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When I first experienced the vibrational state (9-10 years ago) I had forgotten about a nightmare I used to get when I was about 6 years old.
I remembered this nightmare recently when discussing childhood nightmares at a party.
In the nightmare I was in a 'black void' and all that was in this void was  a sort of telephone booth that only contained a red button.
I entered the booth and pressed the red button.
I received a huge current electric shock. I tried to take my finger off the button but it took great effort to do it. Once I took my finger off the button the electric shocks stopped.
In the nightmare I then decided to press the red button again (why? I don't know). The same happened to me again...and again...and again... until I awoke screaming the house down.
This nightmare happened on and off for about 2 months.

Its only recently I started to wonder if these electric shocks were somehow related to the vibrational state before a concious OBE. The pre-OBE paralysis is also suggested by the difficulty I had in taking my finger off the button.
I still have no idea why I persisted in the dream in repeatedly pressing the red button.

Has anyone else had any dreams/OBEs as children?

I began my spiritual quest with shamanism and the writings of Terence McKenna.
I never succeeded in achieving a shamanic journey basically due to poor concentration/relaxation (and attempts via psychedelic drugs seemed too cloudy to put down as a real experience)  but fortunately through no effort on my part I was able to have OBEs when going for an early evening nap.

The RTZ is the only zone I've experienced with my OBEs and I just wondered if shamanic journeys occured in one of the other astral dimensions or if its a completely distinct dimension that cannot be accessed via the OBE techniques.

I realise the shamanic journey is some form of an OBE but it does sound different to the writings of Monroe/Bruce etc.

Hi Kodemaster
Can you not tell your mum in a way that suggests it accidentally happened to you?
ie " I was on the bus and I started dozing off. After a while I found myself floating above my body. It felt great then I woke up again. I don't feel ill. What do you think happened?"

This enables you to break it to her saying it wasn't a concious attempt, get her reaction then you can decide after that if you want to say any more on the subject ie "I may buy a book on this to see if others have experienced this" etc..

If you feel its a waste of time then it may be best to accept that she wont understand.

Hi Zarklon

quote:is it better to be sitting up or lieing down to have try to get the vibrations and stuff ?

I'm sure sitting up works because its harder for you to fall asleep and you have more chance of the body asleep/mind awake state when sitting up.
I find I get the vibrations/paralysis when lying on sofas that aren't very comfortable (but I've also had them after too much sleep when in comfortable bed).

quote:What was with the false awakening that I had ? I mean .. when I thought I woke up, I went into a new resting position and then I woke up AGAIN and was back in the old one  

When I have moments when I drift in and out of sleep I often think I'm awake and say to my wife "Wait till I tell you the dream I've just had" only to find that this also was a dream and when I actually do wake up my wife confirms I've said nothing. These dreams are always very vivid (not lucid as I'm not aware I'm dreaming) and  the dream scene is the room I'm sleeping in which helps create the confusion. Maybe these dreams are my best chances of becoming lucid?

I also notice after 5 or 6 of these short vivid dreams the vibrations kick in. Its the same thing that happens to you at school.

You may be able to recreat this at home by sitting in an uncomfortable chair after a good nights sleep and a few hours of activity.

The way I deal with the paralysis/vibrations is to think about getting up or floating up to the ceiling. This sometimes works but occasionally I get the timing wrong and a part of me ends up stuck to my body.
I've just read Astral Dynamics and the rope technique looks good, I'll be trying that the next time I get paralysis/vibrations.

I would say school is possibly not the best place for an OBE but you've gotta grab every chance that comes your way! I would keep the projection short so you could do a concious reentry before your teacher wakes you up!

It is legal so I'm sure your parents would understand. Just say its related to the herb sage and you fancy making your bedroom a bit more 'green'!!
Maybe buy a few other 'ordinary' plants as well to make it less obvious what your game is!!

Are there any benefits of phasing into the Astral compared to a RTZ projection exit then into the astral from the RTZ?

Hi Tracy

Robert also said in AD that nothing beats direct experience.
I think if people are curious and need help achieving OBEs then whether its herbal mixes, salvia, BWG files, Focus CDs then they should try them and decide for themselves if they are good or not.

I personally don't think there is a right or wrong way to do it as long as it works and you're happy with it.

Alan

Just a quickie:

Sometimes I used to wake up in the morning with a song in my mind. It was usually an obscure pop song from the 80's that is rarely played on the radio.
It was a shock to hear it on the radio 10 minutes later.
This happened 3 times in the space of a few months but it hasn't happened for about 4 years now. I would have been about 24-25 yrs old.
This seems to be a similair experience but more audio than visual.

quote:2) The fact that these drugs are generally illegal. Hmmm...I wonder why.

Why do you think they are illegal? Dangerous to us? Dangerous to society? Dangerous to the status quo?
Maybe our governments don't want us all getting enlightened.
Alcohol is legal and just as dangerous (probably more dangerous) than some of these banned substances.
As Bill Hicks once said:
" Go back to bed America, your government is in control, keep drinking beer, here's some American Gladiators for you!"

As far as I see it-
OBE - fantastic
mushroom experiences - fantastic
LSD - OK but not nearly as powerful.

Both OBE and mushroom journeys have left me with fantastic memories and the drive to find out more.

Oh and by the way, read McKenna's Food Of The Gods...surely it cannot be simply dismissed as rubbish??

another that has mixed success:

sleep for 5 hours
get up for 30 mins (splash lots of cold water on face to properly wake up)
back to bed for sleep sometimes eventually produces vibrations (usually weaker vibrations that need to be worked on with breathing, moving vibes down to feet and up again etc)

I may try the rope method the next time this happens and see how well it goes.

sleep for 8-10
awake for 4-5
I try to get back to sleep after this - keep drifting in and out of sleep with very vivid dreams throughout, usually wake up to vibrations and/or paralysis after 2-3 hours of this

I have been quite fortunate.
Most friends dismiss the experiences as dreams and I find it impossible to convince them otherwise. If it happens to them they'll know!!

My dad had a NDE about 28 years ago when I was about 1 yr old so he was quite understanding.
He heard surgeons talk about him being dead then the tunnel travel occurred.
I never beleived him (I dismissed it as a dream!) until I had an OBE then I apologised to him and told him why I now beleived him.

My wife once saw elves in the garden when on a mushroom trip so discussing OBEs with her was never a problem!!!

If people could evesdrop on some of the converstions we have at home the men in white vans with the straight-jackets would be on their way!!!

I've had excellent times with and without hallucinogenic substances, completely different experiences but equally brilliant nonetheless.
Everyone is different so there is no correct or incorrect way to gain access to higher realms, its just what works for the individual.

I also do not beleive that some of these substances are illegal because they are dangerous to us, the governments that ban these substances don't want the population finding too much out so ban them under the pretence that they are doing us a favour protecting us from these 'harmful' drugs, allowing drugs like alcohol to remain legal.

Find your own path!

Same here!
When I awake I know I had no control over it, its just like you've watched a movie unfold around you.

I probably didn't explain in enough detail -
the phone booth wasn't really a phone booth and there was no phone in it either.
It was more like an small phone booth sized empty framework with just a button in it (I'm not sure if it had glass walls/windows or was just a bare metal frame.
Anyway, enough of my rambling - I'm just glad I didn't get a reply saying...
"Ahh the old black void/booth and button dream - this means you have psychotic tendancies !!"

Sorry, Salvia D -  smoked it once and it was OK (certainly not as potent as some hallucinogens) but I didn't try it with astral work.
I think Salvia D and  BWGEN files together may work quite well for OBE attempts and its something that everyone can try (I wouldn't recommend mushrooms to everyone!) I may buy a plant and give it  a go.

http://www.salvia-divinorum-scotland.co.uk/

McKennas best book-
For serious information on the history of the human species and mankinds relationship with plant hallucinogens then Food Of The Gods is best.
If you want a great adventure story full of UFOs, DMT sex, using sound waves/human brain/mushrooms  to shatter space and time, telepathy and the theory of mushrooms being a form of galactic intelligence then True Hallucinations does the job - if Terry Gilliam made it into a movie it would be the best film ever!!

I think he was basically saying that its the most powerful hallucinogen on the planet and if you have never encountered LSD, psylocibin mushrooms then it may not be a good idea.
I have never tried DMT (basically because I can't get hold of the stuff-people don't seem to want it in Scotland) but whenerver I went for a big mushroom dose I fastened my seatbelt and must admit I was always scared. Once the trip got going everything was beatiful but mushrooms and DMT should both be treated with total respect.
I think the DMT experience would be fantastic but I think once I smoked the pipe the fear factor would be 100 times bigger than the OBE paralysis/vibrations ever were.
Its a different ball game to salvia divinorum!!

Here's a link:

http://www.deoxy.org/h_twha.htm

Maybe we can read more about this lazy technique in Robert Bruce's forthcoming book...Couch Potato Astral Dynamics ...or CPAD as I like to call it!!!

One final thing on DMT
McKenna has been asked if he thinks DMT is dangerous.
He said the only danger is death by amazement!!

The late Terence McKenna has based much of career on the elf-inhabited areas accessed when smoking synthetic DMT. One of his best books,Food Of The Gods discusses these experiences in more detail.
Various tribes in the amazon ingest naturally occurring DMT in some of the plant species down there.
I cant remember off the top of my head but I think ayahusaca is one of the names of the brew they create.
Unfortunately I dont know where to get it but have heard that it can be extracted from canary grass (if you know what you're doing!!)
I am always vary of trying to make my own stuff as I'm no chemist and can't even get a simple pasta dish correct let alone my own DMT!!!

I have very limited success with achieving the trance state through controlled relaxation/meditation.
It seems I can guarantee the buzzing/vibrations just by following a precise sleep pattern with no effort to actually attain the trance state, it just happens.

1) I get a full nights sleep (8-10 hours)
2) Get up and live life for 5-6 hours
3) Go for a nap
4) Trying to sleep when my body doesn't require sleep takes between one and two hours before I start dozing off. (This may be a good point to try techniques to stay concious) In my cases I simply fell asleep and seemed to have a vivid (not lucid I don't think) dream, wake up again, doze off again, have another bizarre vivid dream. This happens 3 or 4 times and suddenly I awake with either just the vibrations OR a combination of heavy vibrations and sleep paralysis. Before I knew about OBE's this was terrifying, now its exciting because I know I can simply float up or 'roll over' to achieve the OBE.

I accept this is a lazy technique and I can only do it this lazy way when time permits ie some weekends.

I am trying to achieve an OBE using relaxation/meditation which would mean I could get to the vibrational state in 30 mins instead of 2-3 hours.

I also noticed that if the lazy method failed when napping, if I went to bed again at night, because of the nap, I would still be awake and there was always a good chance the vibrations would kick in.

Has anyone else had an OBE using this lazy technique?

In some ways it feels like a cheat mode to an OBE but I'm not complaining if it works!!

It sounds like a genuine OBE to me.

1) If your concious thought is as focused as it is in the physical then its probably a real OBE.
I understand what you are saying when you say you get excited when it happens and end up back in body too soon. Unforunately I still suffer from this problem sometimes.

2) I have a similair problem when I'm out and I feel I'm always on the end of a tight elastic band trying to suck me back to my body and it usually makes me wake up back in the physical. I think there are 2 possible reasons for my experience, 1-Me thinking of this happening makes it happen and then it gets worse because I'm expecting it to. 2- I try to leave the body too soon after the vibrations start so therefore I'm not totally free and the only way is back to body.
I think in your case its the first point. I think you are free to explore but you have got into a bad habit that is now repeating itself. Try doing something completely different when you exit. Try immediately floating through your ceiling or through an outside window before the fall occurs. If you expect the fall to occur it will. I'm saying this as someone who still has many astral problems to combat so I'm no expert but I do know that bad habits need to be broken for progress to happen.
I hope this helps.

I also put 75%
My first OBE (concious exit when napping) would be 100% but I was only out for a couple of minutes before conciously willing to go back to body.
Since then it has became more difficult, not easier to project and I seem to actually be thown back into body with 75% memories rather than conciously wishing to go back. It seems that I'm on the end of a tight elastic band that I'm constantly struggling with. I suppose if I am totally free and actually wish to go back to body I can then prepare myself for remembering the experience. When I am forced back to body I'm that annoyed at what's happened that I begin to forget the small details of the experience.