here to train ourselves and then we return home. Think of it as a tour of duty.
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« Reply #1 on: December 19, 2011, 05:24:02 »

logoVisit the website of Astral Pulse creator Adrian Cooper.

Home of the best selling book Our Ultimate Reality.

Astral Projection, Metaphysics and many other subjects.

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majour ka
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« Reply #2 on: December 19, 2011, 05:56:25 »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VmkPBrHwQWI&feature=related

Pretty interesting...

It disappoints me though... undecided

So everyone I meet in this lifetime... All of my good memories of this lifetime... My family, pets, relationships, etc. Just gone after leaving? You will never meet up with them again, for you will have no clue who your family even was. If this life we are in now fades away "like a dream" Then you are sent back here to relive the physical again.


Hi, I can only speak from my view point as a working Medium.
When people come and speak from spirit side of life to people here, their personality is recoginsed, they often give their name etc first name last/name. They will talk about old memories, mention people that are important to them. Often they tell us where they used to live, city/town road name house number etc. What they did for a job, things they loved to do and didn't like also. They often will also say who they have met up with for instance uncle Chris or or their sister jenny just for example and allot of the time they will have pets with them that people recognise and give the pets name etc...so while the youtube video is interesting it is fairly flippant and brief, when you consider what a complex topic he is describing...and how does he know ? Regards  smiley
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majour ka
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« Reply #3 on: December 19, 2011, 05:57:37 »

I didn't see anything unexpected. Our real existence is in spirit realms and we come here to be challenged without the security of knowing that we are totally safe and always protected. Under this condition of stress we learn through adversity and we progress. We meet our loved ones again back in spirit or our loved ones will write and choose their own lives to be with us again during the incarnation.

It's an eternal journey so never worry about any one individual cycle.

He doesn't suggest that we have no further memory of our life and loved one and, regardless, we can always go and re-experience it as we choose. Our true life is in spirit. We are here to train ourselves and then we return home. Think of it as a tour of duty.

Absolutely...we come to experience limitation and the expression of form
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Volgerle
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« Reply #4 on: December 19, 2011, 11:36:33 »

Campbell's descriptions are almost or fairly consistent with what Monroe reported, and also what hypnotherapists like M. Newton report on life "between" lives (which is a wrong expression, as the life "between" is our "real" life).

Compare:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0QDT58Q6Zxo

I think that you, Army, really misunderstand the basic tenets of this. You incarnate again together with spirits you know from before (friends or whatever). Every incarnation is like a "role" in a game. And once you played a role and know (again) it was only a role it really starts to fade. I wouldn't say like a dream (but TC uses this only as a metaphor), the memory of one life experience is just put into perspective to your "real" (spirit) life and the other lives you lead and will lead (which might be quite a few!).

When looking at our life we lead now, we need to get out of the box of our "ego" perspective. Because the Ego wants things as they are now. (Telling yourself: "I am this person now and I will be always this person because that is the way I WANT it to be. Period."). This is mainly what many religions do (esp. the monotheistic ones): they "flatter the ego" because they tell you if you behave well (and as they want you to behave) and 'serve' the God they want you to serve you will basically "stay the same" after death as a reward. But this is an illusion. You are not the same after death. That's because you are not what you(r ego) think(s) your are right now as human being, in the first place. You are much MORE than this. This life is just a little part of what you "really" are.
« Last Edit: December 19, 2011, 11:44:57 by Volgerle » Logged

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« Reply #4 on: December 19, 2011, 11:36:33 »



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kurtykurt42
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« Reply #5 on: December 19, 2011, 12:01:41 »


When looking at our life we lead now, we need to get out of the box of our "ego" perspective. Because the Ego wants things as they are now. (Telling yourself: "I am this person now and I will be always this person because that is the way I WANT it to be. Period."). This is mainly what many religions do (esp. the monotheistic ones): they "flatter the ego" because they tell you if you behave well (and as they want you to behave) and 'serve' the God they want you to serve you will basically "stay the same" after death as a reward. But this is an illusion. You are not the same after death. That's because you are not what you(r ego) think(s) your are right now as human being, in the first place. You are much MORE than this. This life is just a little part of what you "really" are.

That's one theory.

Or maybe we never reincarnated before and our conciousness develops as our physical body develops.

Or we did reincarnate on this planet but had all memories of past lives erased in the process.

In any event... there's really no point in guessing.

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« Reply #6 on: December 19, 2011, 16:22:08 »

When you're in a great dream and think it's real, you don't want or expect to wake up into reality, but then you do and remember everything and see the dream for the illusion it was and appreciate it from your current perspective.
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majour ka
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« Reply #7 on: December 19, 2011, 17:28:17 »

When you're in a great dream and think it's real, you don't want or expect to wake up into reality, but then you do and remember everything and see the dream for the illusion it was and appreciate it from your current perspective.

Amen
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majour ka
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« Reply #8 on: December 19, 2011, 17:35:40 »

Campbell's descriptions are almost or fairly consistent with what Monroe reported, and also what hypnotherapists like M. Newton report on life "between" lives (which is a wrong expression, as the life "between" is our "real" life).

Compare:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0QDT58Q6Zxo


When looking at our life we lead now, we need to get out of the box of our "ego" perspective. Because the Ego wants things as they are now. (Telling yourself: "I am this person now and I will be always this person because that is the way I WANT it to be. Period."). This is mainly what many religions do (esp. the monotheistic ones): they "flatter the ego" because they tell you if you behave well (and as they want you to behave) and 'serve' the God they want you to serve you will basically "stay the same" after death as a reward. But this is an illusion. You are not the same after death. That's because you are not what you(r ego) think(s) your are right now as human being, in the first place. You are much MORE than this. This life is just a little part of what you "really" are.

Thats a good description of how many religions have "lost their way" if we look at most religions, Christianity, Buddhism, Islam etc etc there was a person who seemed to go through a transformation...and enlightening experience and have then shared that and said you too can experience this for your self, but most of which was probably never really understood or lost in translation. 
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« Reply #9 on: December 19, 2011, 22:59:50 »

Some questions that have baffled me regarding the theory of reincarnation are these Ė How do I know that the ďbeingsĒ guiding me through the afterlife, assuming there is one, are benevolent?  How can I trust them enough to allow them to wipe my memory clean?  How do I know that they donít have their own secret agenda? Robert Monroe once wrote about us being on the earth for the purpose of providing/harvesting ďlushĒ or something of that nature.  Tom himself says that our purpose is to reduce our entropy in order to help AUM/AUO achieve a higher state of being but what are the intentions of AUM/AUO.  How do I know that reincarnation is not a scam to keep me trapped in this planet for harvesting or whatever?
 
Maybe some cleaver beings propped-up a scenario in the afterlife in an effort to take advantage of our lack of understanding of what is going on (being new to the afterlife and all) and dupe us into believing that we need to reincarnate in order to achieve a bogus state of being and BAM! We get bagged!  Ready for moreĒ harvestingĒ back here on earthÖ. BTW, has anybody ever seen the movie ďThe IslandĒ starting Ewan McGregor and Scarlett Johansson? That movie perfectly describes what Iím trying to say.

Iím not trying to say that this is how it is but how can I know that itís not? There is still a lot that is unknown, personally, I donít think itís a good idea to be all trusting I donít care how loving some of these beings might appear.  If I do encounter a scenario similar to this one after death, I know that Iím going to be asking a %^& load of questions and if they still insist that I must reincarnate, Iíll tellíem to go kick rocks.  Thereís no way that Iíll allow anybody to wipe my memory and thereís no way in hell that Iím coming back to this rock.

Am I paranoid for thinking this way?  shocked grin
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Oversoul123
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« Reply #10 on: December 20, 2011, 00:11:16 »

Man, I should've posted this on Halloween.  evil
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kurtykurt42
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« Reply #11 on: December 20, 2011, 00:47:44 »

Some questions that have baffled me regarding the theory of reincarnation are these Ė How do I know that the ďbeingsĒ guiding me through the afterlife, assuming there is one, are benevolent?  How can I trust them enough to allow them to wipe my memory clean?  How do I know that they donít have their own secret agenda? Robert Monroe once wrote about us being on the earth for the purpose of providing/harvesting ďlushĒ or something of that nature.  Tom himself says that our purpose is to reduce our entropy in order to help AUM/AUO achieve a higher state of being but what are the intentions of AUM/AUO.  How do I know that reincarnation is not a scam to keep me trapped in this planet for harvesting or whatever?
 
Maybe some cleaver beings propped-up a scenario in the afterlife in an effort to take advantage of our lack of understanding of what is going on (being new to the afterlife and all) and dupe us into believing that we need to reincarnate in order to achieve a bogus state of being and BAM! We get bagged!  Ready for moreĒ harvestingĒ back here on earthÖ. BTW, has anybody ever seen the movie ďThe IslandĒ starting Ewan McGregor and Scarlett Johansson? That movie perfectly describes what Iím trying to say.

Iím not trying to say that this is how it is but how can I know that itís not? There is still a lot that is unknown, personally, I donít think itís a good idea to be all trusting I donít care how loving some of these beings might appear.  If I do encounter a scenario similar to this one after death, I know that Iím going to be asking a %^& load of questions and if they still insist that I must reincarnate, Iíll tellíem to go kick rocks.  Thereís no way that Iíll allow anybody to wipe my memory and thereís no way in hell that Iím coming back to this rock.

Am I paranoid for thinking this way?  shocked grin


Easy... Trust no one.
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Oversoul123
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« Reply #12 on: December 20, 2011, 01:27:13 »

Easy... Trust no one.

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ArmyOfOne1911
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« Reply #13 on: December 20, 2011, 04:33:49 »

Some questions that have baffled me regarding the theory of reincarnation are these Ė How do I know that the ďbeingsĒ guiding me through the afterlife, assuming there is one, are benevolent?  How can I trust them enough to allow them to wipe my memory clean?  How do I know that they donít have their own secret agenda? Robert Monroe once wrote about us being on the earth for the purpose of providing/harvesting ďlushĒ or something of that nature.  Tom himself says that our purpose is to reduce our entropy in order to help AUM/AUO achieve a higher state of being but what are the intentions of AUM/AUO.  How do I know that reincarnation is not a scam to keep me trapped in this planet for harvesting or whatever?
 
Maybe some cleaver beings propped-up a scenario in the afterlife in an effort to take advantage of our lack of understanding of what is going on (being new to the afterlife and all) and dupe us into believing that we need to reincarnate in order to achieve a bogus state of being and BAM! We get bagged!  Ready for moreĒ harvestingĒ back here on earthÖ. BTW, has anybody ever seen the movie ďThe IslandĒ starting Ewan McGregor and Scarlett Johansson? That movie perfectly describes what Iím trying to say.

Iím not trying to say that this is how it is but how can I know that itís not? There is still a lot that is unknown, personally, I donít think itís a good idea to be all trusting I donít care how loving some of these beings might appear.  If I do encounter a scenario similar to this one after death, I know that Iím going to be asking a %^& load of questions and if they still insist that I must reincarnate, Iíll tellíem to go kick rocks.  Thereís no way that Iíll allow anybody to wipe my memory and thereís no way in hell that Iím coming back to this rock.

Am I paranoid for thinking this way?  shocked grin


No, I hear you I think this way too! Lol this reminds me of the movie eraser with Arnold Schwarzenegger.
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« Reply #14 on: December 20, 2011, 16:18:32 »

Yes... trust no one and USE YOUR INTUITION AND INTENT. That's really all you've got. You can keep trying to figure it out or give up and hope for the best.
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« Reply #15 on: December 20, 2011, 19:49:17 »

No, I hear you I think this way too! Lol this reminds me of the movie eraser with Arnold Schwarzenegger.

Glad I'm not the only one haha That movie sounds interesting; I'll try to watch it if I have time.

Yes... trust no one and USE YOUR INTUITION AND INTENT. That's really all you've got. You can keep trying to figure it out or give up and hope for the best.

+1
« Last Edit: December 20, 2011, 21:02:31 by Oversoul123 » Logged
Volgerle
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« Reply #16 on: December 20, 2011, 21:24:14 »

Yes... trust no one and USE YOUR INTUITION AND INTENT. That's really all you've got.
So is INTUITION an antagonist or even the contrary of TRUST?  huh
And how about using one's INTUITION to TRUST s.o. (if you have it) - should you rather DIS-TRUST your INTUITION then?

Certainly, I agree with regard to INTENT. To have the INTENT to trust s.o. or sth does not justify it and can even be dangerous, but if you 'intuit' it?

You see, I am not too sure about the usefulness of a general "100%-trust-none"-policy forwarded here by the majority of posts now.
I agree that one should always be 'cautious' but that is still sth different from being entirely 'distrustful'. Btw, this applies, for me, to physical as well as astral life.
« Last Edit: December 20, 2011, 21:28:18 by Volgerle » Logged

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« Reply #17 on: December 20, 2011, 23:37:15 »

So is INTUITION an antagonist or even the contrary of TRUST?  huh
And how about using one's INTUITION to TRUST s.o. (if you have it) - should you rather DIS-TRUST your INTUITION then?

Certainly, I agree with regard to INTENT. To have the INTENT to trust s.o. or sth does not justify it and can even be dangerous, but if you 'intuit' it?

You see, I am not too sure about the usefulness of a general "100%-trust-none"-policy forwarded here by the majority of posts now.
I agree that one should always be 'cautious' but that is still sth different from being entirely 'distrustful'. Btw, this applies, for me, to physical as well as astral life.

Thereís a difference between trusting yourself (intuition) and trusting those outside of yourself.  But the kind of trust that is being referred here (I think) is not in reference to the trust between loved ones, a life partner or a business partnership (great joy and great pain can come out of those, but we learn valuable things from them)--the trust in context here is in regard to granting someone/something outside of yourself the authority to erase your identity and assume that they have your best interest in mind.  

Itís always a good idea to exercise extreme caution.  If at the end, after using my intent, I canít find another way then Iíll have no other choice but to take a leap of Ďfaithí.
« Last Edit: December 21, 2011, 01:20:39 by Oversoul123 » Logged
Volgerle
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« Reply #18 on: December 21, 2011, 12:16:50 »

the trust in context here is in regard to granting someone/something outside of yourself the authority to erase your identity and assume that they have your best interest in mind.
Well, okay, fair enough. Also, I was thinking more of the trusted-guides-issue when I talked about trust by intuition, but I see that this is of course another topic now, as we talk about afterlife concepts here.

I do not believe that there is something to erase because 'over there' in NPMR we "are what we are" (so to speak), and this is automatically different from what we are here. So our 'identities' (egos) here are more or less an illusion if we believe them to be persistent or the basis of our true Being / Self.

To use a metaphor: What we are here is a kind of 'role' we play here, that's the way I see it. Looking at it like a 'role' has the advantage that it is a neither/nor or either/or-thing. You bring yourSELF into that role as you play it - so it IS YOU indeed on a certain level. On the other hand, it is still a role and it is temporary. You leave the stage, take off the costumes and go home when the play is done.  wink

And that also, in turn, does NOT mean the identity's role is erased by anyone (or ourselves), why should it be? It just means that they do not even exist on that higher level entirely, just like (to stick to the metaphor) you leave the stage and stop playing the role and still are yourself - and keep your memory, knowledge and skill of the role you played. So for me it is not a trust issue at all because these things will come back naturally to us, when we are back, after our death here. You will KNOW that it is "just" a role and no one will have to convince you of it or force you to believe something or even 'erase' something.
« Last Edit: December 21, 2011, 12:23:43 by Volgerle » Logged

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« Reply #19 on: December 21, 2011, 16:14:13 »

I guess I meant in order: don't trust anyone off the bat, use your intuition to know who to trust, and use your intent to take action.
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Oversoul123
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« Reply #20 on: December 21, 2011, 22:19:33 »

Well, okay, fair enough. Also, I was thinking more of the trusted-guides-issue when I talked about trust by intuition, but I see that this is of course another topic now, as we talk about afterlife concepts here.

I do not believe that there is something to erase because 'over there' in NPMR we "are what we are" (so to speak), and this is automatically different from what we are here. So our 'identities' (egos) here are more or less an illusion if we believe them to be persistent or the basis of our true Being / Self.

To use a metaphor: What we are here is a kind of 'role' we play here, that's the way I see it. Looking at it like a 'role' has the advantage that it is a neither/nor or either/or-thing. You bring yourSELF into that role as you play it - so it IS YOU indeed on a certain level. On the other hand, it is still a role and it is temporary. You leave the stage, take off the costumes and go home when the play is done.  wink

And that also, in turn, does NOT mean the identity's role is erased by anyone (or ourselves), why should it be? It just means that they do not even exist on that higher level entirely, just like (to stick to the metaphor) you leave the stage and stop playing the role and still are yourself - and keep your memory, knowledge and skill of the role you played. So for me it is not a trust issue at all because these things will come back naturally to us, when we are back, after our death here. You will KNOW that it is "just" a role and no one will have to convince you of it or force you to believe something or even 'erase' something.

Yeah, that can also be a possibility, and I respect that but whenever I come across the concept of reincarnation I canít help but look at myself with my limited awareness and wonder if I did the right choice (if it was indeed my choice to reincarnate here).  I mean, to come here and decide to start fresh without any memories from the past takes a huge leap of faith.  Maybe the afterlife is how you say it is, or maybe not. Itís all hypothetical at this point.  undecided

I guess we will all deal with it in our own way when the time comes.  Cheers.  cool
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