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yeah yeah, but still what happens when the brain is gone? human, alien or wombat, its hard to think if theres nothing to think with and how else can one perceive anything? you know?

its true what you say -E- but some people don't have all the answers as you clearly do
and I apologize i just thought i could help put someones mind at ease by sharing what i thought to be a similair experience but next time i'll be sure to let experts like yourself field these types of questions
since you have such a clear understanding of the inner workings of the mind

hmm that complicates things quite a bit

i'm really new to this too i stumbled upon this sight yesterday
but when i was a kid it happened just sort of on its own
i think what helped though is the fact that i had heard that you can control your dreams (on an episode of ghost busters now that i think of it,huh)
anyway i used to have alot of nightmares about monsters and stuff
now i knew there weren't such things so i knew that if i was confronted with monsters i was dreaming and  knew that i could control the enviroment so when i came face to face with a monster ide say somthing like oh yeah take this
then ide imagine that i had a ghost buster blaster thingy and shoot the hell out of these monsters that were always chasing me
eventually i didn't really have monster nightmares anymore but would still be able to figure out if i was dreaming simply by how strange the situation was (seven dwarfs in the living room, i think not)
so i would just tell myself "i can fly i can fly"
then i pretty sure the frequency of actual OBE went up
because there was nothing weird happening
my family was sleeping i could see i was sleeping and ide just go flying around the neighborhood
this is all just coming back to me now so sorry for being rambly
but i figure if i was doing it without all these techniques and being aware of what i was doing maybe its easier not to overthink it
oh yeah!
there was this article i read in the weekly world news about astral projection when i was really young and it said you can go anywhere in the world while you sleep so as to save money on vacations(ha)
it said that just before you go to sleep tell yourself"i'm going to remember everything" over and over again or picture where youd like to go
i did it and it seemed to work
hope it helps
now that i remember all this i think i'm gonna try it again

did it ever happen to you as a kid randomly?

well i had somthing like this happened that spooked me quite a bit

i went to sleep and was dreaming about being in this apartment i don't know if i had been there before or not (i'm leaning towards not)
there's this little boy sitting on the couch reading outloud
it seemed to me like he was my son (i don't have a son)
there was a mostly empty glass of milk on an end table(1/4 full)
i pick the glass up and ruffle the boys hair (like, ada boy!)
upon standing up i have a dizzy spell and collapse to my knees spilling the glass (i've had dizzy spells like this before)
i hear a woman scream "oh my god are you okay!"
and look over to see her legs as she approaches. i don't see her face because shes standing over me like the person who drapes james brown in a cape after his show while he's on his knees
i say "yeah just gotta get my bearings...."
i collapse again right on my face and everything goes black and i have the distinct feeling like i'm floating but everything is black
i still had spatial awareness because as i'm floating i'm looking up and down and all around thinking "well i guess i'm dead,but where's the white light.
it seems like alot of time is passing because i had time to think about what good i've done as opposed to what harm i've done
i eventually conclude that the god must have been as strict as the catholics say he was (i'm not really a religious person)
and i must be going to hell for taking his name in vein one to many times
(i really haven't done anything that bad,maybe lied to get out of trouble or stolen candy as a kid)
i'm sure that i'm going to hell
i begin to panic but calm down when i realise thers nothing i can do at this point
but no fire and brimstone (i should mention that the whole time this is happening i did assume that it was a dream but got panicy when i tried forcing my eyes open to wake up and could not)
nothing was happening and i began to worry that this was the after life eternal blackness left alone to your own inner monolouge
after a while of trying to force my eyes open (ide like to say it was an eternity having so much time to think but it was just a really long time)
i did open my eyes jolting up and gasping like i had been underwater
i was shaking and breathing heavily and hope i never experience that again although i fear i might because i fear i was wittnessing my own death due to the fact i've had prophetic dreams in the past
so who knows i don't this helps you but its kind of a load of my chest
thanks :confused:

i've had dreams that play out scene for scene in waking life the next day.
For instance an old flame that i had thought i'de put out of my mind for quite some time.
I dreamt that I met her in a corridor we hugged and talked.
the next morning she calls me out of the blue to ask how i've been doing since it seemed like ide vanished off the face of the earth
i wasn't surprised but i had the feeling she might have had the same dream but didn't ask cuz i didn't want to sound like a psycho
are there cases of this sort of thing happening does it tie in with OBE
or is it somthing else

p.s thank you to everyone who's replied to my many posts and anyone who replies to this one, some of this stuff may be outlandish but i'm really trying to figure this all out the best way i know how

some one tried to explain 4d to me one time like this,

imagine a line no matter how you look at it its just a line,(1d)
now imagine pulling that line untill its a square(2d)
now you tug on that square untill its a cube(3d)
now tug on the cube untill you have two cubes overlapping into themselves, thats 4d
kind of like the astral pulse logo at the top left of the page with the woman then the astral body emerging half way out
Is the astral body always there we just don't see it in the 3d world because its beyond comprehension?

the mayan calendar suggests that we're reaching a point where we're evolving so quickly that we'll be able to leave our bodies like turning a switch, i've heard psychics say that the veil is thinning (between the physical and spiritual world) What do you think?

Is it our human brains that make us unique? Or is it just energy resting in this vessle that isn't bound anymore once the Brain dies? can animals be astral travelers?

[Anything]

tell me everything you've read that will help me better wrap my head around this anything related (i've said in another post my best tools as a child were some show at disney land and an episope of batman the animated series,waking life too) Anything

A couple people have mentioned that there are various levels you can ascend to that some are unimaginable or untreadable the higher you go.
Is this so? are these places what we'll no to be the afterlife or is my guess as good as anyones?

so after becoming somewhat infatuated yesterday thinking that the universe has brought me to this place to remember how to astral project (i don't even feel comfortable calling it that but i'm just trying to fit in i suppose) I went to bed with my mind buzzing with all this information, and i'm sure i'll be posting alot of what ifs and has this ever happened? sort of things but as i drifted off to sleep i tried not shut my eyes instead focussing very hard on the floural pattern on my sofa i think i could almost see through my eyelids again but who knows i could be manifesting it all. but i did dream of being at some party with faces i had never seen before which got me thinking about what Bertrand Russel said about imagination. its basicly this, you can only imagine things you've seen before and any number of combinations you can create with all the information you have, like i could imagine my 3rd grade teacher wearing a cowboy hat even though ive never seen her in a cowboy hat but have seen her as well as cowboy hats. just like i cannot imagine a color that i've never seen before. so upon seeing another astral traveler what do they look like? is it like your connecting to the global network of consciousness? what would someone who's been blind since birth see? can you really see other travelers?

so what happens when the mind dies then? no brain no plain?

this is all so wild, i had no idea other people experieced this, you'd think it'd be better understood by now how far back does this go,is their recorded history of this kind of thing?

i was reading one article where the author  states that some people have battled with"low level" astral beings or that perhaps the shock of astral projecting for the first time might cause cardiac arrest or that one migth simply become lost and not return to ther body

I've had the experience of actually laying back down into my body to wake up is it possible for two people who can leave thier body to simply trade? Is there any groups or research being done to test any of this stuff in the field?

say you were on your deathbed due to a stroke that had left you unable to communctate and unable to move the right side of you body, your able to comunicate with your loved ones through a series of  thumbs up and thumbs down you can't write anything legible due to arthritis.
would the sheer frustration drive people unaware of astral projection to comunicate through dreams?

I remember that if I was out of my body I would have to return to the one I could see to wake up and that if i forced myself to wake up it felt as if i had just fallen into my bed upon awakening. Is this common?

Are their cases of people who were known by their friends and family to be into astral projection and they simply died in their sleep one night?

If you can remember doing this sort of thing as a child (astral project) yet have trouble now wouldn't it make more sense to figure out what made it easy before and try to duplicate the conditions? (pardon my ignorance but i'm new to this) is that somthing people do? or do you force it? or is it just somthing that happens and remembering that it happened is the hard part?

thank you

I was reading this Chogyam Trungpa book and he talks about the legend of Shambhala this city where the ruler decreed that everyone follow this form of meditation. The citizens were so enlightened that they say the whole city vanished and is just a collective dream now? is this sort of thing like that astral meeting thing on the linking website?

is this earthly body the only tool we have to astral project or is the spirit actually leaving the body?

When I was a kid I used to have the most beautiful dreams that I was floating about my house while evreyone slept. Although I was far to young to rationalize what was happening I knew these dreams were different somehow. I could see myself sleeping and the rest of my family sleeping, I soon came to realize that I didn't have a bedtime anymore and began using what little knowledge of the world I had picked up from the never ending stream of light and sound that was used to babysit more often than not (there was a t.v in every room of my house growng up) and my travels that I  barely remember (alot of family vacations as a very young kid) to figure out what was going on. I was able to play with astral projection far before I had any idea what it was I was potentially doing and long before I had lost my full imagination (I mean sure you may paint or write music but when was the last time you created an entire world for your stuffed animals or pretended your hand was a person who could carry a converstion)
Anyway on a trip to disney land I remember this show on the water near amazon land or somthing. The whole story was (i think) that mickey mouse is in the dream world and all his friends are captured by the disney villains and evetually someone tells him somthing like "but mickey if its all just a dream you can control everything" so he starts using his imagination to change everything (your not really big and mean,theres no cage etc) mickey saves the day and i'm weeping tears of joy. Later that night I remember thinking before I went to sleep " I can control everything, I can control everything..." so all of a sudden i'm floating around the motel room and I use my new found power to float through the door out to the pool then way up into the sky. another time I saw an episode of Bat Man the animated series where bat man's dealing with the mad hatter and realises the mad hatter used his new device to trap batman in his own dreams, but bat man see's through it  because he can't read any writing on the pages of a book or make out what time it is on a digital clock. So  put that theory to the test, the next time I had one of my floaty dreams I looked at the bookshelf in my room and could clearly make out the writing on the spines of the books. So really all I thought was that bat man was wrong or stupid. there were other times growing up that I remember distictly looking through my eyelids. I was at the pool (I couldn't swim,still can't) competting with my bother to see who could hold their breath the longest. I could see his face he was puffing out his cheeks and holding his nose I came up for air then he did. He won we laughed then I said somthing like "huh, you looked funny" then imitated him he said " you opened your eyes?" I replied "no, are you crazy it burns" he just gave me a wierd look then splashed me. On one other occasion (last one I promise) I had crashed my bike into fire hydrant after hitting a crack my handle bar spun around and slashed across one one of my eyes and just the top eyelid on the other. I didn't lose my eye (thank God) but I did have to keep a patch on the one eye and it was a strain to open the other. During my recovery I was lying in bed watching t.v getting frustrated that I couldn't see very well and since my one eye was partially shut I was getting sleepy but didn't want to sleep. So I turned on my side and cried I think. I was laying ther listening to the t.v trying to follow the story, all of a sudden i'm sitting up watching it with perfect sight. It was an episode of california dreams it was like saved by the bell but they were in a band, years later I saw a rerun of the same episode and I remembered the images.
But time passed and  now I have trouble doing what came so natural as a child, I feel like I've grown down rather than up, I saw the movie waking life and everything made sense and now i'm just trying to figure it out again. Is that what its like? was I on the astral plain? has any one else ever done that pool thing? i've seen these astral project in 20 minute cds for $29.95 what are those? how do they work? I had no idea there was an online community let alone people even thinking about this stuff and I guess thats why this post is so long I just had to tell someone who would believe me because I can't help thinking thats why it doesn't come naturally anymore because everyone laughed it off as my imagination or just a wierd dream or that I was lying. You know? are their any good books to read on the subject? Please let me know you Know where i'm coming from,thanks.