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OK this week I had alcohol on two occasions - one on Tuesday (1.5 pints of ale), one on Wednesday (3 glasses of wine). Thursday morning I had two OBEs.

I should probably also point out I had some kind of mental breakdown this week, so I wasn't in a normal state of mind.

I managed to fix this problem myself, but I have another issue now. There's a kind of energy build up in my right foot while meditating. When it peaks, my foot twitches and spasms, and it's quite disruptive to my state of mind. I'll keep working on it, but if anyone has any advice, it'd be appreciated.

Might sound obvious, but have you tried asking it (politely) to leave you alone and not bother you any more?

Forgot to mention that he mentions prymids, that 11:11 is a prymid. 11:11 is ment to be some important number in this era.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winter_solstice
In 2012, the exact time of winter solstice (UTC - in the UK, that means) is 11:11.

IMO, this is still all bovine excrement.

Are you saying that the third time you did it, you got up after the vibrations, and then found yourself back in bed? That sounds like an OBE.

I've had that feeling of rapid breathing while OOB, too. Not quite sure what it is, but I'm certain it isn't physical. The physical body is usually hardly breathing at all.

As for the feeling of derealisation, maybe you got up too fast and you weren't quite "lined up" with your body. You have to bring yourself out slowly.

Well I have a friend who says she always visits the same older version of her room while OOB, so I guess it's possible to repeatedly visit the same person. Why do you ask?

If you can use alcohol in moderation to better manage your OBE experiences, than go for it man! We all respond differently to various substances besides.

Thanks dude. I didn't mean to sound so arrogant before. Anyway, I guess I'll soon find out what effect it does have on OBEs.

(Lack of) Astral sight is still a thing that bothers me. It takes me a lot of will-power to gain vision in the etheric body. Once the astral body has separated, sight seems quite natural.

To separate, I do a lot of different things. The last one that worked well for me was to "pull" on the etheric body, which makes more sense when you know how that feels. Pulling is something I can do while fully awake (even as I type this), but it never seems to lead to release unless I'm fully relaxed and I move focus away from my body, to a point in the centre of my head.

[not enough to make you pass out, fall over, or vomit.]

First of all, I want to point out that the consensus is rarely correct. If it was something to be relied upon, we'd never make any scientific progress, the world would be flat, the sun would orbit us, dinosaur fossils wouldn't exist (because they weren't part of consensus reality before we found them) etc.

Secondly, a limited amount of alcohol each day has been shown to provide health BENEFITS. http://www.askmen.com/sports/foodcourt/45_eating_well.html

The question of whether you become dependent on a substance is whether you allow yourself to. Drink alcohol only in moderation, and you won't have any problems. I find it hard to believe you could become dependent on a substance for OBEs though. Most of them tend to be spontaneous, and once you've already had a few, spontaneous OBEs increase in frequency a lot. So if you used a hangover to induce an OBE one night, most of the time you're still going to be having sober, spontaneous OBEs.

Don't mix alcohol with medication without doing proper research on the drugs first. I've had OBEs during hangovers without any medication, so it works without the added danger of additional drugs anyway.

usually when you are intoxicated (on any drug), you don't dream. This seems to be a universal thing.

That's an over-generalisation. There are MANY drugs that give you wild and vivid dreams. Most psychedelics will do that. It's true that when you've passed out (from alcohol or any other drug), you won't dream, but that's because it's not sleep. You can still dream while drunk (number of dreams may be fewer than normal, though).

What you wrote seems to be the exact opposite of that. In which case, no one can help you because you are ab normal. 

Are you going to back that up with evidence? Am I abnormal too?

You would most definitely have a far higher quality OBE experience *without* some sort of drug.

Is that personal / moral bias, or is it something you've found to be true through experience? It's tempting to think this, but where's the evidence?

I haven't kept careful notes on my alcohol intake so far (will do now though!), but if memory serves me correctly, alcohol intake doesn't seem to affect the quality of my OBEs. In fact, the last two OBEs I had were the morning after a night where I had a bottle of red wine, and I had MORE mental control during those experiences than in any other. Afterwards, I felt fully rested, and I experienced no more hangover symptoms.

Maybe it's the combination of disturbed sleep and slight dehydration that does it. And my spontaneous OBEs usually occur just after waking up from a dream when my mind is still adjusting back to reality (and the dream scenarios taint the OBEs), so perhaps the reduction in the number of dreams during a hangover helps with mental clarity.

I would go as far as to say that you will never have a true full blown lucid OBE as long as you have a drug in your system. You will remain in the buffer zone of your own mind-thoughts (as real as they may seem) and never actually reach objective consensus realities outside your own mind. This is for your own protection and the protection of other minds.

Why?



Here's version 1.1 of the hangover method:

1. Drink enough to make you giggly and happy, but not enough to make you pass out, fall over, or vomit.
2. Drink a little water if you need to, but not enough to completely cure the hangover.
3. Go to bed early.
4. ? ? ?
5. OBE!

Important note: consuming lots of alcohol is also a good way to induce liver disease. Use this method at your own risk.

I'll try it out next month, and I'll post any results I have.

Maybe you walked into someone else's dream.

[Imagination.]

Imagination.

Dreams, Lucid Dreams, Daydreams, Astral Projection and Out-of-Body Experiences are ALL taking place in your imagination.

Now why would I say such a thing? It's a trick that you've fallen for your entire life but never gave attention to. We're taught that dreams aren't real, that daydreaming and imagining things is a fantasy for children -- and it has no value because it is not real. But then everyone here says that AP and OBE's are real and that it's not the same as a dream, and I agree.

The truth is we've just never realized how powerful and IMPORTANT the imagination is.

Think of the above over and and over again. Seriously, don't just skip it over, go back and really think about it -- it's a major key to the bigger puzzle.

It goes back to Monroe, and further ahead to Frank fitting right in place. Focus, and finish the puzzle.

IMO, the real world is illusory; just a day dream. Same goes for individuality. Is this what you're trying to say? By phasing to the different focus levels you're just changing your state of consciousness. You don't really go anywhere because there's nowhere to go. Raise consciousness "high" enough, and you see the world for what it is.

That's called a false awakening.

I keep on having these experiences after having indulged quite a bit in alcohol the previous night. I have never had these experiences when I haven't indulged in alcohol. I need to know, if I ditch the alcohol completely, if these experiences will eventually come back , without the alcohol?

Yes, they will still happen without alcohol. Strangely, I get OBEs quite often while hung over. I wonder if that could be turned into a technique

What is so cool about being secretive? Pretending like you have knowledge that no one else has, does it make you feel better about yourself? Your in secret orders? Ha, thats hilarious. And yet this forum has more info than your secret order? doesn't that defeat the whole point?

Either share your information or don't. Don't talk in circles and try and play with people.

I don't think that's the kind of person Steel Hawk is. Whatever he was thinking about saying was probably something very true, but not politically correct. That's the impression I get.

I would say don't have faith. Faith, IMHO, is one of the biggest barriers to true spiritual experiences. It taints your view of the world and it taints your experiences. Just because you *want* to believe there's an afterlife, it doesn't mean that there is.

You should use knowledge and experience instead of belief. I would suggest doing some validation experiments for yourself. If you do them in an objective, almost scientific way it might also help convince your pseudo-sceptic buddies.

Ah so much more to say, but it's controversial. Better just leave things as they are.

Intriguing...

A lot of people have reported doing that.

Well done UmmaGumma!

Cool but would you be willing to take a lie detector test on this?

Is that a joke? A lie detector wouldn't prove anything. They suck.

I used to have some experiences like those back when I was first starting (even the video game type stuff), and it might be caused by one of two things:

1) If you're having spontaneous OBEs during the hypnopompic state (i.e. immediately after waking, while you're still disoriented), you can have experiences that seem a lot like dreams, because you're not fully "back" from the astral (where you had the dreams) yet. If that's the case, you could find other ways to project, or just go with it and enjoy projecting to the astral rather than the RTZ. This still happens to me occasionally.

2) When OOB, a lack of mental self-control can cause things to change or appear wrong. Just get some more practice quietening your mind and notice things rather than actively think about them.

Something else that might help is if you pay close attention to your state of mind while separating. The first separation puts you in the etheric body which you can explore the etheric plane / RTZ / physical clone in, and I think this is what you want. If you pay close attention you may notice a second separation, and that will put you in the astral body, which doesn't hang around in the RTZ, but prefers dream-like worlds.

Thanks, CFTraveler.

I found and read some of your posts from 2007 and 2006, and they were quite enlightening (couldn't find anything older though...). If it happens again, I'll try not to be negative... and if I do find that pink alien dude again I'll apologise to him for scaring the excreta out of him. I can't get my head around the first extremely negative experience with the invisible people though; I don't think I was being hostile, but they were still extremely impatient, rude and uncaring. IDK 

As I understand it, you don't see light particles like you do while in your body. This also makes reading words and numbers and recognising patterns and colours correctly very difficult. When you looked at your bed, you were probably thinking "I'm here, not in there," so you didn't see yourself in there.

I've had a number of experiences like that, and even seen my body looking much younger than I really am on occasion. I'd suggest either not worrying about it, or being more aware of your state of mind: if you don't have much practice with mental self-control, you'll tend to "drift" into the astral or see astral overlays.

Yesterday and the day before I had OBEs during the mornings (first ones in a long time). I met with one of my guides, Exsy, who congratulated me on achieving a new level of consciousness and achieving a particular task I'd been given, and he showed me some living claymation kittens, which I helped heal and played with.. That was fantastic! The next day I paid particular attention to exactly what I was doing when separating from my body and noticed exactly at what points the transitions were made. It was very educational.. Anyway that's some background.

Last night I made a brief attempt to project, but gave up after 30 minutes because of being tired. At about 6am this morning, I was having a dream where I was fixing a girl's bike. I ran up the stairs to fetch some tools, and as I lay them out on the bed to pick the ones I needed, this disembodied human-looking arm reach down from the ceiling and flung me up into the air.

I felt the "whoosh" that comes with leaving your body, and kept my eyes closed because I had some knowledge that I was not going to like what I saw (as if I'd been through this before), and I had a very strong urge to try to sleep so I didn't have to remember what happened. The next thing I know, I feel like I'm laying down on a hospital bed, and I'm surrounded by bright flashing vibrating lights and there are two pairs of disembodied arms over me. My right arm is floating up, and these disembodied arms are trying to push it back down. I resist, and raise it again.

I say, feeling extremely sedated, "What's going on?"

One of the owners of the arms shouts at me, as if to a misbehaving child, "STFU. Look, do you want to go back to your university accommodation or do you want to end up somewhere in Spain?"

I had a strong urge to answer the question, but being aware it could be a false dichotomy trick to get me to consent to something I just said "What? Why would you do that?"

The next thing I know, I'm lying in bed, awake.

I go back to sleep but two hours later I woke up and found myself partially paralysed. I couldn't see out my left eye, couldn't turn my head left, and I couldn't control my left arm (which I couldn't see behind my nose, but I could see my hand rising and sinking gently, and I could control my left hand). Eventually my arm raised far enough to allow me to see my elbow, and I spotted a finger resting underneath the elbow.

Being pretty protective of my property, I snapped my right arm over there, yanked on the hand under my elbow and pulled some kind of short thin pink alien. I grabbed it by the neck almost strangling it, and pulled it close. It had *small* black eyes with vestigial flaps above and below them that weren't quite eyelids, no nose, and a mouth that came forward to a peak.

"Who are you? What the f are you doing in my room?" I demanded, blanking my mind to avoid letting it read an answer from me, but it still managed to grab onto some of my doubts:

"What I'm doing is really important," it said, weakly. "I'm a friend of a friend."

If it was really a friend it would have asked for my conscious consent, and would have explained why whatever it was doing was important, so I pulled it closer and yelled at it "GTFO out of my room and never come back!"

And then it vanished and the paralysis was gone.

What do you make of that?

I don't think that's prana. I'm pretty sure that's just cells moving about in the fluids in your eyes. There are smaller dots you might be able to see that I think might be related to prana. They're sort of infinitely small dots without height or width, they're everywhere, and you don't need a bright background to see them (dim light is best, actually). But that might just be visual noise again.

I've seen my etheric body while out of body a few times now. It seems to be blueish, with a network of gold/silver channels of energy between chakras (major and minor). My etheric head also seems an odd shape. I guess that was kind of unrelated to your question, but I think if anyone can see prana or chi while still in their body, they should also be able to see your etheric body (actually I think I might have been able to see the edges of peoples' etheric bodies before while looking for auras...).

Very interesting, Steel Hawk  I'll definitely give that a try if I need to.

I'm curious as to what the effects of heavy foods such as steak are. Do you know if there is a reason? I had steak for dinner last night and still managed to project this morning...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cryptomnesia